Sunday trading laws to be suspended during Olympics?

Originally Posted by Peter_

It would create more jobs due to the extra opening hours but it is probably unlikely to ever happen.

where's the extra profit coming from to pay fo the extra workers ?

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Peter_

It works in Scotland so why not here.

If it has been announced that longer trading hours in Scotland has made it the region of the UK with the best performing retail economy then I missed that news bulletin.

There are arguments for and against changing the hours that shops can open on sundays but it having anything other than a negligible effect on the economy is not one of them.

[colin25]

Originally Posted by Russ

If it has been announced that longer trading hours in Scotland has made it the region of the UK with the best performing retail economy then I missed that news bulletin.

There are arguments for and against changing the hours that shops can open on sundays but it having anything other than a negligible effect on the economy is not one of them.

So true. Apart for convenience, it won't do much else. Though it gives more time to spend the money, the amount of money available to spend is basically the same.

Originally Posted by Peter_

It works in Scotland so why not here.

It doesn't work in Scotland. The economy here is not roaring ahead of the rest of the UK. The shops do not sell any more. All that happens is, the same amount of stuff is sold over a more extended period, more people have to work Sundays and fewer people get family time with children while the children are out of School.

Extending Sunday trading hours (by which I mean, permanently, not the temporary lift during the Olympics) can't be defended on any grounds other than the rather selfish demand for people to go shopping at 4pm on a Sunday because they damned well want to go shopping at that time and why should anyone stop them.

Peter, as an avowed Union man I'm gobsmacked that you of all people should be so in favour of what is basically a further erosion of the rights of low-paid workers to a decent structure and time off during their week. And let's be clear about this, the people who will be hit hardest are the low-paid retail shop floor workers who, while technically having the right to derogate from Sunday hours, are the ones who are least empowered to actually do so.

Originally Posted by Chris

It doesn't work in Scotland. The economy here is not roaring ahead of the rest of the UK. The shops do not sell any more. All that happens is, the same amount of stuff is sold over a more extended period, more people have to work Sundays and fewer people get family time with children while the children are out of School.

Extending Sunday trading hours (by which I mean, permanently, not the temporary lift during the Olympics) can't be defended on any grounds other than the rather selfish demand for people to go shopping at 4pm on a Sunday because they damned well want to go shopping at that time and why should anyone stop them.

Peter, as an avowed Union man I'm gobsmacked that you of all people should be so in favour of what is basically a further erosion of the rights of low-paid workers to a decent structure and time off during their week. And let's be clear about this, the people who will be hit hardest are the low-paid retail shop floor workers who, while technically having the right to derogate from Sunday hours, are the ones who are least empowered to actually do so.

[mertle]

Originally Posted by Chris

It doesn't work in Scotland. The economy here is not roaring ahead of the rest of the UK. The shops do not sell any more. All that happens is, the same amount of stuff is sold over a more extended period, more people have to work Sundays and fewer people get family time with children while the children are out of School.

Extending Sunday trading hours (by which I mean, permanently, not the temporary lift during the Olympics) can't be defended on any grounds other than the rather selfish demand for people to go shopping at 4pm on a Sunday because they damned well want to go shopping at that time and why should anyone stop them.

Peter, as an avowed Union man I'm gobsmacked that you of all people should be so in favour of what is basically a further erosion of the rights of low-paid workers to a decent structure and time off during their week. And let's be clear about this, the people who will be hit hardest are the low-paid retail shop floor workers who, while technically having the right to derogate from Sunday hours, are the ones who are least empowered to actually do so.

I agree with this went scotland couple years back we went on sunday we got there late. We had to go shopping previsions by heck the shop was ghost. literally 10 shoppers max.

I even question how succesful 24 hours shopping I know the stackers would have more time with pest shoppers around messing there stacking. Getting in there way disrupting what they doing asking where so and so.

There lies another really shops need the breathing to replenish stocks without the pesky shoppers.

Originally Posted by Chris

It doesn't work in Scotland. The economy here is not roaring ahead of the rest of the UK. The shops do not sell any more. All that happens is, the same amount of stuff is sold over a more extended period, more people have to work Sundays and fewer people get family time with children while the children are out of School.

