General : Traffic Management Changes - April 2nd

[SnoopZ]

Originally Posted by General Maximus

let me know what page it is on because I couldnt be arsed to trawl through all 50 of them

This post from Craig.

http://community.virginmedia.com/t5/...132719#M123721

I was thinking this was the double speed upgrade so not sure if that is included?

[Chrysalis]

no its the STM changes.

[PowerUser]

It's a good thing then that Virgin aren't a major Supercar Manufacturer, They would sell you the car, But told you that you were only allowed to drive it for 3 hours a week.

If the infrastucture is so poor that 10% of its members can't be heavy users, Then they shouldn't be boasting and bringing out higher speeds.

It's a real shame they have the only exclusive fibre optic network, I'm sure if other companies controlled fibre optic network and rebranded it, they would offer much better deals.

[carlwaring]

Originally Posted by PowerUser

It's a good thing then that Virgin aren't a major Supercar Manufacturer, They would sell you the car, But told you that you were only allowed to drive it for 3 hours a week....

...at 70mph. The rest of the week you'd be limited to 50mph.

If you're going to make an analogy, at least get it right

Originally Posted by PowerUser

If the infrastucture is so poor that 10% of its members can't be heavy users, Then they shouldn't be boasting and bringing out higher speeds.

Just for interest, the advertising rules state that any headline speed must be achievable by only 10% of users. Well, VM's headline speeds are constantly achieved by 66% of it's users. Just saying

It's a real shame they have the only exclusive fibre optic network, I'm sure if other companies controlled fibre optic network and rebranded it, they would offer much better deals.

Complete and utter speculation and therefore not worth con

[PowerUser]

Originally Posted by carlwaring

...at 70mph. The rest of the week you'd be limited to 50mph.

If you're going to make an analogy, at least get it right

That is your analogy not mine, It's a matter of opinion, Ever heard of It!!
Stop being so arragant as to thinking your right.
Limitation can be as harmful as not at all.

Originally Posted by carlwaring

Just for interest, the advertising rules state that any headline speed must be achievable by only 10% of users. Well, VM's headline speeds are constantly achieved by 66% of it's users. Just saying


Complete and utter speculation and therefore not worth con

Oh Dear!!...

[Chrysalis]

Some of the other proposals the ASA had but turned down were.

To require 50% of users able to reach speed.
To use a typical speed range.

I think given by adsl stats I seen on another forum ended up using 10% because its conveniantly close to 16meg on adsl2+ and so looks clear to me this 10% was done with the cooperation of the isp's. Making it a very easy win for VM since they dont worry about sync speeds they will just need 10% of areas to be uncongested as well as 10% of users not affected by STM.

[carlwaring]

Originally Posted by PowerUser

That is your analogy not mine...

Well it was based on your analogy but it was factually inaccurate as you are not permanently limited to a slower speed.

It's a matter of opinion, Ever heard of It!!

If you based your opinions base on incorrect fact then your opinion is suspect.

Stop being so arragant as to thinking your right.

In this case, though, I am right.

Limitation can be as harmful as not at all.

Is that some Chinese proverb or something?

---------- Post added at 22:15 ---------- Previous post was at 22:10 ----------

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

Some of the other proposals the ASA had but turned down were.

To require 50% of users able to reach speed.

That would have been my choice and would be a far better indicator.

I think given by adsl stats I seen on another forum ended up using 10% because its conveniantly close to 16meg on adsl2+ and so looks clear to me this 10% was done with the cooperation of the isp's.

A sound theory, Mr Holmes :p

Making it a very easy win for VM since they dont worry about sync speeds they will just need 10% of areas to be uncongested as well as 10% of users not affected by STM.

Well, like I said, right now officially 66% of users get VM's headline speed; and that's with congestion and STM. (As far as we know!)

[broadbandking]

Originally Posted by PowerUser

It's a good thing then that Virgin aren't a major Supercar Manufacturer, They would sell you the car, But told you that you were only allowed to drive it for 3 hours a week.

If the infrastucture is so poor that 10% of its members can't be heavy users, Then they shouldn't be boasting and bringing out higher speeds.

It's a real shame they have the only exclusive fibre optic network, I'm sure if other companies controlled fibre optic network and rebranded it, they would offer much better deals.

I take it you don't like VM or the new STM.

[carlwaring]

Clearly not. Nor does he do analogies very well; and seems to like making up things that he cannot possibly back up with facts.

So far I have had two people tell me to "get my analogy right" yet not only was it not my analogy in the first place. neither has offered me any clue as to what was wrong with it in the first place. So they can't back-up their own arguments either!

ETA:
Actually, I just noticed the "flaw", but it's probably not the one the OP was thinking of. His analogy is completely wrong from the outset!

If the analogy was right, it would be this.

"It's a good thing then that Virgin aren't a major Supercar Manufacturer they would sell you the car but tell you that, whilst you can drive it at its top speed most of the time if, at certain times, you travel at full speed for more than a certain amount of time, you will then be limited to 50mph for the next five hours. The rest of the week you'd be limited to 50mph."

