Huge fire at West London tower block

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by Damien

Not sure how accurate the 600 people figure is but there were many families in that block. Children could share a room etc.

That still works out at around an average of 3.5 children per extra bedroom(98) and assuming 2 adults per adult bedroom(127). An average means some will be less and some will be more.

40x1 bed, 80x2 bed, 3x3 bed, 4x4 bed.

Originally Posted by nomadking

That still works out at around an average of 3.5 children per extra bedroom(98) and assuming 2 adults per adult bedroom(127). An average means some will be less and some will be more.

40x1 bed, 80x2 bed, 3x3 bed, 4x4 bed.

I'm not sure. There is likely be some over-occupancy in some flats but the suggestion of some immigrants being in there and illegal sublets seems to mean there isn't a definitive list of residents.

[Hom3r]

Well I heard that there where 5 members in a two bedroom flat, so 600 is easily reached.

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Most construction companies work on 3-5% profit of contract value. So they would have expected to make around 0.5m on the total job.

I doubt very much the management company is settling for 3%, that's another question that could do with being asked imo, how many different individuals and companies were taking a slice of the refurbishment pie. Another question that needs addressing right now is why are victims of this disaster sleeping rough in cars and parks

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news...-have-10653319

Originally Posted by nomadking

That still works out at around an average of 3.5 children per extra bedroom(98) and assuming 2 adults per adult bedroom(127). An average means some will be less and some will be more.

40x1 bed, 80x2 bed, 3x3 bed, 4x4 bed.

I don't think you can add up people's circumstances with such simple maths, for instance it's perfectly legal and acceptable according to my local authority to turn my living room into another bedroom, potentially it was/ is a box ticking exercise to turn every 1 bedroom flat into a 2 bedroom and every 2 bedroom into a 3 etc

[TheDaddy]

News breaking on lbc about the refurbishment work not being signed of...

Well presumably the company still got paid..How would that have gone ahead?

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

News breaking on lbc about the refurbishment work not being signed of...

http://www.lbc.co.uk/news/london/wes...edium=referral

[Osem]

I wouldn't be at all surprised if there were a number of people living/staying there who shouldn't have been. Sub-letting is an increasingly common problem in our major cities and then of course there could well have been family friends who were being put up unofficially. That'll be why the police said quite clearly the other day that people should report 'anyone' who'd been in the block at the time and they had no interest in why they were there.

I do think the authorities need to be 'interested' in this problem, however, because overcrowding tends to lead to rule breaking (e.g. overloaded electrical outlets) which can also be the cause of fires etc. Yes they do need to be sensitive in the circumstances but IMHO they also need to know that the people in those flats were supposed to be there and that occupancy rules were being followed.

Anyone who doubts the scale of this problem ought to check out some of the rogue landlord type TV documentaries which show how common serious sub-letting is - I've seen examples in which dozens of people, almost always foreign nationals, have been crammed into very modest, usually unsafe houses with just mattresses on the floor. They're being terribly exploited and put at severe risk by landlords who have no morals at all and they don't feel able to complain because they're either illegal immigrants or have no other choice of where to live.

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by Osem

I wouldn't be at all surprised if there were a number of people living/staying there who shouldn't have been. Sub-letting is an increasingly common problem in our major cities and then of course there could well have been family friends who were being put up unofficially. That'll be why the police said quite clearly the other day that people should report 'anyone' who'd been in the block at the time and they had no interest in why they were there.

I do think the authorities need to be 'interested' in this problem, however, because overcrowding tends to lead to rule breaking (e.g. overloaded electrical outlets) which can also be the cause of fires etc. Yes they do need to be sensitive in the circumstances but IMHO they also need to know that the people in those flats were supposed to be there and that occupancy rules were being followed.

Anyone who doubts the scale of this problem ought to check out some of the rogue landlord type TV documentaries which show how common serious sub-letting is - I've seen examples in which dozens of people, almost always foreign nationals, have been crammed into very modest, usually unsafe houses with just mattresses on the floor. They're being terribly exploited and put at severe risk by landlords who have no morals at all and they don't feel able to complain because they're either illegal immigrants or have no other choice of where to live.

Isn't the whole point about sub-letting, that the landlord is not the true landlord? Also those sorts of TV progs show how difficult it is for the owners to do anything. Can take several months to get rid.

[Osem]

Originally Posted by nomadking

Isn't the whole point about sub-letting, that the landlord is not the true landlord? Also those sorts of TV progs show how difficult it is for the owners to do anything. Can take several months to get rid.

Yes, by 'landlord' I was referring to both the ones doing the illegal subletting (thereby acting as landlords) unknown to a genuine owner and those landlords who knowingly let out their own run down/unsafe premises to far too many people.

It's a huge problem for the genuine, unwitting landlord who finds that his property has been sublet and he/she's held responsible for it with often £1,000's in associated costs and losses. Yes another reason why rents are going up I imagine.

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by papa smurf

http://www.lbc.co.uk/news/london/wes...edium=referral

But would that be part of the planning docs?

At the planning stage you have to have faith that the architects and designers know what they are doing. The specifics of using certain materials is down to them.

Looking at the sectional views of the exterior walls you can easily see how the fire went to and fro between the inside and the outside. You have either 150mm of flammable insulation or window frames covering the outside of the building and little else.

Hmmm ;

Survivors of the Grenfell Tower fire are to be rehomed in a luxury housing development in the heart of Kensington, the government has said.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40357280

Good for them to find a swift resolution to it. By the sounds of it these are social housing apartments built in the midst of the complex rather than luxury apartments themselves.

[denphone]

Indeed that is excellent news.

[BenMcr]

Originally Posted by Damien

Good for them to find a swift resolution to it. By the sounds of it these are social housing apartments built in the midst of the complex rather than luxury apartments themselves.

Yes, that's right. Another story on it:

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...rtment-complex

The most luxurious four-bedroom apartments are currently on sale in the development for £8.5m but the homes being released to Grenfell residents are part of the affordable quota being built and feature a more “straightforward” internal specification, but have the same build quality.