ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Looked for an old thread on this subject, but couldn't see one.

Telegraph today reports

"ITV is poised to hit Virgin with a hefty bill for carrying it's main channel backed with a tacit threat of a blackout if it refuses to pay up"

Not good news, although I suspect/hope a compromise will be reached.

Are they taking the same stance with other carriers such as Sky, Freesat, Freeview?

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Good, no more pathetic soaps clogging prime time :P

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Hmm, I thought I saw a thread on this yesterday as well.

It reminds me of the time when they dropped sky (2007). That lasted for about 20 months.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

AS the article says Liberty Global are major shareholders of ITV if thats the case surely they would not want to upset their shareholders by forcing Virgins hand or would it not be take the money out of one hand and give it to the other??

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

It was mentioned in the Coming Soon thread by MB, maybe that was it.

Apparently, with this, Sky are re-evaluating what they pay ITV for ITV Encore exclusivity and VM what they pay for ITVBe exclusivity. This could mean VM customers getting ITV Encore and Sky customers getting ITVBe in HD.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Does ITV still transmit programmes?

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

They still transmit...

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Hope they do blackout Virgin, no more emmerdale or coronation street. Yassssssssss!!!!

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

That won't please your other half though.;)

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Seems to be on endlessly Den. Pretty sure she records them and plays them on a loop to keep me out the room:D

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Not sure why something potentially on would be in a thread entitled coming soon ?

Perhaps, the lack of logic was the reason I couldn't find it again.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Speculation that an ITV blackout may be coming soon?

Sounds ok to me. No difference from speculation on new channels that never arrive...:dmonk:

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

More junk on the way , does anyone actually watch half of these channels.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Well, those of us who remember the days of 5 or fewer channels being available will think that we have less choice these days despite having hundreds of channels to choose from.

The truth is, the choice of good programmes is better than in those days, but spread amongst all of those hundreds of channels in between tons and tons of dross. So they are much harder to find. So hard, in fact, that many don't even bother looking for them any more.

That is why the huge concentration of good quality stuff on Amazon and Netflix is proving so popular, and in time, this method of viewing will be the norm.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Netflix and Amazon whilst good value have their fair share of junk also.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

You seem to be getting grumpier the older you get MM.:D

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Thats probably why VM carry ITV channels, as they don't pay for it.

Don't know how VM will get over this.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

He's 100% correct imo too, Den.............:p:

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Same old story. Channel 'insert name' threatens to black out screens unless they get more money. Only for a last minute compromise, plus extra publicity for the channel. VM and it's customers shouldn't have to pay anything for crap like ITV, it should be self funded through the amount of advertising. It's on freeview so why should other platforms pay.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Clearly, no platform will ever provide 100% of programmes that you are dying to see, but if you put all the programming (except sport,) of the Sky channels together and compared it with Netflix, then Netflix would come out the sure fired winner. And when sport does come to Netflix, as I believe it will in time, that will provide better value for money as well.

Sky may have broken the mould of TV in the UK, which was great, but Netflix and Amazon are definitely the best things that have happened to telly to date, in my opinion.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

:tu:

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

I don't think ITV is as popular as you believe.They rely heavily on the familiarity they have with the British public and are no longer the force they used to be.

They have been attempting a come back in the last few years, but decisions such as cutting off Virgin will sink the channel, I'm afraid.

If you were an ITV executive and came up with the idea that to boost advertising revenue, the company should cut off a significant part of its audience, you should not be surprised to lose all credibility overnight. How this idea got off the starting block, is a mystery to me, but whoever thought that one up should be looking for anothrr job before the inevitable happens.

---------- Post added at 10:48 ---------- Previous post was at 10:42 ----------

It's called the Meldrew factor in our house!

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

ITV2 is up for carriage renegotiation too in the near future so that could go off too.

I say could as I agree with Mr K.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

To be honest, I don't think I have ever watched a programme on ITV2. I have definitely not watched anything on ITV Be!

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

I say let them go. When ITV see that they are losing viewers and advertising revenue and come back with their tails between their legs, hit them with a hefty carriage charge to be on the platform. That'll teach 'em. :p:

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

ITV are a pile of crap anyway. One they are in bed with SKY and two they only broadcast in stereo on Virgin.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

I agree with this, or when they come back with their tails between their legs make them develop an ITV Hub app for Tivo and V6 as the only way back onto the platform.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

...And don't forget ITV Encore!

