View Full Version : Requesting 2 Mainstream Newsgroups to be added
why dont ntl carry alt.binaries.tv (http://www.binsearch.info/browse.php?bg=alt.binaries.tv) and alt.binaries.multimedia ? (http://www.binsearch.info/browse.php?bg=alt.binaries.multimedia)
and is there anyone i can mail to try and get them added?
why dont ntl carry alt.binaries.tv (http://www.binsearch.info/browse.php?bg=alt.binaries.tv) and alt.binaries.multimedia ? (http://www.binsearch.info/browse.php?bg=alt.binaries.multimedia)
and is there anyone i can mail to try and get them added?
Why you're at it get dvdcore and dvdr added too.
They were there not so long ago, but were removed.
grubbymitts
30-07-2006, 08:35
because they have so high a usage, NTL don't want to have to update their Usenet servers to cope with them. These two groups can have upwards of 200gb posted everyday.
You'll never see multimedia, tv or the DVD groups on NTL ever again.
tv so far today has 51gb
and drives are cheap these days,
are you saying ntl dont want to shell out £75 (200gb HD) x days of retention
tv so far today has 51gb
and drives are cheap these days,
are you saying ntl dont want to shell out £75 (200gb HD) x days of retention
If it was legal content then i'm sure they wouldn't have a problem.
tv so far today has 51gb
and drives are cheap these days,
are you saying ntl dont want to shell out £75 (200gb HD) x days of retention
:LOL:
Do you really think they use £75.00 drives from aria and then only 2 .
I have seen the servers they are a bit bigger than that.
And that 51 gig is nearly all dubious as far as copyright goes. Just looked ;)
grubbymitts
30-07-2006, 16:08
tv so far today has 51gb
and drives are cheap these days,
are you saying ntl dont want to shell out £75 (200gb HD) x days of retention
LOL. No, you're killing me. Please. Stop. :rofl:
zeus9876
30-07-2006, 16:26
you may as well get A.B.boneless added too
they want to add tv on demand why not download tv on demand ;)
unlimited: obviously the main servers drives are bigger than that
they want to add tv on demand why not download tv on demand ;)
unlimited: obviously the main servers drives are bigger than that
Then you should say that the costs are far more than what you stated.
Ntl will never again included the high traffic feeds.
1. There is cost of bandwidth used.
2. The stuff on those newsgroups are dubious as far as copyright goes "i know i subscribe to a paid news feed of which those feeds are part of the subscription and i make big use of them ;)" therefor NTL could leave themselves open in the future to possible copyright problems.
3. i am willing to bet they NEVER include them in a free service.
And finally Ntl should spend money of their email service first and try to get that usable before spending money on newsgroups. Just my :2cents:
This was not me trying to start a fight here just my outlook on the whole NTL newsgroup mess.
grubbymitts
30-07-2006, 19:04
As time goes by they will probably drop the Usenet service altogether
zing_deleted
30-07-2006, 19:07
they want to add tv on demand why not download tv on demand ;)
unlimited: obviously the main servers drives are bigger than that
Then you should say that the costs are far more than what you stated.
Ntl will never again included the high traffic feeds.
1. There is cost of bandwidth used.
2. The stuff on those newsgroups are dubious as far as copyright goes "i know i subscribe to a paid news feed of which those feeds are part of the subscription and i make big use of them ;)" therefor NTL could leave themselves open in the future to possible copyright problems.
3. i am willing to bet they NEVER include them in a free service.
And finally Ntl should spend money of their email service first and try to get that usable before spending money on newsgroups. Just my :2cents:
This was not me trying to start a fight here just my outlook on the whole NTL newsgroup mess.
I personally do not believe bandwidth costs anything but I do understand contention.If it did talk talk sky and now ntl wouldnt be able to offer high speed internet at low cost.
they want to add tv on demand why not download tv on demand ;)
unlimited: obviously the main servers drives are bigger than that
Then you should say that the costs are far more than what you stated.
Ntl will never again included the high traffic feeds.
1. There is cost of bandwidth used.
2. The stuff on those newsgroups are dubious as far as copyright goes "i know i subscribe to a paid news feed of which those feeds are part of the subscription and i make big use of them ;)" therefor NTL could leave themselves open in the future to possible copyright problems.
3. i am willing to bet they NEVER include them in a free service.
