Benefit cuts are fuelling abuse of disabled people, say charities

Originally Posted by martyh

So what your saying is basically that over the last decade or so there has been an epidemic of mental health issues .Why all of a sudden are so many people being classed as disabled either physical or mental ?Why are more people claiming disability benefits of some kind than are claiming unemployment benefit ?

have a read of this it's a good article imo .

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/br...nefits-debate/

Are you saying people want to be classed as mentally ill to get benefits? Would you want to get the stigma of being considered mentally incapable for the rest of your life?Because I can assure you it is something that follows you around where ever you go.Even those who are mentally ill don't want to be classed as such and will do anything to hide the fact.

Originally Posted by Maggy J

Are you saying people want to be classed as mentally ill to get benefits? Would you want to get the stigma of being considered mentally incapable for the rest of your life?Because I can assure you it is something that follows you around where ever you go.Even those who are mentally ill don't want to be classed as such and will do anything to hide the fact.

so where is this sickness coming from ,why are so many people classed as mentally ill .Is it the water ,the food ?something must be causing it .You insist that people don't want to be classed as mentally ill so by extension they must be genuine claimants ,then something is causing the problem,what ?.

Originally Posted by martyh

so where is this sickness coming from ,why are so many people classed as mentally ill .Is it the water ,the food ?something must be causing it .You insist that people don't want to be classed as mentally ill so by extension they must be genuine claimants ,then something is causing the problem,what ?.

Maybe everyone is finding a society that couldn't give a toss about the next man/women/child rather stressful.Maybe modern life is more stressful.Maybe two wars in 10 years and the terrorist attacks have added to everyone's anxiety.Then we have a never ending recession where being poor makes you a target for those who hate poor people.Personally I can't say that I KNOW that there are more mentally ill than ever before and I suspect you have no more idea about that either.

Maybe if the Daily Mail and other papers of that ilk would actually report truthful news for a change we would have a happier society.

[peanut]

Originally Posted by martyh

Quite clearly you think that every claimant is justified and every claimant should be given money and support which what is so wrong with the system .Not all disabled need support ,that is a fact whether you like it or not .

Now where did I say every claimant should be paid disability? But I do agree, quite a lot of people do get turned down for Incap/DLA, Because they don't qualify, or down to a factor of just filling in the forms wrongly. But what I do object to is people like yourself saying the way things are now going to be is justifiable.

There will be a lot of people who are genuinely disabled and totally incapable of work who rely on their benefits only to find out the goalposts have now moved way beyond what people 'signed up' for. I was told that the Tories will be making the process easier (sounded good), and I was told that those that need help will get it (sounded even better). But according to you all that is still correct and that's what you believe, well unless you know what you're talking about, you'll see that really is far far from the truth. We've (the genuine) have been hung out and left to dry, but you say you welcome this.. So hopefully you can now see why you've put a few backs up here.

Originally Posted by Maggy J

.Personally I can't say that I KNOW that there are more mentally ill than ever before and I suspect you have no more idea about that either.
.

I don't ,i just took Angua at her word but the figures produced by HMG seem to support it .

around 300 people out of 1,000 will experience mental health problems every year in Britain
230 of these will visit a GP
102 of these will be diagnosed as having a mental health problem
24 of these will be referred to a specialist psychiatric service
6 will become inpatients in psychiatric hospitals.

http://www.mind.org.uk/help/research...ental_distress

[Taf]

Some medications can cause mental side-effects (Strattera for ADHD is one as my daughter has found out). But the side-effects are less of a problem than the original problem.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atomoxetine

[mertle]

Martyh also fails to see there been quite few accidents which increased health issues for many not talking the fake car accidentsthe proper accident which done damage. Then there new illnesses even new people collapse or feel ill diagnosed with number illnesses or combinations.

Now they maybe shorterm or long term they still have the right to claim if they pass the new goalpost.

I am not shocked disabilty going up because all these factors.

What are you proposition to solve it LIFO system we only allowed X number those who aint died yet or cured get drop for new member in the queue. It dont work like that you will get sadly increases while medication keeps disabled to live longer or should we be inhumane pull this needed medication. I not suprised with the atitudes and verbal attacks many disabled feel like giving up let the swines win.

Maggy you forgot to mention squeeze on pay high costs one of the biggest factors for mental breakdowns not actually suprised this going up as we see society crumble. Its another short sightedness that it will cause stress anxiety.

The purge on disabled, poor, unemployed will also create big increase.

Once people see no end see money shrink they become inward and depression sets in. I believe the pattern was before during the great depression too. Anxiety, stress, depression link to recessions

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/20...ealth-problems


Suicides go up too sadly although this american so we will get told not in uk it wont.

http://www.boston.com/lifestyle/heal...des_surge.html

Originally Posted by mertle

Martyh also fails to see there been quite few accidents which increased health issues for many not talking the fake car accidentsthe proper accident which done damage. Then there new illnesses even new people collapse or feel ill diagnosed with number illnesses or combinations.

