View Full Version : *ALL* ntl Cap Discussion (Part 3)
The previous cap thread has got rather long, so time for us to start again...
Summary of what has been said so far:
ntl's terms and conditions for broadband state the following:
20.2 Data Usage
Nobody may use the Internet Services, either directly or indirectly in excess of the usage allowances set out in this section. Our Internet Services are intended for normal recreational or educational use by individuals and families and our pricing and network architecture have been designed accordingly. Customers who exceed the usage allowances applicable to the Internet Services may reduce the performance of the network for other customers.
In the event that you exceed the usage allowances applicable to your Internet Services, we reserve the right (at our sole discretion) to reduce, suspend or terminate your Internet Services. During any period of reduction or suspension, you will remain liable for the payment of your Internet Services charges at the original level. We also reserve the right (at our sole discretion) to re-grade your Internet Services to a different speed and/or usage allowance at the appropriate charge.
The following tables (which will be updated from time to time) set out the download speed, monthly usage allowance and price for ntl's Broadband Internet Services and ntl's Freedom Internet Services:
Broadband Internet Service
(download speed) Monthly Usage Allowance
1Mb- 3GB
*2Mb 30GB
3Mb 30GB
Ntl appear to be now enforcing the usage policy more strictly than previously- a number of members have reported having a letter about their usage - most of these people have been hitting over 100GB per month, although it has not been confirmed what level of data transfer triggers this letter being sent. An example of such a letter is here http://pictures.britxbox.co.uk/articles/big/908043778.jpg [thanks to Phlashman (http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/member.php?userid=11664) for scanning the letter].
Advice regarding bandwidth usage from ntl is available at www.ntlworld.com/bandwidthadvice .
Ntl have also stated that they are launching new packages in the future, including a 10mb product with a 75GB/month usage allowance, and a number of unlimited products. Discussion of 10meg should take place in the thread here (http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33357).
Conclusions from the previous thread: some people are happy with the cap, some are not... so on that note... let the discussion continue :)
dilli-theclaw
25-08-2005, 17:23
Um - I'm happy with things the way they are too.
Chrysalis
25-08-2005, 18:05
Ok I think my original guess of 150gig been the trigger for these letters seems a lucky guess, but dont start downloading 149gig assuming I am right because I may well be wrong.
Another question to ignition or ntl tech's in the know, is how would ntl react to a scenario where everyone on the ubr is under the 75gig cap but using bulk of their traffic around peak time so the ubr becomes laggy and congested at that time.
Will they.
(a) play the BT game tell customers its part and parcel of contention live with it.
(b) do upgrades
(c) decrease caps
This is the problem with a broad cap, a cap eg. of 30gig on peak 150gig off peak is much more effective then a broad cap of 75gig any time, and I still have my concerns, the low cap and massive increase in speed speaks high contention ratios.
nice post Chrysalis, i know what you mean about the trigger for these letters thats why i'm aiming for around 75gigs next month, other isp's have the same approach with these letters - Plusnet being one, stay within these invisible boundaries and you'll be ok untill a HARD Cap is enforced which looks bad for customers when selling a BB service so its not something NTL will do at present.
I also will be downloading during peak times also, where before it was early morning or after 12midnight,but not anymore
and yes there may be a % of heavy users over use over 150 gigs a month but i bet there is even a higher % that use between 30gig to 100gig a month, and i cannot see NTL getting rid of them, thats why the soft cap will increase when they go 10meg, so stay within them limits until NTL enforce a proper hardcoded cap and you'll be fine i bet anything!!
Hello Chris W. I'm not a 'high flying' user; I'm just a septuagenarion dabbler on the basic 300kps package and I average perhaps a gigabyte per month....and most of this, some 5-6 mbs per day, is atrributable to downloads I cannot souce. Is there anyway this pensioner can get, say, a one mb service with the 2 gbs limit without having to pay an arm and a leg. I am pleading poverty....and curiosity to see how superior, and faster service really is ?
HaroldT [77833483]
Hello Chris W. I'm not a 'high flying' user; I'm just a septuagenarion dabbler on the basic 300kps package and I average perhaps a gigabyte per month....and most of this, some 5-6 mbs per day, is atrributable to downloads I cannot souce. Is there anyway this pensioner can get, say, a one mb service with the 2 gbs limit without having to pay an arm and a leg. I am pleading poverty....and curiosity to see how superior, and faster service really is ?
HaroldT [77833483]
Then the 1 meg service with 3 gig limit for 9.99 should do you. :D
Does this 'service' exist on NTL; I've neither heard or read anything about a 1mb package ? Would you know how I could arrange this. I greatly appreciate this information Bill C - you certainly are quick off the mark.
Ht
Does this 'service' exist on NTL; I've neither heard or read anything about a 1mb package ? Would you know how I could arrange this. I greatly appreciate this information Bill C - you certainly are quick off the mark.
Ht
Yes check here http://www.home.ntl.com/icat/broadband
This is brilliant .... does this mean that I can just exchange my Model T 300 kps for for the super new 1 mb without penalty or hassle ?
Ht
theNomad
26-08-2005, 14:54
http://www.home.ntl.com/icat/broadband
wow they actually admit to it having a limit,something that tv adverts,door2door and highstreet canvasers still dont tell you.
:monkey: Cap Wars: Episode III - Revenge of NTL :shocking: :sniper:
Nice to have a fresh cap discussion.So I'll shut up going on about the same old issues,untill we see what happens after the soft caps.I'm affraid Ive probably allready gone over my 30gbs again,still not sure how to check as netlimiter resets stats to Zero on start-up,but I'm really trying to curb my ways somewhat.
This is brilliant .... does this mean that I can just exchange my Model T 300 kps for for the super new 1 mb without penalty or hassle ?
Ht
Just give them a call and explaine what you want. They should tell you what you need to know. But yes you can. One point at the moment on your 300k service you have a monthly limit of 30gig. If you move to 1 meg you will then be limited to 3 gig. However if you only use the small amount that you have quoted then you will be fine.
One mnore silly question,,,,,, who / where do I call....Ht
Many thanks for this info Bill C - I really apprciate your generous help.
orangebird
26-08-2005, 15:14
One mnore silly question,,,,,, who / where do I call....Ht
Many thanks for this info Bill C - I really apprciate your generous help.
0800 052 2000 :wavey:
Many thanks gentlemen, I am now, I gather, on 1mb - 3 gbs but at £17.99. It seems that the offer £9.99 applies only to 'new clients' - and the NTL web site had not been modified to show this. I will now have to learn to work at high speed.
Ht
Getting back on topic again, what about the lower speeds where we probably can't get anywhere near 150Gig a month ? (that's a lot of CDR's!!):p:
I'm on the 1M connection so what would be a trigger point to get a warning at this speed ? Has anyone had one ?
I'm not trying to push my luck but I want to d/l an ISO of a Linux installation package which at 700Mb will take me over my limit for this month and not leave me any usage for the rest of the month.
Currently I'm at 2.4Gigs since 1st August. I use Netmeter (http://readerror.gmxhome.de/) which has cumulative figures for daily, weekly & monthly usage in u/l & d/l streams plus a settable usage alarm figure.
Am I worrying too much about this ? :disturbd:
Should I just go for it to see what happens ? :angel:
BTW
3Gb per month is roughly 100Mb per day which is fine for a light user but once you have 2 computers plus use them a lot for video conferencing it soon gets chomped away at !
well i say if you want more then at least you should go on highest available tier and pay for it. The 1meg service tier should be Hard Capped to stop people taking the **** and paying the lowest rate. Yeah i may have gone over but at least i'm paying highest available price.
sorry if that sounded harsh, wasn't meant to be but everyone moans about leechers and stuff yet people forget that most of these 24/7 leachers probably ain't on the top tier, cos mummy & daddy won't pay more
ian@huth
27-08-2005, 12:28
Getting back on topic again, what about the lower speeds where we probably can't get anywhere near 150Gig a month ? (that's a lot of CDR's!!):p:
I'm on the 1M connection so what would be a trigger point to get a warning at this speed ? Has anyone had one ?
I'm not trying to push my luck but I want to d/l an ISO of a Linux installation package which at 700Mb will take me over my limit for this month and not leave me any usage for the rest of the month.
Currently I'm at 2.4Gigs since 1st August. I use Netmeter (http://readerror.gmxhome.de/) which has cumulative figures for daily, weekly & monthly usage in u/l & d/l streams plus a settable usage alarm figure.
Am I worrying too much about this ? :disturbd:
Should I just go for it to see what happens ? :angel:
BTW
3Gb per month is roughly 100Mb per day which is fine for a light user but once you have 2 computers plus use them a lot for video conferencing it soon gets chomped away at !
The caps aren't rigourously enforced at the moment so you will have no problem downloading your Linux ISO and continuing to use your connection for the remainder of the month. It won't be too long before they do start to enforce the caps though.
I really don't know why people are afraid to say the truth...everyone is claiming that he downloads Linux ISOz, yet only 5% uses Linux/Unix/OS-X/.....etc.... !!!!!!!!!!!
Ok...regarding that bulldog stuff I said days ago....after 1 week of struggling with them, they gave me a call and told me that my line can't go beyond 1Mbit, and when I told them they tested my line when I signed-up like 2-3 months ago...they said it was preliminary test!!!!!!! <<<<<<<<<BS!!!
The CS tried to convince me to stick with them at a lower rate and he said in 2 months we are introducing higher speeds and your line might support up to 4/5 Mbit then...........LOOOOOOLââ ¢â‚¬Å¡Ã‚Â¬Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â¦ÃƒÆ Ã‚Â¢ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¡Ã‚Â¬Ãƒâ šÃ‚Â¦.."There's an old saying in Tennessee ††I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee ††that says, fool me once, shame on ††shame on you. Fool me ††you can't get fooled again." :) This statement President Bush made in 2002 is one of the classic Bushisms of all time.ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â€šà ¬Ã‚ÂÂ
I told him....I already have NTL and I signed up just to test the service so just cancel my account......hopefully they will cancel it cause I heard some talk about them no to do that easily!!!!!!!!
Anyway...the worst experience ever....and did I say RUDE CS also!!!
So if you are looking for another ISP to download XBOX/PS2/MP3/XVID/PSP/GC......look somewhere else and don't bother calling bulldog.......
theNomad
27-08-2005, 15:14
Thats the key matmimi (member.php?u=6967) really I too thought about bulldog (once your on it seems good from the guys I hang around irc with,but its clearly a long journey till they sort new users accounts out so its a long wait)
Untill the future plans of ntl are revealed with the possible unlimited 10mb or some kinda lower speed unlimited service,(surely if you d/l 10gbs or 210gbs theres alot who this will suit as they dont like having to watch their clocks) and if theyre ever gonna go from soft to hardcaps.I'm holding my guns and cutting down on my use a touch,football seasons back now thankfully so I've not as much free time as I had over the last few months so hopefully wont get a letter again.So like most I'm keeping my eyes on this thread to learn whats going to happen.
Chrysalis
27-08-2005, 15:25
there wont be a unlimited 10mbit. They have announced the prices will be static so the unmetered options will be lower speed then the metered options.
well lets hope they sort these unlimited tier or tiers out soon, since my letter i got myself DU METER to monitor whats been downloaded and since 23rd i have downloaded 14.69gigs and thats not what i even call excessive either as the pc wasn't on all day or all night or 24/7, just when it was it was downloading.
23/08/2205 - 1.16gig - less that 1 hour download
24/08/2205 - 128meg
25/08/2205 - 5.62gig - about 5 hours
26/08/2205 - 3.72gig - about 3 hours
27/08/2205 - 4.07gig - about 4 hours
I predict that i will use 20gig a week which falls 5gig over the new 75gig a month cap on the new 10meg connection if i go for speed and watch how much i download or just wait for a unlimited option that allows me to download more.
Nearly 17Gigs in 4 days? What would you call excessive then?
At that rate you will be well over the 5Gigs you think you will be over the cap lol. Don't forget it's a monthly cap not 4 weekly ;)
what you talking about? "well over the 5gigs" ?? - i'm on 3meg - 30gig a month soft cap, and what i'm aiming for during month of September when i'm *supposed* to be monitored is 75gigs as earlier i pointed out i got a letter for 155gig and there is noway i can keep to 30gig so making a point that anybody can download upto 100gigs a month and get away with it as the letters are sent out on a trigger of 150gigs
and i would call excessive is anybody that use's P2P and leave their PC's on 24/7 to do so! - where as mine is 14hours out of 60hours, not what i call excessive! as this has hardly any impact on the service unlike P2P users who constant max out their upstreams and downstreams
Erm I'll clarify what I wrote as you seem to have mistaken what I put in my post ;) You stated that at the rate you are using your connection you would be around 5Gigs over your cap. I pointed out that after downloading 17Gigs in 4 days you would be over the cap by more than 5Gigs. (16.69 divided by 4 = 4.1725, 4.1725 X 30 = 125Gigs ish)
what you talking about? "well over the 5gigs" ?? - i'm on 3meg - 30gig a month soft cap, and what i'm aiming for during month of September when i'm *supposed* to be monitored is 75gigs as earlier i pointed out i got a letter for 155gig and there is noway i can keep to 30gig so making a point that anybody can download upto 100gigs a month and get away with it as the letters are sent out on a trigger of 150gigs
and i would call excessive is anybody that use's P2P and leave their PC's on 24/7 to do so! - where as mine is 14hours out of 60hours, not what i call excessive! as this has hardly any impact on the service unlike P2P users who constant max out their upstreams and downstreams
150 GIG trigger is an assumption, just for the point of asking why do you find it so difficult to keep to the cap? Just wondering dont mean anything by it.....:tu:
maverick
27-08-2005, 19:10
what you talking about? "well over the 5gigs" ?? - i'm on 3meg - 30gig a month soft cap, and what i'm aiming for during month of September when i'm *supposed* to be monitored is 75gigs as earlier i pointed out i got a letter for 155gig and there is noway i can keep to 30gig so making a point that anybody can download upto 100gigs a month and get away with it as the letters are sent out on a trigger of 150gigs
and i would call excessive is anybody that use's P2P and leave their PC's on 24/7 to do so! - where as mine is 14hours out of 60hours, not what i call excessive! as this has hardly any impact on the service unlike P2P users who constant max out their upstreams and downstreams
So let me get this right::
You have had a letter advising you that you have gone over your 30 gig per month limit,so the month your monitored your going do 75 gig and go over the limit again :dozey:
And you think ntl wont do anything about it,ok we will see ;)
mcmanic: go for it!!!!! Download all you want...games/movies/music.....and even *linux isoz* as some weirdo do!!! :D :D
i based my downloads amount on the new 10gig amount not the 30gig (yes i know i shouldn't), but if they can say you can have 75gigs on 10meg when available they ain't gonna kick you of if you download 75gig on 3meg are they? - and if they do well that about sums up NTL don't it
and no NTL won't do anything, why because i haven't or won't have gone over the trigger amount of 100 or 150meg and my download for that month WILL be alot lower (less than half), thus it won't flag up on their system , because to see if i downloaded "X" amount over the limit they will have to send out letters to everyone who has gone 30gig just to see if i have gone over which would upset ALOT more people than the people who use it more. , i believe these letters was a test bed for the new 10meg service and we heavy users was used 1st to test the system is ready for an increased amount of downloading and possible offenders
And if i got a another letter then i'd deny all knowledge of receiving a letter (as they don't send recorded letter or e-mail) and deny anything i know about caps and become a newbie on all things internet and ask them to explain what a cap is as i never signed up for a limited service many years ago, upon which i'll let them go on about the T&C's ect,ect, then i'll just say sorry didn't know and then ask if they have a unlimited service starting soon, and if not then i would say that well i would have to reconsider my services (tv & phone & Internet which cost a fair bit) with NTL as now their services are not what was advertised when i signed up and not what i want anymore, then i would probabaly get a lovely discount for 3 months, lol
and why do i find it difficult to keep with the current 30gig cap, well having 3 kids don't help, lol and a wife who don't like watching what you do, so the PC is one of my main entertainments otherwise i'd go mad, lol - but the 75 gigs is far more acceptable
anyways must dash, got Stargate Atlantis to watch
The 1meg service tier should be Hard Capped to stop people taking the **** and paying the lowest rate. Yeah i may have gone over but at least i'm paying highest available price.
sorry if that sounded harsh, wasn't meant to be but everyone moans about leechers and stuff yet people forget that most of these 24/7 leachers probably ain't on the top tier, cos mummy & daddy won't pay more
Er... I'm not taking the pi**, I just want to learn a bit about Linux and as a one off "large" download it will eat a chunk out of my normal useage. Maybe you people are all set on your own wavelengths so you can't read between the lines of these posts.
