TiVo TiVo performance. - Page 6

Digital Fanatic · 23-02-2012, 13:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by stereohaven

Usually only by people that don't have it or have never watched it.

Also, isn't it funny how when Sky market an exclusive channel included with their basic service it's "over hyped", yet when VM do the same by playing on the fact they include ESPN for free, it isn't?

As I said, I try and keep a balanced and objective view as it's just one channel, whichever side of the fence you sit on, it's a shame others can't.

You seem pro-Sky, so not really "balanced". Nobody can claim to be fully "balanced" as you'd just be a fence-sitter

andy_m · 23-02-2012, 15:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by stereohaven

Yes and no.

I agree that it is just another channel that some people may or may not watch, miss or not miss, my point was I don't understand why some people keep complaining about "over hype" if they don't watch it, can't watch it or have never watched it!

Surely you have to have seen or experienced something to judge objectively whether someone who raves about it is (in your opinion) right or over hyping it?

I see people raving about the TiVo as some kind of technological messiah but whilst I think it has potential, for me it is a long way from being perfect or the best solution to our needs.

Having experienced both SKy and VM's STB's (in fact having them both plugged in right now to the same TV), I can make a direct comparison and form my own opinion, which is that the TiVo service cannot currently live up to the hype, but do I waste my energy bleating about it every 5 minutes?

No, I just change service provider!

Well you've certainly mentioned it more than once!

I think the mistake you're making is assuming that people who don't have Sky aren't able to access the shows you think they're missing, and that they're basing their opinions on nothing, or worse, jealousy. You seem to be of the opinion that you alone on this forum are uniquely positioned to give your assessment of Sky Atlantic because the rest of us have no experience of it. And yet your opinion, based on the fact that you haven't missed it whilst you've not had it, chimes with the opinion of those of us apparently unable to form an opinion - it may have some good content, but it is over-hyped.

FWIW I'm a relatively recent Sky customer, and, in my opinion, the TiVo stb, even in it's current state, far outstrips the Sky+HD stb. The Sky box may be simple, but I happen to think the TiVo UI is very intuitive - and to be honest, I don't want something that's simple - I want depth and range. I want to be able to explore shows without having to look them up elsewhere, I want to be able see suggestions based on things I like, and if I like a certain actor I want my stb to do the hardwork to see when is stuff is being shown. If I can't do things like that with my PVR then was there ever any real point in them replacing the VCR? Wasn't that supposed to be the start of improving the way we consume television? Isn't TiVo a giant step along the way? Sky+HD certainly isn't. I think it's telling that Sky have had to set up their web-based "never miss" when with a TiVo I just set up a wishlist at the point of use, to give just one example. It took the first whispers of multi-room streaming for Sky to announce that they're working on their own solution to give another. Virgin may not have yet implemented TiVo as well as we'd all like, it might not be as "simple" as it's competitors, but it is technologically well ahead of anything on the market. That's not hype - Sky's own efforts to "keep up" prove it.

muppetman11 · 23-02-2012, 16:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by andy_m

It took the first whispers of multi-room streaming for Sky to announce that they're working on their own solution to give another.

And weres your proof of that , multiroom streaming has been out for years in the USA , one being DirecTV who I believe use NDS middleware a News Corp firm who Sky also use.

You may well like the many advanced features of TIVO and for what it's worth I agree some are pretty good suggestions being the exception in my opinion however the majority just want a functioning PVR what records their favourite shows.

andy_m · 23-02-2012, 18:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by muppetman11

And weres your proof of that , multiroom streaming has been out for years in the USA , one being DirecTV who I believe use NDS middleware a News Corp firm who Sky also use.

You may well like the many advanced features of TIVO and for what it's worth I agree some are pretty good suggestions being the exception in my opinion however the majority just want a functioning PVR what records their favourite shows.

In fairness I don't have any evidence for that particular assertion other than the timing of the announcement, but the point I was making was that technologically speaking, Sky have work to do to match some of the things Tivo is capable of (whether implemented or not) and the evidence suggests that they are trying to close the gap by offering things like "never miss", by working on multi room streaming, by dabbling in vod. If all the majority wants is a simple box and a large channel line up then why are they bothering?

