Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Perhaps so, but that doesn't mean that contracts can't reflect what the BBC wants to do in terms of showing these programmes.

A few years ago, there were restrictions on which programmes could be made available on demand and through catch-up. Now, that requirement is built into the carriage agreements and pricing structure.

---------- Post added at 18:24 ---------- Previous post was at 18:23 ----------

Because this is the now, not the future. :rolleyes:

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

In reality, your prophecy can never be proven to be wrong unless you give a time limit.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

If you go back to all my posts on this, you will see that I have been looking towards 2035 (originally 20 years ahead but less now)!

It will be a gradual process at first, but that will speed up as fast broadband speeds become available throughout the country and more people become used to on demand viewing. The reduction in audience levels for the conventional TV channels will lead to reduced advertising revenues and ultimately, these channels will start closing down.

Some have said that the BBC won't be affected as they don't carry commercials, but even they are working on the basis that in 15 years' time' streaming and on demand viewing will be the focus.

Others have said that we will always see conventional channels for showing sport, but we can all see the trend towards streaming of live sport - the new Eleven Sports streaming service being the latest example.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Still singing from that same old unsubstantiated hymn sheet l see OB.:banghead::banghead:

---------- Post added at 09:05 ---------- Previous post was at 09:01 ----------

Only in your mind as there is no trend at all unless you think a few cheap tat bargains!!! in the bargain basement are the latest example of that..

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

So why did you say "BT Sport UHD is the first of our new UHD channels, and remarkably, it is a conventional rather than a streamed channel, which is very interesting"?

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I have provided links to substantiate what I have posted on here over a long period, and I would remind you that the BBC recently stated that they were looking to transitioning to on demand after the next licence review. You may not believe it, which is fine, Den, but it is not 'unsubstantiated', which is what your view of the position is.

Of course there is a growing trend towards the streaming of live sports programmes! What are you on about?

---------- Post added at 10:26 ---------- Previous post was at 10:09 ----------

The only reason being that it seemed sensible to make UHD viewing available via streaming and on demand. UHD takes up considerable bandwidth and so I would guess that there would be a limit to the number of UHD conventional broadcast channels that could be made available. Additionally, concern has been expressed about how much UHD you can record given the upper capacity on a V6 box is 1TB - although you did reassure me on that point a few weeks ago.

I guess that technology advances are overcoming problems faster than we imagine sometimes!

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Live Sports have been streamed for a long while you talk about it like it's something new , it still doesn't mean Sport on linear channels delivered by DTT , Satellite , Cable etc is going anywhere anytime soon.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

What with small bargain packages which are the cheap tat packages and are of little relevance to the main big sports rights packages which are all on leading TV channels now and in the future which you find very hard to take in...

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

All the more reason to broadcast it.

Think about this. Let's say BT Sport UHD is 20Mbps, and a million people want to watch it simultaneously.
1) If it's streamed, how much bandwidth does it need?
2) If it's broadcast, how much bandwidth does it need?

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I believe currently BT Sport UHD and Sky Sports UHD is around 30Mbps.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Your future goes about two weeks ahead, Den!

So the BBC i-Player and Eurosport Player offer 'cheap tat'?

---------- Post added at 11:57 ---------- Previous post was at 11:55 ----------

I didn't say 'soon', but in a decade the trend will be undeniable. Most TV industry experts support this view.

---------- Post added at 12:00 ---------- Previous post was at 11:57 ----------

Ok, you've convinced me!

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Is VM not using switched video yet?

If there are bandwidth limitations, it doesn't make any sense to broadcast all tv channels to each customers home when only the requested channels could be sent over IP?

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Here we have the reason why there are not more high profile sports being streamed currently. However, they are working on it!

https://www.rapidtvnews.com/20180715...#axzz5LLzJ7nYm

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Yes, in apps such as WorldBox.

IP delivery only makes sense for channels with a very small number of viewers.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

But how does that scale?