I was just wondering if something 'bad' would happen if I'm a few meg over my limit but seeing about how other people seem to be trying to fill out their hard drives instantaneously then I needn't really be worried should I.
(What on earth are they downloading? It really can only be porn can't it! :nono: )
I want to learn about Linux because this crap XP crashes out after a few hours so I can't leave the PC on overnight let alone 24/7 !! :scratch:
By the way, "mummy & daddy won't pay more" er... actually I am a daddy!
A one off download is unlikely to affect your cap. It's the people that are downloading 150 gig a month that will be affected.
Er... I'm not taking the pi**, I just want to learn a bit about Linux and as a one off "large" download it will eat a chunk out of my normal useage. Maybe you people are all set on your own wavelengths so you can't read between the lines of these posts.
sorry, wasn't directly aimed at you! maybe you should read between the lines also!
But there IS plenty of 1meg users who do use their connection 24/7 when they shouldn't, these people are worse then the people who do it on the 3meg simply because they pay less to do so! and still get away with it,
i'm just trying to get across to whoever is reading these cap discussions threads and giving heavy downloaders a hard time that NOT all of us who download alot are uncaring about other people in how we actually use the service compared to those who do 24/7 download using P2P.
I use my net alot, I spend alot of time online as its how me and my gf communicate with family, aswell as entertain ourselves with online games and hobbies.
Hence my internet is being used nearly 24hours a day.
Nothing to do with NTL, but my Grandfather is on Tiscal Broadband and he just had this through email, wonder what NTL's next move will be, lower the price on broadband a bit while giving us 10mb ;)
Its says Unlimited broadband with lower prices :)
Exciting news! As part of our commitment to ensure you're
getting the best deal we're cutting your monthly fee to just
£17.99 a month!
PLUS we're also removing your monthly download usage cap
so you can enjoy unlimited broadband access!
You don't need to do anything, we'll automatically remove your
usage cap in September and reduce your price to £17.99
in October.
https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2005/08/3.gif (https://www.tiscali.co.uk/members/myaccount/upgrade/upgrade.html)
If you prefer, you can upgrade to one of our great value bundle packages, simply login to My Account (https://www.tiscali.co.uk/members/myaccount/upgrade/upgrade.html) to view these new deals guaranteed to save you money.
https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2005/08/4.gif (https://www.tiscali.co.uk/members/myaccount/upgrade/upgrade.html)
Enjoy download speeds of up to 1Mb unlimited broadband and all your local
and national phone calls at any time for one LOW flat fee.
https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2005/08/5.gif (https://www.tiscali.co.uk/members/myaccount/upgrade/upgrade.html)
Enjoy blisteringly fast download speeds of up to 2Mb broadband and all
your local and national phone calls at any time for one LOW flat fee.
We are also changing our Fair Usage Policy to benefit all our customers. This will take effect from mid September and will be referred to in our Terms and Conditions. Find out more about our Fair Use Policy (http://www.tiscali.co.uk/products/broadband/build/tcs/tfu.html).
Kind regards,
The Tiscali Team
Nothing to do with NTL, but my Grandfather is on Tiscal Broadband and he just had this through email, wonder what NTL's next move will be, lower the price on broadband a bit while giving us 10mb ;)
Its says Unlimited broadband with lower prices :)
Also says this
What happens if you are affected by the Fair Usage Policy?
During peak hours, customers affected by the fair usage policy will share bandwidth with each other and will be separated from other customers. The amount of bandwidth available for affected customers to share, will be at least as much as for those customers unaffected by the policy.
The speed affected customers experience when downloading at peak hours will therefore depend on what these customers are doing. If they are all web-browsing and reading emails, they will experience normal broadband speed. If on the other hand they are using Peer to Peer or file sharing software they will experience slow broadband speed. Outside of peak hours, no restrictions will apply.
Which points to the hours between 6pm and 11pm being seriously throttled everyday for people who are seen to be using too much bandwidth.
Also says this
Which points to the hours between 6pm and 11pm being seriously throttled everyday for people who are seen to be using too much bandwidth.
In other words "they give with one hand and take away with the other. " . And i bet that there will those here who put a spin on it to make it look like a fantastic offer and all should change to it :LOL:
Hans Gruber
28-08-2005, 11:27
I wouldn't touch Tiscali if they offered 100mbit uncapped :td:
theNomad
28-08-2005, 13:10
Saxodriver (member.php?u=11528)thats one of the things these "ohh you do more than 30gbs a month you should be ashammed of yourself" people fail to see as they dont have familys maybe it is possible to keep within a 1gb per day limit if your some loner who just uses it to find a mail order lady boy and book justin timberlake tickets,anyone like me with four kids and a partner who actively use the net too,will know its a painfully low cap we all know now-a-days with the amount of free audio-video streaming,skype,game/software demos,webcams and all the premium payper d/l services (ive just signed with an online net service that streams fox-sports nice way to get matches sky dont cover live) even ntl's got a pay-per use download thing now in its downloadplus service thats gonna gbs extra to add to the allready bulky netload (it claims d/l 10,000 music videos 1,000,000 music tracks and 100 games hehe yeah great idea NTL sell people the service of downloading content then get angry at 'em for doing so a month later) its so easy to go over 1gb per day legally.
So I think NTL's fair use policy isnt fair for family's.
Admin Edit (Stuart C): Post edited. See below.
People, please keep the personal comments out of this.
I received the letter everyone is one about on the 22nd August.
I downloaded 172 gig. I am surprised that it was this high, I played a lot of Xbox live!!
August will be under 30gig but i doubt september will, the month i get monitored. No mentoin was made on any preveious month since I have been on broadband, every month is always in excess of 30gig.
But NTL has no facility on showing you usage on say NTLworld customer services. When I use my Xbox I can not use a windows IP traffic logger. My modem is connected into my router. I can't even run it on my PC as 3 PC are connected to the network + wireless laptops, PDA.
Could the letter be sent out to people who download over 150gig to scare them into leaving the NTL network?
Maybe NTL does not want people who download over this amount (irrespective of what other package or phone usage they have). The letter is to saying COMPLY or be suspended (with charge) or downgraded at same price. Has the broadband department looked at what that account spends with NTL each month? I'm sure some have all the packages, sports movies and large phone usage.
Sad PR for a modern technology company, that has the most broadband users - hence some of the largest turnover in telecommunications. It is time for me to leave NTL and not be tempted this time with the upcoming 10meg upgrade package!
BB
:welcome:
What router do you have? If it is compatible you can use something like PRTG (http://www.paessler.com/prtg) to monitor the traffic going through the router.
I've been think about caps lately.
What with webcams, video streaming (like Big Brother), online gaming, P2P (Legite not Kazaa and similar), and others that I cannot think of all these will eat your 75Gb (when it arrives).
I would also like some software that check what i'm downloading, but the ones I've used have one fault, they check all data going through the router, which can cause inacurate readings from the web (I backed up data over my home network in excess of 75Gig. so theres no way to check what you are really downloading.
Is there anything software that works like this it counts what is being received via the web through the router, but ignores traffic over a local network?
see my post just above yours ;)
I used to use PRTG and had it set to monitor the uplink interface on my router.... so it ignored the local traffic :)
well if my download of 172gig is about 512kb line flat out for 24/7.
then my 172gig on a 3meg line is about 6 days flat out of 30 day month.
To me 6 days flat out, out of 30 possible days is exceptable. When you spread taht 6 day usage across the 30 days (maybe not even spread), a companies infrastructure should be able to cope with that.
If I were to download non stop 24/7 on my 3meg line i could manage over 950gig of data.
So i see ADSL offering 2meg unlimited download. so in one month that is 648gig. 1meg 24/7 is 324gig. 512kb=165gig 24/7.
If they offer unlimited they should adhere to it. But companies do state up 2meg rate (maybe peak slow you down - fine).
I still think if NTL want you to manage your download they should provide a means of logging into a user area and seeing your download for that month/week/day, show the user the statistics that NTL can see (or some user friendly page). I hope NTL have up to date live statitics of their broadband users usage?
BB
even at 512k, that is 165GB/month... What would you do with that much data? how would you store it? That is over 1 DVD full per day!
Ntl do have statistics. At the moment ntl are not "hard capping" but warning people who are going miles over their usage- most people who have had letters have exceeded the allowance by about 5 times... surely you can't claim that you didn't know you were going to be over 30gb??
I am confident that if (/when) hard capping is introduced, ntl will provide a means of monitoring usage.
theNomad
28-08-2005, 19:34
<Mod Edit: Chris W> Personal Attack Removed.
I still feel the points I made are worthy of saying,wish you would of actually made a comment about those and the painfully honest fact that a 30gb per month cap for a family with teenagers isnt worth the £25 theyre charging.
Thats just the point Chris W alot of modern things arnt saved to your hdd like streaming or webcam use,modern winamp video streams are 30-70kbs while your watching them,if NTL are happy to sell their broadbandplus package,then why should they be so anti downloading NTL are just one of 1000s of services that offer pay-per view media.
I am limited by my hard disk size and my dvd burner speed.
Really time is what stops me from downloading more.
http://www.newzbin.com/
Praticaly when I am out and working I don't download anything. But when I'm in I just QUE things up and my comp just downloads them. And continues downloading when I am out.
I probably do less then 100gig a month, just that July I was home with injury. A 10meg line would not mean more downloading just faster for what I want.
I would be happy to stay with 3meg.
I would like to know though how many households that are on NTL broadband 3 meg, can move to similar or faster ADSL products. NTL tactfully increase speed as ADSL speeds increase (e.g. 3 meg beats the ADSL 2meg at same price). ADSL is getting faster for more people and NTL bring 10meg line to market (although hype).
But why can NTL not offer unlimited, I don't care about the future products that may be available. They have a problem with me now.
I have been threatened to COMPLY now or face reaction in october, but I am happy to go unlimited now - but it's not part of their package, wise up and and become a proper bussiness.
I have just come back form my hols and found it ammusing that where I was staying had a 10meg line (although each download is limited to 100k/s, you could run say 6 downloads and manage 600k/s). But what was more intersting, on one cable line coming into the flat you had at least 3 different cable operators to buy from (thats called compatition). Not just one monoply compay (some say you have BT but canot get same speed from them), I can't get telewest cos NTL is on my road!
BB
look folks, just admit it, hands up like me we got caught out, then just remember as long as you keep below 75gigs (they not going to kick you off for this amount as 75gigs will be the new 10meg allowance) when they say they are gonna monitor during September (which they don't as its not monitoring as such but a flag system over a certain amount 150gigs), then you'll be fine, and wait for the unlimited option *if they go ahead with it*, its only a few months - if that
look folks, just admit it, hands up like me we got caught out, then just remember as long as you keep below 75gigs (they not going to kick you off for this amount as 75gigs will be the new 10meg allowance) when they say they are gonna monitor during September (which they don't as its not monitoring as such but a flag system over a certain amount 150gigs), then you'll be fine, and wait for the unlimited option *if they go ahead with it*, its only a few months - if that
Hmm... how much of this is fact and how much is presumption?
Chrysalis
29-08-2005, 00:18
I have just come back form my hols and found it ammusing that where I was staying had a 10meg line (although each download is limited to 100k/s, you could run say 6 downloads and manage 600k/s). But what was more intersting, on one cable line coming into the flat you had at least 3 different cable operators to buy from (thats called compatition). Not just one monoply compay (some say you have BT but canot get same speed from them), I can't get telewest cos NTL is on my road!
BB
I have mentioned this a few times, true competition we would be seeing cable operators competing with each other but they are not. NTL have an effective monopoly on the following types of customers, unless you count AOL as effective competition.
People who cannot have a sattelite dish and want premium channels.
People who cannot change their phone socket.
People who cannot have ADSL due to distance or exchange not been enabled.
Most of the people who fall into these categories are probably in rented accomodation where they dont have the freedom to have telecom companies coming in doing work on the cables and sockets.
glitchuk
29-08-2005, 00:19
Just out of interest is the cap so low because bandwidth is costly to NTL or because the network is not adequate to cope with content being downloaded?
Reason I ask is that there are various web hosting companies that offer 330GB of data transfer a month from your web server they host for £5-6. So my paying £38 for 30GB of data transfer seems a little on the low side.
Also why are people who download that bit more than 30GB being treated like they are hammering the network 24/7 by certain people here. I download between 500MB-3GB a day just watching various shows from the US as I don't watch tv anymore. There is no issue with download space as I delete it when I have watched it and I don't flog anything down the pub.
Looking at my stats for the week I average 43Kb/s down and 3.7Kb/s up which I do not consider to be of heavy usage (using ClarkConnect which is very good by the way). I also would have been none the wiser to the "cap" if I had not come on here to post something, where were the letters? (An amendment to the t/c's is not very helpful as I imagine a large number of people clicked past them on the upgrade like I did).
With the advances of the stuff you can download legally (HDTV clips, demo's, game reviews, music and the ever quoted "Linux Distro's" etc) I cannot see how the limits NTL have imposed are realistic. There is going to be more and more content available on the internet and it is going to be larger in file size. The more you surf the more you see there is to download and the closer you come to your limit, kind of takes the enjoyment out of it. Moan over gone to watch the letterbox for an official looking NTL letter.
Chrysalis
29-08-2005, 00:28
The limits themselves defenitly are on the low side as I already stated previously if the limits were imposed as 20:1 contention it would be nearer to a 160gig cap, but their are 3 reasons why I think they are much lower.
1 - They are any time of day caps and as most people use their net in the evenings, unless their is going to be an off peak cap then limits will have to be treated with higher contention in mind.
2 - The contention levels I think are now going to be much higher then 20:1 and ntl seem confident the usage patterns will be low enough for this to not become a problem. Noone has yet responded to my question of what will happen if a ubr hits congestion and noone using it is above the cap.
3 - Profits, lower limit = more overage charges, the previous limit of 30 gig was low but that was just a guideline. I would expect when all this is rolled out the caps will be hard caps and overage charges will be a possiblity.
Ignition
29-08-2005, 00:36
2 - The contention levels I think are now going to be much higher then 20:1 and ntl seem confident the usage patterns will be low enough for this to not become a problem. Noone has yet responded to my question of what will happen if a ubr hits congestion and noone using it is above the cap.
Same as happens now, resegmentation or other upgrades.
Chrysalis
29-08-2005, 01:17
thanks
sleepless
29-08-2005, 03:24
Just a thought, apologies if others have mentioned this (I'm a little ****** ;) ).
If ntl are sending these letters out asking for punters to call in etc. to explain themselves then they should provide a means to monitor their downloads. Failing to do so could lead to ntl being liable to legal ramifications.
How do Mr & Mrs NonTechy with 5 kids who like listening/watching broadband Plus all day monitor their downloads. Do they really want to?
Lots of loop holes here.
Just a thought, apologies if others have mentioned this (I'm a little ****** ;) ).
If ntl are sending these letters out asking for punters to call in etc. to explain themselves then they should provide a means to monitor their downloads. Failing to do so could lead to ntl being liable to legal ramifications.
How do Mr & Mrs NonTechy with 5 kids who like listening/watching broadband Plus all day monitor their downloads. Do they really want to?
Lots of loop holes here.
Yep agree, you would 1st think that they would at leat e-mail you if you go over the soft cap instead of sending through royal mail, after all we all know letters go missing and you may not even know about it :angel: , other companies do,
For me i rather they did hard cap and strictly enforce and have different download limit/unlimited options - why? - because this at the moment is a guessing game, do i go over?, will i get done?, how much can i go over?, how often can i go over?.
There should be some sort of direct link to what you download, a personal webspace/chart and i don't want anything running on my PC via software either, i have enought stuff in my taskbar using up resources and don't need anything else, i don't use the BB software NTL supply and don't want to use any BB usage Monitor, what would they want you to install next - blooming AOL likeness browser?, lol
Yep agree, you would 1st think that they would at leat e-mail you if you go over the soft cap instead of sending through royal mail, after all we all know letters go missing and you may not even know about it :angel: , other companies do,
Like the way that they email you to tell you that your mailbox is over their "high water mark". That always makes me laugh, your mailbox is full but they are just stuffing even more in there! Like that helps you in some way ! ha ha :D
They must have some way to log usage otherwise how would they know who to send letters to. In that case, why can't they let us as the user have access to their data with an online service (via our account details?) to check & do something about our usage before we get way over the top.
