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bopdude
24-04-2006, 05:51
Has anyone here tried this treatment, if so, what were the results, any improvent, about the same, or worse :shocked:

I'd like to keep this thread as clean as poss ( yeah, I know, fat chance ) the reason being, I am a HEAVY sufferer and have tried just about everything I think over the years, from injections of kenolog to clinical trials ( guinea-pig stylee )
I've heard stories about acupuncture for hayfever, one from my sister about a friend, she seems to be :erm: less streesfull, as those that suffer will know.

Any offers / comments :tu:

greencreeper
24-04-2006, 07:17
Do you know what makes you sneeze?

skyblueheroes
24-04-2006, 08:34
I only got it at about 21 but have a couple of months each year of streaming eyes and sneezing. I'm not too bad but the pills you get from Boots just don't seem to work.

Kliro
24-04-2006, 09:04
Accupunctures working for me, not hayfever though.

Its not cheap though :(

Salu
24-04-2006, 13:29
I would be very interested to see any "research" in to the effectiveness of this as cannot see how acupuncture can have any effect on an allergy due to the mechanism of allergy.

That doesn't mean I am sceptical of all acupuncture though....

Shaun
24-04-2006, 13:34
Thanks bop, I almost forgot it was nearly time for me to start with the runny eyes again. :(

I have got some rusty nails though if you want me to have a go on you ;)

bopdude
24-04-2006, 15:54
Well that wasn't bad, from my initial post saying can we try and keep it clean, not one of the 7 replies is on toipic


Do you know what makes you sneeze?
Yes, quiet a few things in a variety of strenghts.
Fungi pollen, tree pollen, grass pollen, house dust, saw dust, cats, dogs, mould......... to name but a few :(


I only got it at about 21 but have a couple of months each year of streaming eyes and sneezing. I'm not too bad but the pills you get from Boots just don't seem to work.
Nope, gone through the lot, off the shelf a prescription, trying a new one that Rammy suggested, my condition is just laughing at them :(

Accupunctures working for me, not hayfever though.

Its not cheap though :(
:erm: thanks for that :shrug:

I would be very interested to see any "research" in to the effectiveness of this as cannot see how acupuncture can have any effect on an allergy due to the mechanism of allergy.

That doesn't mean I am sceptical of all acupuncture though....
Me as well mate, me as well, all I'll say is 1 billion chineses can't be wrong :shrug: :D seriously though, I have heard 'stories' about it, waiting to hear back from my sisters friend, I'm dessperate so will try anything :erm: almost ;)

Thanks bop, I almost forgot it was nearly time for me to start with the runny eyes again. :(

I have got some rusty nails though if you want me to have a go on you ;)
No worries mate, rusty nails :shocked: do you think it will work ??????

Chris
24-04-2006, 16:40
Well that wasn't bad, from my initial post saying can we try and keep it clean, not one of the 7 replies is on toipic

<snip>
Now be fair, only two of the posts were completely off topic ... the thread went unscathed for ooooh, must have been almost eight hours before going astray.

Can we please try not to sabotage threads by taking them off topic. Especially not as fast as this.

bopdude
24-04-2006, 16:51
Well that wasn't bad, from my initial post saying can we try and keep it clean, not one of the 7 replies is on toipic

<snip>
Now be fair, only two of the posts were completely off topic ... the thread went unscathed for ooooh, must have been almost eight hours before going astray.

Can we please try not to sabotage threads by taking them off topic. Especially not as fast as this.
OK, maybe I exaggerated a tad, such is my suffering atm, honestly, I would not wish hayfever as bad as I get it, on anyone, makes me irritable ( well more so ) down, miffed, /slips into wet reporter stylee, wet, freezing cold wet, totally p****d off :(

WHISTLED
24-04-2006, 17:53
Not had it for hayfever but spent months with physio for back problem, went to accupuncture once and cleared up within 48 hours. BRILLIANT.

Ramrod
24-04-2006, 18:15
Marina will probably jump up and down on my head when she see's this but here goes: :D

Acupuncture and Chinese herbal medicine in the treatment of patients with seasonal allergic rhinitis: a randomized-controlled clinical trial.