Virgin has demonstrated that it has the capacity for at least 2 broadcast UHD channels. What if demand increases and there are 10, 20 or even more UHD channels? Does Virgin have enough capacity to broadcast that many?

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

When Sky Sports HD first came out it used at least 20Mbps - then codecs changed compressing HD somewhat along with a reduction in quality.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

The reality is in the actualities. Looknwhat this American research has shown.

https://www.rapidtvnews.com/20180716...#axzz5LQtkePGS

In what may be an inflexion point for the broadcast industry, a study from Hub Entertainment Research has found that as consumers adopt more platforms, even older viewers are abandoning live TV as their home base.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

There are always ways of adding more capacity if necessary.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

That is very reassuring and not what many people believed was the case!

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Just to repeat what I said in other threads, but this is the correct place for it.. :)

With Disney now winning the battle for Fox and Comcast looks like it has won the battle for Sky, the battle doesn't end there. It may just be beginning.

City analysts are saying that Disney wants the European pay tv rights for Disney/Fox to be taken away from Sky, so that Disney can exclusively use their own content on their own services.

Some on here have been glib about the demise of linear tv and although I think some linear channels will be around for a long time to come, especially the main broadcast channels, I do think the vast bulk of the pay tv channels market will collapse.

On another thread, Old Boy reckons that within 10 years, some of these pay tv channels may collapse, but I reckon that may happen a LOT sooner in some cases for this reason:

How can Sky run several film channels, if half of its content (Disney and Fox films) are no longer available to Sky? What if, as is the case, the likes of Amazon and Facebook win premium sports rights? Where does that leave Sky?

People can only watch so much tv. Something has to give. You cannot have 300+ channels which are financially viable alongside several major streaming services. It's too much.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

To be fair of late Sky has struggled to give away the movie channels just look at the discounts they are offering.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

The inflection point is Rupert Murdoch selling most of his business empire which he has spent a lifetime building, because he cannot compete with the like of Netflix, Amazon and the others.

He cannot just throw a few billion dollars to make new content, they can. It's numbers. They can simply outspend him into oblivion, which is why he is selling why he can.

What clearer signal can there be, that linear tv as we know it, is going to fade away?

---------- Post added at 17:16 ---------- Previous post was at 17:16 ----------

Some great offers can be had with Now tv too.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I'm struggling to understand your comments about content both Disney/Fox and Comcast have far more content than Netflix and Amazon have.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Fully agree MM. But that is old stuff. You look at the numbers for the amount of new tv shows/episodes being produced, Netflix is making far more than Disney and Fox combined. Amazon, though, are still way, way behind for now.

---------- Post added at 17:42 ---------- Previous post was at 17:27 ----------

RC, I've copied your post into this thread as its more relevant here.

This is all related to the media mergers in defence against the streaming companies.

The BBC, ITV and Ch4 want to create a combined streaming service to compete against Netflix. They currently have a service in America called Britbox. They want to launch that service, or something similar here.

They also want to distinguish their services from Sky and Vm's paytv services and essentially make Freeview and their streaming service as the place to go for TV, with obviously the three of them in overall control.

As I said in my above post, I think the broadcast channels will survive for a long time to come and clearly so do the paytv companies as they have moved some of their services or rebranded services onto Freeview. But where does that leave pay tv? My reply to that is, it doesn't. Something has to give.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Had it free for a year - watched 3 films in that time.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Totally agree we now just use PPV and watch the odd film we want to its far more cost effective for us. There's a lot of rubbish comes out of Hollywood these days.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

If I never see a superhero film again, that will be fine with me. :)

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I'm with you on that one, utter rubbish...…...:D

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Said it before, most films these days are utter tosh.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

All in the eye of the beholder l say..

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Agree. Talking Pictures will show you some decent stuff !

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Especially for us oldies..;)

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Sorry Den, you're wrong. I'm fed up with superhero movies and shows being catagorised as SciFi, they are not! They are SciFan!

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

l am certainly not going to argue with you pip..:)

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

The forthcoming launch of the BBC/ITV/CH4 streaming service is another clear indication that linear tv, or at least linear pay tv is "evolving".

