View Full Version : I need some advice on something...
So, I have a share in a house, it's also owned by my brother and father
The deal was, my dad would put down 40k as a deposit on a house and we (my brother and I) would pay the mortgage
All sounded rosey and whatnot, but that is where the pretty picture went wrong.
It was a mistake for us to move in with each other, one of the worst mistakes in my life in all honesty and as a result, my brother has proven himself to be a worthless piece of living flesh.
He came home drunk on Sunday of last week after the football, he then went into the lounge and told my dad clearly and without remorse, he wanted nothing more to do with him, me or my 2 uncles.
At first, we thought it was "the drink talking", but unfortunatly, it wasn't
He hasn't spoken to either of us since then and he's basically forcing my dad out of our house
Our house is a three bedroom home, my dad currently sleeps in the lounge, because we have a lodger in the third room
If my dad doesn't move out or wants to stay, my brother said he'll move out and the lodger (his friend) will go with him, which leaves me and my dad by ourselves.
My dad is retired, can't work due to illness, so that basically means we'd lose the house
So it's either my dad moves out, or we lose our home, that's how bad it is
So as you can imagine, my brother doesn't speak to us, not a word, which makes for an....uncomfortable living arrangement
I don't have a job, so I can't move out, we can't sell the house so i'm stuck here with that retarded thing called my "brother" and his attitude.
My dad and I are the ones on the mortgage agreement, not my brother
But, his name is on the house deeds (From what I remember)
Can anyone offer some advice? I'd really appreciate it..
It does really depend on who is the legal owner of the property, and who has names on the mortgage so worth checking on that.
If your brother and the lodger do move out, is there any reason why you can't get another lodger (or two) to help cover the costs of the mortgage?
Also, does your lodger have a shorthold tenancy agreement? If so, then you may be able to enforce this contract, to ensure that you obtain the rent for the remainder of the contract period.
---------- Post added at 20:48 ---------- Previous post was at 20:46 ----------
hmm... i'm trying to work remember back to when i studied land law as to whether your brother actually has any rights over the house- the only one i can think of is section 70(g) of the 1925 act- stating that persons in actually occupation of the property have an overriding interest, but if he moves out this obviously won't apply......hmm. *scratches head*
It's definatly me and my dad on the mortgage
I'm 99% sure all three are listed on the house deeds, i'll have to check
The lodger is a friend of my brother's, so no agreement was written up/out.
This is always a bad idea because if one of the people gets married or moves in with some one then they want to let go of there share as they need the money to set up some were else.
The best I can advise is got to the CAB or to a solicitor as soon as possible
Good luck and I hope it all works out for you and your dad
but in this case, the brother hasn't made any contribution has he?
He didn't pay the deposit, and his name isn't on the mortgage......
but in this case, the brother hasn't made any contribution has he?
He didn't pay the deposit, and his name isn't on the mortgage......
No, except his half of the mortgage payment every month. (We both pay £375ish per month)
My dad was responsible for the deposit (So he could have a place to retire to)
It's a sad situation, how someone can disown half of his family over issues years in the past is alien to me.
I'd suggest;
You getting a job (if possible)
Trying to get your brothers name off the deeds (as I'd find paying someone elses share unbearable)
Then trying to get a lodger or two to help with the mortgage repayments.
It probably couldn't hurt to explain the situation to your bank, to see if they could reduce the monthly payments??
Hope all goes well :)
Yea, a job is something i'm working hard on, just not having much luck. :(
zing_deleted
18-06-2006, 16:24
id suggest you let your brother leave straight away.Your dad stays down stairs and you get 2 more lodgers charging each 250 quid plus bill per month and your 125 quid a month better off job done
I agree......eh
The problem I see is this, my brother is the type of guy who will turn against us
And he has the advantage, he owns most of the appliances in this house, including washing machine, kettle, toaster, fridge, all the cutlery and plates etc
Even if he does agree to move out, I know he'd "ban" us from using all of the above
And I don't know if my dad would want to live out of the living room indefinatly, heh.