Anyway, this isn't about what the majority want, I just don't like being told I can't have an opinion about a channel just because I don't currently receive it.

devilincarnate · 23-02-2012, 18:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Digital Fanatic

Nobody can claim to be fully "balanced"

I'am

muppetman11 · 23-02-2012, 19:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by andy_m

In fairness I don't have any evidence for that particular assertion other than the timing of the announcement, but the point I was making was that technologically speaking, Sky have work to do to match some of the things Tivo is capable of

That's a very one sided opinion though Andy , what about balancing it with some of the features the Sky+ box has that are still missing on TIVO

Dynamic EPG , an EPG that's updated by the broadcaster and not reliant on a company in the US , a 1TB box that records 240 hrs in HD , BBC , Sky Sports red button , reminders , the ability to setup a series link or reminder from a trailer , On Demand content that can be copied to your planner to avoid expiration.

I currently use both boxes granted the TIVO maybe only once a week or so and both have strengths and weaknesses and I do agree that Sky do see TIVO as a threat and rightly so , as DF frequently says on here it's down to the individuals requirements my parents can barely receive 1mb via ADSL hence why they choose VM , for me the fact Sky is cheaper offers a better HD linear channel range , Sky F1 HD , Sky 3D plus a multitude of mobile apps are the pull. I'm sure you choose VM for BB and TIVO and the fact it probably saves you money.

denphone · 23-02-2012, 20:13

But Virgin offer many things that their competitors don't offer or if they do then they have to pay more for them and then you can couple that with Virgins superior broadband, a superior VOD service and a vastly superior STB and overall that makes it a better all round service in many peoples minds.

http://shop.virginmedia.com/existing...Tickles_ExC_10

stereohaven · 23-02-2012, 20:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Digital Fanatic

You seem pro-Sky, so not really "balanced". Nobody can claim to be fully "balanced" as you'd just be a fence-sitter

What I mean by "balanced" is that I have tried both service providers within the last 6 months, so (I think) I can provide a more reasoned view on both product ranges.

What I am not interested in hearing repeatedly is bleating and moaning from people who haven't ever seen, heard or used something. It's just pointless noise as far as I am concerned and I fail to understand why people get so wound up about things they don't have or apparently don't want because it is "over hyped" anyway!

I assume all of these people will leave in droves out of sheer disgust when Sky Atlantic comes to VM...

As for being "pro Sky" then I am guilty as charged!

I left Sky in October for VM and apart from some positives, overall the service has been a big disappointment to us, so as soon as we can we will give notice and return to Sky because for us, their package works best.

At least I can say I have tried both services which I believe (even if no one else agrees!), means my opinions are more valid on the services offered.

Quote:

Originally Posted by andy_m

...I just don't like being told I can't have an opinion about a channel just because I don't currently receive it.

Of course you can have an opinion, it just doesn't have any weight with me when you are talking about something you have never seen or used.

Quote:

Originally Posted by devilincarnate

I'am

Glad to hear it.

andy_m · 23-02-2012, 20:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by muppetman11

Dynamic EPG , an EPG that's updated by the broadcaster and not reliant on a company in the US , a 1TB box that records 240 hrs in HD , BBC , Sky Sports red button , reminders , the ability to setup a series link or reminder from a trailer , On Demand content that can be copied to your planner to avoid expiration.

I did say that I knew not all of what Tivo is capable of had yet been implemented, and it is frustrating that red button and reminders are

"coming soon". However, you seem to suggest that Tivo wouldn't be able to run with a dynamic epg, which I don't believe to be the case, and the recording space on the hard drive differs because of the compression standards used by the different companies rather than any lack of ability on the part of the box so I think you're being slightly harsh to claim that as a Sky "feature" in response to a post which is specifically about whether one box is technologically superior to another. As for being able to back up on demand, I would imagine the rights issues are a bit easier to get over when you own them all-again, nothing to do with the box, more to do with the company.

And yes, I did come to Virgin for the broadband. When I later moved my TV over to them I found V+ a real shock to the system, even though it is just a "simple pvr that records peoples programmes". I'm sure you would agree that in terms of boxes V+ hd doesn't come close to Sky+ hd, even though it has many "features" you refer to.

andy_m · 23-02-2012, 20:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by stereohaven

Of course you can have an opinion, it just doesn't have any weight with me when you are talking about something you have never seen or used.

