View Full Version : Request to Customers from a Tech
DJSADERS
16-06-2012, 21:12
Just a quick request and explanation, hopefully other techs will agree with this statement :)
If you choose to leave Virgin Media than please leave the boxes on the wall inside and out (Telephone and DTV Outlets) (This also includes CableTel / ComTel / Telewest / NTL / Cable and Wireless etc...) and please don't cut the cables, when we leave the yards at 7.30am with 6 / 7 sometimes 8 jobs, it causes stress beyond belief, it also causes us not to get home until gone 6pm / 7pm sometimes even later having to recable houses, 9 times out of 10 i would say the cables end up being exactly where they were before!
I understand sometimes they get accidentally broken, thats fine, but choosing to remove the cables puts us techs behind by hours, and just 1 house needing rewiring can add 1- 2 hours onto our day, but imagine 3 or more (Like my route today ¬__¬).
It does no harm leaving them and it means when you choose to rejoin or move installation is quicker and you have a happier tech on your hands.
Thats all :)
I'm curious how often you're able to determine that the person who has just ordered VM services is the same person who previously ripped the wires out whilst redecorating or whatever?
Your appeal is likely to fall on dead ears, unfortunately. I don't imagine anyone who intended to re-use their omnibox or isolator would deliberately remove them. It's more likely that they are removed by people who never intend to use them or don't know what they are.
Sorry to hear you had a frustrating day at work though ...
DJSADERS
16-06-2012, 21:36
i usually start a conversation with the customer about it, and i would say it's 50/50, but with redecorating it's not hard to unscrew them and then rescrew then on to the wall after like what is done with plug sockets.
and if people don't know what they are why touch them, you wouldn't see people removing other devices attached to the wall without knowing what they are...
alot of people i have found do it in anger, they were p****d off with virgin (or a prevous company) and decided to remove it all, then after hearing good feedback want it all back.
builders are the worst though... going straight through drop cables without looking.
What you're saying is just unfortunate for the installers. Customers are paying upto £50 for an install so its more than acceptable they get at least 1hour 30mins from the installer.
Paying £50 for some guy to turn up and screw a connector into the back of a modem and Tv STB is not acceptable.
DJSADERS
17-06-2012, 08:37
Do bare in mind that we don't get paid £50 we see barely any most jobs £10 if that.
And hardly anyone pays the £50 fee, as most people argue it.
It is totally acceptable for us to turn up and get the equipment running without cabling, as we have to check signal levels, set the box frequency's, do the telco (which is a 2 stage pain in the ass process), with the tivo it takes 30mins at least to get it going, the broadband takes 10ish mins due to the activation process and then there is the talk through with the customer on how to use everything.
Do bare in mind that we don't get paid £50 we see barely any most jobs £10 if that.
And hardly anyone pays the £50 fee, as most people argue it.
It is totally acceptable for us to turn up and get the equipment running without cabling, as we have to check signal levels, set the box frequency's, do the telco (which is a 2 stage pain in the ass process), with the tivo it takes 30mins at least to get it going, the broadband takes 10ish mins due to the activation process and then there is the talk through with the customer on how to use everything.
Do bare in mind I don't care how much you get per job, just like you're not to interested in the quality of the job. I just care I am paying £50.
You're really not painting a picture of a guy who is interested in the quality of his work, or who is interested in leaving behind a happy customer.You should of known what was required in the role before you applied for it, it is also very obviously a customer facing role which will involve some demonstration of the products/services.
Sometimes I think better installations in the first instance would probably reduce fault call outs by 20-30% for Virginmedia. Perhaps they should up the job rate. VM installers always look like they had a very hard paper round as a kid, Sky installers just go with the flow and look pretty relaxed.
This is not a dig at installers by the way.
DJSADERS
17-06-2012, 09:12
where do you get i don't care in the quality of the job... it wouldn't take hours to rerun cables if that was the case!
where do you get i don't care in the quality of the job... it wouldn't take hours to rerun cables if that was the case!
Ok maybe you do care about the job, I apologise.
Do bare in mind I don't care how much you get per job, just like you're not to interested in the quality of the job. I just care I am paying £50.
You're really not painting a picture of a guy who is interested in the quality of his work, or who is interested in leaving behind a happy customer.You should of known what was required in the role before you applied for it, it is also very obviously a customer facing role which will involve some demonstration of the products/services.