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Purely personal but I'd disagree I watch just as many shows across the Sky channels as I do off Netflix and that's not including Sport and Movies I watch on Sky.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Well I get ITV Encore through Now TV, whilst I have to admit any ITV channel is not exactly high up on my list to find something to watch I haven't noticed anything on there that is not a repeat from ITV1 (its original premise was after 12 months to have original content air on Encore first before it went on the main channel but that has never materialised), so imho its not exactly something VM subscribers are missing out on, its just another way ITV are trying to monetise their program catalogue and not worth one penny added to a subscription.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

No me episodes of The Chase being on 6/7 days a week, :D

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

I didn't suggest we should pay extra for it!

Agreed there's mainly repeats on that channel at the moment but we were told that original dramas would start to appear. That may still be the case - but maybe ITV think it's not worthwhile during the Sky exclusivity period.

I only view the channel to watch The Americans.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

I actually thought that was the whole point of the 'exclusivity period'.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

I believe that ITV Encore's audience share is very low, which I guess they think would make the production of new dramas uneconomic.

However, in my view, if they were to add some decent original material to that channel, and advertise it on the main ITV and Sky channels, it would gain a much bigger audience on Sky. Even if its audience share remained on the low side, the cost of the original dramas shown on there would be recouped from repeating them on ITV at a later date, with a note that it was originally shown on ITV Encore. The channel would then seem to be more interesting.

As it is, they've turned this channel into one that's regarded as irrelevant because it screens stuff that has already been shown on ITV3, itself an ITV repeats channel.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Any updates on this?

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

You do know what "encore" means, don't you?

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

None thus so far.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Probably a lot on here will disagree with me but in my opinion ITV have aired some great shows over the years , they have a pretty good back catalogue of shows.

Like most broadcasters these days they have far to many channels with the good stuff spread to thinly.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Well MM it might surprise you but you are quite correct as they have a great back catalogue of shows that is for sure.

---------- Post added at 18:57 ---------- Previous post was at 18:55 ----------

Well if they showed all the stuff that is not politically correct then that would increase the content quite considerably on some of their lesser channels.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Agreed, but very much doubt that linear TV is the way for people to enjoy them. Far better to put them on video on demand platforms. Linear channels replaying old content, with the exception of +1 channels, can't have too much life left in them and, frankly, no reason to have them.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Yes like 'On the Buses' and 'Celebrity Squares' nobody else could make this quality entertainment ;)

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

I didn't actually say everything they touched was a hit.;)

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

l have a part just perfect for you in the new remake Mr K.;)

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Ooh you are naughty Den, get them buses out !

I've got a part in mind for you too...
https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2017/08/16.jpg ;)

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Nice on.:D:D

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Both those shows were big hits.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

On the Buses was so big there were 3 spin off films as well.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Yes perhaps I should have said a hit with everybody.:D

---------- Post added at 08:17 ---------- Previous post was at 08:15 ----------

I would say Mr K is more of a Arthur Daley :D

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Now the next question is who on this forum can we cast as his minder.:D

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Oh it'd have to be Mick, he'd scare off any 'undesirables' ;)

Actually I quite like On the Buses. It's in the category of 'so bad, it's good'.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

On the Buses was that classic British sitcom which is just as good as when it was shown then.

---------- Post added at 12:13 ---------- Previous post was at 12:12 ----------

He will send out his dogs of war on the riff raff and malcontents.;)

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

I don't think that ITV offer a live internet stream, so if they continue to demand retransmission fees perhaps VM could do a deal with tvPlayer by doing a BBC3 on channel 103?? They wouldn't be showing ITV without authorisation, but simply pointing viewers to a free and publically available internet stream!

Not that I'd want to encourage this as we wouldn't be able to record anything.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

If ITV were to cut off several million of their viewers, their advertisers would be very unhappy, it makes no sense and I cannot see that they would actually do it.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

But it might please lots of England fans if ITV cut them off now.....based on this game anyway!! :)

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

ITV offer a live Internet stream at https://www.itv.com/hub/itv

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Thanks, maybe VM could put this behind a red button on Ch 103 in the (unlikely) even that ITV is removed.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Surely the method of delivering the channel to the set top box is irrelevant - if VM are to make it available at all they would have to have an agreement in place (and pay any agreed fees).

I'd imagine it would be different if they added an app such as TV Player, which would have its own agreement with ITV, but I can't see that happening.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

And we'll still have to pay for a poxy tv licence :mad:

---------- Post added at 07:44 ---------- Previous post was at 07:39 ----------

Forget it, why would you bother remembering it

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

I'm afraid there are too many diehard politicians wedded to their traditional ways of doing things for anything to change on that front for the time being, although I'm still hoping this will change the next time the licence is up for review. The sooner the BBC is obliged to go to subscriptions so that people can choose whether or not that want to view and listen to BBC programmes, the better.

