Cable Forum

Cable Forum (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/index.php)
-   Current Affairs (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/forumdisplay.php?f=20)
-   -   The 2017 General Election (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33704990)

Chris 08-06-2017 09:19

The 2017 General Election
 
Please continue all election discussion here, and vote in the poll ONLY IF YOU HAVE ACTUALLY VOTED.

Ta muchly. :)

Hugh 08-06-2017 09:30

Re: The Cable Forum 2017 Exit Poll
 
Amusing point about the drive for "tactical voting" being pushed by Labour, Greens, and the Lib Dems to keep out the Conservatives. They seem to forget it works both ways.

I know of Conservatives in two marginal Labour/Lib Dem constituencies who are voting Lib Dem to keep Labour out.

What's the old saying "be careful what you wish for...".

OLD BOY 08-06-2017 09:39

Re: The Cable Forum 2017 Exit Poll
 
I do hope that voters see through Labour's extremely costly manifesto and work out for themselves that the country cannot afford such extravagance. Promise people the earth and some will believe it, but hopefully, most voters have sufficient common sense to realise that if it looks too good to be true, it probably isn't a runner.

Given that a huge chunk of the money Labour say will come from an increase in corporation tax, and given that recent reductions have increased the yield to the treasury, it seems to me that Labour have got their plusses and minuses mixed up. Increased corporation tax will result in a lower, not a higher yield in tax returns.

If you want to see what happens when Corbynista policies are enacted in a country, just take a look at what has happened in Venezuela - go on, Google it, and see whether it is the few or the many suffering there. Corbyn is a big fan of Venezualan politics, so be warned!

Corbyn is looking to increase our debt even further, despite the fact that our deficit continues to add to the trillions of pounds of our debt every day.

If this country is ever to pay of the deficit, and then our debt, thus freeing the next generation from having to pay it off for us (how selfish is that?) then voting Conservative is the only real choice.

Damien 08-06-2017 10:03

Re: The Cable Forum 2017 Exit Poll
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35902164)
Amusing point about the drive for "tactical voting" being pushed by Labour, Greens, and the Lib Dems to keep out the Conservatives. They seem to forget it works both ways.

I know of Conservatives in two marginal Labour/Lib Dem constituencies who are voting Lib Dem to keep Labour out.

What's the old saying "be careful what you wish for...".

The Daily Mail advocated people in Sheffield Hallam vote for Nick Clegg in order to keep out Labour!

There is though an understanding that the right of the country has largely united and the left would have to do the same.

---------- Post added at 10:03 ---------- Previous post was at 09:44 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by OLD BOY (Post 35902166)
If this country is ever to pay of the deficit, and then our debt, thus freeing the next generation from having to pay it off for us (how selfish is that?) then voting Conservative is the only real choice.

If Corbyn is to even achieve a hung parliament it will be off the back of young voters. For many of them the talk of not being able to afford things only applies selectively and not to pensioners who get triple-locked pensions whilst they get tuition fee rises. The Tories themselves continually put back their own deficit reduction targets to the point where it's barely mentioned in this election. Then you have the spending on things like trident which many of them see as a waste of money (I am not arguing that it is, just that the perception exists).

A lot of it comes across as spin as opposed to reality. After all two years ago Ed Miliband's policy of capping energy bills was a financially illiterate Marxist policy and now it's common sense.

So I guess my point is that if, somehow, Corbyn does it today then the Tories only have themselves to blame. They can't spend as much as they have on their own voters then turn around to young people to lecture them on financial responsibility.

Mr K 08-06-2017 10:16

Re: The Cable Forum 2017 Exit Poll
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35902164)
Amusing point about the drive for "tactical voting" being pushed by Labour, Greens, and the Lib Dems to keep out the Conservatives. They seem to forget it works both ways.

I know of Conservatives in two marginal Labour/Lib Dem constituencies who are voting Lib Dem to keep Labour out.

What's the old saying "be careful what you wish for...".

If we had a decent electoral system people wouldn't need to think about tactical voting. As it is, if you choose to vote for a 3rd place party in your constituency your vote counts for nothing.

muppetman11 08-06-2017 11:23

Re: The Cable Forum 2017 Exit Poll
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 35902173)
If we had a decent electoral system people wouldn't need to think about tactical voting. As it is, if you choose to vote for a 3rd place party in your constituency your vote counts for nothing.

Totally agree.