I don't think he saying any such thing when he originally posted.I think he was merely asking for people not to destroy the equipment and cabling left when services are terminated in case anyone else who may buy or rent the house in future are not inconvenienced unduly and the installers don't have to take twice as long to install said equipment/cabling.
It didn't seem like a particularly contentious request to me..Why this thread has developed into conflict bemuses me..:confused:
I care about the job, but I care about getting home on time more :)
I hate when they cut the cable at the isolator and it's 4 floors up, can't put a new cable in so have to do a botch DIY join outside the window.
I don't think he saying any such thing when he originally posted.I think he was merely asking for people not to destroy the equipment and cabling left when services are terminated in case anyone else who may buy or rent the house in future are not inconvenienced unduly and the installers don't have to take twice as long to install said equipment/cabling.
It didn't seem like a particularly contentious request to me..Why this thread has developed into conflict bemuses me..:confused:
Obviously your idea of conflict is different to mine,
Obviously your idea of conflict is different to mine,
Oh I've become quite expert on what constitutes conflict on Cable Forum across the last 10 years. ;)
DJSADERS
17-06-2012, 09:48
Sky techs haven't got quite as much to do per job though, Virgin techs as mentioned have the broadband, tv and phone to setup as well as any cabling, whereas sky techs only have the tv to set up and possibly a dish, as the telephone and broadband (if you can call it that) is done through openreach / BT.
---------- Post added at 09:48 ---------- Previous post was at 09:47 ----------
And with more and more people having more than one tv box installed it a fairly big jop per customer, sometimes huge (3 or more tv boxes)
Do bare in mind that we don't get paid £50 we see barely any most jobs £10 if that.
And hardly anyone pays the £50 fee, as most people argue it.
It is totally acceptable for us to turn up and get the equipment running without cabling, as we have to check signal levels, set the box frequency's, do the telco (which is a 2 stage pain in the ass process), with the tivo it takes 30mins at least to get it going, the broadband takes 10ish mins due to the activation process and then there is the talk through with the customer on how to use everything.
While I actually sympathise with you, the average customer doesn't care what you get paid. They just see that they paid £50. In some cases, they paid £50 for a technician who did a half arsed job and vanished after 20 minutes.
I realise that not all technicians do that, but it has been my experience every time I have had a VM install.
Even when I had the Tivo installed, the technician vanished before the service activated.
And no, I have never done anything to the cable. I've never touched the omnibox either.
MovedGoalPosts
17-06-2012, 12:57
I think the problem here is one of time allocated to the installer, not the actually payment. It doesn't matter what walk of life you are in, you pay one company for something, they will take a big cut and so on down the line until the poor sod at the bottom of the pile actually doing the job gets a pittance.
VM's databases show which properties have once had a cable connection. If you want a service, the database says you already have cable, just needs reactivation. It might allow to run additional internal cable to the new installation location, but certainly they expect an intact cable feed from the street jut to be reconnected perhaps at the cabinet. The installer's time slot is allocated accordingly. If a cable the database says is there isn't then something is going to take a lot longer than allocated and that means delays to customers (especially those later in the day as the installer runs behind) as well as a frustrated installer.
i must say i agree with all that DJSADERS has said, i had a bad day on saturday 6 quad installs { bb, phone, tivo plus extra bos, and all cable had been chopped on were missing .
Davesdealing
30-06-2012, 14:33
Telly Bear, I see you are seriously considering sky? would that mean you will be off? And in doing so would you rip your boxes and bits off your wall?
Just reading DJSADERS posts, seem a fair point to me!
I've been with NTL/VirginMedia from it's inception in Luton, some 20 years, makes me shudder to think how much I've paid them in my time, currently £85 a month! So over that time I've had quite a few techs in my home, they do what we all do, "work for a Living" and want a peaceful enough working day for a fair (or good) wage.
Do you really think the 50 quid "some" pay goes in to their pocket? It's not fair to beef these guys on that..
So with this defence of these super guys... when you come on Tuesday to fit my 1TB Tivo Box, Super Hub with 60Mg Broadband, move my Vbox HD DVR upstairs can you point me in the right direction how to connect my TV in the conservatory to one or the other please :)
DJSADERS
30-06-2012, 16:54
There 3 ways i know of...