Car manufacturers provide a speedo so you know when your going to break the speed limit, it's really just a similar function but at the NTL end of the network.
Also, why can't they follow the mobile phone companies lead and go to pay-as-you-use systems. Something like 1 pence per Megabyte. Then it would really make people take account of their usage.
As a personal curiosity, do the business rates have caps on them ?
Ive been reading the many posts for the last couple of days.
Like a few others I too have had the "letter"
What I want to know is how accurate is NTLs monitoring of the bandwidth usage. When I rang up the "expert" (thats what he told me, he has 8 years IT experiance, unlike my 22 years!!) he couldnt give me an answer.
I only ask as I have been mointoring my usage and yes it does go over the cap.
In fact it goes over what the letter says I used.
When I converted to 2 meg I asked about the cap and was told dont worry its not being implimented until the new year, when there would be announcment.
Its not the new year and theres been no announcement.
maverick
29-08-2005, 15:58
NTL,s monitoring is very accurate.
The reason the letter is showing lower then your actual bandwidth usage is becuase the letter does not show your usage from the postal date.
The cap is being implimented but has been a softcap for sometime.
What I dont understand is that the customer services are allowed to say one thing, and then something else happens e.g the caps.
When the speed was increased and the caps anounced I rang up to leave.
The customer retention people then told me dont worry about the cap.. as ive already said.
Its now a bit of a pain having to cancell phone, broadband, tv etc, and go else where but if thats the only way to get around the cap without doing something illegal then thats what ill have to do.
I think they call it a soft cap for a reason they will enforce it if it is abused :)
Ignition
29-08-2005, 17:05
Ive been reading the many posts for the last couple of days.
Like a few others I too have had the "letter"
What I want to know is how accurate is NTLs monitoring of the bandwidth usage. When I rang up the "expert" (thats what he told me, he has 8 years IT experiance, unlike my 22 years!!) he couldnt give me an answer.
I only ask as I have been mointoring my usage and yes it does go over the cap.
In fact it goes over what the letter says I used.
When I converted to 2 meg I asked about the cap and was told dont worry its not being implimented until the new year, when there would be announcment.
Its not the new year and theres been no announcement.
Wonder who you spoke to who claims to be an expert?
Heh @ the comparing of experience, I'll quite happily tell you it's as accurate as you could wish for to be honest, even with my mere 6 years of experience I can assure you it's bang on if it's coming from the source I think it is.
Worth your remembering that you could see various non-unicast traffic hitting your modem and that'd go on your stats, whereas the measuring systems would only count unicasts and multicasts.
Presumably you're breaking 150GB/month probably either through using the link for business purposes or 'dubious' material, so you've little chance of finding sympathy for your plight here. Whatever the CSR may have informed you the T+Cs are specific.
A 'soft' cap of 30GB/month, if you're doing this 5 times over to be honest you can't be too amazed if you get pulled up on it.
The only definite guide that you can go by is the T+Cs, customer services aren't always the best informed people and certainly shouldn't be taken as gospel on matters like this, major management decisions.
This probably isn't something that was decided on lightly or at a low level, and chances are that CSRs weren't aware of it much before it actually happened, so they may not even have been misinformed, just had out of date information.
If you've had ntl for over a year you certainly have the right to cancel, and may want to consider it in order to find a service more appropriate to your needs.
__________________
What I dont understand is that the customer services are allowed to say one thing, and then something else happens e.g the caps.
When the speed was increased and the caps anounced I rang up to leave.
The customer retention people then told me dont worry about the cap.. as ive already said.
The 1GB/day guideline has been there for years. This was just reiterated by the upgrade. I'm afraid I can't see this as being a point, although it's a bummer you were misinformed the information may well have been correct at the time.
My feelings regarding customer retention aren't something that I'd comment on in public too much, they probably have a list of stuff they have to follow, however I absolutely hate the fact they are there to beg you to stay by any means necessary, yet don't have the tools (a new contract) to make it stick. A 'poopy' job indeed.
The funny bit about what the expert said was "you are allowed to send/recieve 8000 emails." When I asked him what happened if they were large emails did this mean only 4000!! Im afraid he didnt see the funny side. The guys in my office did!!
Ignition
29-08-2005, 17:40
The funny bit about what the expert said was "you are allowed to send/recieve 8000 emails." When I asked him what happened if they were large emails did this mean only 4000!! Im afraid he didnt see the funny side. The guys in my office did!!
Hrm who the *bleep* was this guy? Where did his IT experience come from?
This is a bit scary :)
Wonder who you spoke to who claims to be an expert?
Presumably you're breaking 150GB/month probably either through using the link for business purposes or 'dubious' material, so you've little chance of finding sympathy for your plight here.
For all the people who say you can't go over the cap without using your sevice for business or illegally. Try:
http://www.archive.org/
Your can download dvd's of films that are in the public domain. There are lots of great movies like White Zombie, Reefer Madness, A farewell to arms and many, many more.
rogerdraig
29-08-2005, 20:26
i have watch these threads with interest and find it funny so many like or think caps are ok and that most will be happy with them
personaly i signed up to an unlimited service but thats not my main dislike of caps my main one and one that a lot who havnt complained so far will most likely complain on enmass after this rather unthought out speed upgrade
that will be cost because though unlimited was part of what i and many of my friends and family signed up to the main part was cost i was sold this mainly on the " no need to worry about your bill " side of the sales pitch broadband always on no need to worry about that phone bill
plus i and many of my friends were offered or sold a nice router so we could use it between the family
now if many of you cant see 2 or three kids plus mum and dad useing this service is unlikely to stay under these caps then you arnt living with kids lol
and as many have said its total cost that i will worry about not speed so unless the uncapped services are reasonable they will see lots leave as most of us dont care if a page takes a fews seconds more but we do care if the bill isnt fixed
PC_Arcade
29-08-2005, 21:32
I want to ensure I don't go over 30Gb next month, I've been looking on this thread for what I can actually use to monitor it. PRTG is out of the question 'cos my router doesn't support snmp :( but I ONLY want to monitor up and down traffic from my modem (terayon), nothing from my internal network.
WHAT CAN I USE TO MONITOR MY UPLOADS and DOWNLOADS ??!!
NTL are not playing fair with this, we were promised the tools to monitor our bandwidth usage and once again NTL have failed to deliver.
Also, has anyone heard anything more concrete about these uncapped services? or are these yet another NTL lie to keep customers (in the short term) like the "Power users" lie was?
Chrysalis
29-08-2005, 21:36
If I got a letter the first thing I would do when speaking to ntl is ask for them to provide me with the means to monitor their measurements, if they say no then I will tell them to stop wasting my time with something I cannot keep an eye on.
cookie_365
29-08-2005, 22:54
I want to ensure I don't go over 30Gb next month, I've been looking on this thread for what I can actually use to monitor it. PRTG is out of the question 'cos my router doesn't support snmp :( but I ONLY want to monitor up and down traffic from my modem (terayon), nothing from my internal network.
WHAT CAN I USE TO MONITOR MY UPLOADS and DOWNLOADS ??!!
NTL are not playing fair with this, we were promised the tools to monitor our bandwidth usage and once again NTL have failed to deliver.
Also, has anyone heard anything more concrete about these uncapped services? or are these yet another NTL lie to keep customers (in the short term) like the "Power users" lie was?
How about NetMeter (http://readerror.gmxhome.de/)?
PC_Arcade
29-08-2005, 23:27
Doesn't that just monitor one machine?
PLUS, I can't see any option for ignoring network traffic, looks like that isn't right either
PC_Arcade
30-08-2005, 09:02
Utterly pathetic, I've just spoken to an unhelpful, rude and knowledgeless member of the AUP team and it seems there is NO means for me to monitor my usage. NTL are pathetic, not even BT (who haven't actually started writing to / capping their users yet) give you the means to check.
I'm willing to stay within 30gb, but I fail to see how I can ensure I do so.
I think the best option for me is to just disconnect the modem for the month of september as it's the only way that I as a multi PC household can be SURE not to go over this pathetic "cap".
wot the hell are you guys downloading to go over the limet
Hans Gruber
30-08-2005, 11:06
wot the hell are you guys downloading to go over the limet
PORN!
Well isn't true that we can all go over to the AOL network over NTL lines?
They offer 2meg line unlimited for £29.99 per month.
You do not have to use there software, just their connection. So this is a better offer than NTL and is cheaper?
BB
2 meg unlimited but there T&Cs still state that they can and will take action if they deem that a user is affecting the network. After just dealing with AOL all i can say is come back NTL alls forgiven, AOLs customer service is absolutely diabolical
ian@huth
30-08-2005, 12:10
Well isn't true that we can all go over to the AOL network over NTL lines?
They offer 2meg line unlimited for £29.99 per month.
You do not have to use there software, just their connection. So this is a better offer than NTL and is cheaper?
BBAOL only offer the £24.99 1 Mbps Gold service over NTL cable.
Originally Posted by bbr81
Well isn't true that we can all go over to the AOL network over NTL lines?
They offer 2meg line unlimited for £29.99 per month.
You do not have to use there software, just their connection. So this is a better offer than NTL and is cheaper?
BB
AOL only offer the £24.99 1 Mbps Gold service over NTL cable.
So not cheaper in the slightest :LOL:
Chrysalis
30-08-2005, 17:42
£24.99 unmetered, how is that not cheaper then 30gig metered?
wot the hell are you guys downloading to go over the limet
Read my last post (7 before yours). Totally free, legit dvd downloads :)
cookie_365
30-08-2005, 18:37
Doesn't that just monitor one machine?
PLUS, I can't see any option for ignoring network traffic, looks like that isn't right either
Oops :dunce: !
Next time I'll try to read your post properly before replying ... :(
£24.99 unmetered, how is that not cheaper then 30gig metered?
£24.99 for 1meg and just to say i know 2 ppl who have aol. They absolutly hate it, random disconnects etc etc... dont even compare aol with ntl, there is no comparison lol :D
theNomad
30-08-2005, 19:55
sorry chris w and fellow cf admins/mods,you run a fair site keeping users comments intact,ive had a bummer of a bank holiday period and wrongly took my frustrations out on sections of members here who have different opinions than me.
I have watch these threads with interest and find it funny so many like or think caps are ok and that most will be happy with them
Well most here who defend the cap are people with vested interest in ntl,and would sooner their customers use their connections for surfing websites alone.
AOL only offer the £24.99 1 Mbps Gold service over NTL cable.
I pay £24.99p m on the top of a tv-phone package that boosts it to around the £85pm mark and only get the 1.5mb 30gb cap service <*cough*>hehe not untill they hardcap me,or suspend me when I'll be taking my custom elsewhere<*/cough*> as Ive the old pace box.
Ive spent an average of £1020 per year thats around £4080 over the four highly happy years (mainly at the OK for me unlimited 750k level) not much is it put next to the debt ive read ntl have,but its money all the same & money I'd sooner spend on a service I would be happy with instead of the silly giving with one hand speed increases and taking with the other hand download cap.
On another issue Ive been speaking with an ntl service man about the caps,he mentioned that theres been real problems with people sharing the same ips because a mess up in the manufacture of set-top boxes I think.I'm no tech geek and know its just clutching at straws from my end and is just another anti-cap moan really,but can anyone back if this is the case up and if it would give false readings on users stats ?
I guess untill we have a means of testing what we use over multiple machines our self,then we cant know what we are using.Maybe I'll have to give my kids bedrooms their own 5gb cap limit.I did try with netlimiter but it reset the bloody stats when I turned off and restarted my PC.
On another issue Ive been speaking with an ntl service man about the caps,he mentioned that there's been real problems with people sharing the same ips because a mess up in the manufacture of set-top boxes .
News to me. I have not heard a word about that on any of the meetings i attend. ?
If i am correct the monitoring is not done on the ip anyway.
and just to say i know 2 ppl who have aol. They absolutly hate it, random disconnects etc etc... dont even compare aol with ntl, there is no comparison lol :D
can say that about any isp to be fair, they all have problems at some stage, i used AOL on dialup and never had a prob, i know people on AOL who are more than happy with their service and gloat at NTL capped users at the mo. I cannot wait to get another letter so i can cancel everything then get a NTL engineer back in to reinstall AOL on NTL's network!
I have watch these threads with interest and find it funny so many like or think caps are ok and that most will be happy with them
Well most here who defend the cap are people with vested interest in ntl,and would sooner their customers use their connections for surfing websites alone.
You don't know that. For instance, I have been known to defend the cap, and have no vested interest in NTL. In fact, beyond the fact I am friends with people who work there (and obviously don't want them to lose their jobs), it really wouldn't affect me much if NTL folded.
Apart from that, if I found the Cap caused me problems, I'd be off.
On another issue Ive been speaking with an ntl service man about the caps,he mentioned that theres been real problems with people sharing the same ips because a mess up in the manufacture of set-top boxes I think.I'm no tech geek and know its just clutching at straws from my end and is just another anti-cap moan really,but can anyone back if this is the case up and if it would give false readings on users stats ?
TBH, in all likelyhood, if two machines took the same IP, one (or both) of them would not be able to recieve or send and data (as the routers on the internet would have no way of knowing where to route the data).
I guess untill we have a means of testing what we use over multiple machines our self,then we cant know what we are using.Maybe I'll have to give my kids bedrooms their own 5gb cap limit.I did try with netlimiter but it reset the bloody stats when I turned off and restarted my PC.
Agreed, I think, at the very least, NTL should have a download meter..
rogerdraig
30-08-2005, 21:29
Quote:
I have watch these threads with interest and find it funny so many like or think caps are ok and that most will be happy with them
Well most here who defend the cap are people with vested interest in ntl,and would sooner their customers use their connections for surfing websites alone.
ah those must be very loyal employess or are they board members in disgiuse lol
ntl must have some way to monitor bandwidth once the updates take place, their not idiots (bet someones going to say they are lol). Otherwise ppl could just say how did i know
FrankieX
31-08-2005, 00:27
I'm curious about what level of usage people who got this letter will have to adhere to in order to keep their current package, be moved to a new package and get kicked off altogether.
You would think that getting the monthly total below the trigger for recieving the letters (which may be 150GB) would be enough to keep the current package, simply because NTL seems willing to leave people at that level so far. Would it be fair that someone downloading 151GB in July and 101GB in September would be kicked off their package whilst someone downloading 145GB every month isn't, for example?
Quote:
I have watch these threads with interest and find it funny so many like or think caps are ok and that most will be happy with them
Well most here who defend the cap are people with vested interest in ntl,and would sooner their customers use their connections for surfing websites alone.
ah those must be very loyal employess or are they board members in disgiuse lol
Not an employee and the only vested interest i have is getting the connection i pay for without it being impacted on because someone doesnt beleive in staying inside the cap. The amount of downloading per month some people do is bordering on the ridiculous, but they just got to keep the downloads going! and before someone mentions it, it makes absolutely no difference if its legal downloads or not, and i would hazzard a guess that the majority of 200+gig a month isnt, the cap is there we all know what the cap is so keep within it or go elsewhere simnple really. The i can legally download argument is total ****** yes you can but there is a cap so no you cant deal with it or go find anither ISP that will allow it. That is untill they have the same problems as NTL with the bandwidth being raped by the serial downloaders .. rant over :Yikes: :Yikes: :Yikes: Flame away.....
Chrysalis
31-08-2005, 01:05
I wonder tho, claim 1% are serial downloaders. so
38mbit ubr
200 users
2 users= serial downloaders constant 6mbit if 3mbit downloaders.
there is still a 32mbit allotment of bw on this ubr, so if a ubr does get overloaded then either the ubr has above average serial downloaders (student area's) or they are an easy target to blame.
of course on 10mbit pipes the same 2 users would be sucking up 20mbit and its a much different story.
right now tho I think ntl's biggest problem's are external bandwidth.
rogerdraig
31-08-2005, 02:47
Not an employee and the only vested interest i have is getting the connection i pay for without it being impacted on because someone doesnt beleive in staying inside the cap. The amount of downloading per month some people do is bordering on the ridiculous, but they just got to keep the downloads going! and before someone mentions it, it makes absolutely no difference if its legal downloads or not, and i would hazzard a guess that the majority of 200+gig a month isnt, the cap is there we all know what the cap is so keep within it or go elsewhere simnple really. The i can legally download argument is total ****** yes you can but there is a cap so no you cant deal with it or go find anither ISP that will allow it. That is untill they have the same problems as NTL with the bandwidth being raped by the serial downloaders .. rant over :Yikes: :Yikes: :Yikes: Flame away.....
and you get slow downloads ?
i know many near me download alot of stuff never seems to affect my service in fact not met any one yet with that problem
all the problems i hear about are email and tv stopping breaking up ect
personaly i signed up to an unlimited service knowing at that time i was sharing with another 50 or more people and that we shared that bandwidth
the cap is about trying to charge more not helping you if downloading was a real issue upping the speed as they are doing is insane
and again for alot of us parents the fixed price was what sold us this package and despite the fact you havnt got thousands moaning now
you will see them doing so if bills go back to guess what the bill is this time like we had before broadband
Rillington
31-08-2005, 10:55
I have mentioned this a few times, true competition we would be seeing cable operators competing with each other but they are not. NTL have an effective monopoly on the following types of customers, unless you count AOL as effective competition.
