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Looking at the thread about redundancy reminded me to pass on this sorry tale from someone I have been working with recently.
We have a very nice guy who has started working with us part time, he is a very intelligent engineer but has been out of work due to an accident. He was unfortunately struck by a lorry that pulled out in front of him on a dual carraigeway as he was overtaking it, he rolled his car about three times and as a result has suffered some very bad head injuries and has been unable to claim compensation due to the driver being untracable with foreign plates.
He has been receiving some form of incapacity benefit, and decided to look for a company that would give him a chance to gently ease himself back into work. He suffers a little from short term memory loss, and really wanted to join us to see if he could manage a few hours a day for 3 days a week and increase slowly if he was able to. The benefit office said this was OK, but would take anything above £15 a week that he earned back. His travelling for the 3 days is £20 so he's effectively out of pocket before he starts anyway. The benefit office promised that his mortgage interest payments and other benefits would not be affected, after about a month with us they have now refused to accept his claim and have asked for the forms to be re-submitted, he says they will not backdate the claim and it will cost him around £900 in interest payments.
I think its a disgusting way to treat a guy is making the effort to ease himself back into work after an accident that was no fault of his own. If he intended to milk the system and never work again life would be a lot easier, as he says his idea was to try and be stress free whilst easing back into work and become self supporting again.
I dont think the little hitlers at the benefit office are making any efforts to help this guy back to a normal life.:mad:
MadGamer
18-01-2006, 23:54
Looking at the thread about redundancy reminded me to pass on this sorry tale from someone I have been working with recently.
We have a very nice guy who has started working with us part time, he is a very intelligent engineer but has been out of work due to an accident. He was unfortunately struck by a lorry that pulled out in front of him on a dual carraigeway as he was overtaking it, he rolled his car about three times and as a result has suffered some very bad head injuries and has been unable to claim compensation due to the driver being untracable with foreign plates.
He has been receiving some form of incapacity benefit, and decided to look for a company that would give him a chance to gently ease himself back into work. He suffers a little from short term memory loss, and really wanted to join us to see if he could manage a few hours a day for 3 days a week and increase slowly if he was able to. The benefit office said this was OK, but would take anything above £15 a week that he earned back. His travelling for the 3 days is £20 so he's effectively out of pocket before he starts anyway. The benefit office promised that his mortgage interest payments and other benefits would not be affected, after about a month with us they have now refused to accept his claim and have asked for the forms to be re-submitted, he says they will not backdate the claim and it will cost him around £900 in interest payments.
I think its a disgusting way to treat a guy is making the effort to ease himself back into work after an accident that was no fault of his own. If he intended to milk the system and never work again life would be a lot easier, as he says his idea was to try and be stress free whilst easing back into work and become self supporting again.
I dont think the little hitlers at the benefit office are making any efforts to help this guy back to a normal life.:mad:
Thats absolutly terrible, makes me sick.
Sucks especially as people who *are* entitled to the benefits have to battle for them whereas the chavs who aren't and CBA to work for money, despite being able to, get loads they aren't entitled to innit.
I know how he feels, unfortunatly those that want to work and need help get Sweet F*** all, while those that want to sit of there Ar$e and do SFA get cash given to them that they should even get.
In my own case I was made redundant and because I like at home (I couldn't afford a morgage, or to rent a house in my town, so have to live at home) I only get the minimum £56 per week and I have to spend double that.
Like I siad the honest people get treated like *****.
But that aside I home your college makes a full and speedy recovery soon.
The chavs tutor each other on DLA etc, so the genuine people dont stand a chance, but ive heard there is a charity that helps people to sort all there benefits properly, cant remember what ist called.
And yes it sucks :(
I've been saying for ages that the worse thing to be in this country is straight and a taxpayer.
---------- Post added at 05:13 ---------- Previous post was at 05:11 ----------
Looking at the thread about redundancy reminded me to pass on this sorry tale from someone I have been working with recently.
We have a very nice guy who has started working with us part time, he is a very intelligent engineer but has been out of work due to an accident. He was unfortunately struck by a lorry that pulled out in front of him on a dual carraigeway as he was overtaking it, he rolled his car about three times and as a result has suffered some very bad head injuries and has been unable to claim compensation due to the driver being untracable with foreign plates.