1. HDMI splitter and a long hdmi cable
2. Long SCART cable
3. Video sender (i'm sure there are wireless ones :))
I care about the job, but I care about getting home on time more :)
I hate when they cut the cable at the isolator and it's 4 floors up, can't put a new cable in so have to do a botch DIY join outside the window.
Great, there goes the upstream!
Great, there goes the upstream!
Plenty amalgamating tape, had two yesterday, seems to be when the council refurb the houses
Just a quick request and explanation, hopefully other techs will agree with this statement :)
If you choose to leave Virgin Media than please leave the boxes on the wall inside and out (Telephone and DTV Outlets) (This also includes CableTel / ComTel / Telewest / NTL / Cable and Wireless etc...) and please don't cut the cables, when we leave the yards at 7.30am with 6 / 7 sometimes 8 jobs, it causes stress beyond belief, it also causes us not to get home until gone 6pm / 7pm sometimes even later having to recable houses, 9 times out of 10 i would say the cables end up being exactly where they were before!
I understand sometimes they get accidentally broken, thats fine, but choosing to remove the cables puts us techs behind by hours, and just 1 house needing rewiring can add 1- 2 hours onto our day, but imagine 3 or more (Like my route today ¬__¬).
It does no harm leaving them and it means when you choose to rejoin or move installation is quicker and you have a happier tech on your hands.
Thats all :)
I'll do you a deal, I'll put word out to everyone I know about leaving omni boxes and the like alone, if you put word out to all the engineers you know asking very politely to demand VMNG300's instead of S'hubs for BB jobs from the gaffers before driving to your first job. :)
if you put word out to all the engineers you know asking very politely to demand VMNG300's instead of S'hubs for BB jobs from the gaffers before driving to your first job. :)
As they no longer exist that would not be possible, they would be better of asking for a branded modem modem rather than the illegitimate devices called VMNG300 and the Superhub as both are botched devices built by a committee.
Think of them both as racehorses built by a committee where the outcome was a camel.
The VMNG300 is the dromedary and the Superhub is the bactrian.
When NTL fitted my installation, I asked them to route the cables under my floors & to my electric cupboard, where the phone box & modem would be fitted. They fitted a white box on my wall outside & ran the cable down through an air vent, then under the floor to the cupboard. Of course I had thin rope ready to pull the cables through.
The installation is unchanged & untouched, even though I am now on sky.
I wont have any cables looking unsightly, or running round the room, had NTL fitted them that way, I would cut & chuck them too. Should I wish to return to Virgin its a simple matter of swapping plugs into different sockets.
In my experience the cable installers were extremely pleasant & quite happy to comply with my requests. I cannot understand why anyone would want to chop the outside cables though.
Davesdealing
03-07-2012, 13:03
Well...It happened, well nearly, well almost, in fact it never did... I think I've been well and truly tucked up! I now know why you techs say your self employed and don't work for Virgin!
What's easier you may ask? Just an upgrade, you may say.. then he came, he was well pleased with the parking on our drive, He installed the Tivo box in minutes, looks good.. he went upstairs and put in the superhub, albeit I asked if he could put it downstairs, near the box coming from the wall so I can hard wire my mac and smart tv in which is in the front room.. :angel:
No mate, cant do that, im just here to do an upgrade, from exactly where they are to new boxes, to do that it will cost £90 via another booking. Mmm OK.. So that went in, he was here about 9.30am. :tu:
So he went into the bedroom and this is where it went to ratsh1t
The TV is on our facing wall, the Virgin Box on the wardrobe about 4m away connected by coax through RF, the box coming upstairs was my downstairs V+ box, no RF. Virgin supply only a 2m HDMI lead, so the straight swap over that was promised now flawed, no longer was he able to do the straight swap he had told me he was here to do, now he had disconnected and put my samsung box to sleep, and had been taken off the network, I'm told although Virgin charge me for the additional room and installed my old system and this was meant to be a swap, it now cannot be done unless I go out and buy my own cabling. :confused:
So he wasn't prepared or could do anything but leave my upstairs now disconnected and take my V+ box, I said no, you said you were here to swap and make it work on the new upgrade, I certainly don't want to be worse off, so after 6 phone calls to VM and his contractors base my old samsung RF was put back on, they left my V+ box on our bed! :rolleyes:
Why on earth cant virgin provide HDMi leads, they are not expensive anymore, not like they were when they first came out, and the amount they install would be pennies to them, after all they would run coax around the house to get it to work, surely the cost is about the same. I mean not everyone would need a long one, (lead that is).. Gee if the tech had a 6m one on board I would have bought it.. (although at thatstage I nver knew I didnt have a HDMI socket :D ).