People who cannot have a sattelite dish and want premium channels.
People who cannot change their phone socket.
People who cannot have ADSL due to distance or exchange not been enabled.
Most of the people who fall into these categories are probably in rented accomodation where they dont have the freedom to have telecom companies coming in doing work on the cables and sockets.
I'm one such person. You honestly think I would pay for a telephone line I am forced to have and a TV service which chooses not to put through channels I want to watch if I could ahve Sky? No way.
FrankieX
31-08-2005, 13:20
Just reading the letter posted at the start of the thread, could someone explain what it means "We may temporarily suspend your Broadband service -- you will remain liable for your original monthly Broadband charge"
Does this mean people suspended by NTL will still have to pay monthly for a service they are no longer recieving? And if so can they cancel it, even if their year is not up?
Also what is the situation for 1Mbit users? Presumably some are affected (a quick look on MSCalculator says they have a max monthly download of 240GB). The letter says NTL may drop to a lower speed with higher limit, but are NTL planning a service less than 1Mbit with a higher limit?
Just reading the letter posted at the start of the thread, could someone explain what it means "We may temporarily suspend your Broadband service -- you will remain liable for your original monthly Broadband charge"
Does this mean people suspended by NTL will still have to pay monthly for a service they are no longer recieving?
They'll probably try - but I can't see as NTL have any rights to charge somebody for a service they aren't recieving.
Perhaps if they had put in the letter 'we may charge you for the excess bandwidth' .......:erm:
sorry, wasn't directly aimed at you! maybe you should read between the lines also!
But there IS plenty of 1meg users who do use their connection 24/7 when they shouldn't, these people are worse then the people who do it on the 3meg simply because they pay less to do so! and still get away with it,
i'm just trying to get across to whoever is reading these cap discussions threads and giving heavy downloaders a hard time that NOT all of us who download alot are uncaring about other people in how we actually use the service compared to those who do 24/7 download using P2P.
Hi had to register to reply I'm not sure if there are different 1meg packages on ntl but i'm on 1mb line and have a warning letter as i downloaded 168gb of data, so ok I'm over my limit but according to the letter i recieved my monthly limit is 30gig, but after reading the thread it looks like 1mb should have a 3gig cap
so does anyone know am i on a 1mb/30gig cap or do ntl have no idea about there own services??
as to the quote above 1mb users pay less for slower speed so they are no worse than 3mb users if both are using there line 24/7 as both will go way over there respective caps
maverick
31-08-2005, 13:40
If your on the 1mb package then your bandwidth cap is 3 gig per month.
Thats what this thread lead me to believe but the cap letter i recieved from ntl AUP team states
'You currently subscribe to our 1Mb broadband service, which has a monthly usage of 30GB.'
so i'm confused, can anyone explain
maverick
31-08-2005, 13:55
If thats what your letter states then it is incorrect.
Each package is described HERE (http://www.home.ntl.com/icat/broadband&source=ntlcom_bblink)
So then in that case if I go over 3 gig in September and ntl call me they can't do much as the warning letter states 30gig.
if they don't even know abouth there own services how can they enforce a cap on me when i stay under 30gig, as i've done just what they ask of me
Well I just checked my bill and I pay £24.99 form 1mb line
so either Ntl are ripping me off, or I'm on 1mb line but being charged £24.99 for 30gig cap, Just phoned a friend who has same 1mb for £24.99 mystery package
I'll stick to 30gig in September and see if they phone.
DieDieMyDarling
31-08-2005, 14:53
LOL. Another case of ntl not even knowing their own rules.
__________________
Not an employee and the only vested interest i have is getting the connection i pay for without it being impacted on because someone doesnt beleive in staying inside the cap. The amount of downloading per month some people do is bordering on the ridiculous, but they just got to keep the downloads going! and before someone mentions it, it makes absolutely no difference if its legal downloads or not, and i would hazzard a guess that the majority of 200+gig a month isnt, the cap is there we all know what the cap is so keep within it or go elsewhere simnple really. The i can legally download argument is total ****** yes you can but there is a cap so no you cant deal with it or go find anither ISP that will allow it. That is untill they have the same problems as NTL with the bandwidth being raped by the serial downloaders .. rant over :Yikes: :Yikes: :Yikes: Flame away.....
But the facts seem to say that people AREN'T being affected by other users yet. As pointed out below, if the figures from ntl are correct (1% of users hammering the service), then the UBR shouldn't be affected to the point of other users losing speed.
Also, ntl themselves are in the middle of setting up unlimited services, so clearly it can't be damaging the networks that much, if they're going to actually sell a product based on unlimited downloads.
but i'm on 1mb line and have a warning letter as i downloaded 168gb of data,
and this is where you should be penilized more than say me, my usage was 155gigs on 3megs which in theory meant i downloaded 3x quicker than you so used up less broadband time leaving the network free for other people and you didn't and paid less. I think i'll downgrade!
but surely the point is anyone who goes over the cap should be penalised regardless of how quick they manage to download i would gladly pay what you pay and stay on the 1mb line if i can download 155gig without breaking the AUP
BTW who's to say you downloaded 155 gig quicker than i did anyway
just worked it out to see as I know my pc is on 24/7, during July i downloaded on average 5.41 gig a day half my maximum speed, so if i were on a 3mb line I could download 15gig in the same 24 hours at half speed so which one puts the most load on the network
even if you stop sooner than me for the time you are downloading you will put more load on the network
slowcoach
31-08-2005, 18:49
Well I just checked my bill and I pay £24.99 form 1mb line
so either Ntl are ripping me off, or I'm on 1mb line but being charged £24.99 for 30gig cap, Just phoned a friend who has same 1mb for £24.99 mystery package
I'll stick to 30gig in September and see if they phone.
Perhaps it's a new tier, 1Mbs 3GB = £17.99 and 1Mbs 30GB = £24.99, just a thought.
PC_Arcade
31-08-2005, 19:00
Well, after the way that I was treated by the AUP team when I phoned them, I've decided enough is enough. NTL have lied (Power Users? :lol: and I'll believe unmetered when I see it), changed terms to screw their own customers over (I signed up for an unmetered) and been rude to me on the phone, so screw them, I've just ordered a BT line so I have a choice of ISP's, they may not be as fast (at the moment), but at least i'll be able to change suppliers when / if I have problems.
thats true i'll see once i go over 3 gig if they phone or not, i can live with 30 gig for £24.99 means i'm paying extra £15 for 27 gig, just seems odd they didn't ask me first
Oh wait a minute this is NTL were talking about my BB email has never worked but my NTL email account from the odd pre 2000 free dial up account (anyone remember) still works #true story#
so i'm not really suprised
I rang earlier to night to cancel my phone line and tv package. I couldnt because customer services carnt cancel. You have to ring another line..It shuts at 5.00.
Chrysalis
31-08-2005, 23:23
their is congestion on a few of ntl's peers where external traffic is pumped into the network and it is happening every night, however they look very heavily congested to the point that if the top few % of users didnt exist they would still be congested.
theNomad
01-09-2005, 14:03
Not an employee and the only vested interest i have is getting the connection i pay for without it being impacted on because someone doesnt beleive in staying inside the cap. The amount of downloading per month some people do is bordering on the ridiculous, but they just got to keep the downloads going! and before someone mentions it, it makes absolutely no difference if its legal downloads or not, and i would hazzard a guess that the majority of 200+gig a month isnt, the cap is there we all know what the cap is so keep within it or go elsewhere simnple really. The i can legally download argument is total ****** yes you can but there is a cap so no you cant deal with it or go find anither ISP that will allow it. That is untill they have the same problems as NTL with the bandwidth being raped by the serial downloaders .. rant over :Yikes: :Yikes: :Yikes: Flame away.....
I understand why ntl & their employee's are pro caps,theyre in it for the money but someone whos happy to get what most likely will be the same package (in your case speeds where bad,even though by the sounds of it everyone else is happy with their speeds) but capped amount for what you was getting uncapped is just stupid sounding to me.
Basicly your an anti anyone whos not a lone user,like ive bashed my head against the wall more than once here,that slight speed decrease you are having is probably you live in a family area and not like you say serial downloaders.I understand your frustraitions but surely you must understand the ntl package is aimed at familys who like me have various computers in their bedrooms.Theyre more than happy to charge me for disney even though I don't have sky movies at an extra £6 per month and I get full cartoon package ontop of that,they cant be happy with familys for their cable yet not net services surely.
I can't see how you Doofy or other none ntl employees actually gain from being pro cap anyway.Everyone whos unhappy will move on (allready happening and as the soft to hard cap goes on maybe this will rocket even more so as the ntl salesteam cant keep selling new packages for,I'm sure once theyre marketing the capped package clearly interest will plumet even quicker)
So now your slightly slowed down speed gets better,yet what the hell you gonna use your new found speed for when your capped,1mb doesnt take long to reach 3gbs & 2-3mbs doesnt take long to reach 30mbs.And as numbers who are subscribing to whole packages take their custom elsewhere your bill will surely rise.
How are you gaining exactly,ohh that google page opens a second or two quicker.Because thats all that your package could be used for websurfing.
Maybe a bright idea by ntl would be to lower peoples cost who only surf down so its inline with other cheap entry level net packages around £15pm,a nd leave their existing happy not knowing what mumbo jumbo is in the T&C's happy.Unless they wanna start hearing the deafening sound of large numbers of its users playing Bob Marley's Exodus.
slowcoach
01-09-2005, 18:45
The †œBloke in the Pubââ‚ ¬Ãƒâ€šÃ‚ is in hospital for a new liver so forgive me if I have to fall back on the †œRumour Millââ‚ ¬Ã‚ÂÂ.
Latest word from the †œRumour Millââ‚ ¬Ã‚ÂÂ:
Uncapped tiers will be available before next Christmas.
No other information regarding speeds etc. at this time.
The †œBloke in the Pubââ‚ ¬Ãƒâ€šÃ‚ is in hospital for a new liver so forgive me if I have to fall back on the †œRumour Millââ‚ ¬Ã‚ÂÂ.
Latest word from the †œRumour Millââ‚ ¬Ã‚ÂÂ:
Uncapped tiers will be available before next Christmas.
No other information regarding speeds etc. at this time.
So not this Christmas. Know i have heard of edging your bets but that has to take the record.
:LOL:
slowcoach
01-09-2005, 19:54
So not this Christmas. Know i have heard of edging your bets but that has to take the record.
:lol:
Just to clarify it's Christmas 2005. Which in Oldham is next Christmas or this Christmas however you want to say it :p:
Just to clarify it's Christmas 2005. Which in Oldham is next Christmas or this Christmas however you want to say it :p:
:LOL:
Thats what this thread lead me to believe but the cap letter i recieved from ntl AUP team states
'You currently subscribe to our 1Mb broadband service, which has a monthly usage of 30GB.'
so i'm confused, can anyone explain
I am wondering whether there is a typing error on the web site. They have typed 3GB instead of 30GB.
It is so misleading and annoying when a company gets its information wrong either by misinterpretation or laziness because whoever is responsible does not bother to proof-read the letter stating the AUP or check the website.
With the BBC considering streaming either BBC1 or BBC2 over the internet next year and the BBC iMP trial which I believe is using p2p, this will put a greater demand on the internet.
I believe that there should be a package where you pay a basic price for your broadband connection and then pay extra for a varied range of download options. One cannot expect something for nothing. There is a cost involved whatever one does. Maybe one of the options should be for family use because I can sympathize where each family member wants to use the internet. You can get squabbles because 'Johnny' wants to use the pc and 'Sarah' wants to use the pc at the same time so they have their own computers and want to download material etc.
Well I just checked my bill and I pay £24.99 form 1mb line
so either Ntl are ripping me off, or I'm on 1mb line but being charged £24.99 for 30gig cap, Just phoned a friend who has same 1mb for £24.99 mystery package
I thought the broadband tiers were as follows:
Tier 1: 128kbps uprated to 150kbps uprated to 300kbps uprated to 1MB at £17.99 currently.
Tier 2: 512kbps uprated to 600kbps uprated to 750kbps uprated to 2MB at £24.99 currently.
Tier 3: 1Mbps uprated to 1.5Mbps uprated to 3Mbps at £37.99 currently.
What other packages are there?
Michael
Chrysalis
01-09-2005, 21:54
Not an employee and the only vested interest i have is getting the connection i pay for without it being impacted on because someone doesnt beleive in staying inside the cap. The amount of downloading per month some people do is bordering on the ridiculous, but they just got to keep the downloads going! and before someone mentions it, it makes absolutely no difference if its legal downloads or not, and i would hazzard a guess that the majority of 200+gig a month isnt, the cap is there we all know what the cap is so keep within it or go elsewhere simnple really. The i can legally download argument is total ****** yes you can but there is a cap so no you cant deal with it or go find anither ISP that will allow it. That is untill they have the same problems as NTL with the bandwidth being raped by the serial downloaders .. rant over
Well I got a thoery that if ntl booted all the users breaking 30gig we would still be congested in the evenings be it less congested but still congested. NTL would be left with congestion but lower turnover.
Well i've been with NTL since 512 was fastest speed I went from 512-1mb-1.5-750-1mb again
downgraded from 1.5 because i didn't want to use the silver stb
so that could explain my mystery package but my bill does say 1024 connection £24.99
this will be my argument when they say i should only download 3gb a month, then i want a refund £15 a month back till when the cost started being £9.99
I have no intention of monitoring my bandwidth during September so I'm sure they will call
__________________
What i don't understand is if (because i got a letter) I'm the cause of congestion in my area why do i always get full speed surley the other people sharing with me would sometimes get full speed and i would notice a drop, but i never do, its not like i get download priority
for example if i download 1 file and I get full speed if i then download a 2nd file at same time the connection is shared the 1st file does not get priority.
or have i missed the point (quite possible) if so can someone explain
slowcoach
01-09-2005, 23:54
Well i've been with NTL since 512 was fastest speed I went from 512-1mb-1.5-750-1mb again
<snip>
It's probably nothing to do with you degrading other local users, ntl probably think you are taking the *iss by the amount you download, simple as that.
Just cut back until the waters settle, or expect the contractors to come and rip out your cable ;)
nemesis01
02-09-2005, 09:16
i downgraded my service shortly after getting my letter to the 2mb package, and have capped my download speeds so i will only be downloading about 1/8th of what i was before, that is until new unmetered arrives, i can live with it for now.
Well i've been with NTL since 512 was fastest speed I went from 512-1mb-1.5-750-1mb again
downgraded from 1.5 because i didn't want to use the silver stb
so that could explain my mystery package but my bill does say 1024 connection £24.99
this will be my argument when they say i should only download 3gb a month, then i want a refund £15 a month back till when the cost started being £9.99
I have no intention of monitoring my bandwidth during September so I'm sure they will call
__________________
What i don't understand is if (because i got a letter) I'm the cause of congestion in my area why do i always get full speed surley the other people sharing with me would sometimes get full speed and i would notice a drop, but i never do, its not like i get download priority
for example if i download 1 file and I get full speed if i then download a 2nd file at same time the connection is shared the 1st file does not get priority.
or have i missed the point (quite possible) if so can someone explain
Your 750k connection would have been upgraded to 2meg, but if you don't have a samsung box this is why it is gone to 1meg instead. The package is 1meg with 30gb usage, and is a temporary package option, until you contact ntl to arrange installation of a samsung box for the 2meg package, or downgrade to 1 meg with a 3gb cap (17,99) . However, if 1meg 30gig cap suits you then why not leave it like that :p:
30GB is way too low for a cap in todays modern world.
legitimate content include;
HTTP Surfing, FTP, email, Video streaming (Shoutcast TV, Winamp Videos, MTV videos, movie trailers, game trailers), Linux DVDs, Music download services (Itunes, Napster, Virgin, HMV), Voice over IP, webcams, remote office working, Xbox Live, multiple PCs, distant relatives wanting the video of your summer holiday, managing your NTL web site, future services like BBC1/2 streaming, BBC TV Archive, enhanced mapping services (Google earth streams from the web). Bandwidth becomes even more precious when you have a family of 4/5/6 all with PCs....
