Application Throttling/Management
 

Ok,

As a certain someone has nagged me about this...and others wanting to know where the future holds for VM as far as this goes.

As i have mentioned a few weeks or so back VM have been trialling application throttling/management in lab 3 (for those interested, this is just a name to represent the area where the trial is going on, not an actual lab)

Currently through the trial Usenet ports (including SSL) are throttled (reducing speeds down to 512k)

This, is, as far as one is aware going to be used for both in and out of peak hours for whoever they see "fit" as a heavy user.

I'm sure some of you noticed "Allot" was mentioned in another thread on here and i've had a few people asking me what this is.

It's currently what VM are using to trial application/throttling/management and is to be deployed across the VM network fully sometime either third quarter 2008 or first quarter 2009, the dates are unknown/rough ideas right now as things are being kept quiet over @ VM headquarters.

Now before any of you shout at me or anything i wasnt going to release this information until *certain people within VM* thought it would be amusing to try and release information about me on certain sites, and no this is not revenge on them, but i have had a few people asking me to release this information.

Anyway...you can view more about Allot over at http://www.allot.com/index.php?optio...&id=2&Itemid=4

I would note there is ALSO a seperate trial going on while controls ports speciifcally for games (Wow etc) which affect the pings for said games.

I will add more information to this thread over the coming weeks (i have ALOT going on right now, so dont moan about lack of info just yet)

Just to add, this will be a part of their FUP and completely seperate to STM.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

God with all this crap that VM & alex BROWN are doing, will they have ANY customers at all by the end of this year / begining of next??

If I find out they are throttling ANY port or application on my "unlimited" broadband, I will tell them exactly WHAT i think of them and the way they are screwing customers, and tell them quite plainly and clearly to stick their rubbish (I'm sure everyone knows the word that would come next) and cancel straight away, and if they dare to chagre, i'll take them to the small claims court!

THEY(vm) are in my eyes the criminals here, ripping people off, stealing back most of what is been sold, then there is the blatant lies, treating its customers like dog chod etc...

Looks like I just like many here will soon be an ex-virgin media customer!!!

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

When this does happen then it'll be the end of VM broadband as a whole. There's not a lot else you can say really.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

The main problem is that Virgin are the only player in the cable market as everything else is via the BT phonelines, and it is only a relative few people who come on these forums out of over 3.5 million Virgin customers, so the answer is that regardless how much you personally will Virgin to fail, I cannot see that many people going elsewhere for their services as the vast majority are satisfied with their services.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

This thread has the potential to be quite impressively large...

Have you been taking PR lessons from the news groups? ;) This is being tested, and no they wouldn't tell tech support about it.

Not about wishing Virgin or anyone else to fail the man is simply stating the facts as they stand right now. If you object to your customers being told what's presently on the drawing board for their services that's your prerogative.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Yeah I will be off to the land of crappy adsl as even the 4/5 meg I can get off them is better than 512

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I'm happy with my phone and TV service from VM, but if I can't use the main service I pay top whack for then I'll gladly cancel the lot and go back to BT or whoever. Do you think people will still pay £37 a month for something they can't use?

Still, there'll always mugs who'll say "well done virgin, my emails come through so much quicker now, that's well worth £37".

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

The BT Total or whatever looks quite tempting at the moment will even take my mobile from o2 as they supply a HTC pocket pc phone for £30 quid a month inclusive of voip package internet and home hub add the 30 quid a month call package in dump vm phone and tv and ill have slower net but actually save a few quid

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

No just stating the facts that we the people who post on here are in the minority and the average person who has services from Virgin are unaware that these forums even exist, if its not MSN or Facebook they do not care but we do in different ways thats why we are here, I expect you will agree on that point.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

But this information will goto press.

There is no defending VM anymore they are screwing their customers over. Ok you can argue Usenet is piracy but even considering throttling gaming ports is just wrong wrong wrong. VM are standing toe to toe to us customers smacking us in the mouth over and over trying to push us as far as they can and so far we are not hitting back

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Sure, but I've no idea what the relevance is to testing / planned rollout of application throttling / management so let's discuss that :)

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I cannot wait to see this thread grow as it should, because what you mention above is going to get worse as the rollout of 50Mb gets closer and we once again get stitched up even further.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

OMFG i have had it with VM do they wanna exsit as a company if they do STOP THE STUPID IDEAS to screw customers over

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

If there are concrete plans to introduce this then I would hope that VM are seriously considering updating their pricing. £38 to be dicated to as to what type of traffic you are allowed to download at 20Mbit/sec is wholly unacceptable. We shall see.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

He didn't say throttling. Sounds more like QoS type rules to prioritise certain gaming traffic and improve pings.