Stuart 08-06-2017 11:45

Re: The Cable Forum 2017 Exit Poll
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 35902173)
If we had a decent electoral system people wouldn't need to think about tactical voting. As it is, if you choose to vote for a 3rd place party in your constituency your vote counts for nothing.

In practice, yes. In theory no.

That said, even the most diehard areas can change allegiances. My local ward has been staunch conservative since the Borough was created (around 1965). They usually give the conservative candidate a huge lead, even when Labour are polling well, and the conservatives are doing extremely badly. However, in one of the elections in the 90s, the Conservatives did so badly that it was almost a tie between the Lib Dems (who do traditionally come second) and them. So areas can change.

I have to admit, I am not sure who to vote for.

I like Labours manifesto, but I don't like the anti semitism that appears to be in the party. The sorts of things Jeremy Corbyn protested for in the past do make me uncomfortable, but I do like the fact he felt compelled to protest. This suggests to me that he entered politics because he wanted to change things, not as a career move. I like that, and I think that Theresa May is the complete opposite. She became Prime Minister because it was a promotion.

However, I don't think Jeremy is a strong leader. He has repeatedly failed to attack the government on various issues that should have made it easy for an opposition leader to get the upper hand. He said he supported the Remain campaign during the referendum, but stayed largely silent, not really campaigning for one side or the other (in fact, various members of the remain campaign tried to contact him and had trouble). I do feel he should have campaigned, even if he campaigned for the Leave campaign.

Theresa, I don't like. She switched allegiances because she saw what was popular, and seemingly got voted in as Prime minister because no one else actually wanted the job. Neither are good things in any leader. We need a leader that is going to make the right decisions for the country. These may not be popular decisions. After all, we don't always like to do what is right. e.g. Everyone agrees that it is the right decision to go to the dentist to get your teeth checked, but no one could argue that is a popular past time. I get the impression TM will go for the popular one. TM has compared herself to Margaret Thatcher. Apart from the fact they are both arguably strong women, and their initials are the same but reversed, I don't see any major similarities. There is one major difference though. Mrs T always did what she believed was right, even if it was unpopular. She was also a good negotiator and got the rebate from the EU that almost halved our contribution to the EU and the Leave campaign continually neglected to mention. Also there may be a reason she didn't actually get the job on Merit.

I can't comment one way or the other on Tim Farron. As a Lib Dem supporter, I'd like him to do well, but I don't actually know enough about him or his policies to comment on him one way or the other.

So, my choice is vote Labour, knowing that they have a weak leader, and a problem with anti-Semitism. Vote Tory, even though I disagree with their policies, and have major concerns that TM will just go for what she believes is popular, or Vote Lib Dem (or any one of the other parties) knowing they are unlikely to get anywhere. If I decide to vote tactically, my best option in my area is actually Labour, assuming I want the Tories out.

The one choice I don't believe I have is to not vote.

Chris 08-06-2017 12:17

Re: The Cable Forum 2017 Exit Poll
 
Tory.

The projection is that the Nats will hold my constituency but in Scotland, the overall size of the vote is all-important.

I'd dearly love the SNP to drop below 40%.

RizzyKing 08-06-2017 13:03

Re: The Cable Forum 2017 Exit Poll
 
Tory here not because they really earnt my vote but of a bad lot they were the least alarming choice and the only one i think will not accept any crap deal offered by the EU. Very underwhelming election by all of them with none showing any real reason to believe in them and i think Theresa May got lazy banking on the shambles that is labour to win it for her.

heero_yuy 08-06-2017 13:14

Re: The Cable Forum 2017 Exit Poll
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris (Post 35902193)
I'd dearly love the SNP to drop below 40%.

Anything that wipes the smirk of Nicola Krankie Surgeon's face gets my vote.

I can't vote as I'm away in Cornwall at the moment and forgot to get a postal form. However it'll make no difference in Worthing as it's true blue Tory throughout. Having said that Tim Loughton, our local Tory, has been very active on local issues especially the dreadful gridlock state of the A27 through the town so would have got my vote.

I'm interested to see what happens down here as the Torys and Lib-dems are both angling for the vote especially as the rural community went whole heartedly for Brexit. There are huge posters up in the fields next to roads for the Torys.

---------- Post added at 13:14 ---------- Previous post was at 13:05 ----------

Apocalypse Mao: Shops boarded up, rise in jobless, power cuts, strikes, soaring inflation, tax hikes, plummeting house prices, uncontrolled immigration, riots, monarchy under threat, kicked out of Nato, a country in meltdown and rules by the hard left… a chilling look at the future in Jeremy Corbyn’s Britain

Read this and be afraid, be very afraid.

passingbat 08-06-2017 13:30

Re: The Cable Forum 2017 Exit Poll
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RizzyKing (Post 35902195)
Tory <snip> the only one i think will not accept any crap deal offered by the EU. .


