[Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
18-11-2020, 20:48
|
#511
|
The Dark Satanic Mills
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: floating in the ether
Posts: 12,053
|
Re: [Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
All this means is car manufacturers will be heavily marketing all the countries that don’t ban the internal combustion engine.
Much in the same way the Tobacco industry continues to thrive and marketed around most of the world were there aren’t any restrictions
__________________
The wheel's still turning but the hamsters dead.
|
|
|
18-11-2020, 20:48
|
#512
|
cf.mega poster
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,235
|
Re: [Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking
New R&D in petrol cars is now going to end. In time, as demand for petrol reduces, fewer petrol stations will remain open, and those that do will increase their prices because of the increase in costs with reduced sales.
The energy suppliers can cope with the varying supply of wind power because there is surplus supply from elsewhere, so talk of "the current system can cope" is misleading.
Add in the effect of moving away from household gas central heating and you have further demands on the electricity system.
Going to be fun when there is a power cut in an area.
Cycling? How does that work in bad weather? News reports on cycling only seem to occur in fine weather. Try doing it in heavy wind, rain, snow, or even sunshine.
Too many gimmick based policies.
|
Global warming is a reality and needs to be addressed, doing so is not a gimmick or fad it's a necessary human and economic reality.
I don't think that the timescales under consideration seem unreasonable and with global efforts focused on battery development, peaks and troughs in power generation can be ironed out.
Well done to BoJo.
|
|
|
18-11-2020, 20:49
|
#513
|
The Dark Satanic Mills
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: floating in the ether
Posts: 12,053
|
Re: [Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K
Don't worry old chap Boris knows what he is doing, honest,. have faith....
Princess Nut Nuts is a good influence and our prime policy maker.
Meat eating will also be outlawed by 2033.
|
You been drinking again?
__________________
The wheel's still turning but the hamsters dead.
|
|
|
18-11-2020, 20:54
|
#514
|
cf.mega poster
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,235
|
Re: [Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre
All this means is car manufacturers will be heavily marketing all the countries that don’t ban the internal combustion engine.
Much in the same way the Tobacco industry continues to thrive and marketed around most of the world were there aren’t any restrictions
|
That's not an argument against these initiatives, though.
Furthermore, car manufacturers are wedded to profits, not a means of propulsion. If electric cars become cheaper globally through initiatives like these, then they will displace internal combustion engines in some countries where such initiatives are not taking place.
|
|
|
18-11-2020, 21:02
|
#515
|
Remoaner
Cable Forum Team
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 32,236
|
Re: [Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
Yeah, the car industry isn't especially wedded to the future of the oil companies. A national transition to a new engine is an opportunity for them to sell more cars. These companies have been preparing for this for a while with a lot - if not most - already selling electric versions of some of their most popular models.
There is still another 10 years to go as well which is plenty of time for them to shift their focus.
|
|
|
18-11-2020, 21:11
|
#516
|
cf.mega poster
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Northampton
Services: Virgin Media TV&BB 350Mb,
V6 STB
Posts: 7,866
|
Re: [Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1
That's not an argument against these initiatives, though.
Furthermore, car manufacturers are wedded to profits, not a means of propulsion. If electric cars become cheaper globally through initiatives like these, then they will displace internal combustion engines in some countries where such initiatives are not taking place.
|
How will they become magically cheaper?
Rare earth elements are rare.
Battery raw materials could face a supply crunch by the mid-2020s. Link
Quote:
The experts have also calculated that based on the latest battery technology (80 per cent nickel, 10 per cent cobalt, 10 per cent manganese), UK demand for EV batteries will require almost the total amount of neodymium produced globally each year, three quarter’s of the world’s lithium, and “at least half” of the world’s copper.
The letter, authored by a team of eight scientists headed by the Natural History Museum’s head of earth sciences, professor Richard Herrington, explains that to replace the UK’s cars with EVs will require 207,900 tonnes of cobalt, 264,600 tonnes of lithium carbonate and “at least” 7,200 tonnes of neodymium and dysprosium, as well as 2,362,500 tonnes of copper.
|
And that's just to supply the UK.
|
|
|
18-11-2020, 21:19
|
#517
|
Trollsplatter
Cable Forum Team
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: North of Watford
Services: Humane elimination of all common Internet pests
Posts: 36,959
|
Re: [Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking
|
There’s clearly a role for hydrogen fuel cells in cars. Hydrogen production is part of the strategy announced today.
|
|
|
18-11-2020, 21:20
|
#518
|
Woke and proud !