Agree. As part of a Sky type package, £10pm or even free I can understand draconian measures like this. But to charge broadband-only customers £38pm for this is disgusting.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

No, it's a tool for increasing revenue at your expense. You can't just give something to someone then take it away and expect them to pay the same price.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

To be quite honnest, these days the internet is just getting more and more full with useless garbage, there are more self-obsessed idiots than ever before, the amount of spam has grown to an unbelievable amount, more profile sites than I can count on 2 hands, too many pricks either conning / offering pointless crap, and then there is phorm....

My online MSN contacts are practically nill (god I remember the good old days when i'd have 6 or 7 chats going at once, not even a second to breath myself) as they have ditched their internet, and to be quite honest, I would not miss it at all, so if virgin DO make this live, i will tell them to stick it and go without!
I could probably do with spending more time with family, and with a library just 10mins away from me offering free wifi, I could use a laptop to download what I want/need and screw the lot of the other rubbish out there!

Really, I think i am out-growing the internet, years ago it was really exciting, now its quite boring and not half as much fun as ot used to be!

Bye bye virgin, you can shove your "services" that you screw us PAYING customers with and i hope you sink faster than the titanic!!!

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I think you are over reacting to Traxs' news.

The Allot system is essentially designed to maximise traffic throughput on certain protocols, prioritising certain types of traffic over others.

Essentially it tries to give an even playing field to all users.

As Trax mentioned for example it could help ping times for certain online gaming such as World of Warcraft, or give priority to other data types at different times.

Lets be upfront here, most people think that VM's problems are down to lack of capacity, the pipe. They think that if you increase the flow, or enlarge the pipe - everything will be ticketyboo. WRONG.

It's simple, if people are taking more than they reasonably should, you should not give them a wider door to go through, no sir. You controll the flow, making it fairer for the majority, that is what the Allot DPI system provides. It gives VM mission critical data to help them manage peoples expectations of traffic flow. This is ultimately what people want, the ability to turn on their PC, do what they have to do then get off.

Virgin Media are not criminals just because you're not happy, they have to manage a massively complicated network with a burgening demand from its customers and all the various content out there.

Trust me when I say this, the problem is global. The bigger the ISP, the bigger the problem. Traffic management isn't a nice to have, its a must have and the quicker we accept this the better.

Can I suggest something though? Leave, leave now.....you're not happy, and this system has been in place for months, possibly a couple of years but VM have never used it, its going to happen, so cut your losses and head off to ADSL land. Be Unlimited seem to offer good packages, and there are other ADSL providers who will provide a premium service for a premium price, that is give you priority traffic at peak times if you pay more - oh wait - that wouldn't be fair in your eyes, sorry.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Hopefully they will do as you say by the bucket load

But remember everyone that does leave Pick a none Phorm ISP when you do leave

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I can just about put up with STM - I have a pretty solid service

but if my newsgroup activity starts being affected as stated in the OP, then I'll be off like a shot.

It'll be a shame, but certainly won't miss the tv - I'll be more than happy with Freeview, and hopefully, get an OK speed with ADSL

I think this will hit VM hard - certainly only a tiny fraction of VM users frequent this forum, but I'd bet the majority of 20Mb users out there aren't just browsing/checking e-mails and do actually know what they should be expecting

people are a lot more savvy these days

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

he didnt say it wont be throttled either

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

This is disappointing to read. I always thought VM were good value for money in the past for what i got and used. Then STM came in but i stayed out of the problem hours and survived ok. Then STM hours were increased to most of the day (and lets face it the night is just round the corner) and that has made me think about moving. Now i see this and think my time with VM is definatly up as i feel i am going to be paying way over the odds for a service that ADSL can supply just as well for my needs.

Goodbye VM, hello BE*

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Is this does come into effect I will probably be going, at the moment we have VIP package, that will be reduced to TV only (can't get SKY) and maybe keep the V+ box.

As far as broadband goes they can forget it, I can just about live with STM but this will be taking it to far.

Unless of course they advertise it as what it will be, a restricted broadband service (but thats a whole other discussion) and price is accordingly.