It just seems too easy to get near or break the 30GB cap. Especially as that 3MB Itunes file will actually eat more than 3MB into your cap. You could probably add 10-20% onto that figure to allow for all the various network elements (MAC/IP/TCP headers/frame acknowledgements) to get that 3Mb 'payload' to your PC. You could take 10-20% off of that 30GB limit and say that that is your actual usable data allowance.
I don't mind capping but the levels should be set at a fair amount. Even VoIP uses approx 1.3MB a minute at G.711 codec. How many minutes does your household spend on the phone a month? It is the simple things that can eat into your allowance and at present I have no idea what I use...
just my 0.02......;)
__________________
This is a list of game demos posted on gamespot over the last month...interesting amounts of data.....I am glad I am not a game junkie..
bet on soldier: blood sport single-player demo (download bos_sp_demo_setup.exe now!)
from kylotonn / 553.9mb / posted: 02-sep-2005
blitzkrieg 2 single-player demo (download bk2_singleplayer_demo.zip now!)
from nival interactive / 272.9mb / posted: 02-sep-2005
starship troopers demo (download starshiptroopersdemo.zip now!)
from n/a / 461.0mb / posted: 01-sep-2005 / 17,732 downloads
fifa 06 demo (download fifa06demoen.exe now!)
from ea canada / 219.0mb / posted: 31-aug-2005 / 8,153 downloads
ultima online: mondain's legacy client (download uoml_setup.exe now!)
from electronic arts / 779.7mb / posted: 30-aug-2005 / 352 downloads
gods: land of infinity demo (download gods_loi_demo.exe now!)
from cypron / 271.1mb / posted: 30-aug-2005 / 1,756 downloads
nhl 06 demo (download nhl06demo.exe now!)
from ea canada / 279.7mb / posted: 29-aug-2005 / 5,376 downloads
delaware st. john volume 1: the curse of midnight manor demo (download dsjv1demo.exe now!)
from bigtime games / 139.1mb / posted: 26-aug-2005 / 1,018 downloads
myst v: end of ages demo (download mystvdemo.exe now!)
from cyan worlds / 276.4mb / posted: 23-aug-2005 / 19,863 downloads
dark age of camelot 14-day trial (download daoc_14-day_trial_setup.exe now!)
from mythic ent / 1.9gb / posted: 22-aug-2005 / 13,950 downloads
nibiru: age of secrets demo (download nibirudemoen1-2.exe now!)
from future games / 143.0mb / posted: 19-aug-2005 / 8,039 downloads
squad assault: second wave demo (download saswdemo.exe now!)
from freedom games / 122.5mb / posted: 18-aug-2005 / 4,602 downloads
myst v: end of ages demo (mac) (download myst_v_demo.sitx now!)
from cyan worlds / 468.2mb / posted: 18-aug-2005 / 863 downloads
land of legends demo (download lol_setup_demo.exe now!)
from tiny hero / 68.5mb / posted: 17-aug-2005 / 1,257 downloads
gt legends demo (download gtlegends_demo.exe now!)
from simbin / 269.0mb / posted: 17-aug-2005 / 20,041 downloads
the star and the crescent demo (download tsatcdemo.zip now!)
from prosim / 48.6mb / posted: 16-aug-2005 / 784 downloads
PC_Arcade
05-09-2005, 10:09
I have now cancelled everything but the TV (which I was offered so cheaply I couldn't afford NOT to keep it!), the retention department person who I spoke to seemed genuinely concerned about the way I was treated by the AUP team, hopefully it'll get communicated back and they will learn some manners (although I doubt anything will change :( ).
Strangely NO mention was made of upcoming uncapped services, which I find odd as it would be a way to keep customers who state the cap as a reason for leaving, which leads me to believe the uncapped services ARE a lie (or a LONG way off).
It's much better for me though, i'll save money as I was on 3mb and I will actually have the option to CHANGE when / if I'm unsatisfied with my ISP. NTL need to wake up and realise that BT are NOT their only competitor.
It's a shame really, i've been with NTL for 7 years and they've gone from being the best ISP by a country mile to one of the worst :(
orangebird
05-09-2005, 12:47
Utterly pathetic, I've just spoken to an unhelpful, rude and knowledgeless member of the AUP team and it seems there is NO means for me to monitor my usage. NTL are pathetic, not even BT (who haven't actually started writing to / capping their users yet) give you the means to check.
I'm willing to stay within 30gb, but I fail to see how I can ensure I do so.
I think the best option for me is to just disconnect the modem for the month of september as it's the only way that I as a multi PC household can be SURE not to go over this pathetic "cap".
What about dumeter?
i've been with NTL for 7 years and they've gone from being the best ISP by a country mile to one of the worst :(
i've been with them longer and even due to these letters wouldn't call them one of the worst TBH, infact i've never had any probs in all them years so at present willing to lower my usage for September (am doing ok atm also, but finding it very hard not to download something, lol). If nothing appears about the unlimited services that was announced (i think they will) then i too will be forced to leave i think, because at the moment this watching of my interent usage is driving me nuts just like dailup days!!, there is no way me and my family can stay within 30gig a month at present if we wasn't watching are usage.
Personally i waiting for 10meg with 75gig ATM and gonna see how that goes before i make my final decision.
astra_lestat
05-09-2005, 14:49
Personally i waiting for 10meg with 75gig ATM and gonna see how that goes before i make my final decision.
Same here. Although, I hope they will do the same for 2M connections as well, since I have no use for 3M speed. Otherwise I will be forced to leave as well :(
I don't want to though.
Chrysalis
05-09-2005, 16:39
I have now cancelled everything but the TV (which I was offered so cheaply I couldn't afford NOT to keep it!), the retention department person who I spoke to seemed genuinely concerned about the way I was treated by the AUP team, hopefully it'll get communicated back and they will learn some manners (although I doubt anything will change :( ).
Strangely NO mention was made of upcoming uncapped services, which I find odd as it would be a way to keep customers who state the cap as a reason for leaving, which leads me to believe the uncapped services ARE a lie (or a LONG way off).
It's much better for me though, i'll save money as I was on 3mb and I will actually have the option to CHANGE when / if I'm unsatisfied with my ISP. NTL need to wake up and realise that BT are NOT their only competitor.
It's a shame really, i've been with NTL for 7 years and they've gone from being the best ISP by a country mile to one of the worst :(
Well I hope it isnt a lie as that is by no means the way to treat customers, the problem I got is I want to see how things go before taking any action but I will probably have to upgrade to £37.99 to get a decent cap whilst I wait for these unmetered packages, I feel £37.99 is very expensive for 75gigs of traffic. I would be suprised if the cap at the stage 10mbit is rolled out is still a soft cap.
Theres a lot of heated debate on what and how much people download. Isn't the real issue WHEN the download takes place? If someone is downloading a large amount of data in the wee small hours - does it really matter?
However if every ntl user decides to hit the web and surf at the same time wouldn't that bring the network to its kness- yet no-one would be breaking their cap!?
Chrysalis
05-09-2005, 17:00
Theres a lot of heated debate on what and how much people download. Isn't the real issue WHEN the download takes place? If someone is downloading a large amount of data in the wee small hours - does it really matter?
However if every ntl user decides to hit the web and surf at the same time wouldn't that bring the network to its kness- yet no-one would be breaking their cap!?
Fully accurate in my view, but these points remain unaddressed.
agree,and all my downloads from now on will be during peak hours,
PC_Arcade
06-09-2005, 08:29
What about dumeter?
Who cares?? I'm off, to ADSL land where I don't have to monitor every byte in and out of my house and if it's changed so I have to I can change ISP's
The AUP team were so rude to me that they lost any chance of keeping me as a customer, I was TRYING to get some help to stay within the guidelines, but in all honesty it's pointless, there are plenty of ISP's with no / high limits where I wont have to.
I've always been put off by the £75 BT want to fit a line, but the saving i'll make on not having to pay £37.99 (I was on 3mb & ADSL is significantly cheaper - though slower) will make that back in ~6 months.
I hope enough customers leave and FORCE NTL to re-think this utterly stupid cap, it's unfair for a company to punish its customers due to it's own ineptitude. Is it the customers fault if NTL can't manage their network properly? No & yet all the burden seems to be on the customer to keep the network within its limits.
DieDieMyDarling
06-09-2005, 11:01
What about dumeter?
Is dumeter free? Or do Ntl offer it free, as part of the service now? Or maybe you expect customers to pay for their own software, to monitor a useage limit which ntl introduced, without the means to let their customers monitor it?
Kaychsea
06-09-2005, 11:22
I hope enough customers leave and FORCE NTL to re-think this utterly stupid cap, it's unfair for a company to punish its customers due to it's own ineptitude. Is it the customers fault if NTL can't manage their network properly? No & yet all the burden seems to be on the customer to keep the network within its limits.
Isn't the cap an attempt to manage it's network properly? Damn them for trying to shift to an equitable charging regime!!
Bye bye.
__________________
30GB is way too low for a cap in todays modern world.
...
I don't mind capping but the levels should be set at a fair amount. Even VoIP uses approx 1.3MB a minute at G.711 codec. How many minutes does your household spend on the phone a month? It is the simple things that can eat into your allowance and at present I have no idea what I use...
I appreciate your point, but the problem is who decides what is fair? 30Gb may well be an inappropriate cap for some, I don't get near that, but it might well be a fair cap for the provider at that price point.
PC_Arcade
06-09-2005, 12:19
Isn't the cap an attempt to manage it's network properly? Damn them for trying to shift to an equitable charging regime!!
Bye bye.
No, the cap is the punishing of customers because NTL CAN'T manage their network properly,if it was about being equitable, then surely they would provide higher limits off peak to try and avoid congestion at peak times, rather than just limiting everyone to 30Gb?
I appreciate your point, but the problem is who decides what is fair? 30Gb may well be an inappropriate cap for some, I don't get near that, but it might well be a fair cap for the provider at that price point.
30Gb in this day and age is nothing much IMHO, The latest full distribution (32 & 64 bit) of Suse Linux is 9.4 Gb, or 1/3 of your limit with one download :lol:
30Gb @ £37.99 (£1.26 per Gb) for NTL compared to
500Gb @ £24.99 (£0.04 Per Gb) for UKonline or unlimited for £24.99 (0.00 Per Gb) (bulldog, pipex, demon) etc
I can't see how £1.26 per Gb compared to the either of the above is a "fair cap at the price"
rogerdraig
06-09-2005, 12:26
[QUOTE=Kaychsea]Isn't the cap an attempt to manage it's network properly? Damn them for trying to shift to an equitable charging regime!!
Bye bye.
__________________
nope its just yet another example of british companies trying to charge us more than any one else
theNomad
06-09-2005, 15:39
Hey see ya pc-arcade hope ya happy where you move too,no need to disrespect customers who have been using their service for as long as you.
30Gb @ £37.99 is shocking,just speaking with one of my net hang outs swedish members hes rolling on the floor thinking I'm making it up.
Surely theres some kind of govening body who stop companys over charging,like all the news reports on cd price fixing and how we live in rip off Britain.
Someone who I know online told me about this
"Brand-new Internet service provider Be Unlimited is on the verge of launching a 24Mbit/s broadband service - the fastest in the UK and triple the speed of the current leading competitor. Based on ADSL2+ technology (doubles the download bandwidth) and thanks to LLU (Local Loop Unbundling), Be Unlimited's new service should help to give the UK's broadband market a much-needed shake-up. The rollout will start in London, quickly expanding to the rest of the UK, according to the company."
I'm gonna stick it out hopefully ntl's current letters and scare tactics are as shallow as the ones we got 2 years ago and nothing else will happen,theyre also still not clearly pointing out its a capped service when advertising,if not maybe services like that be-unlimit one could prove a ray of light.
After trying for nearly a week to get through to the disconnections part of NTL. "We only work 9 to 5"!!! So do most other people..
I finished work early today. Managed to speak to somebody about stopping my phone and tv at 4.40. (leaving the broadband until the phone is connected).
When I explained that I wanted to close my account the person on the phone took the details and put me on hold. When the phone was picked up again (now 4.55) the person asked for my details again, so like a good customer I gave them over. She then asked me what I wanted. I explained that I had already given my details once and had allready told somebody I wanted to leave. This new person then went on to say I had rang the wrong number and gave me the "correct" number. When I calmed down after counting to 10 I explained that I had rang that number, been put on hold and I guess transfered to the normal help line. Not best pleased. I did ask if this was a ploy to make it as hard as possible to stop my account. The person I was speaking to was then able to stop cancel my account as it had now gone five and the other line was closed.
So after, I carnt remember how many years, since nynex and cable and wireless Im back with BT.
So long and thanks for the cap
Kaychsea
07-09-2005, 16:18
No, the cap is the punishing of customers because NTL CAN'T manage their network properly,if it was about being equitable, then surely they would provide higher limits off peak to try and avoid congestion at peak times, rather than just limiting everyone to 30Gb?
30Gb in this day and age is nothing much IMHO, The latest full distribution (32 & 64 bit) of Suse Linux is 9.4 Gb, or 1/3 of your limit with one download :lol:
30Gb @ £37.99 (£1.26 per Gb) for NTL compared to
500Gb @ £24.99 (£0.04 Per Gb) for UKonline or unlimited for £24.99 (0.00 Per Gb) (bulldog, pipex, demon) etc
I can't see how £1.26 per Gb compared to the either of the above is a "fair cap at the price"
I thought you were off?
How can NTL be punishing people by providing a particular service and charging what they think the market will bear? If they are wrong folk will leave to find other providers and they'll adjust their strategy. If they don't then they will go out of business. It's not like the board are falling off their chairs with laughter at the caps having lured innocent grannies in off the street, is it?
You don't know what the economics of the provision of the service are so you don't know how sustainable the other deals are, but as you point out there are more attractively priced packages for what you want, so why are you complaining? Would it not make more sense for you to sign up to these great deals and come back and gloat at the rest of us? Or is it the moaning that you get off on?
It's one thing to complain about a service that doesn't work, or you haven't had any warning about changes to. It's another to complain up to the wire that what's coming isn't fair and how much better other deals are if you don't get on your bike and take advantage of them. The infractructure costs that left all of the cable companies near bankruptcy and huge debts are beginning to payt off, but the debts are still there and they are corporate entities, in it to make money, for themselves and shareholders, not to hand out freebies.
I thought you were off?
How can NTL be punishing people by providing a particular service and charging what they think the market will bear? If they are wrong folk will leave to find other providers and they'll adjust their strategy. If they don't then they will go out of business. It's not like the board are falling off their chairs with laughter at the caps having lured innocent grannies in off the street, is it?
You don't know what the economics of the provision of the service are so you don't know how sustainable the other deals are, but as you point out there are more attractively priced packages for what you want, so why are you complaining? Would it not make more sense for you to sign up to these great deals and come back and gloat at the rest of us? Or is it the moaning that you get off on?
It's one thing to complain about a service that doesn't work, or you haven't had any warning about changes to. It's another to complain up to the wire that what's coming isn't fair and how much better other deals are if you don't get on your bike and take advantage of them. The infractructure costs that left all of the cable companies near bankruptcy and huge debts are beginning to payt off, but the debts are still there and they are corporate entities, in it to make money, for themselves and shareholders, not to hand out freebies.
:tu: :tu:
Always-on connection sales blurb
untill you reach 30 gig then no longer always on, how does that work
and as for leaving I'm sure a lot will but while they provide the service i orignally signed up for I will use it as i wish untill i'm pushed.
why go through the hassle of sorting out a new connection untill I have to, as for people moaning about wanting a better service so they are applauding NTL for eliminating the Bandwidth abusers Wake up and smell the corporate coffee this is about NTL wanting bigger profits and in no way linked to an improved quality of service
if you don't believe me wait untill September when anyone who got a letter (myself included) and didn't take any notice is thrown off the network, and any problems you may be having remain.