As for ITV Encore, it's only good for 'The Americans' in our house!

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

More on this in the Torygraph:-
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/...edia-80m-bill/
I'm with VM no way should they be paying for Freeview channels. But they shouldn't be charging customers for the Player package, which is basically freeview.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

My belief is ITV are sabre rattling Mr K.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

If the figures in the article are correct, it averages out at £1.75 per customer, per month. It's pretty hard to imagine the cost being fully absorbed by Virgin if implemented. However, earlier in the year the Telegraph suggested ITV was also tying in carriage renewal for its other channels into a the negotiations - so the figures may not just be for the main PSB channel and it's +1 and HD variants.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Obviously you have to pay for the player package, you have a v6 to rent

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Have they done the same for sky and if not why? If sky are getting away with it couldnt VM do the same as sky?

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Cheers for that, I had no idea what it is I'm paying for :D

you notice I said paying for and not watching, because there's nothing on there that would interest me . . . well actually there may well be a couple of programs, but as the wife watches all the inane crap it spouts out there really isn't any 'free' time to watch anything I'd consider entertaining.

At 63 years of age I've seen the best of TV viewing come and go, to be replaced by the politically correct and sanitized drivel that keeps the unimaginative masses hooked on whether Tommy will kiss Gloria in tonights episode, or which of the (unknown) celebrities will win that massive £2500 for a charity of their choice.

Keep all that stuff, I'm happy fragging people in online gaming :D

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

I don't think ITV should be allowed to charge for their main channel - it is free on terrestrial tv after all.

Additionally, this will set a big precedent.

If they insist, Virgin should set ITV up as a standalone channel (way down the EPG listings) and demand ITV set up the method and expense of charging for it themselves.

This way they will realise people aren't going to pay for a channel full of adverts and dross programming.

Whatever next, BBC trying to charge for their main channels?

We should all make our feelings known to Virgin that we are not prepared to be charged extra for it.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

This new law only applies to cable delivered TV and won't affect Sky until they start their IPTV service.

The Government initially said that they didn't expect this to affect traditional cable companies, but now that ITV is trying it on, they say that it's for the market to decide.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Simple answer, Sky don't transmit ITV on satellite, ITV does via their own contractors. They simply pay Sky to be on the Sky EPG. Should ITV impose a retransmission fee for carriage on satellite, they would have to charge themselves.

---------- Post added at 22:42 ---------- Previous post was at 22:34 ----------

Indeed. As ITV have now put forward a figure of 80m, VM should now make it clear that they want ITV to pay for carriage. A sum of £120m sounds reasonable.

---------- Post added at 22:44 ---------- Previous post was at 22:42 ----------

Not like this government to get itself into a situation with no clear plan of how things will work out. Oh wait...

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Why not blame it on Brexit?

Everything else that goes wrong is blamed on it after all:D

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Now you're just being silly ;)
(however it is to blame for a lot of what's going tits up atm !)

There is an interesting bit in the Telegraph article about VMs contingency if ITV did blackout. Just getting the channel from Sky's unscrambled feed ! (Even if it's just the main ITV channel).

---------- Post added at 11:42 ---------- Previous post was at 11:20 ----------

The only thing ITV have of any worth (imo) is next year's World Cup, shared with the BBC. They could use this as a bargaining chip, but most of us still have aerials anyway...

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Do we? I don't...........

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Its surprising the amount of channels you can pick up with an indoor aerial and I'm not in a particularly strong signal area.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

I do, but not one that was designed for digital reception, and I'm not sure how good it (or the lead etc) would be, it's not been used for 17+ years now.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

In most cases transmitters are broadcasting DTT at similar power and in the same frequency group as they did in purely analogue days. If your aerial gave you good reception 17 years ago it will do so now, provided the wind hasn’t shifted it and the weather hasn’t degrade the exposed cable.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Also there's no such thing as a digital aerial, this was a myth perpetuated by aerial installers at Digital Switchover.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

I find freeview useful as an alternative source particularly when you've got one box feeding a few TVs and you want to watch different things ! Plus the HD on freeview seems to be better for some reason.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

As usual they take a grain of truth and twist it to get sales. A so-called “digital aerial” was just a wideband UHF aerial, able to receive all frequencies used in terrestrial broadcasts in the UK.

In some places, while analogue and digital were broadcasting at the same time, it was necessary to broadcast digital outside of the transmitter’s usual frequency group. In such cases a house with a rooftop aerial optimised to receive only frequencies from within that group would be inadequate to receive digital transmissions properly. In those cases, a wideband aerial was required.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Boost for ITV as Government backs commercial deal in £80m fees row with Virgin Media.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/...es-row-virgin/

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Itv never used to be on sky, wasn't for years and it really irked them

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

They had better be ready to be irked again, I think! When VM take a different feed and put them down further in the EPG, ITV will be well annoyed!