There are now clear signs that linear tv, or at least linear pay tv channels may bite the dust and it may happen sooner than we all think.

What would happen if the main terrestrial broadcasters removed all their offshoot channels from Sky and VM? I think it would kill the pay tv services off.

If Disney do as they suggested last week and remove all their content from Sky, I don't see how the traditional pay tv companies can continue in their present form.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Project Kangaroo was certainly a great hit was it not?

---------- Post added at 11:30 ---------- Previous post was at 11:30 ----------

l somehow doubt it Horizon.

---------- Post added at 11:31 ---------- Previous post was at 11:30 ----------

Not a chance in a month of Sundays IMO.

---------- Post added at 11:32 ---------- Previous post was at 11:31 ----------

Any proof of that? as again l would say that is pie in the Sky to pardon a pun.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I'm not sure where this obsesession with Sky and Disney comes from , Disney sells it's content to Sky , BT , Virgin and others.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Project Kangaroo was killed off in an error of judgement by Ofcom. This has put the main terrestrials back by a few years, bit it's nice to see now that Ofcom have changed their position.

The new streaming service planned along the lines of Britbox is the way to go, and will ultimately replace the conventional broadcast channels. It's no lnger a case of if, but when.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

You can believe that if you want to but many won't.

The trouble with your hymn book OB its always missing quite a few of the pages.;)

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

The pages of the future have yet to be written...:o:

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Not sure why these new linear channels have come or are coming soon when they should be streaming:)

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Kangaroo never got off the drawing board, because for some inexplicable reason Ofcom refused regulatory permission for the BBC to be involved.

Had it gone ahead we might by now have had a standardised, high-quality iPlayer offering full on-demand functionality for all the UK’s public service broadcasters, plus a viable home-grown platform to compete with the extremely well-funded American operations like Netflix and Amazon Prime.

As it did not, we have hardware being sold with a random assortment of on-demand services built in and the ability of end users to add or remove them from those devices varies enormously (Channel 4, for example, is still withholding All4 from Freesat devices due to an ongoing dispute over carriage fees - the service was automatically removed from boxes about 2 months ago. This behaviour, arguably, should be forbidden as part of C4’s public service obligations but that’s another discussion entirely).

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I think for the coming three to five years, conventional type channels will be launched with streaming/on demand alternatives available (unless the company providing the content is stuck in the last century, like UKTV!).

At some point after that these channels will be in decline and new carriage deals will be concentrating on the on demand and streaming content.

---------- Post added at 16:02 ---------- Previous post was at 15:57 ----------

I agree with most of that, but the ability to withhold channels or on demand content where the platform operator won't agree to pay the price is important. If this was forbidden as you suggest, it would mean that platform operators could simply not pay, or pay a reduced price, and the supplier would have to provide the content regardless.

Maybe that's not the arrangement you had in mind, but I cannot think of an alternative.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

As per the thread title.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

That's right, heero_guy. I think most have now conceded that streaming services will become the most popular means of accessing TV content, but there are still those who cannot bring themselves to believe that ultimately, the existing broadcast channels will wither on the vine as it will no longer make financial sense to provide them.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Whilst this may be the case for most of the dross on TV, sport will remain the Jewell in the crown of standard tv channels as viewers will not stand for the continuous buffering problems streaming has at present.

Of course when the majority of people have broadband speeds in excess of those currently available streaming UHD sport should not be a problem - until then
Streaming of sport will not take off in any large numbers and sky/BT will continue to harvest the majority of important sports rights.

Eleven Sports are streaming the 1st 2 rounds of the USPGA tournament free - but if you want to watch the important weekend rounds then you have to subscribe - to a fledgling service with mainly foreign to rights.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Yes the inconvenient truth is often painful for those in never-ending denial..

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

That is the bottom line and for the majority FTTP is not that many years away. Once it comes the likes of Sky & BT will be the ones to be able to supply them via streaming, VM once DOCSIS 3 is finally rolled out. Where is that going to leave linear channels?