BTW has anyone here actually been a victim of a heavy downloader and not just NTL's poor service
before anyone starts saying then why don't you leave my answer because my service has been ok and I'm too lazy, I'm the leech waiting to be picked off.
At least I'm honest
DieDieMyDarling
07-09-2005, 17:54
Has anyone gone over 30GB yet, this month, after receiving the letter last month? Anything happened if you have?
PC_Arcade
07-09-2005, 17:58
I thought you were off?
I am, however I have to put up with NTL for another month.
How can NTL be punishing people by providing a particular service and charging what they think the market will bear? If they are wrong folk will leave to find other providers and they'll adjust their strategy.
People are leaving already, 2 have posted here already and I'm fairly sure more will follow if they continue to enforce the cap.
If they don't then they will go out of business. It's not like the board are falling off their chairs with laughter at the caps having lured innocent grannies in off the street, is it?
We can but hope, as for the board, I don't know what they are doing, I don't attend NTL board meetings, do you? If so, please tell us what they ARE doing
You don't know what the economics of the provision of the service are so you don't know how sustainable the other deals are, but as you point out there are more attractively priced packages for what you want, so why are you complaining? Would it not make more sense for you to sign up to these great deals and come back and gloat at the rest of us? Or is it the moaning that you get off on?
I have switched, and I wasn't moaning, I was disappointed that NTL put me in a position where I felt I had no choice BUT to leave, or are you now saying that it's OK to talk to heavy users like **** because they have transgressed a rule that they never agreed to in the first place? I don't "get off" on moaning, in fact looking back I don't see where I did moan, I stated my reasons for leaving, and backed them up when you posted. I'm sorry if YOU didn't like it, but there ya go :)
It's one thing to complain about a service that doesn't work, or you haven't had any warning about changes to. It's another to complain up to the wire that what's coming isn't fair and how much better other deals are if you don't get on your bike and take advantage of them. The infractructure costs that left all of the cable companies near bankruptcy and huge debts are beginning to payt off, but the debts are still there and they are corporate entities, in it to make money, for themselves and shareholders, not to hand out freebies.
I HAVE TAKEN ADVANTAGE OF BETTER DEALS which part of that do you not understand? My service did work very well, and it's a shame I have to leave, but in all honesty do you expect me to feel sorry for NTL being left near bancruptcy?? I couldn't care less if they go bancrupt, other than feeling sorry for the GOOD employees that will lose their jobs. It shouldn't be down to the customers to pay inflated charges though because NTL made some ****-poor business decisions should it?
Has anyone gone over 30GB yet, this month, after receiving the letter last month? Anything happened if you have?
50 gig so far and nothing, but the letter said they would contact us again in October, if they do and are not happy with me thats when i'll leave and go else where.
awaiting AUP Stormtroopers to kick my door down any day now:Yikes:
bugger, ive been using usenet day and night :(
Im on 2mb at the moment. Is it conceivable that they will drop me back down to one meg at the cost of 2mb but with no cap?
Have ntl release the bandwidth useage program Ive heard about yet?
nemesis01
08-09-2005, 14:08
i dont think i have even downloaded 10gb since i got my letter, downgraded my service to 2mb too, might download a few things to get my money's worth but doubt i will go over the cap limit.
14gig so far here,probably will go over the 30gig cap by at least double, using about 1.5 gigs a day, you'll be surprised how much bandwidth MSN Zone takes up playing them online games everyday!. How anybody can stay within 30gigs and use the internet is beyond me, try playing on MSN Zone for 3/4 hours and see how much you download
Hi Guys
I'm not ideologically opposed to caps and I don't want to degrade my neighbours' connections. But I don't seem to be able to monitor my usage. I have a network of three computers connected through a hardware router. My router doesn't log the amount of data going through the WAN port so I can't monitor my usage there (unfortunately PRTG doesn't work either). I can log the network usage for each computer, but this includes all my local network traffic (which is a huge amount because I stream digital television from one computer to another).
The only thing I have been able to do is to keep tabs on the larger files I have downloaded. But even this isn't straight forward. I downloaded Debian (9GB!) using BitTorrent, but I don't know how much of my 30GB limit that ate up because being BitTorrent a whole load of it would have been uploaded to other users as well as downloaded. Okay, sure, I don't download linux every month, but there are loads of things you can do on the internet which make estimating your usage really complicated (e.g. streaming music/radio/video, gaming).
I want to be a co-operative customer but ntl don't give me the means to know whether I am staying within the cap. I have tried to find a way of logging my usage and I'm sure it must be theoretically possible, but I don't think it is reasonable to assume such a high level of technical expertise from the general public. This isn't like using the telephone where you can keep a mental log of how many calls you have made. For people like me data seems a very abstract concept and without some tools with which users can monitor their usage the AUP seems unreasonable.
Someone made the point that anyone downloading 150GB/month must know they are busting the cap. I think for the most part that is a fair assumption. But for those of us much closer to the 30GB cap I'm not sure the same is always true. I'd be really surprised if I got a letter from ntl about my usage because I suspect I am way below their radar. But this isn't the point, I could still be in breach of the AUP without knowing it and without meaning to be.
barq
Lemonhunny
12-09-2005, 15:04
I've just cancelled my account with NTL, effective October 12th, when I shall do something I always swore I would never do, and return to BT. The lady at Customer Relations was extremely helpful, tried to persuade me to go to AOL 1mg unlimited connection, retaining my NTL phone line. I declined that. She went on to tell me about the 10mb connection, which I told her I had no interest in, the 2mb connection being more than ample for my needs, and that I felt the cap on that was equally ridiculous as the cap being used on the other connections. She asked if I exceeded my 1g per day, and I told her yes, that it was easy as pie to exceed that, with 3 pcs connected all doing stuff such as webcam chats to family overseas; legal download of movies in the public domain; online gaming etc etc - the duMeter is terrifying to watch at times! She started to tell me about other services that will be released at the same time as the 10mg connection becomes available, 2mb quoted verbally as being the £24.99 per month we pay now - but unlimited data transfer. But who wants to watch a meter constantly NOW, and risk being suspended or even terminated for exceeding the limit? It's almost as bad as clock-watching when we were all paying ENORMOUS phone bills for dial-up!
She expressed regret that I was looking at leaving NTL (I've been with them years, and have always been bemused at problems others report, as I've had none), thinking their service (to me at least) to have always been excellent. But eventually she realised I was leaving, there was no persuading me otherwise, and I arranged disconnection for October.
It's sad, because I've hated the times I've been with BT, and hubby hated BT even more. But all we'll use is the phone line, having chosen to go to an ISP that gives us 2mb unlimted connection (I have phoned and checked and double checked), and also unlimited 24/7 phone calls within the UK, all for £29.99 per month.
I will watch with interest, and no doubt one day will say "I wish I'd stayed with NTL", but for now - for me - there is no choice other than to leave.
sorry if this has already came up but does any one else here use 300k atm and haing to opt out of the covert 1 mb semi mandatory upgrade with a huge downgrade in cap incres in speed = 3 times
decrese in cap = ten fold
wheres the value in this i know i represent the small part of the market needign resonable transfer limits (3 gb not resonable god only knowsd what ntl will do with use when they move that to 10 meg 3 gb caps with 10 meg speed any one) without having the cash flow to grab a huge connection such as ntl 2 or 3 meg.
way to go rip[ off britain
rant over flame me all u like
Ignition
12-09-2005, 23:07
sorry if this has already came up but does any one else here use 300k atm and haing to opt out of the covert 1 mb semi mandatory upgrade with a huge downgrade in cap incres in speed = 3 times
decrese in cap = ten fold
wheres the value in this i know i represent the small part of the market needign resonable transfer limits (3 gb not resonable god only knowsd what ntl will do with use when they move that to 10 meg 3 gb caps with 10 meg speed any one) without having the cash flow to grab a huge connection such as ntl 2 or 3 meg.
way to go rip[ off britain
rant over flame me all u like
I would but I think you'd be far better off learning the English language first.
I didn't really read your post properly as it's next to impossible to read due to the combination of no punctuation, a few typos, poor spelling and a couple of bits of txt spk.
Punctuation, spelling and basic grammar really do go a long way and sadly a point is far more likely to be listened to when presented articulately.
As far as your comments go you represent the part of the market needing higher transfer limits but don't have the money to take a 2 or 3Mbit service, the only thing I can recommend is that you go ADSL, you get what you pay for in most aspects of life, internet connection being one of them.
UKOnline offer a 512k service from their unbundled exchanges that is unlimited and costs £9.99 a month. There are a few 512k unlimited ADSL options that are sub-£15 a month.
Chrysalis
12-09-2005, 23:39
My friend was about to order the 9.99 offer and almost pulled out because of the 3 gig cap, I persuaded him to order as he is only going to be webbrowsing. Caps do put people off, he had a nightmare with AOL regarding overage charges and all he wants is a flat fee service on his ntl cable, but doesnt want to use AOL its not too much to ask.
rogerdraig
13-09-2005, 00:13
I would but I think you'd be far better off learning the English language first.
I didn't really read your post properly as it's next to impossible to read due to the combination of no punctuation, a few typos, poor spelling and a couple of bits of txt spk.
Punctuation, spelling and basic grammar really do go a long way and sadly a point is far more likely to be listened to when presented articulately.
As far as your comments go you represent the part of the market needing higher transfer limits but don't have the money to take a 2 or 3Mbit service, the only thing I can recommend is that you go ADSL, you get what you pay for in most aspects of life, internet connection being one of them.
UKOnline offer a 512k service from their unbundled exchanges that is unlimited and costs £9.99 a month. There are a few 512k unlimited ADSL options that are sub-£15 a month.
it may be your lack of abilty to comprehend rather than any lack on his part
or do you now have to produce qualifications to ask questions
it may be your lack of abilty to comprehend rather than any lack on his part
or do you now have to produce qualifications to ask questions
And i take it you considered that post to be correctly written with punctuation in the correct place. Showing a good command of the English language and giving everyone the ability to instantly understand the writers intention and statement . Can i then ask that you become the sites unofficial text speak and verbal diarrhea interpreter.
orangebird
13-09-2005, 10:01
it may be your lack of abilty to comprehend rather than any lack on his part
or do you now have to produce qualifications to ask questions
It's not about 'qualifications'. It's about a bit of courtesy and a grasp of basic grammar and punctuation - which most of us learned by the time we'd left primary school, no?
astra_lestat
13-09-2005, 10:53
It's not about 'qualifications'. It's about a bit of courtesy and a grasp of basic grammar and punctuation - which most of us learned by the time we'd left primary school, no?
No. Not at all.
Not everyone was so lucky as to have English as their first language.
I think it was very impolite to point out mistakes...IMHO.
Let alone it was completely off topic, as well as this post.
Erm .... I didn't think this was an English lesson, now back on topic please.
ok one more off topic post sorry for the very poor post i was in full swing with being rarther upset about the email i recived from ntl regarding the cap i apreciate the post was gibberish it was writen in haste i normally go back and full correct the post if not make it gramatically corect but in this case i just clicked post
Rillington
13-09-2005, 20:10
One of my friends was also going to have the 1mb service but also decided against it due to the cap.
I would love to know just how many ARE put off ntl internet simply because of the download cap.
I've actually given up recommending NTL to friends and family. To date at least 15 people I've recommended have joined NTL but that will unfortunately not be the case anymore. This is mainly because I can't be bothered explaining the 3gig cap for the lowest tier. People tend to ask what the cheapest package is and you tell them it's £10 a month but then you have to explain they would have to be really careful about the amount they and their kids download and their eyes glaze over. To recommend the middle tier package with a reasonable cap would simply get a reaction of "well I've seen broadband advertised for less". You then have to explain about caps once again...
I'm not against caps, tho' as I've said before the 30gig cap should be doubled especially for 3mb users since they already pay over the odds for their connection and at the same time increasing the cap for the lowest tier even if that means adding a couple of quid onto the price. I personally would start recommending NTL again if they cap for the lowest tier was 10-15gig and the price was £12- £15.
On a related note, have any letters been received or sent regarding the 3gig(1meg package) cap? If so what kind of usage does it take to summon one for that tier?
Chrysalis
14-09-2005, 01:54
This makes an interesting read.
http://bbs.adslguide.org.uk/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=ntlhome&Number=2032275&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=0&fpart=
A user ordered 2mbit and got 1mbit due to ntl incompetance and tried in vain to get it reverted but tech support failed and he then hit the 1mbit cap of 3 gig, I dont know what happens next.
DieDieMyDarling
15-09-2005, 13:06
BT customers got emails today, about the caps, going into a lot more details and also stating that users don't have to worry if they only go over the caps every now and then, and not by too much.
Expect an announcement by NTL soon, catch up time. :D
orangebird
15-09-2005, 13:10
BT customers got emails today, about the caps, going into a lot more details and also stating that users don't have to worry if they only go over the caps every now and then, and not by too much.
Expect an announcement by NTL soon, catch up time. :D
?? ntl have taken that stance since feb 2003... who's playing catch up? :rolleyes:
Chrysalis
15-09-2005, 13:55
On adslguide what I heard was BT Broadband basic customers have had metering turned of and it is now effectively a soft cap like ntl's currently is. If a user consistently uses a heavy amount they get asked to upgrade to a higher package.
I would expect the difference here is BT are now heading to a uncapped offering with NTL heading the other way, of course NTL are planning unmetered packages but their might be a period of time these wont be available whilst they possibly have hard caps in place.
If a user consistently uses a heavy amount they get asked to upgrade to a higher package.
What, a consistently heavy amount like 150gb with ntl and their letters?
:rolleyes:
DieDieMyDarling
15-09-2005, 16:09
?? ntl have taken that stance since feb 2003... who's playing catch up? :rolleyes:
Ntl did not have a cap since 2003, they had a 'guide'. They only changed it to an 'allowance' this year, when they changed the wording when no-one was looking. :D
To repeat - this thread is not an english lesson. Off topic posts removed.
BT customers got emails today, about the caps, going into a lot more details and also stating that users don't have to worry if they only go over the caps every now and then, and not by too much.
Expect an announcement by NTL soon, catch up time. :D
at least they get a e-mail, i mean how are NTL customers who got letters posted to them meant to read them and to follow what is setout in them when they gone missing in post?,
*The average user don't vist these forums and therefore I know nothing of caps,gigs,bytes, cap letters,fair usage policies, NTL should state these more clearly on signup not by small print- and currently 51gigs downloaded this month*
So assuming someone who recieved a letter (me) still goes over the cap limit what do people think NTL will really do,
according to letter
either move you to a lower speed with higher usage allowance (does this exist??)
or suspend your account but you still remain liable for monthly charge (well if you are past the 12 months minimum contract I can't see how they are planning to hold this up, if you don't like it just cancel your account and go else where)
so are NTL just trying to prune there accounts, again I find it hard to believe that network congestion is really the problem, as there are other ISP's that other totally unlimited usage for about the same price, and I still haven't heard of anyone who has had a problem with there service that is/was caused by congestion, please anyone, I wouldn't mind the cap so much if I thought NTL were telling the truth..
theNomad
17-09-2005, 09:10
yeah I agree with your last comments chiba (member.php?u=11883) & mcmanic (member.php?u=4147) but we know that ntl have had very cagey policy about actually telling people the truth on the caps clearly because its harder to sell the package to people telling them they could only use it in some cut down limit way,and like you state unless you do visit forums like this you probably wouldnt know ntl have any kind of fair use policy.
If ntl played fair I think people wouldnt mind as much as they clearly do.What they need to do is
#1 Make a clear policy about packages - Tell people what they are getting for their said package & how much they can use.We are all here paying different amounts for the same or even worse packages.I have the 1.5mb pace set up and pay the same as the users with proper 2mb probably about 50kbs slower D/L and at least half as much U/L as they have for the same cost.You also hear 1mb users who are paying £25 and not the £18 other 1mb users are.
#2 Come into line with other providers for price & speed - this is the 2nd key issue people are leaving in large numbers.Cost per what you get for your money when you put NTL next to other ISP's - 30gbs for £25 and 3gbs for £18 per month is not value per household,they need to stop marketing on these dream speeds when clearly you cant use that speed for long with those painfully low caps.
I know guys say if your so unhappy switch to another ISP but I'm holding out like ive said before in this cap thread as its a pain to change my tv,net,phone packages to seperate companys.And also Ive gone over my cap again this month but hoping the letters where like the ones from 1-2 years and never went further than empty threats.
peace out guys see you when the next letters and possible action to customers happens.
astra_lestat
17-09-2005, 12:44
Just saw Tesco's broadband 512kbps - NO download limits.