There. Glad I got that off my mind

[kwikbreaks]

Originally Posted by carlwaring

How did I not spot that?!

It would seem that contrary to your obvious opinion of yourself you are not actually perfect.

[Rexz]

Originally Posted by carlwaring

Clearly not. Nor does he do analogies very well; and seems to like making up things that he cannot possibly back up with facts.

So far I have had two people tell me to "get my analogy right" yet not only was it not my analogy in the first place. neither has offered me any clue as to what was wrong with it in the first place. So they can't back-up their own arguments either!

ETA:
Actually, I just noticed the "flaw", but it's probably not the one the OP was thinking of. I put the figures the wrong way round! How did I not spot that?!

Why don't you get back to your web browsing and email reading and leave the real downloading to us. Clearly through this thread you have gone on and on how you think the traffic management is fine and everyone should embrace it, and you seem the first to attack anyone that should disagree with it or you. Of course it won't affect you because you obviously don't utilise your connection. I'm sure VM will have a favourite little spot for you in their customer database, right under MUG...

[carlwaring]

Originally Posted by kwikbreaks

It would seem that contrary to your obvious opinion of yourself you are not actually perfect.

Actually, I have never suspected for a second that I am.

---------- Post added at 09:08 ---------- Previous post was at 08:57 ----------

Originally Posted by Rexz

Why don't you get back to your web browsing and email reading and leave the real downloading to us. Clearly through this thread you have gone on and on how you think the traffic management is fine and everyone should embrace it...

Of course, you couldn't be more wrong if you tried. I have never ever wrote anywhere that I "think the traffic management is fine and everyone should embrace it". I don't like STM and I don't like that VM use it. I do, however, understand and accept the reasons for its use. Unlike, say, you for example.

.. and you seem the first to attack anyone that should disagree with it or you.

Again. Completely and utterly incorrect. I am not "the first" to do anything but I certainly don't see why we should put up with the complete nonsense that some people seem to come out with against VM just for putting measures in places that they don't like. Bad analogies, for example. Furthermore, if I didn't like people disagreeing with me I wouldn't spend so much time posting on a public forum, would I?

Of course it won't affect you because you obviously don't utilise your connection.

I am currently "utilising my connection" to correct you. No surprise you have a problem with that

I'm sure VM will have a favourite little spot for you in their customer database, right under MUG...

At least I don't insult people.

[lucid]

I spent about an hour on the phone enquiring about this and tbh the staff hadn't a clue in terms of understanding it or how the present or future management system was implemented.

All i wanted to know were the times

On the new page it says the following: for example on XL30 (not upgraded yet):

for DL only (not p2p) it seems the traffic management is from 10am - 3pm
then 4pm - 9pm

So does that mean there is no limit counted between 3pm and 4pm because one could easily on a 30meg connection DL 9GB.

And is there no management after 9pm?

The reason i ask is CS insisted it was all active until midnight, even though i thought this was just p2p filesharing. ( i don't do that so no real concern for me).

[Ken Jude]

Originally Posted by lucid

On the new page it says the following: for example on XL30 (not upgraded yet):

for DL only (not p2p) it seems the traffic management is from 10am - 3pm
then 4pm - 9pm

So does that mean there is no limit counted between 3pm and 4pm because one could easily on a 30meg connection DL 9GB.

And is there no management after 9pm?

Correct, you can have as many gigs incoming between 3pm and 4pm as you like (* but see the end for a rider to that comment). And there is no management after 9pm. Note that it's total traffic that counts towards the limit between 10am-3pm and 4pm-9pm, the source is irrelevent. So if you are streaming HD video from a sports service (e.g. baseball premium service) you WILL be STMd after less than three hours viewing on the XL30 service as your data will go over 3.5Gigs. So you are punished exactly the same as any torrent users who go over 3.5Gigs in the same period.

What there still is after 9pm is traffic shaping - all traffic incoming to the Virgin network is analysed to see whether it comes from "acceptable" sources like general web browsing, mail, streaming from iPlayer and other media sources etc. or whether it comes from "less acceptable" sources such as torrents, newsgroups and presumably whatever file download sites are the flavour of the month after the last lot were closed down. (Obviously quotes as it's my quick and dirty definition)

And traffic from the latter is still shaped up til midnight I believe from a posting Ben made a while ago. Which means they constrain how much of that traffic is allowed and share it around (as I understand it). And have apparently been doing so more aggressively since the new traffic policy came in on 2nd April. They don't constrain web browsing, iPlayer and the like under that traffic shsaping (but as above, it will count towards your data use in peak periods).

* But note that some people have indicated they have been TM'd for data downloaded between 3pm and 4pm, so it's not entirely clear whether the practice matches what they've published.

[lucid]

Thank you for yr reply it is confusing as i was told they do manage between 3 and 4 but they couldn't explain the hours gap, as well as saying all traffic was managed until midnight.

Well i got my speed reduced about 10pm after downloading large files needed for adobe premier elements so i don't believe what they publish is what is really happening.