Quite a few accidents ? care to give any details of this sudden increase in car accidents because I'm buggered if i can find anything about it ,and i feel sure that if the accident rate had risen so much as to noticeably affect the amount of disability claimants i think we would all be aware of it ......not to mention very worried

Having taken some time off and got over my little bout of depression i am getting my sense of perspective back. What i think the problem is different perspectives and understanding on the two sides. On the one side you have taxpayers being bombarded with negative media exaggerating the scale of the problem within the benefits system being drip fed stories of ridiculous abuse of the system. They also have the government being alittle creative on the information side to keep the taxpayer supportive of this welfare reform process.

On the other side you have those within the system who have a better understanding of how things are changing and negatively the changes are being implemented and how unfairly the changes are being applied. Both sides are upset and neither side is listening to to the other side putting the arguments both sides hsve down to whinging and others with an agenda making sure the divide cannot be bridged.

I voted tory at the last election i fell hook line and sinker for the slick talk and the "we're all in it together" rhetoric and whilst i expected some of it to disappear once they got into power but i never imagined for one minute how badly they would divide this country. I have always agreed that welfare needs reform but i cannot in all honesty support this
current state of reform it has nothing to do with helping those who need it. This whole process is about saving money by whatever means necessary and is so stupidly short sighted it beggers belief.

[mertle]

Originally Posted by martyh

Quite a few accidents ? care to give any details of this sudden increase in car accidents because I'm buggered if i can find anything about it ,and i feel sure that if the accident rate had risen so much as to noticeably affect the amount of disability claimants i think we would all be aware of it ......not to mention very worried

No not just talking car accidents alone just when you see whole scope things understand why it could increase. Alsorts acidents even those who pursue life on edge hobbies not saying they should'nt but risks they take can often result in severe injuries. Then there the conflicts we had in last ten years where unfortunate very brave soldiers who sadly have been badly disabled for there country.

All you have to factor in lots cases we will see accident great they recover. Many will be just mere minor but there many who endup with bad disibilities or complications. Plus martyh people just become sick its human nature whether they sick enough the system there to decide. I think we hope it balances but as world changes risks get taken inocents get hurt. I wont even factor for self inflicited which why governments urged the healthy living mantra over the years they saw it coming. Many will cite the smokers many got lied to years back it was safe in thing to do. We as nation cant turn our backs on them surely.

Now you could argue we could change the law insurance pick the tab up for healthcare/living of that person now they cant work. If they did would hate to see what sort numbers insurance premiums goto for those without to cover those claims. fear this may happen at somepoint to ofset costs. Not problem if those dont claim get shafted.

Should business support someone who gets badly injured unable to work due to malpractise. Its certainly food for thought but I not advocating it its defenate one for discusion.

[Gary L]

Incapacity tests reject 37% of claimants

"To have such a high percentage who are fit for work just emphasises what a complete waste of human lives the current system has been," the minister said.
"We know that for many it will be a long haul back to work but it's much better to help them on the journey than to leave them on benefits for the rest of their lives."

However the TUC's general secretary, Brendan Barber, said the test was designed purely to kick people off benefits, "whatever the cost".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-17379564

[Jimmy-J]

Originally Posted by Gary L

Incapacity tests reject 37% of claimants

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-17379564

And those that are told they are fit to work, (but are really in no fit state to do any work), have to go through the appeals process, and are normally having to wait around 8 to 9 months for their appeal to be heard. (probably a lot longer now due to a backlog).

Also, what about the genuinely disabled who are too scared to appeal the DWP's (with the help of the ATOS examiners) decision? I wonder what the figures would drop to then?

No wonder some of these "victims" find suicide to be the only viable option. What effects do they have on the overall figures?

However, the new figures did not include information on appeals claimants are entitled to lodge.

Charities claim that as many as 40 per cent of people who are assessed fit to work appeal against that verdict and 40 per cent of those appeals succeed.

Paul Farmer of the mental health charity Mind accused ministers of being misleading by omitting appeals from the figures.

He said: "Today's figures do not accurately reflect how many people are genuinely fit for work. The numbers are misleading as they do not show the full effect of the people who appeal the outcome of their assessment and the 40 per cent of these appeals which are successful.

"The work capability assessment is a flawed process and is causing anxiety and pain for thousands of people who are trapped in a cycle of reassessments and appeals.”

The DWP conceded that appeals will eventually reduce the headline figures from the reassessment exercise.
“The final proportion who are deemed fit to work is likely to fall as some appeals will be successful,” the department said.

Link

[Alan Fry]

All this is a waste of time and money, that could be spend creating new decent jobs

[peanut]

Originally Posted by Alan Fry

All this is a waste of time and money, that could be spend creating new decent jobs

When are you going to add something proper and constructive to a topic? I can't see any sense on most of your posts, and it's getting annoying when you see a new post then hoping that there's something to add to a topic only to see that you keep posting the same rubbish throughout each threads.

Yes please stick to the topic.