I am going to keep their CD now in case I get a letter.
These are going out to BT customers atm.
BT Yahoo! - Important news about your Broadband from BT service Posted:
Weâ₠¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢ve got some great news about TWO improvements weâ₠¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢re making to your broadband. And donââ‚ ¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢t worry, they are improvements at NO extra cost!
Youââ‚ ¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢ll be aware that each of our products comes with a usage guideline. This is the amount of data you can send and receive through your broadband connection each month. However, as we donââ‚ ¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢t want anything to get in the way of your enjoyment of the Internet, weâ₠¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢re making two important improvements to the way usage guidelines work.
A new approach to usage guidelines †“ to give you more freedom
Although the vast majority of our customers are within the current usage guidelines for their product, some customers have told us that they feel restricted. So weâ₠¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢ve responded.
Our new approach to usage guidelines means you are free to use your broadband without the fear of being limited or charged.
From now on, if you occasionally exceed your monthly usage guideline there will be no need to worry, as youââ‚ ¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢ll be able to continue using the service as normal for the rest of the month without any restrictions or additional charges.
In fact, as long as you donââ‚ ¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢t regularly exceed your usage guideline by a large amount, you have no need to worry whatsoever. If you do regularly go over the allowance, we may contact you about moving to a more appropriate product for your needs. However given that the usage guideline for BT Yahoo! Broadband is more than enough for most people on this product, itâ₠¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢s unlikely this will be necessary.
And an increased monthly usage guideline at no extra cost
Additionally, as there are more and more things you can do with a broadband connection, we have decided to increase your usage guideline anyway. This means your monthly usage guideline will be increased from 30GB to 40GB, giving you even more reason to relax and enjoy your broadband.
And you donââ‚ ¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢t have to do a thing
Well its an improvement, and they are increasing limits. ;)
well thought i'd just share my atempt at finding and alternative provider with you all...
I'm about to eat some humble pie here so no flaming please, as i posted in part two of this thread i received a letter with regards to my usage (which i hasten to add i was not incensed about) and decided that i would seek solace somwhere where i wasn't going to be subject to capping.
I phoned ntls' cs and explained the situation and the guy on the end of the phone was very helpful and did as i asked and set me up for disconnection, at that point i started browing for deals and came across onetels unlimited 2mb service plan which i signed up for.
Job done you may think, cut to three weeks later or so and last weekend my ntl service halted so i atempted to set up the onetel kit that had been delivered a few days previous and guess what.. NO DICE!!! the knobbers at onetel hadn't even done a line test to see what if any connection i would get, needless to say i was more than a little upset and after 40 mins of talking with incompetent or indifferent indian call centre staff i finally lost the plot and demanded that my contract was terminated.
the guy at the end of the phone said this can be done but i would get a fifty pounds charge for terminating early, so i went down the bank monday morning and cancelled all their direct debits (see em in court i guess!!), Anyhow to cut a long story short i phoned ntl and asked to get reconnected which was done in a flash, and now i promise to be a good boy and play by the rules..
better the devil you know, bring on the unlimited packages :sorry:
astra_lestat
20-09-2005, 19:37
Well, you can blame only yourself for signing up with someone not so well known. Nowdays you gotta make a good research on the Internet before deciding, also it is a good practice to call them up and ask questions regarding caps and p2p traffic tolerance. So...of cause it is risky. It merely depends on how much one can tolerate caps. I for one, will switch to 512kbps Tesco with no caps than constantly worry about every megabyte I download (in case I receive a letter). But I will do the research before I disconnect :)
Nildram, bulldog, ukonline to name a few much better deals for heavy downloaders, I'm going Nildram way if NTL disconnect me in October close to 200 Gig so-far and proud of it
BTW Direct debits can be re sent from the ISP no problem just cancelling at the bank wont stop them getting the money unless you tell the bank the ISP is trying to de-fraud you of the money but then I'm sure the bank have a duty to inform the police
ian@huth
21-09-2005, 11:01
Nildram, bulldog, ukonline to name a few much better deals for heavy downloaders, I'm going Nildram way if NTL disconnect me in October close to 200 Gig so-far and proud of it
BTW Direct debits can be re sent from the ISP no problem just cancelling at the bank wont stop them getting the money unless you tell the bank the ISP is trying to de-fraud you of the money but then I'm sure the bank have a duty to inform the policeThe ISP's that you mentioned may have better deals on paper but do they have them in reality? They all have clauses in their T&C's that they can use to disconnect any user that they want to get rid of. Many ISP's that are commonly named are not the giants that such as NTL and BT are and would be unable to cope with an influx of very high bandwidth users. As these ISP's offer ever increasing speeds they are getting nearer and nearer to the time when they will no longer offer unlimited services or will use the magic word "UPTO" to ensure that you cannot get anything like the speed you expect. Take Bulldog for example who only have something like 65,000 BB customers and a waiting list of 20,000 (figures were from a month or so ago) who have been having horrendous problems for a fair time.
If you notify your bank that you are cancelling a Direct Debit mandate then they will not take any further funds from your account that were the subject of that mandate.
only said Nildram as I know a few people using them and they have never had a problem one person in paticular is a heavy ftp user.
Nildram have a 50gig monthly cap except between midnight and 8 am with is uncapped, but what i really like is that if you do go over the 50gig cap you aren't diconnected but speed reduced to 64k during 8am to midnight, this I think is fair.
If NTL's real problem was congestion why not offer an uncapped 'Off-Peak' allowance.
I also love the fact BT have now back-stepped to a soft cap only policy the is very clever bussiness if you ask me as soon as NTL go ahead with inforcing hard capping BT up your limit to beat NTL.
as for these small companys taking to long to connect new customers try moving house with NTL then waiting over a month to have the internet connection re-enabled even though you have the phone and tv service working fine, at least the small companies can always use the to small excuse ;-) as opposed to the not customer orientated approach, unless your a new customer of course...
ment to add 'i think' to the direct debit thing as its happened to me the bank 'Barclays' said it was because it was a rolling direct debit not just a one off payment, this is why standing orders are better because they normally have a payment date on them and sometimes even an end date
Direct debits do not they are just an agreement for a company to bill your account for example phone bills are not allways for the same ammount so untill the phone companys issues the direct debit your bank does not know anything about it but you don't have to sign or agree to the transaction each time your bill is due...
as I said i'm not 100% sure just previous experience and worth checking maybe....
__________________
just compared ntlworld an nildram over at adslguide
just look at the gap between them especially regarding Customer service, looks good to me
http://www.adslguide.org.uk/isps/compare.asp?nildram=ON&ntlhome=ON&cmp_action=Compare
Like many others I'll be waiting to see the outcome of all this but
until we know more I've modified my usage.
Not that I ever considered myself a heavy user, but even modifying
my download/browsing etc.. habits, I'm still in excess of the current
miserable 30GB cap.
Chrysalis
21-09-2005, 18:27
dogster what tool you used for that?
Hans Gruber
21-09-2005, 18:33
It looks like dumeter with some godawful windows skin
nemesis01
21-09-2005, 18:53
pretty sure i have gone over the limit, maybe only by a gb or so tho so, i'm hoping ntl lets that go as acceptable.
I have been over the limit twice. I got letters twice, but nothing has been done :)
I have been over the limit twice. I got letters twice, but nothing has been done :)
interesting, was that two consecutive months?, and how much did the letter say you downloaded if you don't mind asking
__________________
pretty sure i have gone over the limit, maybe only by a gb or so tho so, i'm hoping ntl lets that go as acceptable.
lol, Ntl won't do anything even if go over 3x30gig, i bet you £10.
STill sticking to my 100/150gig threshold limit which triggers automatic response and a letter. I mean if it was too low, thousands of people would be getting letters but they are not.
dogster what tool you used for that?
Hans Gruber was correct,it's DUMeter with a WB skin called "Fiesta" :p:
For your benefit Hans I've provided a new SS with a new skin. :D
Hans Gruber
22-09-2005, 09:50
That's much nicer ;)
pretty sure i have gone over the limit, maybe only by a gb or so tho so, i'm hoping ntl lets that go as acceptable.
lol, Ntl won't do anything even if go over 3x30gig, i bet you £10.
STill sticking to my 100/150gig threshold limit which triggers automatic response and a letter. I mean if it was too low, thousands of people would be getting letters but they are not.
ATM they won't. They are monitoring Network Usage.
If Ntl are going to issue letters in September as promised i see a massive increase of the number of people who will get their 1st or 2nd, as September has been a massive week in the console scene (if you know what i mean)
I carnt wait to see my letter!!
I rang up and cancelled everything. Got my date for sky install and BT install.I then got a phone call a couple of days later from a "new dept".
They wanted to know why I was cancelling, so I explained. I have now had to cancel my Sky install as i have been offered tv,phone and broadband free for 6 months. The only thing ive cancelled at the moment is the phone. Ready to jump the broadband ship if they get up set this month with my downloading.
I wont actulay cancel my broadband for the rest of the six months just get a second connection.
The new dept were actually quite interested in all the problems people have been having with the broadband aup team. They implied that quite a few people were getting rid of there packages thats why they had been set up. Not sure how true that is, I could have been reading the conversation wrong.
JackJones-ÃÂÂÂÃÂÂÂ-Ã
26-09-2005, 03:28
lol im always going over my limit never had a letter tho
i see it as i pay for a 3mbit always on 24/7 line so
i download 24/7 why the fluck not ,,, i pay for it :tu:
4 days to go (monitoring)
Letters was sent out around the 20th of the following month, gives us another month to hammer the system (i didn't say that did i? smacks hand with ruler!)
Bluestraw
28-09-2005, 18:35
Does anyone know if the usage is measured per billing period, or per month?
Thanks!
well in the letters it said "during the month of September", so if i get a letter saying i've downloaded X amount and it don't match what i have here they can go and jump and prove to me that their info is correct seeing i'm paying the bill and its my cash they want
Ignition
28-09-2005, 20:07
well in the letters it said "during the month of September", so if i get a letter saying i've downloaded X amount and it don't match what i have here they can go and jump and prove to me that their info is correct seeing i'm paying the bill and its my cash they want
Not hard considering they have records of every single byte you've transferred :)
Sorry but I doubt your software is as accurate as the router that's handling your data....
Not hard considering they have records of every single byte you've transferred :)
Sorry but I doubt your software is as accurate as the router that's handling your data....
thats ok then, but abit pointless in NTL pointing you to a BB monior if its not going to be right and they tell you to use that, especially if they ever enforce the 30gig cap to the hilt via hardware cos then how would we ever know if our software is ever right compared to what NTL are saying it is via hardware.
Ignition
29-09-2005, 09:37
thats ok then, but abit pointless in NTL pointing you to a BB monior if its not going to be right and they tell you to use that, especially if they ever enforce the 30gig cap to the hilt via hardware cos then how would we ever know if our software is ever right compared to what NTL are saying it is via hardware.
There's an ongoing plan to provide customers with a monitoring webpage showing how much they have used, this will be based on the same data that the bandwidth police will be using.
Who knows it might even actually be live at some point!
To be honest though dude if you're downloading DVD-Rs of console games you can't really complain too much, you are after all knowingly and intentionally going over the limit.
don't assume i have then... lol, was pointing out on my other post that it has been a busy month on the scene release, so expect many more people to be caught out if as NTL say "they are monitoring", i know this to be the case as my internet has been much lower so someone in my area is effecting my usage, infact i even know who one of them is!
theNomad
29-09-2005, 16:28
sssshhhh mcmanic (http://member.php?u=4147) dont tell anyone its me.(only joking but I am addicted to winamps streaming channels)
:Yikes:yiikkess how much of an hole have I blown in the cap,tbh I'm pushing my luck now.Ive tried to get information on higher bandwith packages and theyre keeping tighter lipped than Paris Hilton in her sex tape.
I don't wanna pay £90pm (£25 of which is for my poor net speeds of 1.5mb) for a service that I have to watch my use of and keep checking a meter.Cost per speed is bad enough without having to check a piece of software on if I can use my connection or not.
I did try to stick to it for a few weeks but it suck's so I'll take my chance now at getting kicked over my over use.Hopefully the bulk of other users will follow suit,lets see if they'll kick us all.If they do theres allways other isp's and sky digital who will be willing to take our money.If I hadnt allready paid for a years worth of Premiership plus I'd have gone months ago.
all the best guys
I'm still loving NTL on every other issue other than the cap.
Lemonhunny
05-10-2005, 16:56
I've just had my SEVENTH phone call from customer services/retention in the 3 weeks since I started the disconnection proceedings with ntl. My daughter has just come home and told me she took another 2 calls from ntl yesterday, so they are surely keen!
Every time they have called, and including the day I phoned to cancel, I have told each person that the reason I am leaving is the BB cap. Plain and simple - easy to put onto a computer one would think. But still they keep calling me.
I had BT put on for the phone over 2 weeks ago. I ordered my AOL BB set up 7 days ago, got the pack this morning. ( I am NOT an aol snob, having kept my account from 7 years ago when I first got internet - and knowing no better). In the dial-up days, AOL were virtually the only ones not doing a madatory 2hour cut off. Now their TV adverts are STILL saying you can download as much music as you want. That's good enough for me. So on Wed (12th) ntl will come and pick up my stb, and this weekend I'll go and buy a £30 freeview box which will supply every channel I bother looking at on TV.
I'm not happy to be leaving ntl, because I've never had a moment's bother with them in all the time since I went back to them. But I cannot live with two teenage daughters, a husband and myself all online with our own computers, and not a clue who is downloading what; who is webcamming with our family in Iran and Greece; and what bandwidth the latest MSN zone game is taking. It's archaic taking such a huge step backwards, almost to the days of being terrified of the phone bills dropping through the door (BT once phoned me to warn me mine was SO high!). I can't be doing with it - it's far too much hassle. I too tried to keep to just under 1g per day, but it was damn near impossible given the pc useage in my house - I gave up. Have used the pcs just the same way as always since about week 2 of the month, and if I get a letter mid-october from ntl, then I just won't give it another thought, because it'll be too late.
Let's see how things go with AOL - I'm not going to be worrying about bandwidth useage anymore at least. I would be very surprised if they invoke any AUPs, as they never have in the past. And I've always been a 24/7 connection family since dial-up days.
Lemon
Rillington
06-10-2005, 00:32
Not having the two hour cut-off was one of the major reaosns I got AOL.
On broadband they are pretty good too. It's a rarety for things to go wrong and when they do their technical help is very good.
Shame AOL dont do 3meg broadband really.
Even i could put up with their interface if that was the case. :)
astra_lestat
06-10-2005, 16:38
With this kind of services starting to appear here and there I wonder what kind of BB it would be with 30G caps...
http://news.com.com/Studios+to+move+online+to+beat+pirates/2100-1026-5888479.html?tag=nl.e433
Chrysalis
06-10-2005, 21:23
Yeah I find AOL good choice for dialup, nice uniqueness doing toll free with no cutoff. They value customer's need to not want to keep an eye on the clock or meter.
With this kind of services starting to appear here and there I wonder what kind of BB it would be with 30G caps...
http://news.com.com/Studios+to+move+online+to+beat+pirates/2100-1026-5888479.html?tag=nl.e433
There was a thread like this on one of the many earlier cap discussion threads [Number 37 if i remember :D ] and i brought up a similar subject.
It seems like most people on the net will be streaming full movies while we get to watch cartoons. ;)
ian@huth
08-10-2005, 14:43
well in the letters it said "during the month of September", so if i get a letter saying i've downloaded X amount and it don't match what i have here they can go and jump and prove to me that their info is correct seeing i'm paying the bill and its my cash they wantProve to you what? NTL do not have to prove anything, if they say that you have downloaded x amount then that is the end of the story.
lol, whatever, would like to see them prove it all the same, after all their cap is only a soft cap with no means for me to monitor which if they need people to keep to guidelines which to say the least are very wishy washy so we don't know exactly where we the consumer stand then sorry i will demand proof, consumers/customers have rights as well.
Anyway i've been a good boy.....................so far
Chrysalis
08-10-2005, 22:09
I dont think ntl would have a problem proving it I think they already have the technology to measure the traffic in an accurate manner, the problem is making the readings available to the customer so they have the tool to monitor their own usage, and telling the customer to buy dumeter doesnt cut it in my opinion.
i agree, but what if there report don't match yours, who's right and who's wrong, after all there is loads of clone modems out there that could be using your mac address
Chrysalis
09-10-2005, 22:58
if you a victim of cloning I think you would have to try and use the ip address as evidence, as a mac can be cloned but an ip cannot.