JJ

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

To be fair I'm reading the info in that Allot link, not simply what Trax said.

Ie. prioritising delay-sensitive traffic, which in the case of a consumer ISP is likely to be gaming-related traffic.

And anyway what's the point of throttling traffic that uses a relatively small amount of bandwidth? We're talking bandwidth usage for most games, WoW included, in the single-figures of Kbps.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I will just clarify something here.

VM are using this to throttle p2p and usenet for people they class as "heavy" users.

As i said this is in and out of peak hours and in their FUP completely seperate to STM.

And the reason for throttling games is quite simple, the uplink on *some* games affects the network in oversubscribed areas.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I am pretty patient with VM generally, and I can see where they are coming from regarding the heavy downloaders etc (not that I agree with them btw), but.. when they start thinking about blocking/throttling game ports or whatever then that is a bit too much.
I just phoned BT 2 minutes ago, they are coming next Friday to reactivate my line, and hopefully I will be up and running soon with a decent gaming ISP.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

One slight problem..most news servers allow the usage of port80...surely if they restrict that then they're restricting all web based traffic for the user??

Kymmy

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Not really, as with ALLOT it has deep packet inspection, they can easily tell if ur using usenet even with SSL.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

The days of gaming traffic (with notable exceptions) using single digit bandwidth figures is a thing of the past unfortunately. The majority of Xbox live games for example are user hosted and rely on peer-to-peer connectivity.A mid double-digit figure is a more realistic estimation in this case depending on the game in question.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

why pick on newsgroups?

I thought it was the P2P users that caused congestion on the network with uploading

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Another nail in the coffin for VM hopefully. I forsee Be getting a lot of new customers soon. :D

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Fair point, having only ever gamed on the PC I didn't stop to consider consoles.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Feck, if you throttle newsgroup and p2p ports, then what exactly can you downloadload at 20mbit? Or is that the point, they don't want you to use it. As I have said before I am going to wait till 50mbit comes out and see what happens after that. As for saying that the average user doesn't know about this site and is more likely to use Facebook et al. Why not create a anti stm/phorm/throttling Virgin Media group in Facebook. This way you might significantly raise the profile of what they are doing and at the same time put the 'the average user' in touch with what is happening, also if a lot of people register to it that will create public pressure on VM, it would not cost anything and would be free so there is nothing lost in doing it.

I have created an Anti Phorm/STM/Throttling group in Facebook. If you want to join it then here is the link to the group:

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=63826810720

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Well the big problem is that VM can arbitrarily decide what constitutes "heavy" use as they see fit and may arbitrarily apply Class of Service on whatever type of traffic they see fit (potentially to the detriment of their paying customers), just as they have varied the limits of STM and reserve the right to continue to do so.

Unfortunately the more switched on customers who decide that enough is enough and leave will no doubt be replaced by the unsuspecting people who make a grab for the dangling carrot of 50Mbit, which sounds great on paper.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Given the country of origin for this DPI equipment, I do wonder whether these devices were made just for traffic management or something altogether more sinster.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

With all due respect Toto, Trax did not say it could / will help ping times for games, he said it will "affect" it, which means they could (knowing what vm are like) throttle it down, I already have problems playing on Halo Multiplayer, even if the ping is low (lowest I have seen is 30-90) then I still get lags (that red disconnected network thing that pops up in the lower right of the screen and cant move or shoot)

What is the point of moving to (A)DSL when the max I can expect is 1.9mb as I am too far from the exchange. WHEN they have all of this going live, as I said earlier, not only will I cancel all of our virgin "services" but I will leave the net for good, I do not see the point in paying virgin to rip me off, not when I can pop into the library and use the net for free for as long as I want (business opening hours of course) if I wanted to, I could wait outside for them to open, and not leave until they close at night, and with a mate living within spitting distance of it, I could even go round their house and use the free internet, not to mention all of my friends that also have wireless, I'm sure they wouldnt mind me sitting in theirs using their connection, but thats beside the point!

This is all I am going to say on the matter as I dont want to get in an arguement, there's enough of that in the world already!

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Is it legal to use DPI on SSL encryption?

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Assuming that DPI can break the encryption? doubt it, but we are moving away from the point.

