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Welsh 16 year olds get the vote
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Old 27-11-2019, 19:34   #1
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Welsh 16 year olds get the vote

16 and 17-year-olds, plus 33,000 foreign nationals, will be able to vote in the 2021 Welsh Assembly election.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-50561883
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Old 30-11-2019, 10:42   #2
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Re: Welsh 16 year olds get the vote

They’d better all learn that funny language then!

But more seriously (and it is good to preserve ancient languages), 16 year olds have no basis of worldly experience on which to make valid judgements. It is a very dangerous thing to give kids the vote. Even 18 is questionable seeing how those idiots seem to be flocking to Corbyn.

At that age, I too voted Labour just because I couldn’t see why toffs should be so rich. It quickly became apparent when I got my first mortgage why we should strive to better ourselves financially and why the Unions needed bringing under control - hence I switched to Conservative where I have remained.

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Old 30-11-2019, 10:53   #3
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Re: Welsh 16 year olds get the vote

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth View Post
They’d better all learn that funny language then!

But more seriously (and it is good to preserve ancient languages), 16 year olds have no basis of worldly experience on which to make valid judgements. It is a very dangerous thing to give kids the vote. Even 18 is questionable seeing how those idiots seem to be flocking to Corbyn.

At that age, I too voted Labour just because I couldn’t see why toffs should be so rich. It quickly became apparent when I got my first mortgage why we should strive to better ourselves financially and why the Unions needed bringing under control - hence I switched to Conservative where I have remained.

A new Govt. will take a 16 year old, up to the age of 21. Arguably the most important time of their lives? Why shouldn't they have a say? Give them a bit of credit, they are your future.
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Old 30-11-2019, 10:59   #4
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Re: Welsh 16 year olds get the vote

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Originally Posted by Mr K View Post
A new Govt. will take a 16 year old, up to the age of 21. Arguably the most important time of their lives? Why shouldn't they have a say? Give them a bit of credit, they are your future.
Of course they should be able to vote at 16 as its pretty condescending to say they don't know enough to be able to come to a informed decision before they vote.
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Old 30-11-2019, 11:01   #5
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Re: Welsh 16 year olds get the vote

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Originally Posted by Mr K View Post
A new Govt. will take a 16 year old, up to the age of 21. Arguably the most important time of their lives? Why shouldn't they have a say? Give them a bit of credit, they are your future.
Seph answered your question in his last post. Young people still in full time education have little experience of the world and have an idealistic sense of the world. They also tend to believe what their left-wing teachers tell them.

You are expecting them to vote when they have only very recently woken up to politics and what is happening around the world.
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Old 30-11-2019, 11:04   #6
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Re: Welsh 16 year olds get the vote

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Originally Posted by Mr K View Post
A new Govt. will take a 16 year old, up to the age of 21. Arguably the most important time of their lives? Why shouldn't they have a say? Give them a bit of credit, they are your future.
Give them credit for what? Understanding how things work, how wheels turn, how judgements should be made in the context of history and extant situations? Wisdom comes with age.

Maybe a youth Parliament with one elected representative to the Welsh assembly? But votes at 16 is a ridiculous proposition - I fear that it will take hold in the UK. Next it’ll be they can be MPs, too young to buy alcohol, too young to drive but allowed to legislate there on. Quite ridiculous.
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Old 30-11-2019, 12:13   #7
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Re: Welsh 16 year olds get the vote

Labour was the driving force behind this, backed by the Welsh nationalists. Desperate for votes I suspect.

Not so long ago they argued that a jihadi bride should be allowed to return to the UK as she probably did not understand what she was doing at age 16 when she left. But she understands enough to vote?
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Old 30-11-2019, 12:32   #8
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Re: Welsh 16 year olds get the vote

Quote:
Originally Posted by Taf View Post
Labour was the driving force behind this, backed by the Welsh nationalists. Desperate for votes I suspect.