BACKGROUND: Patients with allergic rhinitis (AR) increasingly use complementary medicine. The aim of this study was to determine whether traditional Chinese therapy is efficacious in patients suffering from seasonal AR. <blah> CONCLUSIONS: The results of this study suggest that traditional Chinese therapy may be an efficacious and safe treatment option for patients with seasonal AR.
.........................................

The effect of acupuncture on allergic rhinitis: a randomized controlled clinical trial.

<blah>
This study compared active versus sham acupuncture in 40 consecutive patients with a history of allergic rhinitis and a positive skin test. Patients were randomized and assessed prior to treatment and then reassessed after 12 months. Improvements in symptoms using visual analogue scales, reduction in skin test reactions and levels of specific immunoglobin E (IgE) were used to compare the effect of treatment.<blah>No differences in clinical symptoms were seen between active versus sham acupuncture, thus the conclusion being that the effect of acupuncture on allergic rhinitis should be further evaluated in larger randomized studies.
............................................

[Protective effect of acupuncture on allergen provoked rhinitis]

A study of the protective effect of an acupuncture therapy against a nasal allergen-provoked rhinitis was undertaken on patients suffering from seasonal allergic rhinitis. <blah> The objective and subjective results of the allergen-provocation in the VCC were not able to verify a protective effect of the acupuncture therapy. The "Diary of Complaints (Symptoms)" which the participants had to keep over the 2 months following the treatment showed a definite reduction of the subjective complaints in the verum group during the second month. The range of scatter was too great for a statistically significant result.
.............................................


Effect of acupuncture on allergic rhinitis: clinical and laboratory evaluations.


Of 22 subjects with allergic rhinitis who received a series of 6 acupuncture treatments, 11 (50%) were virtually symptom-free by the end of the series, 8 (36%) experienced a moderate reduction in symptoms, and 3 (14%) received no significant relief. Clinical assessment of symptoms was made on a 6-point scale before the first treatment and before each subsequent session. Laboratory tests included absolute blood eosinophils, percentage of nasal eosinophils, and radioimmunoassay of serum IgE, performed before the first treatment, at the end of the series, and 2 months later. A significant decrease in subjective clinical rating of symptoms correlated with a concurrent drop in absolute numbers of blood eosinophils and percentage of nasal eosinophils. IgE levels decreased in 64% of the subjects by completion of treatment and in 76% at 2-month follow-up.


These were small trials but it looks like acupuncture for hay fever may work for some people......

greencreeper
24-04-2006, 19:31
Yes, quiet a few things in a variety of strenghts.
Fungi pollen, tree pollen, grass pollen, house dust, saw dust, cats, dogs, mould......... to name but a few :(
Not good - makes it hard to avoid a flare up :( It's mainly dust with me - though once I start sneezing and my nose is all inflammed, I sneeze at pretty much everything. I can't see how acupuncture could work :erm: But if it does, then great.

patrickp
24-04-2006, 20:22
I used to get hayfever very badly when I was younger, bopdude. I finally found that a homeopathic remedy did the the trick; unfortunately I can't remember which one it was now - there are a few different ones for hayfever, and it's been 15 or 20 years since it pretty much went away. Besides, what worked for me wouldn't necessarily work for you.

But it was very effective and, of course, completely without the side-effects of more conventional treatments.

bopdude
24-04-2006, 21:34
I used to get hayfever very badly when I was younger, bopdude. I finally found that a homeopathic remedy did the the trick; unfortunately I can't remember which one it was now - there are a few different ones for hayfever, and it's been 15 or 20 years since it pretty much went away. Besides, what worked for me wouldn't necessarily work for you.

But it was very effective and, of course, completely without the side-effects of more conventional treatments.

Yeah tried some homeopathic remedies a few years back, the normal dosage had no effect, so as there were no side effects due to it being natural I would take 10 times the amount in an effort to see an improvment, nothing was ever gained by it :( thanks for the idea though :tu:

Looks like there maybe something to the acupuncture going by Rammies post, I'll have to make some calls tomorrow.

Salu
24-04-2006, 22:32
Marina will probably jump up and down on my head when she see's this but here goes: :D

Acupuncture and Chinese herbal medicine in the treatment of patients with seasonal allergic rhinitis: a randomized-controlled clinical trial.