Extending Sunday trading hours (by which I mean, permanently, not the temporary lift during the Olympics) can't be defended on any grounds other than the rather selfish demand for people to go shopping at 4pm on a Sunday because they damned well want to go shopping at that time and why should anyone stop them.

Peter, as an avowed Union man I'm gobsmacked that you of all people should be so in favour of what is basically a further erosion of the rights of low-paid workers to a decent structure and time off during their week. And let's be clear about this, the people who will be hit hardest are the low-paid retail shop floor workers who, while technically having the right to derogate from Sunday hours, are the ones who are least empowered to actually do so.

Quite frankly i agree and was quite surprised at Peters stance myself.

[Peter_]

My stance is towards it being an archaic law introduced purely for people to go to church, we live in a modern society with modern needs and the is no need for a shops to open later and shut earlier of a Sunday, they could easily open 9am to 6pm without any issue.

Originally Posted by Peter_

My stance is towards it being an archaic law introduced purely for people to go to church, we live in a modern society with modern needs and the is no need for a shops to open later and shut earlier of a Sunday, they could easily open 9am to 6pm without any issue.

There is also no reason at all for them to open 24/7 .Just because the original aim of the law has changed doesn't make it any less valid in modern times ,indeed because we are in modern times an more advanced as a society i think we should really be working less hours

Originally Posted by Peter_

My stance is towards it being an archaic law introduced purely for people to go to church, we live in a modern society with modern needs and the is no need for a shops to open later and shut earlier of a Sunday, they could easily open 9am to 6pm without any issue.

Your argument that something must change because it is 'old' and society is 'modern' is a fallacy. There is no logical reason why something must change just because it has been that way for a long time.

The fact that shops open for more than essential purposes for any time at all on a Sunday is precisely the issue because it increases the number of people who have to work on a Sunday and erodes the seven-day cycle our society has been built around for many centuries.

I'm also a bit sad at your somewhat prejudiced implication that the seven-day cycle's association with 'church' in some way makes it less valid. The fact is, it works. The French revolutionaries tried to decimalise the calendar in the late 18th century and eventually had to give it up (ironically, after an old fashioned dozen years). The seven-day cycle persists because it's a good one that is attuned in some way to a basic human rhythm.

That may be God-given, as the Bible claims, or if you like it could be a natural thing that the Bible simply sought to offer an explanation for (I'm with the former idea personally, but hey ho ). Either way, the seven-day week is discussed in some of the oldest texts in the entire book, which gives the lie to any historically illiterate notion that it is some sort of medieval English invention designed to force people to go to church. It has been around in one form or another for millennia.

I think our put-upon descendants will not forgive us if we give it up.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Peter_

My stance is towards it being an archaic law introduced purely for people to go to church, we live in a modern society with modern needs and the is no need for a shops to open later and shut earlier of a Sunday, they could easily open 9am to 6pm without any issue.

And so the real reason for your stance on this is revealed

[Peter_]

Originally Posted by Russ

And so the real reason for your stance on this is revealed

People would prefer to worship at the till rather than the altar.

[Arthurgray50@blu]

By bringing in this temp measure will bring in extra business - BUT, what about the staff that have to work it.

I believe that ALL shops should close on a Sunday, its the only day off some staff get to be with there families, Its fine to say that staff can get days off during the week, but this is not right.

The big problem is and always will be, the staff that have to work these days, will they get the offer of saying yes or no, some employer could be tough, as to them its money through the till. Will they also get extra payment, guaranteed the shop keepers will increase prices, supermarkets will increase prices - but not pay extra wages.

Sunday's is regarded as a day of rest - some hope.

What about the bus drivers, the train drivers, the pilots, the nurses, the doctors, the nursing home staff, the power station workers, et al - should they also have Sunday off, Arthur?

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Peter_

People would prefer to worship at the till rather than the altar.

I think you'd have earned more respect if you'd have been more honest from the start about what fuels your stance on this.