Same reason here. And, much as some of Corbyn's policies are attractive, there just isn't the money to pay for them. Plus his association with terrorist groups, doubts about pushing the button if required, makes him dangerous in my view.

Uncle Peter 08-06-2017 13:32

Re: The Cable Forum 2017 Exit Poll
 
Done: Con

I hope the young and misguided who vote for the Marxist axis of nonsense are prepared to apologies to their children in 15-20 years time when successive governments have to pick up the pieces in the unlikely event they would get a majority.

denphone 08-06-2017 14:02

Re: The Cable Forum 2017 Exit Poll
 
Not exactly a great choice put in front of the electorate suffice to say but its important that one votes IMO as there are no excuses for those who do not vote as they cannot moan and groan afterwards about things if they did not take any part on democracy in the first place.

A poor choice and quite a difficult choice as firstly lets start with the Conservatives who give us the message of a strong and stable leadership in the national interest which of course is utter bollocks as apart from the great Sir Winston Churchill since then their strongest leader was Margaret Thatcher who was certainly was strong and not for U-turning unlike the current incumbent of 10 Downing Street who has made U-turns that you get in a boxed set of Top Gear DVDS

Although she will get in with a considerable majority come early tomorrow morning their manifesto was a utter disaster with ill thought out policies which quite obviously did not go down well even with her own natural supporters and that will not be forgotten about lightly one suspects in the coming years as l think it has damaged her and her party considerably in the longer term as people have long memorys.

We all know Brexit is happening but l have little faith in the likely outcome and l certainly don't expect one of the key planks of Brexit in lower immigration to be met at all and l think many are going to be very disappointed at the outcome several years down the road as its not going to be the bed of roses that some imagined and hoped for.

Well lets get on to Jeremy Corbyn who l to don't have much faith in either as he is very much too leftist for my liking and like the Conservatives certainly does not have the national interests at heart although l do like some of Labours manifesto policies l do worry about where the money will come to pay for it all this.

Thirdly lets get on to Tim Farron who's gay sex & abortion blunders’ in earlier in the election campaign have not gone down well and ever since then he has been fighting a losing battle and one cannot be surprised at that as they were significant own goals IMO.

So there you are 3 leaders all distinctly very poor but at the end of the day one has to put a cross on their ballet paper so l have chosen Labour with a heavy heart not because of their leader but because l agree with far more of their policies then the other parties at the end of the day.

OLD BOY 08-06-2017 14:14

Re: The Cable Forum 2017 Exit Poll
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Stuart (Post 35902184)
In practice, yes. In theory no.

That said, even the most diehard areas can change allegiances. My local ward has been staunch conservative since the Borough was created (around 1965). They usually give the conservative candidate a huge lead, even when Labour are polling well, and the conservatives are doing extremely badly. However, in one of the elections in the 90s, the Conservatives did so badly that it was almost a tie between the Lib Dems (who do traditionally come second) and them. So areas can change.

I have to admit, I am not sure who to vote for.

I like Labours manifesto, but I don't like the anti semitism that appears to be in the party. The sorts of things Jeremy Corbyn protested for in the past do make me uncomfortable, but I do like the fact he felt compelled to protest. This suggests to me that he entered politics because he wanted to change things, not as a career move. I like that, and I think that Theresa May is the complete opposite. She became Prime Minister because it was a promotion.

However, I don't think Jeremy is a strong leader. He has repeatedly failed to attack the government on various issues that should have made it easy for an opposition leader to get the upper hand. He said he supported the Remain campaign during the referendum, but stayed largely silent, not really campaigning for one side or the other (in fact, various members of the remain campaign tried to contact him and had trouble). I do feel he should have campaigned, even if he campaigned for the Leave campaign.

Theresa, I don't like. She switched allegiances because she saw what was popular, and seemingly got voted in as Prime minister because no one else actually wanted the job. Neither are good things in any leader. We need a leader that is going to make the right decisions for the country. These may not be popular decisions. After all, we don't always like to do what is right. e.g. Everyone agrees that it is the right decision to go to the dentist to get your teeth checked, but no one could argue that is a popular past time. I get the impression TM will go for the popular one. TM has compared herself to Margaret Thatcher. Apart from the fact they are both arguably strong women, and their initials are the same but reversed, I don't see any major similarities. There is one major difference though. Mrs T always did what she believed was right, even if it was unpopular. She was also a good negotiator and got the rebate from the EU that almost halved our contribution to the EU and the Leave campaign continually neglected to mention. Also there may be a reason she didn't actually get the job on Merit.