VM AND BT both have Allot (or similar) installed within their network edge at the pops, I am not sure about other ISP's.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

an ISP can easilly see SSL traffic, afterall you negotiate the secure connection via your ISP

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I was answering the point as to whether or not D(eep)P(acket)I(nspection) of SSL packets whas legal or not, not whether the ISP can see them, which of course they can.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Not really, this is why there are certification chains for the SSL certificates. If Virgin started trying to proxy SSL connections in order to read the contents it would be very obvious when you noted your bank's secure site having a certificate signed by Virgin Media ;)

They can't 'break' SSL but can certainly monitor the endpoints and implement a policy based on that. If someone has 10 SSL connections to news-europe.giganews.com it doesn't take a huge amount of thinking or analysis to guess what the traffic is.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

If this is about QOS and NOT capping download rates for certain services, I think it would be a good thing. By definition, low latency applications (gamming, VOIP etc) require significantly less bandwidth than your blunt force multiple stream P2P/Newsgroup feed, so prioritising this traffic should not adversely affect download rates imo.

Dave

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I think VM are playing with fire

Maybe with all of this coming in VM might offer a "app throttling/STM free" service for a few pounds extra

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

It would depend on what they would do to achieve what they believe to be a quality of service with regards to throttling SSL connections. For example if they took an SSL connection download going at full pelt 20mbit, then throttled it down to say 15mbit perhaps this might not upset most folk. If on the other hand they throttle it from the full 20mbit to 0.5mbit then that really would be taking the micky.

All ISPs have limitations to what they can deliver, so using throttling to gaurntee quality of service isn't intrinsicly bad. The problem arises when an ISP like Virgin Media don't maintain the basic level of service to their customers, then use traffic management and throttling to offset the costs that are needed to maintain a basic level of service.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Virgin Media rubbishes P2P throttling rumours

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/06...ttling_denial/

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I must say I do not believe them

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Gotta agree with you here Zing.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Count me in for that vote

stupid VM

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Scrap that, now my name is posted everywhere i might just keep quiet lol.

---------- Post added at 15:18 ---------- Previous post was at 15:12 ----------

Infact i'm more interested in who sent this to theregister :p:

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I wouldn`t, probably with you coming out with this information may well of sent Virgin (AKA NTL) into reverse mode and just rubbished your name...

I ditched Virgin nearly a Year Ago, Promised discounts etc never came and with the network being dire around here I went with Sky..

8Mb, now going over to their "UPTO" 16mb Package due to them LLU my exchange 2 weeks ago...

I will never Consider Virgin Media (or should we Say a wolf in sheeps clothing) again :mad:

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

VM have approached us today as well as they appear to have been reading this thread and more or less have said what was quoted to Elreg above.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Haha! Quality!
Go Trax!
:p:

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Wouldn't put anything past VM at the moment, I bet they are doing some secret test to throttle P2P and Usenet downloads - this along with STM should take us all back to the dark ages of dial up speeds :D

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Maybe they should do secret tests so we can have free beer ;)

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Nah as they would only put a limit on how much you can have, as well as sell you a pint but only give you a 1/4 of what you think a pint should be ;)

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

One should note VirginMedia also said the exact same thing about the secret STM trials that were originally run on the telewest network before being rolled out.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

*Dreams* of a Unlimited,unthrottled connection

Name Telewest come to mind

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Telewest were running STM trials long before the merger though...

Infact they were stm'in alot of "heavy users"

It's actually telewests fault you have STM...

EDIT : This has kicked up a big big big fuss over at VM, some people are not happy this has leaked...;)

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

This is so funny that they are all up in arms over something they claim isn't going on!

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Very interesting :)

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Nooo stay away!!! The grass is nice and green over here on Be :p:

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Yup, that was my initial thought, they are gutted it`s leaked out..


It`s ok VM, just wait another Year for everyone to forget then sneak it out ;)

---------- Post added at 16:46 ---------- Previous post was at 16:45 ----------

2ND..

"Sky is rubbish, don`t bother switching over here, it`s worse than VM"

Stay Away, Stay Awayyyyyyyyy :D:D:D

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Has anyone checked the ever changing T&C's which magically appear to update whenever anything like this gets leaked??!?!

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Well judging by the letter I received a few weeks ago about the STM and the new daytime STM, im inclined to agree with Traxdata's claims.

As for the port throttling on newsgroups, well that will be me off, I have paid full price for about 4 years. for my broadband and TV.

If VM are reading this, you throttle ports on usenet/p2p, you would be upsetting a lot of customers inc myself.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I was downloading loads under Telewest and never got stm'd

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

You wasnt in the trial area.