zing_deleted
18-06-2006, 17:34
tell him to take them with him if he doesnt then tell him they are abandoned
Oh yea that's what will happen anyways i'd imagine, if not, we'd stick them in our garage.
zoombini
18-06-2006, 19:47
If he does go & take his appliances with him then join Freecycle (www.freecycle.org)and post a wanted for some of these appliances, after being on many of these groups I see them being offerred every week.
etccarmageddon
18-06-2006, 20:46
It's definatly me and my dad on the mortgage
I'm 99% sure all three are listed on the house deeds, i'll have to check
The lodger is a friend of my brother's, so no agreement was written up/out.you can't have different people on the deeds compared to the mortage. if he's not on the mortgage then he's not on the deeds.
you can't have different people on the deeds compared to the mortage. if he's not on the mortgage then he's not on the deeds.
Really? hmm
I need to find those deeds tomorrow!
etccarmageddon
18-06-2006, 22:46
http://www.landregisteronline.gov.uk/lro/index.html
you can get the info on line for £2
---------- Post added at 22:46 ---------- Previous post was at 22:44 ----------
and remember - this isn't definitive information - register entries can sometimes be incorrect. proper proof of ownership is the contract you and whoever signed with the person you bought the house off and the documentation the solicitor has.
Yea I hear you
It'd be nice if he weren't a part of it, I guess we'll see
D'oh, he's on the house deeds.
orangebird
19-06-2006, 14:28
D'oh, he's on the house deeds.
Why is he on the deeds, but not on the mortgage? How does he have rights to ownership, but no liability to the payments?
Either way, tell him to bugger off, take his mate with him and never darken your doorstep again. Or tell him that he can buy your dad out at 60K. Does he really think that your dad should leave a house he put 40k down on?
Does your brother work?
I really don't know :(
I didn't realise he wasn't on the mortgage till recently
He is on the mortgage, got confirmation from our mortgage broker.
hmm. well that changes things slightly...
so the names on the mortgages are yours, your brothers and you dad's ya?
You could buy out your brother for the amount he has paid in contributions, and then remortgage in just yours and your dad's name... however that all depends really on whether your brother wants to leave.
However, if your brothers name is on the mortgage then he is also liable for payments... hmm... getting complicated... too late at night for this :p:
Yea I hear you, it is getting more complicated.
My dad told my brother he'd move out in 4 weeks time (when he gets back from a trip/holiday to sweden)
So he's expecting him out at that time
My dad DOES have savings, i'm going to try and find out just how much and if he'd be willing to pay my brother back, so we can get him out.
orangebird
21-06-2006, 10:43
Yea I hear you, it is getting more complicated.
My dad told my brother he'd move out in 4 weeks time (when he gets back from a trip/holiday to sweden)
So he's expecting him out at that time
My dad DOES have savings, i'm going to try and find out just how much and if he'd be willing to pay my brother back, so we can get him out.
Your dad needs to get a back bone and tell his son to sod off, ungrateful little ****. Your dad put 40k down on that house - it's his home, and he's entitled to stay there!!!!!!!
Indeed, but whether or not he'll do that, is another question.
handyman
21-06-2006, 11:45
I think that even if the situation can be resolved it will probably occur again. Best thing would be to put the house on the market and your dad can get his 40k plus a share of the profit made on the house if any and you and your dad can rent or buy another house.
Well here's the latest situation.
My dad originally said he wouldn't move in for at least a year, because he was staying in his old village in Uckfield, but his tenancy got cut short because the owners sold the pub, which is why he's back now and living out of the front room/living room.
So he's going to move out, then move back in, in 3 months, which would make it a year
At that time, the lodger would have to move out and we're sure my brother will to, at least, we hope.
Downside is I have to live with him for the next 3 months or more, 3 months of being ignored....good fun.
Well my brother has said he's moving out, but not before threatning to trash my dad's stuff when he's away on holiday
He also dropped a hint that he'd key his car when he's away.
Nice eh?
gaffer_gump
24-06-2006, 13:41
Been reading this from the start.
I have nothing constructive to add, but this is a real odd setup you have.