Ignition
09-10-2005, 23:19
i agree, but what if there report don't match yours, who's right and who's wrong, after all there is loads of clone modems out there that could be using your mac address
Hehe sorry dude but there's no way for someone to clone your MAC and use it to mess your traffic stats up. NTL know where your modem is supposed to be and it's impossible for someone in the same area as you to nick your MAC address else it causes severe issues for both of you and is easily spottable.
Next attempt to prove the report wrong please :angel: :D
Repeat after me... 'I connect to a router, that router forwards all the traffic to and from my modem, it also counts all of this traffic. Therefore the stats that my ISP has are more accurate than mine.'
Repeat ad infinitum until you accept that a freeware piece of software isn't going to match 10s of grand of Cisco kit that's actually pushing your packets around for traffic counting :)
There is no debate on who's right and wrong. :)
<snip>
Repeat after me... 'I connect to a router, that router forwards all the traffic to and from my modem, it also counts all of this traffic. Therefore the stats that my ISP has are more accurate than mine.'
<snip>
And I would also add "although it would be nice for my ISP to give me access to those figures".
sleepless
10-10-2005, 05:47
And I would also add "although it would be nice for my ISP to give me access to those figures".
And I would add "They will as it is cooming soon" ;)
Thanks for that reassurance Ignition, I didn't realise that mac address cloning only worked if it was used in a different area. Makes sense if you think about it, if I tried to use the same mac address on two pc's connected to my router problems would obviously occur .
Can't NTL check if more than one person is using the same mac by running a custom script and checking all their "router" logs for duplicates? I'm a total newb as far as networking this high up goes so excuse the ignorance.
ian@huth
10-10-2005, 13:24
Thanks for that reassurance Ignition, I didn't realise that mac address cloning only worked if it was used in a different area. Makes sense if you think about it, if I tried to use the same mac address on two pc's connected to my router problems would obviously occur .
Can't NTL check if more than one person is using the same mac by running a custom script and checking all their "router" logs for duplicates? I'm a total newb as far as networking this high up goes so excuse the ignorance.Who said that it worked in different areas?
Ignition
10-10-2005, 16:21
Who said that it worked in different areas?
Ian read your own signature.
Please put brain in gear before posting.
Please Ian stop defending ntl to the hilt whatever the facts. A post like this makes you look a fool. Everyone who has been on these boards any length of time should know that while the recent software updates have made this practise far more difficult it has in the past been something that's happened and is still possible even if the bar has been raised a lot as far as how difficult it is to accomplish it.
If it were impossible altogether do you not think I'd have just given the one sentence reply rather than the more verbose response I did? :rolleyes:
__________________
Can't NTL check if more than one person is using the same mac by running a custom script and checking all their "router" logs for duplicates? I'm a total newb as far as networking this high up goes so excuse the ignorance.
Easily, though much harder to track down the cloner to an exact address!
Guys i am not a mod on here but can you remember we do not talk about the ways and hows of ripping off NTL. I know you have not yet but would hate to see this degenerate by accident. Or for someone to say the wrong thing. :)
:angel:
Bill C shuts up and crawls back under his stone and hides again :LOL:
ian@huth
10-10-2005, 16:49
Who said that it worked in different areas?
Ian read your own signature.
Please put brain in gear before posting.
Please Ian stop defending ntl to the hilt whatever the facts. A post like this makes you look a fool. Everyone who has been on these boards any length of time should know that while the recent software updates have made this practise far more difficult it has in the past been something that's happened and is still possible even if the bar has been raised a lot as far as how difficult it is to accomplish it.
If it were impossible altogether do you not think I'd have just given the one sentence reply rather than the more verbose response I did? :rolleyes:Ignition, how can you say that I am defending NTL to the hilt by that one comment? I will defend them when I believe that they are right and knock them when I don't. I have done my share of knocking over the years.
From the post that you made I did not assume that it was possible to clone MAC addresses if you were in a different area and get away with it. Look at what you said NTL know where your modem is supposed to be That, to me would indicate that if the MAC address of your modem turned up in a place that it shouldn't be at that NTL would know. The poster to which I responded took it to mean differently in that you could get away with a cloned MAC address in an area other than your own. I simply asked where he got that information from. Before calling someone a fool I suggest that you read exactly what you, I and others have said and make sure that you post an answer that cannot be interpreted in more than one way. :mad:
I think that's enough discussion about 'cloning'.
Its not directly related to caps and is obviously going to cause arguments - and as Bill has pointed out - we don't allow discussion of the methods involved in illegal ripping of ntl's services.
Please get back to the topic subject. Thank you. :)
nemesis01
11-10-2005, 10:54
a letter i received this morning:
Your ntl Broadband Usage
In August we wrote to you about your ntl Broadband usage. We asked you to reduce your internet usage in line with our User Policy to help us continue to offer all our customers the same great service.
During the month of september your Broadband usage was 56GB which is in excess of the 30GB monthly usage allowance for your 3MB service.
Unfortunately, as you haven't reduced your September usage in line with ntl's User Policy, we will transfer you to a new unlimited service later this month.
More usage, less speed.
We understand usage is important to you so your new service will provide unlimited Internet usage at download speeds up to 512Kbps. Your monthly bill will be changed at the same time to a charge of £17.99 per month.
Now, the thing is I feel that since I reduced from 193GB to 56GB that is very harsh, indeed some people on here have said they received 2 warning letters, in light of this one I find that very hard to believe. Still I suppose rules are rules, at least I will admit I got busted unlike some.
The interesting thing is, after I got my first letter I downgraded to 2MB straight away, when my next bill came in it billed me for the 3MB. I rang CS and they said that was a mistake, they told me to pay that bill and next month would be free. Ok, fair enough but why on this letter is it saying I am still on 3MB? Ohwell, at least I did not get downgraded to dial-up.
Now, the thing is I feel that since I reduced from 193GB to 56GB that is very harsh, indeed some people on here have said they received 2 warning letters, in light of this one I find that very hard to believe. Still I suppose rules are rules, at least I will admit I got busted unlike some.
Harsh?! Just how much warez do you now have on your hard drive? I can't even imagine what 250GB of stuff looks like. And please, don't try to tell me it's all legitimate game demos and other fair use stuff. ;) Plus of course that's only the two months they busted you for - how much per month were you downloading before you got your first letter?
Sorry my friend, but NTL's cap has been well known and understood for a very long time now so the way they are treating you is not harsh. You have no excuse whatsoever. IMO you got away with it for too long anyway!
No hard feelings, but my sympathies are not with you, they are with the other poor subscribers on your UBR. :)
nemesis01
11-10-2005, 11:50
i was not looking for sympathy, i accept that it is my fault and can live with 512kpbs. and yes i still do think it's a bit harsh, if only for the fact i know at least 2 people, one of them my brother in law who downloads far more than i ever have and has received no warning letter at all, now that is unfair imo.
if truth be told this could not have come at a better time, i am struggling financially and this is probably best for me, and i suppose all the other ubr users whose lives have been totally destroyed by my downloading. ;)
RichieUK
11-10-2005, 12:16
i was not looking for sympathy, i accept that it is my fault and can live with 512kpbs. and yes i still do think it's a bit harsh, if only for the fact i know at least 2 people, one of them my brother in law who downloads far more than i ever have and has received no warning letter at all, now that is unfair imo.
if truth be told this could not have come at a better time, i am struggling financially and this is probably best for me, and i suppose all the other ubr users whose lives have been totally destroyed by my downloading. ;)
I agree with this. I myself have never gone over the 30GB limit, but i know people who do everymonth, probably over 100GB and none of them have been contacted by NTL about their usage. If NTL are going to do this, they should do it properly and contact everyone
on 3mb and dont even go over 10mb a month wot the hell are these people downloading to go over that lol
orangebird
11-10-2005, 12:32
on 3mb and dont even go over 10mb a month wot the hell are these people downloading to go over that lol
linux distros..... every day. :rolleyes:
linux distros..... every day. :rolleyes:
I think he was being sarcastic :) I think everyone wouild exceed 10 meg in a month:LOL:
i dont i only playonline game most weekends
a letter i received this morning:
Your ntl Broadband Usage
-- snip --
More usage, less speed.
We understand usage is important to you so your new service will provide unlimited Internet usage at download speeds up to 512Kbps. Your monthly bill will be changed at the same time to a charge of £17.99 per month.
So can anyone therefore get on this 512Kbps unlimited deal for £17.99p m? Or do I need to batter down 150Gb of nonsense for 2 months to qualify? What would the upload speed be on this? Reason I ask is I've always said I'd prefer a slower service that I can "use and abuse" (so to speak) rather than have a quicker one that I have to continually think "oh, is what I'm doing going to take me over the limit?" "More usage, less speed" - sums my internet needs up perfectly :)
We play games online (often me and my partner will play UT or Q3) so the upload we currently have on the 2Mb (200k) is better than the previous 128k.
have seen also -
149GB
79GB
all people who have had letters on another forum and downgraded to 512k at £17.99 at end of the month
on 3mb and dont even go over 10mb a month wot the hell are these people downloading to go over that lol
linux distros..... every day. :rolleyes:
You forget that they need to spend at least 12 hours a day watching high bandwidth streaming video..
orangebird
11-10-2005, 14:25
You forget that they need to spend at least 12 hours a day watching high bandwidth streaming video..
Uh-huh. And all the video messages/pictures to email to all the relatives in Auistralia/America/Mongolia.
be perfect for me, just leave pc on 24/7 now and save £20 a month, newsgroups with 25day or higher retentions are wonderfull
Sounds like a pretty good deal. Let us know the upload speed when you get it.
PC_Arcade
11-10-2005, 15:39
Congratulations to NTL for FINALLY doing something they should have done when they introduced the caps a couple of years ago :)
Next they'll be offering a means to monitor your usage!
DieDieMyDarling
11-10-2005, 15:47
Very interesting, and definitely a step in the right direction.
But i wonder, if they are charging 17.99 for 512k unlimited, i wonder if they'll introduce a higher speed with unlimited useage for a higher price? Possibly 2mb/3mb for 37.99?
They're going to lose a bit of revenue if all the heavy users are just put on a slower speed and charged less. I was expecting them to keep charging the 3mb users the 37.99 and lower their speed to whatever it was going to be.
Not sure what NTL are thinking with this. You download too much, so we give you an uncapped service and take £20 per month less off you??? Baffling.
Hans Gruber
11-10-2005, 16:00
i wonder if they'll introduce a higher speed with unlimited useage for a higher price? Possibly 2mb/3mb for 37.99?
Sounds very uncompetative if they do. Uncapped 2mbit from UK Online for £25, uncapped ADSL2+ @ upto 24mbit for £24, etc.
DieDieMyDarling
11-10-2005, 16:12
Sounds very uncompetative if they do. Uncapped 2mbit from UK Online for £25, uncapped ADSL2+ @ upto 24mbit for £24, etc.
17.99 for 512k is hardly competitive either. I don't think they're too bothered about that. Personally i'd pay 37.99 a month for unlimited 2/3mb. It would save me the hassle of moving to BT phone, and finding an ADSL service.
PC_Arcade
11-10-2005, 16:41
17.99 for 512k is hardly competitive either. I don't think they're too bothered about that. Personally i'd pay 37.99 a month for unlimited 2/3mb. It would save me the hassle of moving to BT phone, and finding an ADSL service.
Yeah, it's not great, I left NTL when I got a letter, but I was worried that their offer for heavy users would leave me regretting leaving them.
It hasn't :)
it consider ttakign that tarif its a damn site better than my 300k and the same price
wayneunique
11-10-2005, 17:13
I'm currently on adsl and looking to move to Cable, with NTL the only one available and would easily prefer a 2/3meg unlimited compared to a 10meg (75gig cap).
I really do hope NTL give other unlimited options.
all i got to say, as long as the people who are being downgraded to 512k for heavy downloading are able to upgrade to the 10meg 75gigs connection without being told sorry but you was put on 512k for a reason then i'll be happy, because not all people who are being downgraded have downloaded more than what the new 10meg 75gig cap will be offering when it comes out which is really bizarre on NTL's part:td:
rogerdraig
11-10-2005, 17:47
does any one in this company know what any one else is doing lol
just opted out of 1 meg update why not tell me about this 512 b thing or do i have to start downloading 200 movies this month to get the offer
PC_Arcade
11-10-2005, 18:19
does any one in this company know what any one else is doing lol
It would seem not. I cancelled NTL BB last month and I had the same letter waiting for me when I got home.
The letter was dated the 10th DESPITE the fact that I had my modem disconnected on the 5th.
Interesting article on the homepage: http://www.cableforum.co.uk/article/200/ntl-to-downgrade-heavy-broadband-users
when you get downgraded can someone try the automatic signup on NTL homepage for 3meg or will it be blocked, if not then can see everyone just resigning up for 3meg
when you get downgraded can someone try the automatic signup on NTL homepage for 3meg or will it be blocked, if not then can see everyone just resigning up for 3meg
At a guess I would say that your account will be frozen so that it cannot be changed in that way.
Interesting article on the homepage: http://www.cableforum.co.uk/article/200/ntl-to-downgrade-heavy-broadband-users thats mad m8 thats taking the pish 500GB a month someone nearly download no wonder there are doing this i support this all the way some people are just to greedy wot the hell was he downloading
Will they give me a rebate on my broadband. I cancelled last month after the first letter. Got phoned by a new dept. and offered free 2meg broadband and tv and phone for 6 months. Ive taken the tv and broadband. Changed to BT so that when they do decide to cut my speed i have a couple of options.
1 Keep my 512k unlimited. Will just have to leave connection on all day as against some of the day.
2. Keep my NTL connection for the rest of the 6 months (then cancel), but subscribe to a new supplier and run 2 connections!! Still using my NTL connection 24/7.
If the service is going to be £17.99 I should be due even more money back as I was told 2meg free for 6 months.. not 512k
On my first TV bill there was a £300+ credit.. so looks like they at least got the bill right.
thats mad m8 thats taking the pish 500GB a month someone nearly download no wonder there are doing this i support this all the way some people are just to greedy wot the hell was he downloading
yeah but they forgot to mention the poor sod who only downloaded 56gigs in earlier post, so NTL have to let people know what they mean by "if you go over by a little bit it'll be fine", do they mean 1gig over, 5gig? its all to wishy washy, certainly it seems not 26gigs which really isn't alot and well within their new 75gig for 10meg when due out so why penalize him now!!
rogerdraig
11-10-2005, 21:15
if any one finds a sign up page for 512 sevice give me a bell
lol just re looking at my letter from them 1meg with 1gig limit or 300k 30gig limit hmm but if i had downloaded 500gig i would get 512 unlimited
i am at a loss though i am anti cap how do they expect any one to feel that they are trying to provide a good sevice when they dont offer those who stay inside the TOS the same deal first
Chrysalis
11-10-2005, 21:24
interesting but as others have pointed out, why have ntl thrown away revenue by charging 17.99.
...good point.
Having read this forum for a while, I always found the discussions about caps laugable in the sense that I couldn't believe some people could actually download so much. Then I discovered newsgroups....All the latest American telly at the touch of a button. After 1 month of it, I'm hooked and I can see why others are too. Once you've got used to DIY VOD, you can never go back. Its the future, very much now.
As I have now gone over the usage allowance myself, I'm on 3MB broaband, this thread is all the more important.
I had a look at my old Bell Cablemedia/Cable & Wireless telephone bills yesterday, to see how much I used to spend on internet over the old dial up system which of course went over the telephone line. My basic bill just for telephone charges for the internet were in excess of £150 per month for a 33/56k service. Now I'm paying under £40 for 3MB broadband, "soon" to be 10MB.
I am sure there are some people out there who would be willing to pay more for their internet. So why can't ntl offer us a unlimited, no cap service now and charge us for it?. We're all aware of the ntl "coming soon", my tv service still has the lurid pink software, the upgrade has been "coming soon" for months...
I bet I can't be the only one who used to get these hefty telephone bills and would be quite happy for ntl to relieve me of some more cash for a heavy usage service. I would be happy to pay £60 for a non-capped service, and wouldn't complain if the charges were higher, although probably wouldn't spend over £100 now. What do others think? What would you be prepared to pay if ntl did offer a high speed, non cap service right now?
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