And finally Ntl should spend money of their email service first and try to get that usable before spending money on newsgroups. Just my :2cents:
This was not me trying to start a fight here just my outlook on the whole NTL newsgroup mess.
I personally do not believe bandwidth costs anything but I do understand contention.If it did talk talk sky and now ntl wouldnt be able to offer high speed internet at low cost.
Bandwidth does cost when you look at the amount of Newsgroup and p2p traffic that crosses the Atlantic each day. Someone has to pay for that. Ntl do not as far as i know own any transatlantic routes therefor they have to pay someone for that usage.
If you think about it. The figures must be massive what with HD movies and the like becoming the norm. I downloaded a NASA HD video in .ts format and it was 18 gig :Yikes:
Glad its not me having to paying the transatlantic bill , Only British gas could charge more :)
Shirley once Ntl has it on their news servers all traffic is on net? :confused:
darkone338
30-07-2006, 23:31
Shirley once Ntl has it on their news servers all traffic is on net? :confused:
and where do you think the posts that reside on their servers come from? 99.9% non NTL users i'd bet!
Shirley once Ntl has it on their news servers all traffic is on net? :confused:
You still need a big server farm and it will only get bigger if the big groups are added. And lets face it there is no way NTL can afford to upgrade there newsgroups.
Me i would sooner pay Newshosting.com for a service than let NTL provide one that is crap at best.
I would sooner they spent the money it would cost to upgrade there news servers to supply all these TV eps and DVD rips on the network and email servers.
In fact let them dump their crap news servers and put them to better use on the email network. It only costs me $14.00 a month for unlimited access to over 80000 groups and in those are all the best groups that one would need.
zing_deleted
31-07-2006, 00:38
But one thing ive never understood is of how data transport costs money.The trans atlantic pipes are there the web as is is set up pipes all over the world.I understand how these need maintaining and how this costs but how does the traffic through the pipes cost money its just digital signals with no real form. Its like a train tunnel running through a mountain its there wethers theres a train going through it or not.Yes a passenger on the train or a subscriber to isp pays to connect to the the tunnel but the tunnel doesnt charge to travel through it.I pay for a premium news server based in the US I pay for an unlimited account so I can pull as much data off the servers as I want.That data travels through the pipes the premium news server pays for the right to use that pipe. The pipe is still in place wether theres traffic through it or not.
I have long contested theres no problem due to bandwidth use but I do as I have said understand the problems with contention.
Theres guys all round the world with faster internet connections than us just look at those who upload a dvd in an hour or so with our uploads your talking days but they manage there using a lot more "bandwidth" than us with there identical upload and download speeds.Or what about the 100 meg connections in Sweden and Japan they certainly dont show worries about bandwidth.
But one thing ive never understood is of how data transport costs money.The trans atlantic pipes are there the web as is is set up pipes all over the world.I understand how these need maintaining and how this costs but how does the traffic through the pipes cost money its just digital signals with no real form. Its like a train tunnel running through a mountain its there wethers theres a train going through it or not.Yes a passenger on the train or a subscriber to isp pays to connect to the the tunnel but the tunnel doesnt charge to travel through it.I pay for a premium news server based in the US I pay for an unlimited account so I can pull as much data off the servers as I want.That data travels through the pipes the premium news server pays for the right to use that pipe. The pipe is still in place wether theres traffic through it or not.
I have long contested theres no problem due to bandwidth use but I do as I have said understand the problems with contention.
Theres guys all round the world with faster internet connections than us just look at those who upload a dvd in an hour or so with our uploads your talking days but they manage there using a lot more "bandwidth" than us with there identical upload and download speeds.Or what about the 100 meg connections in Sweden and Japan they certainly dont show worries about bandwidth.
As far as I know, the various ISPs do pay for outside bandwidth. Regardless of any technical advances, laying cabling for new interconnects (whether within this country or outside it) still costs money, and the companies providing the interlinks will make their money by charging ISPs.
