Anti-gay adverts pulled from bus campaign by Boris Johnson

Originally Posted by Gary L

Ah, but does he though?

he may have created them but their thoughts are their own. that's what it's all about. choices and gateways in life that one is expected to follow and not drift from.

Bloody hell Gary ,that's a bit deep for you ,i think you'd better go have a lie down

---------- Post added at 15:49 ---------- Previous post was at 15:34 ----------

A Christian group is taking legal action against Mayor of London Boris Johnson after he banned bus advertisements suggesting gay people could be cured.

http://news.sky.com/home/politics/article/16207800

Boris is getting sued over it now

[TheDaddy]

Don't like the sound of the cured bit, anyone know what their cure is, bet it's a form of aversion therapy involving genitals, gay porn and electrodes...

Strangely enough, I know quite a few gay people, but don't know any ex-gay or post-gays......

Seeing as Marty has jolted the thread back on topic, I should point out that as far as I can see, the Christian group concerned here is possibly a few hymn books short of a service, if you see what I mean. Treating homosexual inclinations or urges as a curable condition in isolation from anything else the Bible calls 'sin' is bogus and misses the point of what sin is. The Christian belief is that all people exist in a state of moral fallen-ness, imperfect before a perfect God. In acknowledging this, and God's remedy (the death of Jesus, seeing as it's Easter, we might as well dwell on that a moment), the Christian benefits from forgiveness of sins committed as a result of being in a sinful state. The Christian also benefits from the indwelling power of God in the form of the Holy Spirit, so that as the believer grows day by day in faith and trust in God, so he finds in himself the Divine power to choose not to commit sins.

We are taught that while our souls and spirits are cleansed as a result of placing our trust in God, our physical bodies remain fallen and will remain fallen until we are one day resurrected to a new life, just as Jesus was resurrected on the third day. As our physical bodies remain fallen, they remain subject to all the temptations and trials they ever were - including, for some people, the tendency to be attracted to the same sex.

The only sense in which a Christian can be 'cured' of homosexuality is the same way in which a Christian is 'cured' of any sinful behaviour, which is the daily growth in reliance on the Holy Spirit dwelling in us, guiding us and granting us God's power in the face of temptation.

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

Don't like the sound of the cured bit, anyone know what their cure is, bet it's a form of aversion therapy involving genitals, gay porn and electrodes...

so it's either adventurous sex or just plain brainwashing

[/QUOTE]

---------- Post added at 18:01 ---------- Previous post was at 17:59 ----------

As an example of how some people are thinking and the problems we as a society are having in understanding homosexuality i have unashamedly lifted this from another forum i frequent posted by a member

Boris Johnson has banned an advert from London buses about giving up homosexuality.

First, why should any advert be banned if it is for something that causes no harm? Free speech is still important to some of us.

Second, what does this tell us about attitudes to homosexuality?

Suppose you are gay and content to be gay. Fair enough. Suppose you are gay and not content to be gay. Suppose you want to stop being gay. Surely that too is fair enough - but Boris Johnson says no.

If you are gay, you must stay gay, even if you do not want to. So says the fascist Mayor of London.

[danielf]

Originally Posted by martyh

[/COLOR]As an example of how some people are thinking and the problems we as a society are having in understanding homosexuality i have unashamedly lifted this from another forum i frequent posted by a member

I think it's debatable that this ad causes no harm, so the 'free speech' argument is a bit of a red herring. Also, no-one is guaranteed free speech on London buses. I think I'd struggle if I wanted to advertise an X-rated movie. Some things are just not approporiate, and TfL is perfectly within its rights to not allow certain ads. As for Boris being fascist for banning an ad that promotes division is just laughable...

Originally Posted by danielf

I think it's debatable that this ad causes no harm, so the 'free speech' argument is a bit of a red herring. Also, no-one is guaranteed free speech on London buses. I think I'd struggle if I wanted to advertise an X-rated movie. Some things are just not approporiate, and TfL is perfectly within its rights to not allow certain ads. As for Boris being fascist for banning an ad that promotes division is just laughable...