Linear broadcast income will decrease resulting in a lack of finance. Hardly rocket science.

http://news.openreach.co.uk/pressrel...gramme-2576879

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I am afraid to say, Den, that you are the one in denial here.

Yes, we currently have some buffering problems with live streaming, but this is early days. It will not be long before such problems will be a thing of the past.

It's a problem for today, not tomorrow.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I agree, also this debate about linear TV was never all about sport being streamed, it was about linear TV in general being overtaken by people streaming other content, such as dramas etc, when it suited them to watch those programmes.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

But Sky's business model (and to a lesser extent BT's) is built on sport not movies and the dross that fill the other hundreds of channels.

So replacing linear tv is all about being able to stream sport reliably - unfortunately for the majority we are light years away from being able to do that.

Additionally, if streaming of sport is so imminent why are Eleven Sports looking to do a deal with Sky and others to carry their sports rights via a linear channel?

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

It wasn't just about Sky and BT, it was about any scheduled programme that people would to have to watch at the stated broadcast time, could have been something like Coronation Street or East Enders for example, but obviously you don't have to do that nowadays with On Demand etc.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Live tv is linear in nature regardless of how it’s delivered - even when it’s carried on a stream over the internet. If and when the U.K. has sufficient infrastructure to deliver HD streams to every household simultaneously (we are many years away from having either the network or the power generation capability to do it), the need for certain events to be shown as they happen will ensure linear TV never really goes away.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Linear TV in its technical meaning will certainly never go away because that is live TV. However, most people when they refer to linear tv are talking about our conventionally broadcast channels, and they now have a limited lifespan..

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Correct, and that was my point in an earlier post.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Except that a decade is not 'light years' away.

Well before 2030, the whole country should be able to receive fast broadband speeds because at long last the Government is getting its act together on this. Once we have that, and with advances in streaming technology, streaming for us all will be as good as live tv on our existing channels is.

Incidentally, whenever I watch the live broadcasts on the i-Player, the streaming is faultless. So it can be done.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

If you believe all of the country will have 300+ Mbps in 10 years time you are delusional. There are vast swathes of the country that only have 2mbps at present.

Politicians tell you what you want to hear then conveniently develop amnesia.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Well, the work is already being carried out, and 300 mbps is not necessary! I have 200 and it is more than ample for streaming and all the gadgets we have going here.

Do you really think the country is going to stand still forever? Some on here do seem to live in that dreamy cocoon!

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

The difference between 200 and 300mbps has more to do with network capacity than the last mile of cable to your house. For most people their choice isn’t between 200 or 300mbps, it’s a range of options below 100mbps, and for a depressingly large number of people it’s still below 10mpbs. That’s down to the “last mile” local loop connecting individual homes to the network, which even in ‘superfast’ areas is still relying on a twisted copper pair to deliver services to each customer.

The issue isn’t that some people think the country is standing still, the issue is that you have little concept of other people’s experiences being different than yours (hence your incredulity that anyone is bothered about Virgin getting Dave back, purely because you personally don’t rate it).

Delivering HD content to a PVR by satellite or terrestrial broadcast is relatively inexpensive, using established technology that has years of life left in it. There is no commercial imperative to abandon it in favour of a wholly IP based system. The universal delivery of a high speed IP network connection to every British home ultimately depends on the government wanting to save money by delivering its services online. That’s why it will be many years before it’s even possible to deliver a universal TV service that way.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I think you're pretty much right Old Boy. Within 20 to 30 years I think television will mainly be streaming. I'm in my 30's currently (spoilers) and I was about 12 then the internet became "big" so i think probably my generation were the first generation to grow up with the internet so to speak. Within 20 or 30 years you've got about 6 generations of people internet savvy so the need for linear channels will have decreased by then.