It was very well known that telewest were running STM trials and it was due to be implemented across the telewest network before the merger took place.

Which is why i laugh at people who think telewest was good :p:

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

O well atleast the speed was stable unlike my 20Mb speed with bursts of 18Mb and stable speed of 6Mb

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I know who i believe. I seem to be on an over night STM trial which they say they are not doing. Yet i seem to be on one :confused:

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Have you not rang TS Sirus lol

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Since when have TS ever been told about trials. I can bet you that they will just say its my connection even when it matches the STM exactly.

Will run tests tonight via a linux machine with MRTG on it and graph the lot.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

We don't agree on very much.. But on this one we do.. STM came out of Telewest.

They were trialling in the Preston Region for almost 18 Months before it say national deployment post merger.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

They say speed limits affect only top 5% which is a lie. It affects everyone who downloads. Why would I have 20mb service just so I could surf webpages? I might as well use dial up then. I played MGS4 online today and after a while my connection was so unstable (because I was being capped) that I had to stop playing.

The only bright side is that I can leave it on overnight but if they start managing traffic during night as well than that would be it.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Hence the LOL at the end of my post

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

There's 2 things that are going to happen here.

1 is when they do implement application management, whether it be throttling or whatever. they will have proved that they lied. and can't be trusted to ever tell the truth resulting in everyone leaving and the company goes bust.

2 is they change their mind and don't go ahead with implementing application management in any shape or form.

Wonder which one they are gonna go for? :D :LOL:

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Will give you an answer to that question by tomorrow morning ;)

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I choose 1 :D

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

BUT there will still be the not-so-tech savvy, and the users that dont freqent here that will know nothing about it, and IF they do actually call up to complain, they will be force fed the usual bullcrap that their pc is infected with viri / spyware or their network card is buggered, and if its the less tech savvy people, then they will actually believe virgin!!

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I think this is the first time when they have denied something is happening or is going to happen (I guess you could say officially)
making that (I guess you could say official) statement, and taking into account the fact that they already do the very same thing on their ADSL offering.

The Virgin *we are in a bit of a pickle* team
:ghugs:

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

People who are on 20mb use their connection, they don't pay out just to browse and get emails. I'm sure they know's exactly what's going on.

When or if this comes into force, for what real reason is left to stay on 20mb or 50mb, or VM as a whole.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

A while back now, back in the days of NTL wasn't there some master plan to put everyone on 10meg (as was the top speed back then) and then charge people for usage - similar to the price plans from ADSL providers like BT?

The more we move towards 24/7 STM and this application throttling (OK, they denied throttling applications but that leaves plenty of scope for destinations, ports, etc) the more the drive is for a higher package to get higher bandwidth rather than the speed.

I've said it before, and I still think this is the case, but I believe the end goal here is to "encourage" people like me on 4meg to upgrade to a higher packager just to be able to use my connection now as I was a year ago. They're banking on the fact that just because you give someone faster speeds doesn't mean their usage changes. The more people on the higher packages, the more revenue for the same cost (in theory anyway).

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I totally agree with what you're saying, but when you're paying £38 for it the fun soon wears off when you can't use what you're paying out for. There are cheaper alternatives out there.

I understand what you're saying, if the 10mb was stm free then I'll gladly down grade. As it stands I do feel like I don't have a choice in the matter as that tier to me is totally pointless as it is now, my only alternative is to look elsewhere and in time all those upgrading will probably feel the same too.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Sorry, I don't think I explained it properly. I'm wondering if they'll put us all on the top speed (20meg) and then the price gets us an allowance STM/throttling. So instead of BB M being 2 meg unlimited*, it's 20 meg with a 3GB monthly limit (for example).

The thing that's really doing VM no favours is that a number of heavy users here wouldn't object to paying a decent price for a decent service. It's paying a decent price and getting messed around that annoys us.


(* = Except for when VM decide it's limited in some random arbitrary way that results in a phonecall to TS to be told your PC has a virus, etc)

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

That may be the reason VM give for doing this, but the main reason is to make money out of video downloading. I've said this several times on this site over the last 3 years. To make money out of legal downloads, they have to clamp down on the illegal first.

Don't worry about it, VM made this public about 3 weeks ago anyway - at least to the City bods.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

You got a link to that as it will show that VM are lying in there denial today. ???

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

They're not lying, the PR people don't know what's coming in the future.