I can't comment one way or the other on Tim Farron. As a Lib Dem supporter, I'd like him to do well, but I don't actually know enough about him or his policies to comment on him one way or the other.

So, my choice is vote Labour, knowing that they have a weak leader, and a problem with anti-Semitism. Vote Tory, even though I disagree with their policies, and have major concerns that TM will just go for what she believes is popular, or Vote Lib Dem (or any one of the other parties) knowing they are unlikely to get anywhere. If I decide to vote tactically, my best option in my area is actually Labour, assuming I want the Tories out.

The one choice I don't believe I have is to not vote.

Labour have populist policies that cannot be funded and a Leader whom MI5 think is a security risk. Unless you want a deteriorating economy and a deteriorating security situation with a Leader who wants to cosy up to losers such as leaders of terrorist organisations and of failing economies, you should not go there.

The Conservatives have an unfortunate reputation, which disguises the real benefits they can bring to Britain with the strong leadership TM should be able to command with a resounding majority.

The Lib Dems' Tim Farron is all mouth and no trousers and his extra 1p on income tax will hurt the 'just about managing' without actually resolving the problems with social care.

The rest (apart from the SNP in Scotland) would be a wasted vote.

---------- Post added at 14:14 ---------- Previous post was at 14:06 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by denphone (Post 35902209)
Not exactly a great choice put in front of the electorate suffice to say but its important that one votes IMO as there are no excuses for those who do not vote as they cannot moan and groan afterwards about things if they did not take any part on democracy in the first place.

A poor choice and quite a difficult choice as firstly lets start with the Conservatives who give us the message of a strong and stable leadership in the national interest which of course is utter bollocks as apart from the great Sir Winston Churchill since then their strongest leader was Margaret Thatcher who was certainly was strong and not for U-turning unlike the current incumbent of 10 Downing Street who has made U-turns that you get in a boxed set of Top Gear DVDS

Although she will get in with a considerable majority come early tomorrow morning their manifesto was a utter disaster with ill thought out policies which quite obviously did not go down well even with her own natural supporters and that will not be forgotten about lightly one suspects in the coming years as l think it has damaged her and her party considerably in the longer term as people have long memorys.

We all know Brexit is happening but l have little faith in the likely outcome and l certainly don't expect one of the key planks of Brexit in lower immigration to be met at all and l think many are going to be very disappointed at the outcome several years down the road as its not going to be the bed of roses that some imagined and hoped for.

Well lets get on to Jeremy Corbyn who l to don't have much faith in either as he is very much too leftist for my liking and like the Conservatives certainly does not have the national interests at heart although l do like some of Labours manifesto policies l do worry about where the money will come to pay for it all this.

Thirdly lets get on to Tim Farron who's gay sex & abortion blunders’ in earlier in the election campaign have not gone down well and ever since then he has been fighting a losing battle and one cannot be surprised at that as they were significant own goals IMO.

So there you are 3 leaders all distinctly very poor but at the end of the day one has to put a cross on their ballet paper so l have chosen Labour with a heavy heart not because of their leader but because l agree with far more of their policies then the other parties at the end of the day.

I'm sorry to hear that, Den. A wrong decision in my view, but we are all entitled to our own opinions and to cast our votes as we think.

I don't think that the Conservative manifesto was a disaster at all, but I must say that the controversy over that social care issue was not well handled.

The policy remains the same as it appears in the manifesto, but what has been clarified is that there will also be a limit on how much anyone has to pay. Disaster? A grand misuse of that word, I think. It was a hidden benefit to people, not a hidden cost

passingbat 08-06-2017 14:35

Re: The Cable Forum 2017 Exit Poll
 
For Brexiteers, who want a proper Brexit, there is only one choice and that is the Conservatives. May has got best plan for Brexit. Labour will compromise so much that it will be worthless; Corbyn doesn't want immigration reduced, and we'd end up staying in the Single Market, and because of that, the ECJ.


I'm wary of Conservative governments, but for me, at this election, Brexit overrides those concerns. It helps that Labour, under Corbyn, (and his buddies) have lost all sense of what we can afford, and with Corbyn, would give the country a terrorist supporting leader.


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 20:33.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.