BACKGROUND: Patients with allergic rhinitis (AR) increasingly use complementary medicine. The aim of this study was to determine whether traditional Chinese therapy is efficacious in patients suffering from seasonal AR. <blah> CONCLUSIONS: The results of this study suggest that traditional Chinese therapy may be an efficacious and safe treatment option for patients with seasonal AR.
.........................................

The effect of acupuncture on allergic rhinitis: a randomized controlled clinical trial.

<blah>
This study compared active versus sham acupuncture in 40 consecutive patients with a history of allergic rhinitis and a positive skin test. Patients were randomized and assessed prior to treatment and then reassessed after 12 months. Improvements in symptoms using visual analogue scales, reduction in skin test reactions and levels of specific immunoglobin E (IgE) were used to compare the effect of treatment.<blah>No differences in clinical symptoms were seen between active versus sham acupuncture, thus the conclusion being that the effect of acupuncture on allergic rhinitis should be further evaluated in larger randomized studies.
............................................

[Protective effect of acupuncture on allergen provoked rhinitis]

A study of the protective effect of an acupuncture therapy against a nasal allergen-provoked rhinitis was undertaken on patients suffering from seasonal allergic rhinitis. <blah> The objective and subjective results of the allergen-provocation in the VCC were not able to verify a protective effect of the acupuncture therapy. The "Diary of Complaints (Symptoms)" which the participants had to keep over the 2 months following the treatment showed a definite reduction of the subjective complaints in the verum group during the second month. The range of scatter was too great for a statistically significant result.
.............................................


Effect of acupuncture on allergic rhinitis: clinical and laboratory evaluations.


Of 22 subjects with allergic rhinitis who received a series of 6 acupuncture treatments, 11 (50%) were virtually symptom-free by the end of the series, 8 (36%) experienced a moderate reduction in symptoms, and 3 (14%) received no significant relief. Clinical assessment of symptoms was made on a 6-point scale before the first treatment and before each subsequent session. Laboratory tests included absolute blood eosinophils, percentage of nasal eosinophils, and radioimmunoassay of serum IgE, performed before the first treatment, at the end of the series, and 2 months later. A significant decrease in subjective clinical rating of symptoms correlated with a concurrent drop in absolute numbers of blood eosinophils and percentage of nasal eosinophils. IgE levels decreased in 64% of the subjects by completion of treatment and in 76% at 2-month follow-up.


These were small trials but it looks like acupuncture for hay fever may work for some people......

What's the source of this Ramroad?

bmxbandit
24-04-2006, 23:09
What's the source of this Ramroad?
Allergy. Volume: 59, Issue: 9, Date: 2005 08 04, Pages: 953-60

Looks like a decent journal, I'd be inclined to trust it... although the sample size is pretty low.

bopdude
01-05-2006, 12:05
Well I had my first acupuncture session on Friday and am having the second of eight planned sessions today, might just be me or weather conditions but I thought there was a slight improvement over the weekend, I'll let you know how it goes after today :shrug:

slowcoach
01-05-2006, 12:57
If you really believe a remedy will work, then it probably will, or it will appear to work, which is just as good.

Make sure your acupuncturist wears a white coat, that usually has a great physiological effect on most people.

I havenââ‚ƚ¬Ã¢â€žÂ¢t been to see my GP for 40 years, funnily enough common ailments appear to clear up in about the same time with or without medication.

The older I get, the less faith I have in other people and I am rarely disappointed :rolleyes:

bopdude
01-05-2006, 13:00
If you really believe a remedy will work, then it probably will, or it will appear to work, which is just as good.


Your not wrong, I sometimes think half of the problem is in the mind, if I'm kept occupied for example, no time to think of it so it doesn't give me grief, much ;)



Make sure your acupuncturist wears a white coat, that usually has a great physiological effect on most people.

Yep, full white coat, old chinese lady with a younger girl / counter / sales person to help with the translation.

slowcoach
01-05-2006, 15:11
Yep, full white coat, old chinese lady with a younger girl / counter / sales person to help with the translation. Looks like she may just be authentic. :tu:

bopdude
01-05-2006, 15:17
Yep, full white coat, old chinese lady with a younger girl / counter / sales person to help with the translation. Looks like she may just be authentic. :tu:
Here's hoping, anyways, gotta go, next pin cushion session in 45 mins :Yikes: ... lol

Chimaera
01-05-2006, 15:39
Let us know how it goes - I might send my daughter for treatment, she suffers really badly. :Yikes:

Ramrod
01-05-2006, 16:00
What's the source of this Ramroad?Just a search on pubmed (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi).....I think I typed in 'allergic rhinitis' and 'acupuncture'
(sorry for the late reply!)