Neil Berkett told City analysts that anti piracy measures would be brought in next year. He mentions it in one of the webcasts. Either the last Merryl Lynch one or Lehman Brothers one available from here:

http://investors.virginmedia.com/pho...onsVirginMedia

You may be asked to register to listen to the webcasts, just use any name and email address.

If I have time tommorow, I'll endure going through each one of them again and I'll post at exactly what time point in the webcast he mentions it.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Making your service so cack that everyone leaves is a novel approach to combating piracy! Effective though. No users = no piracy on our network. :)

Ed.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Update.

Just passed 4.8 gig since midnight and as yet no STM, So ether the threshold is higher or the STM the other night was a faulty activation. Will continue to monitor this over the next week.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Threshold is 9GB overnight.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Well i have set for a higher download than that so will leave it running and see what happens

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

There isn't suppose to be ANY trigger threshold outside the published hours.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Hope you dont get stm'd :)

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Assuming TraxData is right (and I'm betting he is) I'd love to see your evidence sent through to The Register for a follow-up story to VM's denial...

Ed.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

If he's in the trial area, which changes every few weeks :)

VM havent actually denied using allot for shaping really, very choice words from VM to not really give an answer back ;)

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I've just reread VM's statement and I can certainly see some loopholes but it reads like a firm denial re. Allot. What am I missing?

I'm almost tempted to get a job at VM so I can do my bit towards getting some of this doublespeak out into the public domain.

Ed.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

More people read these forums than some may give credit for. I've popped in and looked ever since VM took over, ever since Blueyonder took over, in fact since the early days of Telewest broadband. It's taken a long time but there has to come a point at which one has to say `too far, no more'.

VM with me are on a very sticky wicket. Our relationship has spiralled downward ever since the first day I called VM CS. That patronising voice saying how there are now four choices, choosing, waiting, choosing again, the customer service disconnects while you wait, the unintelligible language of at least half of the CS telephone staff, the fact that I was one of the very first to have broadband in my area with Telewest in 1998, the fact that since 2003 I've payed for the top level service from when it was 1mb to the current 20mb, the prospect of throttling just irritates and angers me beyond words.

You can call it what you like, quantize it, divide it, categorize it, diagnose my modem I don't care any more. The fact is this. 20mb connection speed is what I am paying for. If I find so much as once that I am `throttled' back to anything less than the best service you can be assured I will be leaving VM.

Gone are the days where customer service meant one on one conversation with someone who knew your first name. Gone are the days when if you had something to say about service then you would be duly heard, maybe a new policy would be rolled out too. Gone is the time where value means you get exactly what it says on the lid. I have little in the way of positive things to say about Virgin Media. I am in fact appalled at the entire service overall. The gritty TV signal quality, patchy broadband, atrocious phone services etc. In fact I am on the edge of suicide just reading this back to myself.

I'll just say that there are many unhappy customers about to come out of the woodwork, all of whome are equally disillusioned by VM's advertising and service in general. Throttling elite customers will be very much the beginning of the end.

These are my opinions. I'm sorry if I come across angry.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Just like there isn't any port throttling going on ;)

STM kicks in when it feels like it for me and a lot of other people who have VM for their ISP. What VM tell you as a CS rep and what some goon does behind the scenes are always two different things it would seem.

Love how someone has mentioned that they are doing this to combat piracy - not everything P2P involves illegal material ya know! Just nice to see how VM tar everyone with the same brush and that all their internet users are nothing but pirates :D

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Well i did not get STM'd so i can only assume that the triggering the other night was in error which has now been fixed or that the trial if there was one is over.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Which part of the UK are you in Sirius? I live in the North West and I am STM'd day in day out (love to know how it happens given I am in work from around 8am until gone 7pm some nights and can't possibly be using my VM connection!) with varying limits of what I can download (which is nowhere near gigs of data its demos, and streaming 80meg videos from xbox live)

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

Warrington area.

I know of the day time stm and evening stm however i WAS stm'd after midnight the other week. I knew it was stm as the upload and download was changed at the same time for the STM limits. I have been away and have not had the chance to test until last night. I am worried that it will come in as i see a once great broadband system being changed into a bag of poo.

Re: Application Throttling/Management
 

I agree it was going to be a good internet service, now its just a restricted useless pile of crud. They will bring it in like they do everything else they suddenly claim is a trial when it gets leaked and its just the poor customers who get shafted over and over. Might STM my last payment to them for a laugh and see how they like it ;)