He wasn't pleased, I wasn't pleased, he said he has made no money out of this install? Not really my problem? :shrug:But the fact that Virgin put my old system in and offered me this deal, now becomes my problem to fix! :mad:
Eh... to top it all on taking my TV off the wall to check the connections it doesn't have an HDMi bloody socket anyway!!!!! :( and the rf connector ripped away :erm:
Its now 11.30am :td: before we have both given up the will to live :blah: and nobody can sort it, lets move on to the internet... well Ipad2 x 2 Laptop x1 done, laptop 2 not done on his watch, he was now making a slow walk to the door.. :walk:til he got outside:Sprint:
Oi :rant: He's gone, old samsung 10 year old + back on, TV back on wall, V+ Box on Bed (disconnected) Internet on, half a wireless network completed and ye'olde laptop to do.. Best ring Virgin tech peeps, she was :woot:good and that computer is now on..
All in all... :wtf:I thought this was going to be easy peazy.. :banghead:
So, now I need an HDMI splitter, 10m of cable HDMI to HDMI, a new TV, a further 5m HDMI to HDMI, or keep the older tv and use its DVI out to HDMI :tired:
And I chose this over a 12month Friends and Family deal from SKY, everything possible at £46... This one is costing me £75, I have til Thursday to give my months notice... what do you reckon out there in techie world :confused:
why cant you move the box closer to the tv?
As they no longer exist that would not be possible,
CEO's office had a delivery not long back so they do exist still. Very limited numbers mind.
CEO's office had a delivery not long back so they do exist still. Very limited numbers mind.
Refurbs they are still a racehorse designed by a committee that turned out to be a camel.
Very different stock situation as to having that piece of junk for general issue thankfully, unless they bite the bullet and admit their mistake customers will still be issued crap whether its a VMNG300 or the Superhub.
I find it a fruitless exercise to champion such a device as the VMN300 when the are many better devices on the market not restricted to 4 downstreams and some of those devices were tested by the company and probably by people reading this very post.
You should not be requesting an outdated piece of junk rather complaining loudly about being conned into accepting such a device over decent kit.
Now come on how many of you will actually admit that you would have rather paid a premium for a device successfully used by millions worldwide over that cobbled together piece of junk sitting on your desk manufactured by either UBEE or Netgear, now come on be honest as no one wants an inherently crippled device supplying their broadband.
I for one would pay for a Cisco or Motorola device in the full knowledge that it will do exactly as stated on the box not make half hearted attempts as per the above mentioned camels.
Davesdealing
04-07-2012, 01:35
why cant you move the box closer to the tv?
Oh if life was so easy, the bedroom isnt that big, the end of the bed is but 18 inches from the wall, maybe a little more, putting a shelf up above the tv is the only option, the tv is wall mounted with no leads showing as they go into the wall. The facing wall is the feature wall and looks fairly gucci and minimilistic apart from the LED projected light reflecting, the tv and a long mirror the width of the kingsize bed looking back at us. A shelf above would kill it, as would seeing any wires too.
But thanks for asking, like the responses they are all great to hear.
Jonnymeg
04-07-2012, 22:01
Ultimately a customer can do what ever they like. They can cut cables, remove cable or totally remove all VM kit from their house. It is their property.
They pay (or not) for a full install, they are entitled to such.
If you find your day is long because of this then your beef is with your employer and not the customer.
qasdfdsaq
05-07-2012, 20:06
Actually, no. The equipment provided remains the property of Virgin Media, not yourself, and tampering with it is a breach of contract and in some cases the law.
DJSADERS
05-07-2012, 21:45
Ultimately a customer can do what ever they like. They can cut cables, remove cable or totally remove all VM kit from their house. It is their property.
They pay (or not) for a full install, they are entitled to such.
If you find your day is long because of this then your beef is with your employer and not the customer.
Ok i get that... but why are all the BT phone sockets left in tact... i mean they aren't exactly pretty either... sureley they should be cut and removed... same with sky cables...
Actually, no. The equipment provided remains the property of Virgin Media, not yourself, and tampering with it is a breach of contract and in some cases the law.