He has been receiving some form of incapacity benefit, and decided to look for a company that would give him a chance to gently ease himself back into work. He suffers a little from short term memory loss, and really wanted to join us to see if he could manage a few hours a day for 3 days a week and increase slowly if he was able to. The benefit office said this was OK, but would take anything above £15 a week that he earned back. His travelling for the 3 days is £20 so he's effectively out of pocket before he starts anyway. The benefit office promised that his mortgage interest payments and other benefits would not be affected, after about a month with us they have now refused to accept his claim and have asked for the forms to be re-submitted, he says they will not backdate the claim and it will cost him around £900 in interest payments.
I think its a disgusting way to treat a guy is making the effort to ease himself back into work after an accident that was no fault of his own. If he intended to milk the system and never work again life would be a lot easier, as he says his idea was to try and be stress free whilst easing back into work and become self supporting again.
I dont think the little hitlers at the benefit office are making any efforts to help this guy back to a normal life.:mad:
A guy is trying to get himself back to work after an accident, the DHSS are persicuting him for trying to get himself back on his feet, is there any wonder this country is on it's knees?
A guy is trying to get himself back to work after an accident, the DHSS are persicuting him for trying to get himself back on his feet, is there any wonder this country is on it's knees?
In fairness, and while I do sympathise with this guy, I think it's a bit harsh to say that he is being 'persecuted'.
Unfortunately in this case, the Benefits Agency has rules that it has to work to (which are set up by the DWP, not them) - as a result of these rules, all of these chavs that everyone gets so vocal about stand more of a chance of getting caught if they commit benefit fraud.
In fairness, and while I do sympathise with this guy, I think it's a bit harsh to say that he is being 'persecuted'.
Unfortunately in this case, the Benefits Agency has rules that it has to work to (which are set up by the DWP, not them) - as a result of these rules, all of these chavs that everyone gets so vocal about stand more of a chance of getting caught if they commit benefit fraud.
I think he is being persecuted, because the benefit office assured him working limited hours and declaring it would not affect any of his benefits.
Its about time they looked at individual cases and realised some people with a little help, could get back into work as a taxpayer and be self supporting within a short time period thus paying back the benefits they have received. Surely thats money better spent than on someone who will milk the system for the rest of their lives.
timewarrior2001
19-01-2006, 20:14
I think he is being persecuted, because the benefit office assured him working limited hours and declaring it would not affect any of his benefits.
Its about time they looked at individual cases and realised some people with a little help, could get back into work as a taxpayer and be self supporting within a short time period thus paying back the benefits they have received. Surely thats money better spent than on someone who will milk the system for the rest of their lives.
upto 16 hours a week and upto a certain wage you can claim and declare.
He's an engineer, he wont be working for peanuts, he will be way above min wage so the system rightly says he doesnt qualify.
This guy is on his way to work, he is earning he has a job.
whilst your average chav is incapable of stringing a sentence together, never mind be able to find a job and earn money.
Who needs the states help more? its a choice, the engineer isnt gonna starve, the chav probably would.
As he does not qualify for benefit payments, he can earn more.
If he didnt take out insurances then quite frankly its tough on him.
As for compensation, his solicitor should have informed him of the motor insurance bureau.
upto 16 hours a week and upto a certain wage you can claim and declare.
He's an engineer, he wont be working for peanuts, he will be way above min wage so the system rightly says he doesnt qualify.
This guy is on his way to work, he is earning he has a job.
whilst your average chav is incapable of stringing a sentence together, never mind be able to find a job and earn money.
Who needs the states help more? its a choice, the engineer isnt gonna starve, the chav probably would.
As he does not qualify for benefit payments, he can earn more.
If he didnt take out insurances then quite frankly its tough on him.
As for compensation, his solicitor should have informed him of the motor insurance bureau.
Well the facts are that the guy and more importantly his doctor are not sure if he can ever return to full time employment. He currently works 5 hours a day for 3 days a week to keep under the 16 hours, I'm not sure how you can make a statement and assume he is earning good wages, when in fact he is earning peanuts as an attempt to ease back into work if he can. He feels there is no way in his present condition that he could walk straight into a full time job, and he seems very frustrated by this and the now increased financial burden by his attempts to ease himself off state benefits.
As far as I'm aware, he has made an agreement with his doctor, the benefits office, and the company to make an attempt to try and get his life back to some sort of normailty. If he is unable to succesfully resume his career as an engineer, his employment prospects will be no better than the average chav.