Either way someone has to buy someone out or sell the lot, simple really. :juggle:
I have to ask, does your brother have mental health problems Adam?
gaffer_gump
24-06-2006, 14:25
I have to ask, does your brother have mental health problems Adam?
Very subtle Jules :), 0o0 here is chance for you to pop on the naughty-nurse clobber and get yer sen round there to dish out the 'medicine' :naughty:
I have to ask, does your brother have mental health problems Adam?
Heh I don't know, i'd assume so.
Apparently he told my dad he'd kick the **** out of him if it weren't for his heart.
Update for those interested..
Things haven't changed, my dad is staying, he resides in the lounge at the moment
Unfortunatly, after all the threats against his life, things just got worse
My brother took away the skybox and unplugged the TV (which he owns) so my dad can't watch TV now
He also took down the curtains and moved everything that was my dad's, into the lounge with my dad, so he has to sleep on a blow up air bed, because a normal bed won't fit in there.
Nice huh?
He also managed to knock over my dad's stereo, which broke it and also damaged his wireless adapter sticking out the back of his laptop.
:(
Ok question why does your dad let him get away with all this stuff if he was a son of mind it wouldn't happen! and he would soon know his place!
Well my dad is 61/62, my brother is 28/29
My dad has a weak heart (angina), so he can't really do much.....
Saaf_laandon_mo
03-07-2006, 17:26
Could all this be a windup? I can't imagine any son/daughter doing half the things on this thread..........
You obviously don't know how evil people can be, he's been like this since he was in his teens (worse recently, he only has 1 friend now, as opposed to quite a few years ago)
As for a windup, nope it's not
If you'd like proof, i'd be happy to show it, but as for what kinda of proof I can provide, who knows
I should've recorded on my mp3 thing when he last had his blow up.
Ok best thing your dad can do is get an injunction against him and get him out of the house
I agree, but he won't do it....I have no idea why
Apparently he apologised for the threats, but refused to shake hands saying the "Situation was the same", and hasn't spoke to him since.
Sadly Adam you can't help some one that will not help themselves :(
I agree, but he won't do it....I have no idea why Apparently he apologised for the threats, but refused to shake hands saying the "Situation was the same", and hasn't spoke to him since. Why hasn't anyone you know decked him over this yet? It doesn't solve anything, but i would have done it anyway :/
I dunno what to say, other than try to persuade your dad.
gaffer_gump
03-07-2006, 21:37
Sounds like old bad blood coming to the surface ........ more to this than meets the eye IMO :shrug:
timewarrior2001
03-07-2006, 21:53
2 things I would do.....
Pile your brothers belongings in the front garden and change the locks on the front door. As the mortgage payers you and your father determine who lives in the house.
Secondly beat the living hell out of your brother and then say he was trespassing and threatened your father etc.
Me personally, I'd settle for a beating or several and a smear campaign against your brother. I'd label him a drug addict, a dirty smack head, get him barred from pubs etc. Maybe even worse I'd spread rumours he was a paedo.
The guys a piece of ****, the lowest of the ****ing low and he deserves everyhting you can do to hurt him physically and mentally.
Now I have spoken my mind, just throw his belongings out of the house and change the locks.
Now I have spoken my mind, just throw his belongings out of the house and change the locks.
LOL, nice :P
I agree, but, he also owns a share in this house
Turns out, we're ALL on the mortgage and on the house deeds, so we can't kick him out, as he can't kick any of us out, but he can make our lives very uncomfortable.
And I agree, if my dad won't help himself, there isn't much I can do.
It's a strange situation
We're going to sell the house come spring next year, as we still have to get Central heating installed, but that won't be done till early autumn.
Why hasn't anyone you know decked him over this yet?
Because I don't know anyone who'd want to goto jail for Assault..
timewarrior2001
03-07-2006, 22:16
LOL, nice :P
I agree, but, he also owns a share in this house
Turns out, we're ALL on the mortgage and on the house deeds, so we can't kick him out, as he can't kick any of us out, but he can make our lives very uncomfortable.
