Brexit: Article 50 Has Been Triggered !

Originally Posted by Osem

Just heard Jon Snow, on LBC with Iain Dale, claiming that our youth voted Labour because they have been deprived of the 'right to live, work and love in Europe' by the Tories. Really? How's that then? There's no way any Brexit deal is going to prevent those things but of course it doesn't suit the scaremongering remainers to admit that. This sort of deliberate misinformation is becoming a joke and he's gone down considerably in my estimation by stooping to that level of tripe.

Well they can do so now without visas or much, if any, paperwork. Won't it be more difficult to do those things post-Brexit?

---------- Post added at 14:03 ---------- Previous post was at 13:58 ----------

Incidentally Ruth Davidson is calling for a 'softer' Brexit: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...enges-theresa/

Although equally there will be many backbenchers who'll refuse anything but a hard Brexit. I think we're now in a situation where there is a consensus in the commons for whatever form of Brexit that will eventually be offered.

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Mr K

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...enges-theresa/
Another 'little' problem for Mother Theresa.
Hard Brexit is dead. Brexit itself isn't looking very 'strong and stable'.

She'll say enough is enough to brexit soon

[OLD BOY]

Hard Brexit is still on the cards. TM cannot avoid that without alienating the right wing of her party.

Besides, if we remain in the common market, we have to accept freedom of movement, the European laws and Courts, all of which the majority of those who voted leave wanted to ditch.

A soft Brexit would be a betrayal, and the PM knows it.

[Mr K]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Hard Brexit is still on the cards. TM cannot avoid that without alienating the right wing of her party.

Besides, if we remain in the common market, we have to accept freedom of movement, the European laws and Courts, all of which the majority of those who voted leave wanted to ditch.

A soft Brexit would be a betrayal, and the PM knows it.

Tough luck, the right wing of her party will have to lump it. The country has shown they don't want hard brexit, and more importantly her new best buddies the DUP don't want it.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by Mr K

Tough luck, the right wing of her party will have to lump it. The country has shown they don't want hard brexit, and more importantly her new best buddies the DUP don't want it.

That's not what sunk Theresa May, as you well know; it was her unexpected social care bombshell and subsequent hesitancy that did it.

If it hadn't been for that, her landslide victory would have been in the bag.

Anyways, if Theresa decided not to pursue hard Brexit, she would have a problem, because her right wing would cause maximum problems for her with their voting power.

Hard brexit wasn't the reason the tories did so poorly it was an abysmal campaign with a ridiculously devisive manifesto and again I'll restate for those who clearly haven't read article 50 hard exit is basically the only option unless your prepared to pay massively both financially and in sovereign powers and even most remain supporters would oppose the levels necessary for a soft brexit. Theresa May for some reason that escapes all of us ran the most pathetic campaign and add in corbyns bribes for votes it was a near perfect political storm.

The consolation is that it just isn't possible for the tories to run another campaign like this so they will rebound while i think corbyn has peaked and it won't be long before labour resume the usual infighting.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

That's not what sunk Theresa May, as you well know; it was her unexpected social care bombshell and subsequent hesitancy that did it.

If it hadn't been for that, her landslide victory would have been in the bag.

Anyways, if Theresa decided not to pursue hard Brexit, she would have a problem, because her right wing would cause maximum problems for her with their voting power.

Most analysis I've read left and right seems to vindicate Mr K's statement - the country does not want a hard Brexit.
That's probably less important though than what the House of Commons wants. Here, Ruth Davidson is likely to pressure Theresa May for a softer Brexit. She has more MPs than the DUP and helped Theresa May cling onto power so her opinion should count for a lot.

[passingbat]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

the country does not want a hard Brexit.
.

Originally Posted by RizzyKing

and again I'll restate for those who clearly haven't read article 50 hard exit is basically the only option and even most remain supporters would oppose the levels necessary for a soft brexit. .

I'm with RizzyKing on this one.


Sadly, some politicians are prepared "to pay massively both financially and in sovereign powers"

[Osem]

Originally Posted by Damien

Well they can do so now without visas or much, if any, paperwork. Won't it be more difficult to do those things post-Brexit?

---------- Post added at 14:03 ---------- Previous post was at 13:58 ----------

Incidentally Ruth Davidson is calling for a 'softer' Brexit: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...enges-theresa/

Although equally there will be many backbenchers who'll refuse anything but a hard Brexit. I think we're now in a situation where there is a consensus in the commons for whatever form of Brexit that will eventually be offered.