---------- Post added at 14:59 ---------- Previous post was at 14:56 ----------

Let us know how it goes - I might send my daughter for treatment, she suffers really badly. :Yikes:Wether it helps Bop or not you shouldn't let it influence your decision......it helps some and not others. Like most things in life......

---------- Post added at 15:00 ---------- Previous post was at 14:59 ----------

Here's hoping, anyways, gotta go, next pin cushion session in 45 mins :Yikes: ... lolWierd feeling isn't it?!:disturbd: :D

bopdude
01-05-2006, 19:06
Well, just got back, via the pub :shrug: ( 'tis bank holiday, had to visit me boys ;) )

Not a lot to report change wise, not sure, eyes 'seem' to be a better, nose is going between the blocked and runny phases :(

I'm gonna stick to the course of tablets and needles, nothing to lose, 'conventional' medice hasn't been 'much' help, may as well give the alternative a chance :tu:

Cilonen
01-05-2006, 19:18
Just make sure the needles are coming out of individual blister packs immediately before going into you. If they aren't, there's no guarantee that they are sterile.

If you are a blood donor, you will need to inform the Blood Service that you've had acupuncture as they will only allow you to donate if your acupuncturist is NHS registered (and thus following proper sterile instrument protocols).

greencreeper
02-05-2006, 19:42
I was heartened to hear of this research into house dust mite: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4945728.stm

Warning - graphic picture at the top of the article :disturbd:

shabbadoof13
03-05-2006, 16:44
hi all

just to let you all know there's a forum dedicatd to hayfever sufferers everywhere at http://www.hayfeverforum.co.uk where you might want to post these queries/comments..

jon

Shaun
03-05-2006, 17:35
How you geting on now Bop, any improvement?

My eyes are burning today - bluddy hayfever. :mad:

bopdude
03-05-2006, 18:33
hi all

just to let you all know there's a forum dedicatd to hayfever sufferers everywhere at http://www.hayfeverforum.co.uk (http://www.hayfeverforum.co.uk/) where you might want to post these queries/comments..

jon
Thanks for the link and :welcome: to the site :tu: I suppose it's spam of sorts but seeing as how its related to the thread the mods might let it slip.

How you geting on now Bop, any improvement?

My eyes are burning today - bluddy hayfever. :mad:
having a bit of a time with my nose atm, had a bad morning's sleep with a chesty cough, to sum it up, I think there is an improvement but it's not a total cure............................yet. ;)

bopdude
21-05-2006, 06:43
Well time for an update I think, across the board my condition has improved about 90-95% at a guess. How and why this 'traditional healing' is working I'm not sure, whether it's in the mind, the herbal remedies, the acupuncture, or most likely, a combination, I don't know, all I know is I'm starting to enjoy my first spring / summer for a looooooooooong time.

had a funny thing happen at Fridays session, for some reason the area around the needle in my right forearm 'sank' a small crater of sorts, this led to the assistant not being able to pull the needle out, strange I thought, she went to get the old chinese doctor, whilst she was gone me being me I thought I'd have a go at it, it would not budge, just as I was about to get my foot behind it for leverage :disturbd: they came back in, they screamed at me......................lol, the doctor then took my arm in one hand and began to flick my forearm with her finger, half a dozen flicks later, one small tug, and the needle came out :shrug:
I don't care what others say now, I'm converted, all I'll say is its working for me, you've got nothing to lose, except time and a bit of dosh, and a life to claim back :tu:

bmxbandit
21-05-2006, 11:34
fair enough - if it seems to be working, you can't complain! :shrug:

some people it helps, some it doesn't... looks like you're one of the lucky ones :tu:

Gareth
21-05-2006, 12:31
Good news, Bop :tu:

Mine's not that severe... piriton clears it up for me normally, but if it gets worse, I'll bear this in mind.