The guy actually made the mistake of returning to his work very shortly after the accident, only after collapsing in his previous place of work did he find out there was far more wrong than he realised.
He is going through the insurance bureau, and has been told due to the complexity of the claim and lack of witnesses it could actually take years to settle the claim.
You say "Who needs the state more" I say the state needs him back in work paying tax to support the chavs, and should assist him every way they can!
timewarrior2001
19-01-2006, 21:23
Well the facts are that the guy and more importantly his doctor are not sure if he can ever return to full time employment. He currently works 5 hours a day for 3 days a week to keep under the 16 hours, I'm not sure how you can make a statement and assume he is earning good wages, when in fact he is earning peanuts as an attempt to ease back into work if he can. He feels there is no way in his present condition that he could walk straight into a full time job, and he seems very frustrated by this and the now increased financial burden by his attempts to ease himself off state benefits.
As far as I'm aware, he has made an agreement with his doctor, the benefits office, and the company to make an attempt to try and get his life back to some sort of normailty. If he is unable to succesfully resume his career as an engineer, his employment prospects will be no better than the average chav.
The guy actually made the mistake of returning to his work very shortly after the accident, only after collapsing in his previous place of work did he find out there was far more wrong than he realised.
He is going through the insurance bureau, and has been told due to the complexity of the claim and lack of witnesses it could actually take years to settle the claim.
You say "Who needs the state more" I say the state needs him back in work paying tax to support the chavs, and should assist him every way they can!
Well all I can say is this, if he is working 3 days a week and earning peanuts he's doing himself out of money. I have friends that are civil engineers they earn more in 3 days than I do in a week.
The problem is that if he is claiming incapacity benefit and returns to work, even part time, the incapacity is not stopping him from working, so he is not entitled to the benefit.
life isnt fair, some people get more than others, deal with it, it has happened for thousands of years.
I know of people who deserve benefits and cant get them, these people cant work 3 days a week, yet they still have to feed and cloth themselves and they gfet very little if any help from benefits.
One of them can barely walk, has a stairloift fitted, when they can manage to walk they have to use two stick, their spine is disintegrating, they have arthritis in every joint in their bodies and they have to live on less then £400 a month.
Well all I can say is this, if he is working 3 days a week and earning peanuts he's doing himself out of money. I have friends that are civil engineers they earn more in 3 days than I do in a week.
The problem is that if he is claiming incapacity benefit and returns to work, even part time, the incapacity is not stopping him from working, so he is not entitled to the benefit.
life isnt fair, some people get more than others, deal with it, it has happened for thousands of years.
I know of people who deserve benefits and cant get them, these people cant work 3 days a week, yet they still have to feed and cloth themselves and they gfet very little if any help from benefits.
One of them can barely walk, has a stairloift fitted, when they can manage to walk they have to use two stick, their spine is disintegrating, they have arthritis in every joint in their bodies and they have to live on less then £400 a month.
Not really sure what you are saying, he is actually entitled to the benefit he is receiving whilst working 15 hours for a pittance. the benefits agency have rejected his claim and say they need him to resubmit the forms, they will probably pay him the benefit he is entitled to but they will not backdate the £900 it has cost him due to their incompetence.
You say "life isn't fair deal with it" this guy checked that he could work the 15 hours and they agreed, they have only rejected after the event.
You say "The incapacity is not stopping him from working" but it is, the company has taken him on to help him back into work. He used to work for the company many years ago and everyone wants to se him on the mend.
The issue is not about entitlement, its about the co*k-up with his benefits!
You say people with incapacities are getting less than £400 a month, this guy is the same he said he gets £85 a week. Whilst he is able to walk he is not in any way capable of holding down a full time responsible job in his current state.
I dont understand why you say, working 3 days a week earning peanuts is doing him out of money, when no company is going to take him on in his present condition. So whats the answer, not bother attempting to go back to work and live off benefits for the rest of his life?
This guy is attempting to rebuild his life, and the company is working with him and giving him the opportunity and option to either ease himself back into work or say "No I can't work"
You say "it has happened for thousands of years" I didn't realise the benefits system had being going that long.
I hate nothing more than scroungers, but this guy is making an effort because he wants to work. He is faced with the option of working 3 days a week and being out of pocket for 6 months, or possibly never working again.