And I agree, if my dad won't help himself, there isn't much I can do.
It's a strange situation
We're going to sell the house come spring next year, as we still have to get Central heating installed, but that won't be done till early autumn.
Because I don't know anyone who'd want to goto jail for Assault..
Well if he is on the mortgage then he still has to pay, so moving out wont affect you or your dad.
grandmaster
03-07-2006, 22:31
Your brother sounds like a loser.
SELL THE HOUSE!
Take you cut(s) and never speak to the low life again..
Well if he is on the mortgage then he still has to pay, so moving out wont affect you or your dad.
Yep, but he doesn't want to move out, he's staying put :(
Which is why the situation is just getting worse..
He even removed the shower/bath mat because he owned it, everything that i'd given him he dumped in my room (spare chair, a dvd and some other stuff)
According to my mum, he once pinned her up against the wall with his hands round her throat, so yea, that's what he's like
I didn't even know about that till a few days ago...
As I allways told my mum, he's a stereotypical thug.
Aren't their any authorities that can deal with this?
timewarrior2001
03-07-2006, 23:02
Yep, but he doesn't want to move out, he's staying put :(
Which is why the situation is just getting worse..
He even removed the shower/bath mat because he owned it, everything that i'd given him he dumped in my room (spare chair, a dvd and some other stuff)
According to my mum, he once pinned her up against the wall with his hands round her throat, so yea, that's what he's like
I didn't even know about that till a few days ago...
As I allways told my mum, he's a stereotypical thug.
Well why dont you get a restraining order against him?
Or simply remove all his stuff to his room, permit him use of the bathroom and use of the kitchen and no where else.
Fit a lock to the living room door and only you and your dad hold keys to it.
Put locks on all kitchen cupboards except the one you allocate to him.
Seek legal advice on getting the lodger evicted and let your dad have a bedroom like he deserves.
Invest in £100 and get a CCTV system, install it and put the camera in public areas, record it onto your VCR in Your LOCKED room. My camera even has audio on it and is fitted externally. Hey presto instant evidence if the ****wit **** bandit tries anything.
I can vouch that people like this DO exist. You need to get them out of your life whatever the cost, forgive them (yes, that's right), have no further contact and then get on with your life.
Another thing. Just because your Dad chooses to put up with it doesn't mean you should. Get out.
Well why dont you get a restraining order against him?
Because he hasn't threatened me and he hasn't done anything since his original threat...
Or simply remove all his stuff to his room, permit him use of the bathroom and use of the kitchen and no where else.
Fit a lock to the living room door and only you and your dad hold keys to it.
Put locks on all kitchen cupboards except the one you allocate to him.
Seek legal advice on getting the lodger evicted and let your dad have a bedroom like he deserves.
I wish I could, but things would just get worse and...he owns the majority of the appliances and other items in this house, so if we decided to take action, we'd be screwed as we couldn't then use the fridge, washing machine, kettle, toaster, george foreman, plates, cups, glasses, cutlery etc etc etc
See what I mean? hehe
---------- Post added at 23:38 ---------- Previous post was at 23:36 ----------
Another thing. Just because your Dad chooses to put up with it doesn't mean you should. Get out.
Wish I could, but I have no where to go.
Because he hasn't threatened me and he hasn't done anything since his original threat...
I wish I could, but things would just get worse and...he owns the majority of the appliances and other items in this house, so if we decided to take action, we'd be screwed as we couldn't then use the fridge, washing machine, kettle, toaster, george foreman, plates, cups, glasses, cutlery etc etc etc
See what I mean? hehe
Blimey matey - just do this:
Fridge - cheap enough now or, worst case, buy one of the small ones. I got Twin Nug a Homer Simpson beer fridge for our birthday last year - even that sort of thing would do short term.
Washing machine - frankly, that's what launderettes were invented for :)
Kettle - again, cheap enough. Even a travel kettle would do you.