Join Date: Jun 2004
Services: TV, Phone, BB, a wife
Posts: 9,151
|
Re: [Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking
|
So what's your solution to climate change and our ever dwindling fossil fuel supply? Get a bike?
|
|
|
18-11-2020, 21:26
|
#519
|
cf.mega poster
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Northampton
Services: Virgin Media TV&BB 350Mb,
V6 STB
Posts: 7,866
|
Re: [Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris
There’s clearly a role for hydrogen fuel cells in cars. Hydrogen production is part of the strategy announced today.
|
And where will this hydrogen come from?
They still rely on rare earth metals for the electric motors.
|
|
|
18-11-2020, 21:34
|
#520
|
Sad Doig Fan!
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Barry South Wales
Age: 68
Services: With VM for BB 250Mb service.(Deal)
Posts: 11,666
|
Re: [Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking
And where will this hydrogen come from?
They still rely on rare earth metals for the electric motors.
|
We have oceans of hydrogen.
|
|
|
18-11-2020, 21:34
|
#521
|
Dr Pepper Addict
Cable Forum Team
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Nottingham
Age: 61
Services: Flextel SIP : Sky Mobile : Sky Q TV : VM BB (1000 Mbps) : Aquiss FTTP (330 Mbps)
Posts: 27,785
|
Re: [Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
Of course, producing Hydrogen from those 'oceans' requires electricity in the first place.
Also, despite what some believe, burning hydrogen does produce emissions.
When burned in normal air, you get small amounts of Nitrogen Oxides, and of course, lots of water vapour.
What will be the effect of tons and tons of water vapour being added to the atmosphere I wonder (its a potent 'greenhouse gas').
__________________
Baby, I was born this way.
|
|
|
18-11-2020, 21:36
|
#522
|
laeva recumbens anguis
Cable Forum Team
Join Date: Jun 2006
Age: 67
Services: Premiere Collection
Posts: 42,132
|
Re: [Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
More rain to provide water to create hydrogen from?
__________________
There is always light.
If only we’re brave enough to see it.
If only we’re brave enough to be it.
If my post is in bold and this colour, it's a Moderator Request.
|
|
|
18-11-2020, 21:36
|
#523
|
Dr Pepper Addict
Cable Forum Team
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Nottingham
Age: 61
Services: Flextel SIP : Sky Mobile : Sky Q TV : VM BB (1000 Mbps) : Aquiss FTTP (330 Mbps)
Posts: 27,785
|
Re: [Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh
More rain to provide water to create hydrogen from?
|
.. and more floods ...
__________________
Baby, I was born this way.
|
|
|
18-11-2020, 21:50
|
#524
|
The Dark Satanic Mills
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: floating in the ether
Posts: 12,053
|
Re: [Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking
|
It was reported that there were enough resources to replace the current global internal combustion engine fleet just about.
So given that replacing that fleet would take decades it’s not really an issue initially.
But roll on many decades.
Lithium-ion batteries recycling rate from used batteries to new is between 70-80%. That means diminishing returns of around 25%.
So, much like “fossil”* fuels, lithium is a finite resource and will run out eventually, we’ll be dead by then, but my Grandchildren will be buzzing around in their classic 2019 Mustang that i will have left them.
* if you believe oil to be a fossil fuel, for which there is no evidence.
__________________
The wheel's still turning but the hamsters dead.
|
|
|
18-11-2020, 22:09
|
#525
|
Trollsplatter
Cable Forum Team
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: North of Watford
Services: Humane elimination of all common Internet pests
Posts: 36,959
|
Re: [Updated] New petrol & diesel car sales banned from 2030
If you produce hydrogen by electrolysis of water, first of all you can do it with excess electricity production from the grid, given the massive increase in offshore wind that’s being proposed. If you split water into H and O2 then all your fuel cell does is recombine it. There is no net increase in water in the environment because you’re just putting back what you took out. Any chemical impurities can be filtered or chemically altered in the vehicle exhaust system just as is the case now.
Besides all this, there’s no need to worry so much about lithium because we’re not very far away from a practical lithium-sulphur battery that has the potential to double EV range - or half the size of the battery required.
I think we’re going to see a future of mixed approaches to providing electric power to vehicles. There’s room in it for hydrogen and batteries.
|
|
|
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 2 (0 members and 2 guests)
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:28.
|