TheDaddy
20-01-2006, 00:26
Fair play to the chap for trying, its all to easy to feel sorry for yourself and sit around on benefits, but the moral of this story is, he would have been far better off doing just that and that has to be wrong.
Fair play to the chap for trying, its all to easy to feel sorry for yourself and sit around on benefits, but the moral of this story is, he would have been far better off doing just that and that has to be wrong.
In the short term maybe, but not in the long term (provided he does get back on his feet)
It's not just for people like him that the system is wrong... I know of a guy who was "coerced" back into work (by threats). He was a Carer for his own handicapped child, but they got him work when his child was at school. The moment he earned wages, they ended his Carer status (and paltry payments). He tried to suspend his work during school holidays, so that he could continue his unending support of his child, and the brown stuff hit the fan.... so now all his holiday time is used to continue his Carer responsibilities... and soon he will not have any holiday time due....
.. then who will do it?
zing_deleted
20-01-2006, 01:00
he can and should appeal the none backdating and if its how you have laid out then he will win the appeal
Chrysalis
20-01-2006, 18:22
Looking at the thread about redundancy reminded me to pass on this sorry tale from someone I have been working with recently.
We have a very nice guy who has started working with us part time, he is a very intelligent engineer but has been out of work due to an accident. He was unfortunately struck by a lorry that pulled out in front of him on a dual carraigeway as he was overtaking it, he rolled his car about three times and as a result has suffered some very bad head injuries and has been unable to claim compensation due to the driver being untracable with foreign plates.
He has been receiving some form of incapacity benefit, and decided to look for a company that would give him a chance to gently ease himself back into work. He suffers a little from short term memory loss, and really wanted to join us to see if he could manage a few hours a day for 3 days a week and increase slowly if he was able to. The benefit office said this was OK, but would take anything above £15 a week that he earned back. His travelling for the 3 days is £20 so he's effectively out of pocket before he starts anyway. The benefit office promised that his mortgage interest payments and other benefits would not be affected, after about a month with us they have now refused to accept his claim and have asked for the forms to be re-submitted, he says they will not backdate the claim and it will cost him around £900 in interest payments.
I think its a disgusting way to treat a guy is making the effort to ease himself back into work after an accident that was no fault of his own. If he intended to milk the system and never work again life would be a lot easier, as he says his idea was to try and be stress free whilst easing back into work and become self supporting again.
I dont think the little hitlers at the benefit office are making any efforts to help this guy back to a normal life.:mad:
I am glad you made this public, its this side of incapacity benefit the bbc and other media wont reveal, and the way incapacity benefit is handled is scary.
People will want to return to work as soon as possible but it is high risk, they dont want to lose the security of their income so will need some protection for their benefits as their is a chance the job wont work out and then losing their current claim will be a backwards step. This is a problem that has been around years and still isnt addressed.
---------- Post added at 18:21 ---------- Previous post was at 18:15 ----------
In fairness, and while I do sympathise with this guy, I think it's a bit harsh to say that he is being 'persecuted'.
Unfortunately in this case, the Benefits Agency has rules that it has to work to (which are set up by the DWP, not them) - as a result of these rules, all of these chavs that everyone gets so vocal about stand more of a chance of getting caught if they commit benefit fraud.
not really the problem is benefit entitlement is worked on a broad set of rules that apply to everyone.
for example if you have a undiagnosed illness and are subject to a LiMA medical (computerised) the chances are you will be found fit for work, the claimant cannot even sign of the report to verify its accuracy before its submitted to the DWP and it is used in higher regard then gp's evidence. Their is a list of descriptor's that will treat illnesses with different levels of action so the people who know how to cheat the system can use a method that will rule them disabled without a eyelid lifted. The genuine claimants often will get caught out and this is why a high % of appeals the DWP loses against, since common sense will usually be applied in appeals.
The DWP defenitly need to add manpower so cases can be looked at individually and investigated stop ignoring medical professionals at hospital's etc. and investigate what people called chav's who tar every incapacity claimant with a bad brush.
---------- Post added at 18:22 ---------- Previous post was at 18:21 ----------
upto 16 hours a week and upto a certain wage you can claim and declare.
He's an engineer, he wont be working for peanuts, he will be way above min wage so the system rightly says he doesnt qualify.