Toaster - see my kettle point (although a travel toaster would just be weird :disturbd: )
George Foreman - trust me, you can do without that for a while
Crockery and cutlery - either just but a really cheap set that you can afford to break if it happens, or live off paper plates in the short term :)
My dad's abit of a pussy, really, no offence to him, heh
But he was all set to move out and let my brother have his own way, but I ranted at him and got him to change his mind, which is why my brother then threatened him, we were hoping he'd then say he's moving out, which he did, but then he realised he couldn't because he, like me, would have no where to go, nor could he afford a mortgage and rent at another flat..
So instead, he decided to remove all the stuff my dad used beforehand to make his stay more unpleasant (he hasn't spoken to my dad in 3 weeks, me the same)
He is ****, when we go our seperate ways, I won't have anything to do with him.
carlingman
03-07-2006, 23:59
My dad's abit of a pussy, really, no offence to him, heh
But he was all set to move out and let my brother have his own way, but I ranted at him and got him to change his mind, which is why my brother then threatened him, we were hoping he'd then say he's moving out, which he did, but then he realised he couldn't because he, like me, would have no where to go, nor could he afford a mortgage and rent at another flat..
So instead, he decided to remove all the stuff my dad used beforehand to make his stay more unpleasant (he hasn't spoken to my dad in 3 weeks, me the same)
He is ****, when we go our seperate ways, I won't have anything to do with him.
No offence to you either but how old are you.
Your bro behaves threatening towards your 60 odd year old father with a heart condition.
FFS I dont normally condone violence but beat the **** out of your bro and throw him out.
If you come off worse sue the bstard for assault.
Job done he wont be allowed near either of you.
:)
If your Dad is 62 with a weak heart why are you letting him sleep on the couch?
Lots of good advice in this thread, but none of it will work if you don't have the support of your Dad, you both need to be sticking to your guns and be certain and determined that you want him out. Otherwise this is going to carry on until he does something really bad or your Dad has a major heart attack.
how can there be three people named on the deeds?
a joint tenancy can only occur between a maximum of two parties iirc, otherwise a trust must be setup.
how can there be three people named on the deeds?
a joint tenancy can only occur between a maximum of two parties iirc, otherwise a trust must be setup.
Think it's because we're all on the mortgage.
We're all definatly on there, as i've got the title register.
---------- Post added at 04:35 ---------- Previous post was at 04:34 ----------
If your Dad is 62 with a weak heart why are you letting him sleep on the couch?
He doesn't sleep on the couch, he has a blow up bed...
But even so, he can't get a normal bed because it won't fit in the lounge because there's a sofa in there, the lodger's fish tank and my brother's LARGE TV...(the one he disconnected)
---------- Post added at 04:37 ---------- Previous post was at 04:35 ----------
No offence to you either but how old are you.
Your bro behaves threatening towards your 60 odd year old father with a heart condition.
FFS I dont normally condone violence but beat the **** out of your bro and throw him out.
I'm 26..and no, i'm not a fighter, heh
Kinda wish I were.
Purely from a layman's point your brother sounds schizophrenic! However until your Father takes legal advice the best course would be to sell up and start again as your brother will not stop until your father is out of the house (and then may start on you).
Yea I agree, unfortunatly, we can't sell until we have some form of heating installed, which is supposedly going in by the beginning of Autumn (my dad gets it free due to pension credit)
I wish my brother would move out, it'd be alot less stress for all of us, but he won't.......I wish there was something I could do (And no, I won't beat him up :P)
heh
Yea I agree, unfortunatly, we can't sell until we have some form of heating installed, which is supposedly going in by the beginning of Autumn (my dad gets it free due to pension credit)
I wish my brother would move out, it'd be alot less stress for all of us, but he won't.......I wish there was something I could do (And no, I won't beat him up :P)
heh
Out of curiosity, why can't you sell until the heating's in? We bought our house 2½ years ago without central heating, and it still hasn't got it :shrug:
Worst case is you may have to drop the price a little, but I wouldn't have thought that it was a massive stumbling block :)
Maybe, but even if we did sell the house, i'd still have no where to go and in all honesty, I wouldn't want to live with my dad, so i'm not sure what i'd do without a job.
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