Not so long ago they argued that a jihadi bride should be allowed to return to the UK as she probably did not understand what she was doing at age 16 when she left. But she understands enough to vote?
She'll understand enough to vote Labour the terrorists best friend.
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Old 30-11-2019, 12:48   #9
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Re: Welsh 16 year olds get the vote

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Originally Posted by Sephiroth View Post
Give them credit for what? Understanding how things work, how wheels turn, how judgements should be made in the context of history and extant situations? Wisdom comes with age.


Exactly, look at Stanley Johnson, so old and wise he got on TV and told the British public just what idiots they are!

Quote:
Maybe a youth Parliament with one elected representative to the Welsh assembly? But votes at 16 is a ridiculous proposition - I fear that it will take hold in the UK. Next it’ll be they can be MPs, too young to buy alcohol, too young to drive but allowed to legislate there on. Quite ridiculous.
Old enough to pay tax.

At least you’ve been honest enough that when you were young you were more left wing/less right wing, so merely see it as a function to gerrymander election results by restricting the franchise.

The real fear of course is that 16-17 year olds vote for their economic interests much like pensioners do.

Last edited by jfman; 30-11-2019 at 12:59.
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Old 30-11-2019, 13:11   #10
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Re: Welsh 16 year olds get the vote

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Originally Posted by jfman View Post
Exactly, look at Stanley Johnson, so old and wise he got on TV and told the British public just what idiots they are!

Old enough to pay tax.

At least you’ve been honest enough that when you were young you were more left wing/less right wing, so merely see it as a function to gerrymander election results by restricting the franchise.

The real fear of course is that 16-17 year olds vote for their economic interests much like pensioners do.
I remember being potentially liable for tax when I was just 14 years old(Summer holiday job).
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Old 30-11-2019, 15:16   #11
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Re: Welsh 16 year olds get the vote

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Originally Posted by nomadking View Post
I remember being potentially liable for tax when I was just 14 years old(Summer holiday job).
Potentially.
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Old 30-11-2019, 23:18   #12
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Re: Welsh 16 year olds get the vote

Personally I'd raise the voting age to 21. Along with Drinking, smoking, gambling.
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Old 30-11-2019, 23:29   #13
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Re: Welsh 16 year olds get the vote

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Originally Posted by jfman View Post
Potentially.
Wouldn't have reached the tax allowance. I was still "assessed".

Child showbiz stars must pay tax. Don't know how it works nowadays, but back then it was added to a parents tax. My father had to declare it.
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Old 02-12-2019, 10:14   #14
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Re: Welsh 16 year olds get the vote

Here's the Conservative case for extending the vote to 16 and 17 year olds - https://www.electoral-reform.org.uk/...-at-16-and-17/

In a worst case, with the voting age being 18, you could be essentially disenfranchised until you are nearly 23 under the Fixed Term Parliaments Act. In this time, you could have been working for 6 years or studied for A Levels, got a Degree and be 2/3 of the way through a Ph.D. at the other end of things.

I would suggest that the years from 16 to 23 years old are some of the years that will have the largest impact on your life. There are other life events of course but those years are certainly up there and the breadth of opportunity is never wider than at this point. Not being able to have an influence in how the country is run seems unfair to me.
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Old 02-12-2019, 11:14   #15
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Re: Welsh 16 year olds get the vote

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Originally Posted by jonbxx View Post
Here's the Conservative case for extending the vote to 16 and 17 year olds - https://www.electoral-reform.org.uk/...-at-16-and-17/

In a worst case, with the voting age being 18, you could be essentially disenfranchised until you are nearly 23 under the Fixed Term Parliaments Act. In this time, you could have been working for 6 years or studied for A Levels, got a Degree and be 2/3 of the way through a Ph.D. at the other end of things.

I would suggest that the years from 16 to 23 years old are some of the years that will have the largest impact on your life. There are other life events of course but those years are certainly up there and the breadth of opportunity is never wider than at this point. Not being able to have an influence in how the country is run seems unfair to me.

Indeed, a sixteen year old can choose to defend their country, yet is denied a voice in how that country should be run.
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