This guy is on his way to work, he is earning he has a job.
whilst your average chav is incapable of stringing a sentence together, never mind be able to find a job and earn money.
Who needs the states help more? its a choice, the engineer isnt gonna starve, the chav probably would.
As he does not qualify for benefit payments, he can earn more.
If he didnt take out insurances then quite frankly its tough on him.
As for compensation, his solicitor should have informed him of the motor insurance bureau.
the chav wouldnt starve he would be put on JSA instead.
The system sucks a few jobs ago the companys delivery driver told me he was better of on the dole, he had 5 kids and could save £50 a week if he was out of work.
I felt like puching him.
sadly life is like this I've worked hard for the last 16 years paid my Taxes & NI, I was made redundant through no fault of my own and get the minimum JSA, some little to rag who left school, and sits on there ar$e, never work, and doesn't plan to soon, gets paid more than me, that sucks!
ian@huth
21-01-2006, 00:28
My daughter was in a similar accident on the M25 some years ago. A German lorry pulled out of the slow lane into the centre lane where she was just as she was level with its front wheels andt rolled her car. Even though the police took all the details of the German driver and his employers it took several years for a compensation claim to be paid out. She did get periodic payments to cover such things as Chiropractor bills (Ramrod's friend Julie) though.
A good site to have a look at for anyone having trouble with benefits claims is http://www.rightsnet.org.uk/dc/dcboard.php . This is a site and forums for Benefits claim professionals but the content of the forums is viewable by all.
There are no doubt many stories like this sad one .I suppose rules are rules .What about all the people who are getting away with claiming benefits unlawfully and get away with it .
There are no doubt many stories like this sad one .I suppose rules are rules .What about all the people who are getting away with claiming benefits unlawfully and get away with it .
Personally I would look to inform the relevant department of anyone found to be claiming benefits that they are in no way entitled to. It's those people that take money out of the system that others need to survive.
The most galling thing about the whole benefits system is the length of time it takes to get something in the first place and the unseemly haste with which it all stops. There should be a transitional period between starting work and ending benefits especially with many companies paying monthly what are people to live on in the mean while, let alone getting to and from work.
The rigidity of a computerised decision gives those who abuse the system an easy life. More emphasis should be on transitional payments to assist people into employment rather than a system which only works if you don't. It needs real live persons making real life decisions.
I agree Paul .I dont anyone personally that does this ,but it is well documented in the press .Seems it costs more money to track these offenders down than to pay the money unfortunately
---------- Post added at 11:01 ---------- Previous post was at 10:46 ----------
Angua --totally agree .I am a registered Nusre and still working after 47 years service .Temping fate here but have only been off sick twice
The most galling thing about the whole benefits system is the length of time it takes to get something in the first place and the unseemly haste with which it all stops. There should be a transitional period between starting work and ending benefits especially with many companies paying monthly what are people to live in in the mean while, let alone getting to and from work.
The rigidity of a computerised decision gives those who abuse the system an easy life. More emphasis should be on transitional payments to assist people into employment rather than a system which only works if you don't. It needs real live persons making real life decisions.
Exactly with benefits they will not take into account the month in hand worked by the employee, When I was made redundant they wouldn't start benefits until a month after I was redundant. I wasn't worried myself, but wonder how people living from hand to mouth would manage. I only asked for my NI stamp to be paid after my 6 month JSA because I was in a position to take 6-12 months off work, I was offered travelling costs to interviews and out of principle asked for it after getting loads of hassle from them. I received the amazing sum of £4 and a few pence to cover my travelling costs for a 120 mile round trip, I told them to stick the money where the sun doesn't shine but how would someone living on benefits, especially a single person receiving £40 or so be able to afford to travel to an interview.
The government should put more effort into assisting willing people back into work, and not make it so easy for the professional scroungers. Someone mentioned that the chavs pool knowledge for claiming benefits, in South Wales there are certain charities that advertise and go out of their way to help to people who are seeking asylum claim benefits. In my opinion these charities are being extremely racist, because they are only helping a select audience. I guess its down to public interest, the charity will help one group because they are getting publicity but Joe Bloggs down the road can starve as far as they care.
The bottom line of what I'm trying to say is "Some people are given a head start with benefits" Certain charities help certain groups, and if you dont fit into one of those groups there is a lack of willing people falling over themselves to help you cheat the system.
There is something very wrong with the system I agree
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