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Huge fire at West London tower block
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Old 08-07-2017, 17:04   #391
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Re: Huge fire at West London tower block

Quote:
Originally Posted by deadite66 View Post
The council in "How to get a council house" had a 3 strikes rule, turn down 3 and you off the list.
wonder if they have the same here.
Since that programme was made there has been much more pressure on housing stock, as a result local authorities reduced this to two and then to one.

Most people are no longer offered a home, they have to bid for any vacant property that their allocated points allow. The top ten or so applicants are invited to view the property, if (and it's a big if) those in front of them turn it down, they are invited to view the property and given a chance to accept it themselves.

No idea what policies are being implemented for those made homeless as a result of this fire though.

There was an interesting discussion on LBC very early this morning. From what they were saying, an offer to stay in the UK for a year has been made to any illegal immigrants who come forward to admit that they were unlawfully staying in the flats.

Some callers believed that they should be patched up and sent home ASAP, but most others thought that this idea was a fair compromise.

The host of the show disagreed with them all as he believed that they should be allowed to stay as long as they liked because of what they had been through. He labelled his callers as "heartless".

---------- Post added at 15:04 ---------- Previous post was at 14:51 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by pip08456 View Post
You appear to be confusing compassion with the compensation culture prevalent in society now.

Yes they have gone through a very traumatic experience and do need support through that but don't you think the funds raised would not be able to support that? What does it stand at now? Over £10mllion, That's a lot of money per person to put it bluntly.

So please tell me how we can be more compassionate than to contribute more than £10 million to their need and assist them in the future?

As regards rehousing them where do you think the local council will be able to obtain that amount of stock from?

Tough **** they may have to enroll their kid in a different school if offered accommodation in a different borough but what does that matter?

What has compassion to do with that? I Would be more concerned that my child could continue their education wherever it may be
I personally don't have a problem with those who feel that they have been wronged claiming compensation. If people did the right thing then the claims wouldn't be made or would fail at court.

As a last resort I've successfully taken legal action myself against those who have wronged myself or my business.

However, I do see your point on occasion. A young lad broke into a hairdressers shop and burnt himself on some chemical solution that had been left out overnight.

After being caught for the burglary, he successfully sued the hairdresser. The reasons given were that she had a 'duty of care' towards anyone who came into her shop (even unlawfully) and that the chemical solution should have been safely stored away.

What if a burglar broke into a home and tripped on some loose carpeting and injured themselves?!?!

Maybe this is a reason why any illegals in the tower are being given support??
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Old 08-07-2017, 21:19   #392
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Re: Huge fire at West London tower block

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Originally Posted by Damien View Post
I imagine they don't want to make kids, likely already traumatised from the fire, have to adjust to a new school, in a new environment and have to make new friends. It's hard for kids to move under the best of circumstances let alone after an incident where their homes, possessions and in some cases family members have gone.

I don't understand how people cannot have sympathy here.
I have plenty for sympathy for them but the victims have to be realistic in their expectations. With all the best will in the world, suitable permanent housing cannot be conjured up from nowhere, it's going to take time.

It will be little comfort to them but I reckon that these unfortunate people are getting a hell of a lot more support than 99% of people who are the victims of serious household fires every week of every year. They will be found permanent homes and they will be compensated (to the extent that anyone can be in such awful circumstances) but it's going to take time and they regretfully have to accept that, as will the forensic process and inquiry.
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Old 09-07-2017, 04:34   #393
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Re: Huge fire at West London tower block

A friend of a friend had one of those dodgy tumble dryers that burnt down their house there was no rush of support not even a sense of speed from their insurance company and that's a daily occurence in the UK. No it's not the same scale and there is sympathy for those who died and those who lost people in that incident but over a year we probably have five or six times the number at grenfall who lose their homes often through no direct fault of theirs who get nothing to help them rebuild. Nothing will erode sympathy faster then the living being seen to try and profit from this incident and there are some who are doing that.

There should be no amnesty if the survivors will not give accurate accounts of who was living where then there should be no official bribery to get that information. I agree a degree of compensation is warranted but not an amount that gives a life of luxury for any length of time an amount that gets them back on their feet should be the maximum. Council members who were aware of the situation and did nothing should be charged if they can and if as i suspect there were backhanders involved in the renovation works there should be custodial sentences.

Everyday tradegy strikes families all across the UK in many different ways and they have to manage and don't expect to be sorted out or make any demands. This was horrendous and they should receive help but not a lifetimes help or a lifetimes money especially if they were illegally here.
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Old 11-07-2017, 00:08   #394
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Re: Huge fire at West London tower block

The focus of some on here on the perceived behaviour of the affected in terms of their "demands", degree of illegal status and undeserved levels of sympathy strikes chords with the Hillsborough disaster where some of the mainstream media portrayed the victims had in some way contributed to the loss of life.