I think it will take that long though. My mum is in her 60's and is becoming quite adapt at streaming on demand products on her ipad but I don't think many people in her age bracket are confident enough so as a result tv channels will remain for the foreseeable future

My only quip would be your confidence in the government investing in super fast broadband speeds.....if there is no money to be made for the tories in it then it won't happen. With the debacles occurring at the moment in the UK i don't envision super fast broadband being a top priority for a considerable amount of time

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I think it will be a lot less than 30 years - by 20, it will have happened. We can see the signs already. ITV's heavy dependence on revenues from its commercial channels is already causing alarm, with reduced income forecast for next year. At some point, these channels will become completely unsustainable. This is why ITV is now prioritising its online presence.

https://www.digitaltveurope.com/2018...itv-prospects/

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

As more and more streaming services commission and acquire new content, this will surely leave our traditional broadcasters with little new drama other than what they come up with themselves. Although the Beeb, ITV, Channel 4 and Sky already do this quite successfully, as US content dries up, this is going to leave large gaps in the schedules.

I have noticed that there is less new stuff that I want to see these days on the Sky channels particularly on Atlantic, which has shown some pretty good stuff in the past.

This can only hasten the move from conventional TV to SVOD.

https://advanced-television.com/2018...l-commissions/

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I'm not fussed how the content is delivered as long as I can continue to watch the type of content I enjoy. My concern is that before we know it you'll need multiple subscriptions to multiple services just to keep the status quo. For a nonlinear future to be a success all services need to be available on all platforms, simple to use and available under one monthly payment. There also needs to be a free alternative. We have nearly 13 million freeview / freesat "customers" in the UK who are resistant to move to any form of paid content. I'm sure I read a recent report that showed the majority of households in the UK with Netflix or Amazon Prime also have a pay TV subscription.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Yes, I am wondering about what will happen with subscriptions for streaming services. Almost certainly, there will be multiple choices in the future, but remember, they are all very cheap when you compare them with satellite and cable channels. You can pay £60 per month for a huge number of channels but you end up with nothing to watch. And yet for less than a tenner you can get a huge choice of programmes on just one service - so huge, in fact, that it is difficult to know where to start.

This is why I think what Virgin, Sky and BT have started to do by incorporating streaming services into their packages is the right way for them to go. Once we have a decent choice of these services, I can see subscribers being offered packages of streaming services, either as well as or in place of pay tv channels. I don't think many would be able to afford both.

Think of how much choice you will be able to get once all these global companies start offering their global wares. We would have the choice of Netflix, Prime, Discovery, Disney, Now TV, Hayu, HBO, the new BBC/ITV/Channel 4 venture, and others we don't even know about yet, all for £60 or less if we took them all, I would imagine. On top of that, for viewers who prefer to dip in and out of a particular kind of TV programme on a more occasional basis, there will be a whole range of pay per view stuff available, including Google Play and Startzplay.

Of course, sports programming would be on top of all this price-wise, as it is now, and we have yet to see whether the new streaming services would be able to offer that at less cost than Sky can, given the prices they would have to pay for rights. The complaints about the quality of streamed sport should be addressed over the next few years and the BBC have been trying to get on top of the latency issues, claiming that they have now found a solution.

These are exciting times, and although many will not care about how their TV is delivered, it will become apparent just how easy it is to watch programmes at your own convenience without commercials. Having done that over a period of time, most would not want to go back to scheduled linear channels.

I believe that pay tv channels will be replaced by streaming services first and Freeview channels will be the last to go. It will be fascinating to see how this plays out.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Remember, even if you only subscribed to streamed services like Netflix, you would also have to pay for decent broadband.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Yes, but you could do away with the cable tv channels, thus saving money.

If Sky, BT and Virgin Media only allowed you to subscribe to the streaming services if you also took the pay tv channels (as they do now), the answer would be to buy an appropriate streaming stick or box that provided the services you wanted, such as Amazon Fire or Roku.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

But you will still need to pay for good stand alone broadband without which the streaming services of any kind won't work. This cost must be factored in.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

That's true, but most of us are paying out for that anyway, so it's cost neutral.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I thought most people got a discounted broadband because of the package they were on?

