Unemployment is rising

[Alan Fry]

Originally Posted by Hugh

Ahem.....

Claims to be....

Sometimes, his statements contradict this (and each other)...

I do give money to the homeless, when I see then on the street, but I do not give any to charity

---------- Post added at 13:46 ---------- Previous post was at 13:44 ----------

Originally Posted by Tim Deegan

And using violence, terrorism, rioting, and murder to impose it.

I have not ACUTELY done any of those things!

Yet again you have a wrong impression of me!

---------- Post added at 13:47 ---------- Previous post was at 13:46 ----------

Originally Posted by martyh

That is not democracy Alan ,i'm not sure what it is but it's definately not democracy

Its a democracy, but in favour of the working people

Originally Posted by Alan Fry

Its a democracy, but in favour of the working people

Then it's not a democracy .A democracy gives ALL citizens equal rights and does not favour on class of society over another .To reform democracy changes it to something else .The only thing that can change is the way that democracy is applied NOT what is is

[Alan Fry]

Originally Posted by martyh

Then it's not a democracy .A democracy gives ALL citizens equal rights and does not favour on class of society over another .To reform democracy changes it to something else .The only thing that can change is the way that democracy is applied NOT what is is

Which is what I am saying, it should no longer favour anyone, unlike now where it favours the rich and businesses

There would also be legal rights for wokers rights amoung other things...

Originally Posted by Alan Fry

Its a democracy, but in favour of the working people

Originally Posted by Alan Fry

Which is what I am saying, it should no longer favour anyone, unlike now where it favours the rich and businesses
.

You are contradicting yourself

[Osem]

Warning!... Warning!... Does not compute... Does not compute...

[Alan Fry]

Originally Posted by martyh

You are contradicting yourself

I meant more in favour for the working people by being less in favour for the wealthy and major businesses

[Alan Fry]

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

Specify "decent job"

Do you mean unrealistic pay for doing an unproductive or boring job or do you mean an interesting and well paid job? If it's the second who's going to do all the boring and uninteresting jobs of which most are?

More well paid jobs, it does not matter what job it is

Originally Posted by Alan Fry

I meant more in favour for the working people by being less in favour for the wealthy and major businesses

For the last time Democracy by defintion favours ALL citizens EQUALY.Anything else is NOT democracy.

[Alan Fry]

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

So how much do you think a waiter in your restaraunt should be paid? And then how could you possibly afford to eat there? Or the guy sweeping the street and your council tax?

If everybody's paid more and then it costs everybody more then your back where you started. It's called inflation.

What I am trying to do is move more of the wealth from the rich to the working people, the higher wages can be paid with a crakcodwn on tax evasion and avoidance

What the rich have to accept for them to be less wealthy and for the working people to be richer

---------- Post added at 14:24 ---------- Previous post was at 14:23 ----------

Originally Posted by martyh

For the last time Democracy by defintion favours ALL citizens EQUALY.Anything else is NOT democracy.

But some are more equal than others...

In this case the rich and major businesses

[Tim Deegan]

Originally Posted by Alan Fry

My definiton of democracy is were the working people get the decent jobs and the biggest say in the way things are run

That's nothing to do with democracy......HUGE FAIL Alan!!!!!

[Alan Fry]

Originally Posted by Tim Deegan

That's nothing to do with democracy......HUGE FAIL Alan!!!!!

Yes it does, what the point of democracy if you can't have a high a growing standard of living? (and it goes against you and in favour of others)

[Tim Deegan]

Originally Posted by Alan Fry

I have not ACUTELY done any of those things!

Yet again you have a wrong impression of me!

You have encouraged people to do all of those things, which makes you just as bad. In fact it makes you worse, because you want other people to do your dirty work for you, because you don't have the bottle.

Originally Posted by Alan Fry

Its a democracy, but in favour of the working people

No Alan, it is absolutely nothing to do with democracy.

---------- Post added at 14:38 ---------- Previous post was at 14:35 ----------

Originally Posted by Alan Fry

More well paid jobs, it does not matter what job it is

Where does the money come from to pay for those well paid jobs??? If you increase wages, then you increase production costs, and then increase inflation.

---------- Post added at 14:40 ---------- Previous post was at 14:38 ----------

Originally Posted by Alan Fry

Yes it does, what the point of democracy if you can't have a high a growing standard of living? (and it goes against you and in favour of others)

Get a dictonary Alan

Originally Posted by Alan Fry

Yes it does, what the point of democracy if you can't have a high a growing standard of living? (and it goes against you and in favour of others)

You appear to be confusing politics with economics.....

Democracy is, imho, about involvement in the political process through delegated or representative means by universal suffrage - what has that got to do with 'a high a growing standard of living' (sic)?

[Pog66]

http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/democracy

democracy

Pronunciation: /dɪˈmɒkrəsi/
noun (plural democracies)
[mass noun]

a system of government by the whole population or all the eligible members of a state, typically through elected representatives: a system of parliamentary democracy
[count noun] a state governed under a system of democracy: a multiparty democracy
control of an organization or group by the majority of its members: the intended extension of industrial democracy
the practice or principles of social equality: demands for greater democracy

Origin:

late 16th century: from French démocratie, via late Latin from Greek dēmokratia, from dēmos 'the people' + -kratia 'power, rule'

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

Nobody's going to be as well off as you think they'll be under your equality system but I guess that doesn't fit in with your narrow perspective.

Or, to put it another way:

The rich haven't got enough money to make the rest of us comfortable. Just look at the arithmetic

If we average out global GDP we get to a figure of about $8,000 per head, something like that. That's a tad over £5,000 each. So if we share everything around the world equally with everyone around the world then that's what each of us, at maximum, can possibly have each year.

Given that the UK government is around £700 billionish a year at present and there are 64 million of us, that means that what we can buy with our equal share of the world's resources is about 50 per cent of the government we already have.

<snip>

So truly divvying it all up amongst everyone really isn't going to work. But could we do it just among those who share these Blessed Isles with us? Sadly, no, we can't, not if we're all going to be adequately cared for. As we're told in the paper today there isn't enough money to go round just among us either.

A survey of over 2,000 adults by the insurance company found that Britons need extra pre-tax income of £7,236 a year to make them feel financially secure.

<snip>

So, there are 25 million households in the country and every one of them needs an extra £7,236 a year to feel secure. Yes, we can do this, this is what average means, we get to multiply the average by the number to give us the total. This is, that total, near enough £180 billion as makes no difference ... Where might we get £180 billion from? Well, there's the rich of course! They are the b'stards who have captured all the moolah in the first place and that's where our jacquerie is going to reclaim it from. Darn right too!

<snip>

To make all households financially secure we've got to find £180 billion, but even if we take all the cash off the top 10 per cent, all the food, ponies, labradors and croquet lawns they have, we've only got £130 billion. So we cannot in fact just redistribute the dosh that's lying around and make this the green, pleasant and equal land that some seem to want. For there just isn't enough cash to provide the standard of living everyone wants. That is, we cannot redistribute our way to wealth.

Well worth reading in full:

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/finance...he-arithmetic/