Their, as it turned out, false coverage, helped to taint the public perception of the victims. I hope that similar comments and coverage does not do the same here ..
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Old 12-07-2017, 00:49   #395
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Re: Huge fire at West London tower block

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Originally Posted by ianch99 View Post
The focus of some on here on the perceived behaviour of the affected in terms of their "demands", degree of illegal status and undeserved levels of sympathy strikes chords with the Hillsborough disaster where some of the mainstream media portrayed the victims had in some way contributed to the loss of life.

Their, as it turned out, false coverage, helped to taint the public perception of the victims. I hope that similar comments and coverage does not do the same here ..
Not the same.
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Old 27-07-2017, 19:32   #396
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Re: Huge fire at West London tower block

Police say they have 'reasonable grounds' to suspect Kensington Council and TMO committed corporate manslaughter.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7863616.html
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Old 27-07-2017, 19:37   #397
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Re: Huge fire at West London tower block

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Originally Posted by denphone View Post
Police say they have 'reasonable grounds' to suspect Kensington Council and TMO committed corporate manslaughter.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7863616.html
Newsnight said yesterday that a simulation of the cladding and insulations they mocked up had failed fire safety tests. Which would mean it was illegal I guess...
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Old 27-07-2017, 20:15   #398
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Re: Huge fire at West London tower block

Don't public servants watch each others backs?, i'll be surprised if any get their collars felt.
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Old 27-07-2017, 20:19   #399
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Re: Huge fire at West London tower block

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Originally Posted by deadite66 View Post
Don't public servants watch each others backs?, i'll be surprised if any get their collars felt.
stab more like
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Old 28-07-2017, 01:31   #400
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Re: Huge fire at West London tower block

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Originally Posted by Damien View Post
Newsnight said yesterday that a simulation of the cladding and insulations they mocked up had failed fire safety tests. Which would mean it was illegal I guess...
That was down to the DESIGNERS AND NOBODY ELSE. Look at the plans.
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Old 28-07-2017, 14:53   #401
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Re: Huge fire at West London tower block

Quote:
Cladding and insulation used in at least 60 tower blocks will be deemed to have failed a new fire safety test, the BBC understands.
The test was more thorough than previous checks after the Grenfell Tower fire, which only tested cladding.
The new test checked the cladding in combination with the foam insulation that was used in Grenfell.
It is thought nine blocks in Salford are the only local government-owned buildings to be affected so far
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40749036

Am I correct in thinking that Salford is a dyed in the wool Labour council? Hang on though, that can't be right can it because we all know that it's only greedy, working class hating, Tory councils which put the safety of ordinary people at risk don't we...

I'm sure Corbyn's cronies will clarify it all for us anyway.
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Old 28-07-2017, 16:31   #402
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Re: Huge fire at West London tower block

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Originally Posted by nomadking View Post
That was down to the DESIGNERS AND NOBODY ELSE. Look at the plans.
Perhaps if you provided links to your assertions then people may agree with you.

You have consitently put forward that you have seen the plans, recommendations etc yet have never supplied a link to back up your stance.
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Old 28-07-2017, 17:05   #403
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Re: Huge fire at West London tower block

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Originally Posted by pip08456 View Post
Perhaps if you provided links to your assertions then people may agree with you.

You have consitently put forward that you have seen the plans, recommendations etc yet have never supplied a link to back up your stance.
Link to planning website.
Quote:
SUSTAINABILITY AND ENERGY STATEMENT
Pdf is the "glossy " planning application.
Sectional view of the wall is on page 8.
Quote:
Insulation (New, Celotex FR5000)
Quote:
The chosen strategy is to wrap the building in a thick layer of
insulation
and then over-clad with a rain screen to protect the
insulation from the weather and from physical damage
No fire breaks anywhere and there is not much between the window frame and the outer insulation.

Link
Quote:
Ian notes that the planned separation of the window from the concrete meant that interfaces – “window, head and cill extrusions, foams, perimeter filler insulation, water, air and vapour barrier, and lining boards” – became technically critical for fire safety.
The several materials and products within the interface gap became the only construction stopping a fire inside a flat from reaching the cavity and cladding.
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Old 29-07-2017, 14:00   #404
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Re: Huge fire at West London tower block

No outrage about Salford from the usual rose tinted suspects then. Quelle surprise...
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Old 30-07-2017, 09:33   #405
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Re: Huge fire at West London tower block

I will point out that Salford have been stripping the cladding of said dangerous tower blocks..but so far both Labour and Tory councils are facing this issue together so I think this maybe a situation that goes beyond political parties and ideologies. Neither group can claim the moral high ground because as we know both parties have their fair share of swivel eyed loons and really crap councillors. Just read Private Eye's Rotten Boroughs section to see that.
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