Certainly I do

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Yes, I believe that is correct. However, the cheaper streaming services should still allow you to keep within what you already pay.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Possibly, but would I get the content I desire - I seriously doubt it

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

It depends what you desire, I suppose. Now TV, Netflix and Freeview alone will give you a pretty good choice. Add Prime and what would you be missing that you currently really want to watch?

This excludes Sport, obviously, as this is monopolised by Sky and BT at present, although the sports pack on Now TV covers all the Sky stuff.

The only thing that stands out in my mind is some nature and factual programming, but I dare say there will be a Discovery app soon to cover that.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

There is an interesting assessment of the cordcutting phenomenon set out in this article. It is most pronounced in the US, where it looks as though the days of pay tv are numbered in the medium term. The UK seems to be going the same way, although we are currently behind the US in terms of their direction of travel.

http://www.csimagazine.com/csi/Is-co...-in-Europe.php

EXTRACT

...At the opposite end of the spectrum to Ukraine is the UK, a market that looks the most like the US in that payTV ARPU is the highest at EUR35.5 and there is a high appetite for US content. “For these reasons the UK is one of the few countries where cord cutting could be happening,” Ourliac said.

Ourliac pointed out that OTT services registered more subscribers in 2018 than payTV (close to 18m versus just under 16m for the latter), although this is only the case when incumbent skinny bundles, namely Sky’s Now TV, are included in the calculation. “So the cord cutting has to be balanced in the UK as well,” she added.

According to Ourliac, the case of Sky implies that should cord cutting happen in Europe it will concern satellite first, although it doesn’t mean DTH operators will lose their customers if they successfully manage to attract them onto their own skinny bundles...

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I’ll just leave this here.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-45798523

:D

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Leave it where you want,I don't watch terrestial TV. I prefer to watch what I want when I want.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

It may be technically more efficient, but it's not what people want. Scheduled TV has virtually had its day.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

In your opinion but then you are not the majority as the majority have a different view to yours..

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

You only have to look at the facts, Den, there are enough articles on it. OTT viewing is increasing all the time and a pivotal moment will come.

The BBC are planning for it in 10 to 15 years, so I don't know why you are so dismissive.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Lol, so everyone will have to dump all their tech devices and go back to watching black and white terrestrial TV, yeah right, dream on......:D

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I can only relate my own experience but these days I only watch stuff like news or some sports (if they are on Freeview) 'live'.

If I'm getting it off broadcast TV (Freeview in my case), I'll usually record the show and the rest of my watching is off of streaming services or shows I download.

I just didn't use my V+ box for about 8 months so I just ditched my TV service ... won't miss it, utterly pointless and I personally don't see how offering a static pack of channels is going to appeal to a mass audience as people get more and more used to streaming and on demand programming.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

By your own admission a couple of posts later you are talking in terms of around 15 years.

This is actually a long time in relation to the life of tv!

Hardly 'virtually had its day'

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

15 years is not actually a long time, and what you fail to appreciate is that in the medium term, linear channels will start closing down.

Watch this space if you are skeptical.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

CCS Insights are predicting that Amazon will have its own sports bundle by 2022. If this turns out to be true, it is only a matter of time before it puts in a serious bid for the Premier League, and another barrier will have been broken in the move towards linear streaming.

https://www.fiercevideo.com/video/de...bundle-by-2022

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I read an article, in the national press, within the last week - one of the streamers was quoted as saying they were not currently interested in premier league rights as the cost is way too high - to win the rights they would have to charge astronomical monthly fees to recoup their investment.

As you say it is only a matter of time before they bid for the rights (probably when sky/BT go broke) - could be 10, 20 or even 30 years time

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I think BT will have to re-consider its commitments to the Premier League before much longer.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

l have been watching that space for many a year and apart from a receding of the hair and a receding of the brain not a lot of really changed and nor will it long into the future in regard to Linear TV.