The whole post is a load of rowlocks ,but it does show what harm the advert could do .It would serve to perpetuate the myth that "gayness" can be cured and idiots like that poster believe them because "it must be right it was written on a bus"

Originally Posted by martyh

The whole post is a load of rowlocks ,but it does show what harm the advert could do .It would serve to perpetuate the myth that "gayness" can be cured and idiots like that poster believe them because "it must be right it was written on a bus"

I think we're on a very dangerous slippery slope when we start banning unpopular views for being potentially harmful - especially when the scientific jury is still well and truly out.

The fact is, we do not know whether 'gayness' can be addressed with a medical or psychiatric treatment because the cause of 'gayness' is still not understood.

From the mighty wiki:

Biology and sexual orientation is the subject of research into the role of biology in the development of human sexual orientation. No simple, single cause for sexual orientation has been conclusively demonstrated. Various studies point to different, even conflicting positions, such as a combination of genetic, hormonal, and environmental influences,[1] with biological factors involving a complex interplay of genetic factors and the early uterine environment,[2] or no genetic influence.[3] Biological factors which may be related to the development of a heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual or asexual orientation include genes, prenatal hormones, and brain structure.

And some interesting thoughts from Brendan O'Neill in in today's Telegraph blogs:

The idea that homosexuality is a determined trait is new in gay-rights activism. It would have been anathema to the gay campaigners of yesteryear. Indeed, they once kicked against the idea. In the bad old days, the conservative side claimed homosexuality was "an involuntary physical condition", arguing that there was something different in the "cerebral cortex" of homosexuals – that they were somehow diseased.
Today's trendy belief in the "gay gene" echoes these old ideas about a "gay germ" that carried through to the 1950s.

[danielf]

Originally Posted by Chris

I think we're on a very dangerous slippery slope when we start banning unpopular views for being potentially harmful - especially when the scientific jury is still well and truly out.

Not allowing them to advertise on London buses and 'banning the view' are two rather different things...

Banned from a certain outlet, then ... an outlet that has already been used, without intervention from TfL, to advertise the opposing view.

[danielf]

Originally Posted by Chris

Banned from a certain outlet, then ... an outlet that has already been used, without intervention from TfL, to advertise the opposing view.

True, but this view is divisive, and potentially harmful. The other isn't. Plus, as I said earlier, advertising on London buses is not a right.

Originally Posted by Chris

I think we're on a very dangerous slippery slope when we start banning unpopular views for being potentially harmful - especially when the scientific jury is still well and truly out.

The fact is, we do not know whether 'gayness' can be addressed with a medical or psychiatric treatment because the cause of 'gayness' is still not understood.

From the mighty wiki:



And some interesting thoughts from Brendan O'Neill in in today's Telegraph blogs:

In my opinion Chris they may as well investigate why some people like cats as opposed to dogs .Reasons why people are gay and even if they want to be gay or not are not the issue imo,the issue is why people feel they need to be 'cured' ,if that's possible .

Question ....what would happen if scientists did find a 'cure' for homosexuality ?

Another question ....what should happen if scientists found a 'cure' for homosexuality?

There's no mystery as to why some people want a cure for homosexual urges or preferences. That way of living is proscribed by at least three of the world's major religions (Christianity, Islam, Judaism). Possibly some of the others too. And most of the world is still religious, a fact that often escapes atheists and agnostics living in the UK and not realising that the secular transformation taking place in this country is, by and large, not being repeated elsewhere.

[danielf]

Originally Posted by Chris

There's no mystery as to why some people want a cure for homosexual urges or preferences. That way of living is proscribed by at least three of the world's major religions (Christianity, Islam, Judaism). Possibly some of the others too. And most of the world is still religious, a fact that often escapes atheists and agnostics living in the UK and not realising that the secular transformation taking place in this country is, by and large, not being repeated elsewhere.

Replace UK with Western World, and you might have a point. Might...

Originally Posted by Chris

There's no mystery as to why some people want a cure for homosexual urges or preferences. That way of living is proscribed by at least three of the world's major religions (Christianity, Islam, Judaism). Possibly some of the others too. And most of the world is still religious, a fact that often escapes atheists and agnostics living in the UK and not realising that the secular transformation taking place in this country is, by and large, not being repeated elsewhere.

So given that is correct ,which i accept it is ,what should happen with any cure in relation to religions like christianity who have started to accept homosexuality ?