Re: The state benefits system mega-thread. Many merged.
 

Not sure what you're saying but a natural progression of the benefits bill is whether it can be afforded and ways to cut it. Ways of getting more in to the treasury is a fair topic.

Re: The state benefits system mega-thread. Many merged.
 

Why don't you ask that to hmrc, successful in 80% of aggressive tax avoidance cases they bring to court, if they don't know the difference between someone using allowances fairly and correctly to reduce their tax liability and some shyster taking the pish we really are in trouble.

Re: The state benefits system mega-thread. Many merged.
 

sorted so I can bring up cutting the state pension again seeing as nearly half of the welfare bill goes on it. I serious think it needs means testing I know a lot do not like it but its the biggest bill the tax payer pays into the population.


ESA and JSA makes up just a fraction of the costs the state pension does

Re: The state benefits system mega-thread. Many merged.
 

Funnily enough I did exactly that about 15 years ago as part of a work project I was doing. But as you seem to think neither are lawful I'm curious to know what you think the differences are (if at all).

Re: The state benefits system mega-thread. Many merged.
 

Aggressive tax avoidance schemes aren't legal in 80% of cases, it's proven. Not really sure why you or anyone else would want to stick up for then.

Re: The state benefits system mega-thread. Many merged.
 

I'm not sticking up for anything, I'm just trying to understand your logic.

So are tax evasion schemes legal in more or less percentage of cases?

Re: The state benefits system mega-thread. Many merged.
 

Doesn't it say something though when a court case costing god knows what is needed to decide if tax is payable .

Re: The state benefits system mega-thread. Many merged.
 

I'm not here to play games Russ if there's a point to this inane questioning just spit it out or I'll stick to my original assumption about your participation in this, oh and I really hope it's not over something really stupid and puerile like I've missed a word of a sentence somewhere.

---------- Post added at 17:21 ---------- Previous post was at 17:19 ----------

I said way back we should make them prove in court that such schemes are legal before their allowed to use them rather than the other way round.

Re: The state benefits system mega-thread. Many merged.
 

Petulance will get you nowhere.

Tax avoidance is not illegal. The fact 20% have been found to be doing so legally should make this obvious to you.

Tax avoidance can be used illegally - but within itself is within the law.

Tax evasion, by the way is totally illegal.

Re: The state benefits system mega-thread. Many merged.
 

What have the other 80% been found to be doing, you know the vast, vast majority using the aggressive schemes.

Re: The state benefits system mega-thread. Many merged.
 

The 80% have been using tax avoidance scheme illegally. It really shouldn't be this difficult to explain.

Re: The state benefits system mega-thread. Many merged.
 

And that's what I've been saying all along, that in a vast, vast number of cases it's proven that their acting illegally so the onus should now be on them to prove their acting legally before these schemes are used and it's their own fault, no where else in society would we put up with such an abused system, look at the vilification benefits claimants are getting from all quarters over a tiny percentage of illegality.

Re: The state benefits system mega-thread. Many merged.
 

That's a bit of a sweeping statement Russ ,they are only illegal because a court says they are ,it could just as easily be the other way round .What should happen is that before a tax scheme is used maybe it should be assumed to be illegal until HMRC have approved it for use

Re: The state benefits system mega-thread. Many merged.
 

This gives a reasonable explanation.

http://www.stanbridgeaccountants.co....99s-difference

Re: The state benefits system mega-thread. Many merged.
 

This debate highlights exactly why our tax system is both a mess and a joke and it is long past time it was soted out because surely it is possible to do it if the government of whatever colour of the day could be bothered. Seems to me if you at the lower end pulling a scam you get the book thrown at you but if your at the higher end more often then not the book gets rewritten.