It could be but he didn't say that did he - he said they'd been deprived of the chance, not that it might be more difficult. A man of his intellect didn't do that by accident, it's deliberate misinformation and just the sort of nonsense which Labour circulated on social media targeting young people.

[1andrew1]

Interesting analysis.

No matter who forms a government this is the end of hard Brexit
The hard Brexiteers hoped the election would put the final nail in the coffin of those they call the Remoaners. Instead the tables have been turned.
The Remainers have an unexpected spring in their step today. May has paid a very heavy price for ignoring the 48 per cent. The hard Brexiteers, who always feared the prize would somehow be snatched from them even after the referendum, are re-living their worst nightmare.
Brexit will still go ahead, since the Conservatives and Labour, who won more than 80 per cent of the votes between them, both promised that. But it could now be a very different Brexit, a much softer version than the one May wanted. Membership of the single market and customs union, ruled out by May, are now on the agenda.

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/...81006.htmlback

[Julian]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Interesting analysis.

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/...81006.htmlback

Hardly interesting.

Just more of the same from a pro eu publication. It's all been heard ad nausum.

It's no different from anti eu publications trotting out the same tedious statements slightly reworded to amuse the the intellectually challenged.

A moratorium on anything pretending to be news or comment would be appreciated unless either side has anything factually new to add.

[ianch99]

Originally Posted by Julian

Hardly interesting.

Just more of the same from a pro eu publication. It's all been heard ad nausum.

It's no different from anti eu publications trotting out the same tedious statements slightly reworded to amuse the the intellectually challenged.

A moratorium on anything pretending to be news or comment would be appreciated unless either side has anything factually new to add.

Maybe we should have a moratorium on people calling others stupid for having a different point of view

---------- Post added at 08:42 ---------- Previous post was at 08:38 ----------

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Most analysis I've read left and right seems to vindicate Mr K's statement - the country does not want a hard Brexit.
That's probably less important though than what the House of Commons wants. Here, Ruth Davidson is likely to pressure Theresa May for a softer Brexit. She has more MPs than the DUP and helped Theresa May cling onto power so her opinion should count for a lot.

The reality that Hard Brexit is dead is worrying some people. A compromise Brexit is the right path and the PM knows it ..

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

That's not what sunk Theresa May, as you well know; it was her unexpected social care bombshell and subsequent hesitancy that did it.

If it hadn't been for that, her landslide victory would have been in the bag.

Anyways, if Theresa decided not to pursue hard Brexit, she would have a problem, because her right wing would cause maximum problems for her with their voting power.

The Times is reporting Philip Hammond has agreed to stay only if May prioritises jobs and the economy when it comes to Brexit and Ruth Davidson has thrown her support behind that as well. Even David Davies suggested the plan might be to be revisited.

The election may have been lost elsewhere but the fact remains May campaigned for a strong mandate for her version of Brexit and she didn't get it. She is going to have to listen to others now.

[1andrew1]

I think we'll see more of this as the trade-off between jobs/wealth creation and a hard Brexit becomes more explicit. This would have happened regardless of the election result but organisations may be emboldened to make their needs more transparent rather than resorting to behind-the-scenes lobbying.

The Sunday Times Airbus threatens to move jobs over Brexit
Just days before the government is due to begin talks with the EU, the aerospace giant’s chief operating officer has set “minimum” conditions on free movement of workers, trade tariffs and regulatory conditions.
Business leaders are stepping up their Brexit-related demands following the election result, widely interpreted as a rebuke to Theresa May’s plans for a “hard Brexit”.
Airbus designs and builds wings for roughly half the world’s aircraft in Filton, near Bristol, and Broughton, north Wales. The two sites have about 10,000 staff and the company claims to support 100,000 British jobs.
While current projects, such as work on the best-selling A320 jet and A380 superjumbo, would stay in Britain, Fabrice Brégier warned that the country could lose out on the next generation of models. Germany has long coveted Britain’s wing manufacturing, and would be likely to offer state support.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/b...exit-lcwm7mjng (paywall)

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by Damien

The Times is reporting Philip Hammond has agreed to stay only if May prioritises jobs and the economy when it comes to Brexit and Ruth Davidson has thrown her support behind that as well. Even David Davies suggested the plan might be to be revisited.

The election may have been lost elsewhere but the fact remains May campaigned for a strong mandate for her version of Brexit and she didn't get it. She is going to have to listen to others now.

Again, Theresa May did not lose seats because of 'hard Brexit'! It was the social care policy that upset her campaign.

A hard Brexit with agreements not to impose tariffs would surely be the better outcome economically than staying in the common market.