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Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.
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Old 09-01-2017, 20:30   #166
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Re: Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rogerdraig View Post
if that's to me i would have to say its on the topic of worrying news

If you have as I have done gone through this process of changing over it is not for quite a few an easy or fair

Lots of the questions do not reflect the rule they are asking about and often the person asking doesn't really know what they are asking about either ( and that's me being diplomatic as a few are positively trying to trip people up or just lie about answers you give)

i will just so some may learn ( i may have mentioned this in other threads ) mention just 1 question one that in real terms decides if your worthy of a car ( mobility component )

you are asked Can you stand and then move more than 1 metre but no more than 20 metres, either aided or unaided.

the rules this applies to though is not mentioned this needs to be answered as yes but fails to mention that this is supposed to be something you can do more than once in a reasonable time and with out pain.

I quote from another place



"On 1 February 2013, the government agreed to amend the proposed rules so that the assessment of PIP eligibility should take account of whether the claimant can not just complete an activity, such as walking 20 metres, but do this:
  • Safely
  • Reliably
  • Repeatedly, and
  • In a reasonable time period."
however some of the assessors seem unaware or just ignore this and as of last form i have seen is not mentioned in it.


so if a persons who have the attitude you can leave the house and work you cant be severely disabled could be assessors I would say it is something you should worry about and be forearmed for.
Exactly.
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Old 09-01-2017, 20:40   #167
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Re: Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rogerdraig View Post
  • Safely
  • Reliably
  • Repeatedly, and
  • In a reasonable time period."
however some of the assessors seem unaware or just ignore this and as of last form i have seen is not mentioned in it.
The magic word in that list is "AND". It would appear that some assessors think it is "OR".
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Old 11-01-2017, 20:51   #168
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Re: Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.

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Originally Posted by Taf View Post
The magic word in that list is "AND". It would appear that some assessors think it is "OR".
You've hit the nail on the head, which is why those turned down should always appeal.

The whole system is a farcical mess, driven by a lot of people working in it with the repugnant, discriminatory and baseless assumptions that the severely disabled are all too used to.

If karma does actually exist, it would be an excellent learning tool for some individuals.
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Old 11-01-2017, 21:12   #169
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Re: Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.

sad but true and prepare for appeal on you way through assessment too you might head off the need to as well ( forewarned is forearmed )
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Old 11-01-2017, 22:44   #170
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Re: Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.

Found a useful piece of info today.

They keep going on about mobilizing and about if you have some difficulty walking then it might be reasonable to use a wheelchair, even keeping it at the workplace. They insist they are easily obtained from a local NHS wheelchair service. Well guess what, it's not as easy as that.
Quote:
2.1 Patients will be supplied with a wheelchair providing all the following criteria are met.
Long term provision
For all new patients i.e. those not known to the wheelchair service
The patient has been referred to the service by their GP, Consultant, Registrar, House Officers,Occupational Therapist, Physiotherapist District Nurse or Health Visitor
The patient has a long-term condition that restricts their mobility
The patient is unable to mobilise within their own home
that combined with this
Quote:
3.12 Wheelchairs will not be provided for use solely in a work situation or solely in a school or other educational establishment.
means that it is NOT reasonable to use a wheelchair solely for work. If you can walk enough to get around your home, you can't get a wheelchair.
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Old 11-01-2017, 23:18   #171
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Re: Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.

the wheel chair bit is really silly as even if you can mobilize in one that's if you have the strength in your upper body it doesn't mean that its going to be pain free or that you can get in an unadapted car. which is the main point of the allowance to get you able to get to places and work if able.
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Old 12-01-2017, 00:08   #172
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Re: Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rogerdraig View Post
the wheel chair bit is really silly as even if you can mobilize in one that's if you have the strength in your upper body it doesn't mean that its going to be pain free or that you can get in an unadapted car. which is the main point of the allowance to get you able to get to places and work if able.
The wheelchair thing is about ESA, not DLA/PIP.

The DWP have tried to make it much more difficult to qualify for ESA on mobility grounds.
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Old 12-01-2017, 18:46   #173
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Re: Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.

sort of the ESA ask about roughly the same thing but still has the 50m rather than 20m thing the worrying bit there is that many answering that may put them selves with an up hill struggle with PIP as it again fails to mention the Safely reliably thing and if you answer it with out qualifying your answer with that you can only do this occasionally during the day or that even with aids you are in pain it can be brought up on PIP.

so yes that is ESA but its something you need to think about for your claim for PIP at the same time.
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Old 12-01-2017, 19:06   #174
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Re: Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RichardCoulter View Post
You've hit the nail on the head, which is why those turned down should always appeal.

The whole system is a farcical mess, driven by a lot of people working in it with the repugnant, discriminatory and baseless assumptions that the severely disabled are all too used to.

If karma does actually exist, it would be an excellent learning tool for some individuals.
I know someone who had the appeal but an hour before the hearing citizens advice phones to say that the judge wanted more evidence and the hearing had been adjourned. They were also advised to withdraw the appeal as they had a high chance of losing other parts of the PIP claim that they had already been awarded. In my eyes this was a threat. The advice was from the judge given to citizens advice.
So after being awarded indefinite DLA with the mobility component and having it for 12 years, they now have gone through so much that they withdrew the appeal as the risk was too high to lose everything. So when people talk of it being easy to appeal it is definitely not. They don't make it easy, there is hardly any advice and you have to be lucky to get a nice judge.