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Serves them right if that happens..

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

It irked sky, apologies for not being clearer, we used to like to remind them that Britain's most popular independent channel wasn't available on their platform

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

How can VM get round this by showing a different feed? Surely they will still be 'rebroadcasting' the channel? :confused:

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

My idea of making ITV responsible for individual collection of those who choose to take ITV as a ppv channel is the best idea.

A second option would be for virgin to agree to pay the £80m and charge ITV £150m for access to Virgin's system.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Then itv would say no thanks

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

No loss, I am sure most people can get ITV main channel through an aerial, or other method.

I certainly do not want to pay for what should be a free channel (and is such on other platforms), hence my preferred solution of making it a PPV channel with
ITV being responsible for collecting the fees - or even paying Virgin to collect them.

To be forced to pay for ITV included in existing packages, through a price increase, is just not on!

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

The World Cup next year might be ITVs trump card...

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Only for viewers with no recourse to freeview, freesat, sky, BT tv or terrestrial

Probably an insignificant minority.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

The World Cup Finals are a protected sporting event which has to be made available free to air by ITV to at least 95% of UK households under the Digital Economy Bill. Virgin Media's 3.8 million TV customers account for nearly 15% of total UK households. Virgin could argue a blackout of ITV on their platform could result in ITV not maintaining their obligation to reach 95% of UK households. Virgin could also argue if ITV start charging a rebroadcast fee, which Virgin have to pass onto their customers, then ITV are not technically delivering the World Cup on a free to air basis on the Virgin Media platform.

I'm sure I'm just looking at this at a very basic level however the Digital Economy Bill was brought in to safe guard key cultural sporting from disappearing behind a paywall and making sure the events are made available easily to the widest possible audience.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

I don't think ITV actually shows anything i watch...

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Sorted that for you......:D

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

:)

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Gosh that's even higher than the £120m I suggested earlier. I have to admit, I prefer your figure. In fact, let's make it £160m.

Fine. ITV are complaining about the large number of viewers getting their PSB service for free on VM, let's see how they explain the loss of that large amount of viewers to their advertisers. Advertisers certainly aren't going to continue paying the same amount for an advertising slot with a (potentially) significantly reduced audience.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

AFAIK VM take ITV SD from the Astra satellite and ITV HD is line fed.

I wonder if VM contingency plans mean taking the FTA HD feed from Astra?? Presumably if they refuse to pay the retransmission fee, ITV would cut the line feed off.

But wouldn't this still mean that VM are retransmitting the channel and leave them open to legal action?

I wonder if this will mean us losing ITV2 HD, ITV3 HD and ITV4 HD as these are encrypted on satellite.

Also, I wondered if their contingency plans somehow meant them taking a non Astra satellite feed to get round the issue, but the only non Astra satellites that carry ITV are encrypted and meant for our forces based overseas (BFBS).

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

A few years ago there was a streaming site and app that showed most of the freeview channels, they got taken to court by the broadcasters as it was an unauthorised retransmission. They lost and had to stop showing all the channels apart from the main ones, BBC1, ITV1, CH4 and CH5.

I can't for the life of me remember what the site/app was called but after that court ruling VM would be able to retransmit the ITV channel i'm sure.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Wasn't it TVCatchup?

https://tvcatchup.com

Edit: Looks like it's as you say, just channels 1-5 now (plus some extra ones like shopping channels that would be happy to give permission).

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

I'm not sure about that. I know that VM doesn't have all of the ITV +1 regional variations available on other platforms. Presumably if filling in the gaps is as simple as taking the missing feeds from Astra they would have done that already.

That's up to the courts and/or up to the Government to be more specific about the legislation. Which, of course, should have happened at the Bill stage. This is hardly an unforeseen outcome of the legislation.

It shouldn't as those channels are subject to an existing, apparently long-term, contract.

My personal preference is for ITV to cut the feed and be left to suffer a loss of advertising revenue until they come to their senses. Certainly don't allow them to return to VM without paying a penalty charge for the inconvenience caused. Then encourage third parties to take action against ITV for not upholding the "must offer" requirement of their PSB licence.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

ITV could argue they are providing to VM customers, they just need an aerial & TV like everyone else.

Re: ITV threaten to blackout on Virgin
 

Exactly, we don't need ITV main channel as much as ITV needs us viewers, as others have said loss of viewers = loss of advertising revenue.

Certainly hope VM calls their bluff.