The bandwidth costs argument is somewhat mute. If the NTL UseNet servers carry the high bandwidth newsgroups then they download said content once. All other transfers are then undertaken on their own backbone. If NTL subscribers use third party usenet providers then NTL carry said content multiple times. Therefore theoretically they use more bandwidth not carrying the newsgroups. IMO I should add :)
The bandwidth costs argument is somewhat mute. If the NTL UseNet servers carry the high bandwidth newsgroups then they download said content once. All other transfers are then undertaken on their own backbone. If NTL subscribers use third party usenet providers then NTL carry said content multiple times. Therefore theoretically they use more bandwidth not carrying the newsgroups. IMO I should add :)
However, that still leaves the costs of upgrading the newgroup server clusters to cope with the increased load. And, NTL Networks (who provide the backbone) would probably still charge NTL home for the bandwidth (something to do with our countries free-market laws).
However, that still leaves the costs of upgrading the newgroup server clusters to cope with the increased load. And, NTL Networks (who provide the backbone) would probably still charge NTL home for the bandwidth (something to do with our countries free-market laws).
See Ntl love Proxies/Caches because they take the load off external bandwidth and serve up data on net - why does the same not apply to Newsgroups? :confused: :confused:
Shirley as I said before if they ran good* on-net servers then it could save them money on external bandwidth.:confused:
*I know Bill, their Email doesn't work properly and they can't be trused to run services like this. Saying that if they concentrated on their basic services rather than merging/buying other companys maybe they'd be in a better position! :shrug:
KingPhoenix
31-07-2006, 14:05
I reckon if people paid for the service (putting money into the pot for NTL to upgrade the servers, maintain them, add more to the clusters etc.) then it would be a worth while venture for them...
To offer as a free service..... why should they?
interesting discusion, anyway i found the email to request newsgroups on the ntl group dated 2002, but it doesnt exist anymore so it looks like they dont take requests. In the end i solved my problem by getting the tv group from another provider
interesting discusion, anyway i found the email to request newsgroups on the ntl group dated 2002, but it doesnt exist anymore so it looks like they dont take requests. In the end i solved my problem by getting the tv group from another provider
Exactly what i ended up doing as NTL's service being free is about as much use as a ashtray on a motor bike.
However, that still leaves the costs of upgrading the newgroup server clusters to cope with the increased load. And, NTL Networks (who provide the backbone) would probably still charge NTL home for the bandwidth (something to do with our countries free-market laws).
See Ntl love Proxies/Caches because they take the load off external bandwidth and serve up data on net - why does the same not apply to Newsgroups? :confused: :confused:
Shirley as I said before if they ran good* on-net servers then it could save them money on external bandwidth.:confused:
*I know Bill, their Email doesn't work properly and they can't be trused to run services like this. Saying that if they concentrated on their basic services rather than merging/buying other companys maybe they'd be in a better position! :shrug:
I have to admit, I don't know that they are NTL's reasons for not hosting those groups. I suspect bandwidth may well be part of the reason. As has been said before, storage is another. Ok, so a 200 Gig HDD is £80ish. That's four days of storage for one group. What about the other groups? Very soon, NTL could end up spending £1000s a week upgrading servers just to cope with the demand for a free service.
I suspect that isn't the whole reason either. I suspect the main reason is copyright. NTL (more than other ISPs) need copyright holders on-side, to get better deals. Now, I don't know if the two are linked, but I don't think it would look good for NTL if they are trying to negotiate a deal with (say) Disney while hosting gigabytes of pirated Disney DVDs.
Even if Disney weren't bothered (or didn't know), NTL possibly wouldn't want to risk the consequences.
I thought the NTL newservers were outsourced (in-sourced ?) to Highwinds, Highwinds also provide service for some of the paid news providers including NewsHosting and seem to have a fairly good reputation, presumably they carry those high content groups for their other paying customers and presumably NTL pay Highwinds for their service ?
Just another case of NTL giving half measures, like the email, they don't even give 100meg of space let alone a gig.
There is still plenty of copyright stuff on NTL's newsservers, alt.binaries.games for example.
BT now give their customers free Giganews access, which is so far unlimited.
I thought the NTL newservers were outsourced (in-sourced ?) to Highwinds, Highwinds also provide service for some of the paid news providers including NewsHosting and seem to have a fairly good reputation, presumably they carry those high content groups for their other paying customers and presumably NTL pay Highwinds for their service ?
Just another case of NTL giving half measures, like the email, they don't even give 100meg of space let alone a gig.
There is still plenty of copyright stuff on NTL's newsservers, alt.binaries.games for example.
BT now give their customers free Giganews access, which is so far unlimited.
BT give free giganews access?? (wow)
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