---------- Post added at 20:27 ---------- Previous post was at 20:26 ----------

Is that not what you said once or twice before.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Yes, I read that, too. The figures don't add up at the moment owing to the state of the high speed broadband rollout. Amazon and others could only make this work once everyone has access to this, unless it decides also to create its own conventional broadcast channels as well.

---------- Post added at 07:53 ---------- Previous post was at 07:48 ----------

The past is not the future, Den. You know the timescales, I've repeated this often enough.

---------- Post added at 07:58 ---------- Previous post was at 07:53 ----------

You'd soon point it out if I wasn't consistent.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

This report suggests that linear TV will only save itself if it comes up with something innovative to make such viewing an attractive option, which is what I've been saying for the last three or four years.

Sadly, I cannot think what that could be, can you?

https://www.broadbandtvnews.com/2018...signs-of-life/

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I didn't take that from the article at all. Maybe it's been edited since you posted the link.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Nope.

It's the same as high street shops.

It used to be exciting going into department stores and browsing all their multiple selections and walking along the high street browsing the multiple different shops. But the shops never changed. They replicated themselves so that every high street looked identical to each other with the same chain shops and people got bored with them, then Amazon and other online players came along...

Why would future generations (assuming they can afford to pay for the streamers), choose tv channels, most with adverts, over instantly available shows ad free?

As I keep saying in others threads, the biggest piece of evidence I can put forward as to why we're into a whole different world with tv now and why linear will decline somewhat is simply to look at what Rupert Murdoch did.

He built up a company over decades, only for Netflix to come along and destroy the business model he knows.

The days of television being dominated by a few broadcast channels ended when Rupert Murdoch launched Sky. He was the disrupter, the new kid on the block then.

The days of linear tv dominating ended when Reed Hastings decided sending DVDs out to people was a pain in the arse and it was much better to stream all the stuff over the internet. Things move on. Simple as that.

(Having stuff like Jeremy Kyle and Come Dine with Me, just hastens the inevitable decline of most linear tv.)

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Yes, something has changed. Here is a different link on this story.

https://advanced-television.com/2018...inues-decline/



Globally in 2018, linear TV has shown no new signs of life; ratings continue to fall, even with mainstays like the NFL. Despite this, linear TV has sustained advertiser demand, implying the perception that linear TV is as effective and essential as ever, but for how long and in what balance relative to alternatives?



---------- Post added at 16:42 ---------- Previous post was at 16:39 ----------

I agree 100% with your assessment, Horizon.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

:)

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Spot on, but, there are others on here, who have their heads firmly up their arse, and will deny what is so obvious.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

It is not obvious what will happen in the future, but the evidence for what is happening now is obvious and very clear:

1. Murdoch sold most of his business' because he couldn't compete with trillion dollar tech companies and Netflix.

2. Cord cutting in America shows no sign of abating with people cancelling their traditional pay tv subs eroding the viewing figures for many channels.

3. Netflix's and Amazon's rise shows no sign of abating. Netflix now has 130m subscribers and Amazon has 100m. No traditional pay tv network can compete against that.

I said somewhere at the beginning of this thread or another ages ago, that I do think a core group of channels will survive. But to use the high street analogy again, these channels will ultimately be no more than shop windows into their respective company's streaming services.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

I'm not sure how you work out no one can compete with the subscriber numbers , I remember reading recently Discovery discussing it's global reach through it's many deals it has with pay TV platforms and it way exceeded the number of subscribers you quote for Netflix.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

That's the point muppetman, it's those other platforms that have the subscribers, not Discovery directly, unlike Netflix.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

It's totally irrelevant how many subscribers a streaming company has around the world, it is how manly they have in this country that counts as PL rights are sold on a geographical basis.

I assume no streaming company would be allowed to obtain worldwide rights for PL as any broadcaster isn't even in this country.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
 

Geographical basis for now... do you really think it will remain like that with global steamers which have audiences/subscribers of hundreds of millions?

I don't assume it will remain as it is now, in fact I assume it won't.

Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future