They now have no car and require help from family to get to places.

Last edited by Rexz; 12-01-2017 at 19:09.
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Old 12-01-2017, 19:26   #175
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Re: Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.

I had a phonecall today, not from the DWP but from the assessing company Capita. They wanted specific dates of specific events. They didn't want the actual date, but "beginning or end of the month will suffice".

Are they writing my son's biography?

I told them I have no records, but the DLA unit will have it all.
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Old 13-01-2017, 00:18   #176
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Re: Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking View Post
Found a useful piece of info today.

They keep going on about mobilizing and about if you have some difficulty walking then it might be reasonable to use a wheelchair, even keeping it at the workplace. They insist they are easily obtained from a local NHS wheelchair service. Well guess what, it's not as easy as that.that combined with this
means that it is NOT reasonable to use a wheelchair solely for work. If you can walk enough to get around your home, you can't get a wheelchair.
yep I have mentioned this several times on the internet, think at least once on this forum.

Basically the DWP hasnt a clue how the NHS works they just making up their own rules to achieve a financial and political target.

Basically for a number of years now ESA claimants have been assessed as if they were using aid's they do not have access to, this is simply wrong. When PIP was introduced one of the key changes is they adopted the same rules for mobility on that as well. Ok "lets pretend this person has a wheelchair".

If anyone is deemed able because of a magic wheelchair conjured up by an assessor at least on ESA there is grounds for appeal tho as there is a overuling factor which is that if a ESA decision is deemed to be a danger to the claimant then they qualify for ESA (WRAG group), and if its also deemed a danger for others around them then they qualify for the support group.

The government's response to the really high number of successful appeals was to make it harder to appeal.

Of all the changes in ESA and PIP in the past 5 years or so, mobility has been the area they have targeted for cuts the most, although its not the only area.

To try and save money, just before christmas I had to goto the post office to send something off, and I thought I will see if I can walk there and back and save on taxi fares, I can tell you when I got there, I was in so much pain I was leaning heavily on the counter just so I could stay on my feet without collapsing and when I ordered the taxi outside for the return journey I would have collapsed whilst waiting (no benches or anything else to sit on) if I didnt goto the neighbouring betting shop and sat down on one of their chairs, luckily I didnt get kicked out for loitering.

Last edited by Chrysalis; 13-01-2017 at 00:22.
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Old 13-01-2017, 01:39   #177
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Re: Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rexz View Post
I know someone who had the appeal but an hour before the hearing citizens advice phones to say that the judge wanted more evidence and the hearing had been adjourned. They were also advised to withdraw the appeal as they had a high chance of losing other parts of the PIP claim that they had already been awarded. In my eyes this was a threat. The advice was from the judge given to citizens advice.
So after being awarded indefinite DLA with the mobility component and having it for 12 years, they now have gone through so much that they withdrew the appeal as the risk was too high to lose everything. So when people talk of it being easy to appeal it is definitely not. They don't make it easy, there is hardly any advice and you have to be lucky to get a nice judge.

they should reapply i recommend the guides from http://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/

they are worth the cost




They now have no car and require help from family to get to places.
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Old 14-01-2017, 15:28   #178
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Re: Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking View Post
Found a useful piece of info today.

They keep going on about mobilizing and about if you have some difficulty walking then it might be reasonable to use a wheelchair, even keeping it at the workplace. They insist they are easily obtained from a local NHS wheelchair service. Well guess what, it's not as easy as that.that combined with this
means that it is NOT reasonable to use a wheelchair solely for work. If you can walk enough to get around your home, you can't get a wheelchair.
Thanks for this, i'll pass this onto a welfare rights charity that I support.

Reading the additional problems caused to disabled people by this Government makes me want to weep.

The attempts to undermine the disabled and turn people against them by the Cameron administration certainly did work; attacks on the disabled are on the increase, both online and actual physical attacks.

I know of a young lady who was pushed to the ground and kicked in Blackpool just before Christmas. The reason? She was blind and had some learning difficulties.

I was hoping for a change of attitude from May after she made the sensible decision to exempt those who will never get any better from constant testing and retesting, but it looks like nothing else will improve eg ALL those who aren't exempt will be expected to take part in some form of work related activity!
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Old 14-01-2017, 17:35   #179
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Re: Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.

May has an ongoing consultation in regards to disability and it's effects and many of those she picked to form are people with practical experience of disability and how it affects people. Cameron and osbourne had an horrendous agenda and they had progressed it considerably it's going to take time for the improvement to come. She signalled her intention with the end to testing for those with incurable or conditions that won't improve and that was a bifg step. Another thing everyone has to remember is keep a polite attitude when dealing with people in the system it will get you more then venting.
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Old 27-01-2017, 12:01   #180
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Re: Worrying news for ESA claimants converting from DLA to PIP.

3 letters arrived this morning, 27th January.

PIP application for my son refused (2 points for daily living, 4 for mobility) wef 12th October 2016. DLA stopped wef 21st February 2017).

Carers Allowance stopped wef 21st February.

ESA stopped, he must apply for Jobseekers Allowance immediately.

Free Car Tax stopped, car to be fully taxed from 21st February.

I have been trying to telephone them to demand a review, but they haven't answered the phone yet.
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