But you don't know who has or hasn't seen it-you're just assuming that because the channel isn't on cable nobody with cable can have seen any of the content, when in actual fact they can, and in most cases they can have done so perfectly lawfully.

However, my point was that the channel is not as good as it's made out to be by some. I based that mainly on the fact that I have watched some of the stuff it shows, and I really haven't been blown away. But I also based it partly on your own admission that you haven't missed the channel whilst you've not had it, so even if we take your opinion of the channel as the only one that carries any weight, the channel still isn't all that!

stereohaven · 23-02-2012, 20:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by denphone

But Virgin offer many things that their competitors don't offer...

I like the free photos, that's a nice little extra.

Quote:

Originally Posted by denphone

...or if they do then they have to pay more for them...

If I take ADSL Broadband again when I move back to Sky then after the April price increase we will be saving money over what we pay VM now for the same package (but slower Broadband).

If I get Sky Fibre then it will be costing us around Â£12 a month more, so I can't argue with you on that, but VM can be as cheap as it likes if it doesn't work regularly (which has been our experience), then it is of no use to us.

Actually this month is cheaper again as we have received another Â£15 credit on our account due to Broadband issues.

Quote:

Originally Posted by denphone

...and then you can couple that with Virgins superior broadband...

When it works it's great, but often it doesn't, the SuperHub is pretty useless and how something connected at a reported 30MB can't stream YouTube is beyond me!

Quote:

Originally Posted by denphone

...a superior VOD service...

Yet again iPlayer on the TiVo isn't working tonight.

I did enjoy watching Ashes To Ashes on demand though when I first got it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by denphone

...and a vastly superior STB...

It should be but VM's network and lack of thought on certain features handicaps it in my view. It's good and could be the best STB if they commit to it properly with things like decent apps and a dynamic EPG.

Quote:

Originally Posted by denphone

...and overall that makes it a better all round service in many peoples minds.

Mind reader as well are we? It's like trying to discuss things with Derren Brown not denphone...

Dave42 · 23-02-2012, 20:41

would not swap my Tivo for anything

denphone · 23-02-2012, 20:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by stereohaven

I like the free photos, that's a nice little extra.

If I take ADSL Broadband again when I move back to Sky then after the April price increase we will be saving money over what we pay VM now for the same package (but slower Broadband).

If I get Sky Fibre then it will be costing us around Â£12 a month more, so I can't argue with you on that, but VM can be as cheap as it likes if it doesn't work regularly (which has been our experience), then it is of no use to us.

Actually this month is cheaper again as we have received another Â£15 credit on our account due to Broadband issues.

When it works it's great, but often it doesn't, the SuperHub is pretty useless and how something connected at a reported 30MB can't stream YouTube is beyond me!

Yet again iPlayer on the TiVo isn't working tonight.

I did enjoy watching Ashes To Ashes on demand though when I first got it.

It should be but VM's network and lack of thought on certain features handicaps it in my view. It's good and could be the best STB if they commit to it properly with things like decent apps and a dynamic EPG.

Mind reader as well are we? It's like trying to discuss things with Derren Brown not denphone...

l find your posts very entertaining and perhaps you have had some training from the great master MM and yes l was talking to the great Uri Geller earlier and he gave me a few mind reading tips.

stereohaven · 23-02-2012, 20:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by andy_m

...But I also based it partly on your own admission that you haven't missed the channel whilst you've not had it, so even if we take your opinion of the channel as the only one that carries any weight, the channel still isn't all that!

I haven't missed it probably because Game of Thrones hasn't been on!

I think we are going round in circles because I haven't been defending the quality or otherwise of Sky Atlantic, just pointing out that I don't think people complaining about it when they haven't seen it as having any value.

Sure you can watch some of the content in other ways and no not all of the shows will appeal to everyone but why do people get so wound up about something they don't have?

To be honest I am as bored of trying to make my point clear as I am sure many people are of reading its so I'm going to leave it there.

---------- Post added at 20:52 ---------- Previous post was at 20:48 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by denphone

l find your posts very entertaining and perhaps you have had some training from the great master MM and yes l was talking to the great Uri Geller earlier and he gave me a few mind reading tips.

Just don't let him in the kitchen...

Digital Fanatic · 23-02-2012, 20:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave42

would not swap my Tivo for anything

Same here Dave