Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Perhaps the answer to refuelling problem relating to electric cars is to change the battery that's running out for a charged one at the garage.

The garage would then re-charge the depleted battery and then it's ready for the next customer.

I can't see how else it is practical to manage the situation if you drive 60 odd miles a day as I used to do in my last job.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

a battery for a tesla weighs in at 648 lbs and i think their built into the floor that's about the weight of a chevy v8 engine

Battery Specs
Type Laminated lithium-ion battery
Voltage 403.2V [1]
Nominal voltage 360V [2]
Total capacity 24 kWh [2] (16 kWh available, 67% DoD [3], 21 kWh declared [4])
Power output Over 90 kW
Energy density 140 Wh/kg [5]
Power density 2.5 kW/kg [5]
Dimensions 61.8 x 46.8 x 10.4 in. (1570.5 x 1188 x 264.9 mm) [1]
Weight 648 lbs [6]
Number of modules 48, each with four cells (total 192 cells) [7][2]
Battery pack contents:
Positive electrodes: lithium manganate
Negative electrodes: carbon
Cells
Modules
Assembly parts
Charging times:
Quick charger DC50kW (0 to 80%): approx. 30 min (Level 3 charging)
Home-use AC240V charging dock (0-100%): 8 hrs (Level 2 charging) [8]
Regular 110/120V 15-amp outlet: 22 hours (Level 1 charging) [9]
Battery layout Under seat & floor

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

I am sure that battery sizes can be reduced by 2040, and if they are still too heavy, someone would have to invent a contraption for garages to use when replacing batteries.

If there are no straight forward ways to replace batteries, someone is going to have to come up with an alternative solution that is practical. The only one I have at the moment is hydrogen fuelled cars. Although expensive at present, the price will come down with mass production and competition.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

A huge percentage will be topping up their fuel at home (which they can't do at the moment); or perhaps at a hotel or whatever. There's a pretty horrific environmental cost to extracting oil, refining, transporting and, of course, using.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

a fork lift truck ? battery powered of course ;)

---------- Post added at 17:58 ---------- Previous post was at 17:57 ----------

jerry can :rolleyes:

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

The challenges aren't insurmountable and we'll be there long before 2040 imo. Another plus again imo is to tell those rather unpleasant sand dwelling types with a penchant for decapitation and suppressing women to shove it

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

There's a pretty horrific environmental cost to extracting lithium , refining, transporting and, of course, using.

Elemental lithium is flammable and very reactive. In nature, lithium occurs in compounded forms such as lithium carbonate requiring chemical processing to be made usable.
Lithium is typically found in salt flats in areas where water is scarce. The mining process of lithium uses large amounts of water. Therefore, on top of water contamination as a result of its use, depletion or transportation costs are issues to be dealt with. Depletion results in less available water for local populations, flora and fauna.
Toxic chemicals are used for leaching purposes, chemicals requiring waste treatment. There are widespread concerns of improper handling and spills, like in other mining operations around the world.
The recovery rate of lithium ion batteries, even in first world countries, is in the single digit percent range. Most batteries end up in landfill.
In a 2013 report, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) points out that nickel and cobalt, both also used in the production of lithium ion batteries, represent significant additional environmental risks.

A 2012 study titled “Science for Environment Policy” published by the European Union compares lithium ion batteries to other types of batteries available (lead-acid, nickel-cadmium, nickel-metal-hydride and sodium sulphur). It concludes that lithium ion batteries have the largest impact on metal depletion, suggesting that recycling is complicated. Lithium ion batteries are also, together with nickel-metal-hydride batteries, the most energy consuming technologies using the equivalent of 1.6kg of oil per kg of battery produced. They also ranked the worst in greenhouse gas emissions with up to 12.5kg of CO2 equivalent emitted per kg of battery. The authors do point out that “…for a full understanding of life cycle impacts, further aspects of battery use need to be considered, such as length of usage, performance at different temperatures, and ability to discharge quickly.”

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Most depots I've visited dropped battery power for gas power for all their forklifts years ago.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

That certainly makes more sense to me.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

There is no way this will change in my lifetime.

If you think, my wife has a battered old Diesel car. I have a petrol car - and no we are not rich either.

My daughter has a diesel, my son has a petrol car.

If we got rid of all the cars - and Lorries due to the crazy government going over to electric vehicles.

Can you see how many people would be unemployed. Millions.

To get electric vehicles - how is the government going to get all those taxs.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

There are zero charging stations in my town, the nearest one is (15 miles) 30 minute drive away and if you park in the service station for 1 minute over 2 hours you get a £100 fine.

So much for telling drivers if your tired take a break.

Plus it can take 25 mins to get in the dam place and over 30 mins to get out.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Until there is a breakthrough in battery technology the electric car will stay a minority thing and all this "by 2040" stuff reminds me of old tech shows that were convinced we would all be flying around in our cars by the millennium. Electric is the future but not without a breakthrough in the production of it and the practical storage of it the pace will continue to be slow. Nuclear can barely cover the gap in our current energy plans let alone adding tens of millions of car user's putting their cars on charge and as overnight would be the preference you can bet the power company's will bin the traditional low tariff's during the night.

Despite being supposed first world countries we really haven't done very well adapting to advancing technology and I don't see that changing anytime soon.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

You posted without a link sadly because sadly the many years old article you cut and sadly pasted went on to say "Technology will of course improve, lithium supplies will be sufficient for the foreseeable future, and recycling rates will climb".:nono:

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

Pigs might fly springs to mind.

Re: Petrol & diesel vehicles ban.
 

but sadly they have not