Oh really? Not everyone thought like that.
The telewest engineer that installed our phone extensions wired them into the BT master socket
Oh really? Not everyone thought like that.
The telewest engineer that installed our phone extensions wired them into the BT master socket
Your only entitled to one socket, the telewest engineer done you a favour
Ok i get that... but why are all the BT phone sockets left in tact... i mean they aren't exactly pretty either... sureley they should be cut and removed... same with sky cables...
When Cable-tel put in ours in.He took out the BT socket & cut the line at the outside of the house.With the words you wont need that anymore :dozey:
27monksbury
06-07-2012, 16:02
Seemed like a resonable request, politely put. If you make a personal critisism of a hard working man trying to do his best. This is cruel and unfair.
Your only entitled to one socket, the telewest engineer done you a favour
One socket you say?
http://imgur.com/XStRF,SZcnf#0
http://i.imgur.com/SZcnf.jpg
;)
qasdfdsaq
07-07-2012, 11:29
From VM.
Jonnymeg
11-07-2012, 21:42
Actually, no. The equipment provided remains the property of Virgin Media, not yourself, and tampering with it is a breach of contract and in some cases the law.
It might well be 'technically' but VM do not appear to take that dim a view of it.
Personally i believe they take a rational viewpoint and accept that customers will do what ever they choose with what is on there property.
A phone socket is neither here nor there and no one is going to waste time and money pursing someone for removing it.
In my house i will do what i please.
I removed all vestiges of BT from my property including the wall bracket and wrapped the overhead cable around the telegraph pole as I no longer required it and no one knocked to tell me otherwise, if they did they would have been told to go a procreate with themselves.
I would not hesitate to do the same with my Virgin Media connections if I no longer subscribed to their service.
why bother?
If its in my way and no longer required and possibly causing issues with my decor or plans why not.
Bit extreme removing a drop cable, easier to leave it burried
Bit extreme removing a drop cable, easier to leave it burried
Removal of anything visual but you already knew that.;)
qasdfdsaq
12-07-2012, 11:51
if they did they would have been told to go a procreate with themselves.
You realise humans are one of the only species for whom sex is not primarily for procreation, right?
You realise humans are one of the only species for whom sex is not primarily for procreation, right?
That is because we enjoy it, right?;)
You realise humans are one of the only species for whom sex is not primarily for procreation, right?
Not entirely correct
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_among_animals
Now I think we'd better get back on topic ;)
Who is topic ? and I was never on her in the first place !
27monksbury
17-07-2012, 16:08
I think this is good advice from a hard working polite tech. The disparaging remarks are intemperate, and unkind.
I think this is good advice from a hard working polite tech. The disparaging remarks are intemperate, and unkind.
If any equipment or cabling is in someones way and not in use why should they not rip it out especially as it is on their property and the company never offered to remove it once they left.
My BT cabling ended up wrapped around their pole and if we disconnected our cable services the internal wall box would bite the dust as well.
deathtrap3000
17-07-2012, 21:00
I watched someone rip up virgin cable from their garden a few months ago after they had switched to bt.
I watched someone rip up virgin cable from their garden a few months ago after they had switched to bt.
I would leave the external cabling as it is unobtrusive but would not worry about it getting chopped anymore.
Jonnymeg
21-07-2012, 23:28
intemperate, and unkind.
Are you for real?
DaHustla
23-07-2012, 22:44
My missus was taking down the ivy from the front of the house and cut the cable...does anyone know what cable.....vm use for install so I can get some...
You can't replace the external cable, it's an odd kind with coax and separate telephone wire running alongside. Not the sort of thnig you can easily pick up in your local Maplin. I'm afraid you have little choice but to phone them up and pay whatever they want for the repair.
Equivalent is hd100 from Webro generally easiest place it's available is eBay
Digital and sat cable also works but isn't up to vm standard.. It's missing a 3rd layer shielding.
Vm cable tri shielded
Digi and sat cable dual shielded
DaHustla
23-07-2012, 23:28
Not entirely correct
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_among_animals
Now I think we'd better get back on topic ;)
You do know that wiki ismade up right
You can't replace the external cable, it's an odd kind with coax and separate telephone wire running alongside. Not the sort of thnig you can easily pick up in your local Maplin. I'm afraid you have little choice but to phone them up and pay whatever they want for the repair.
It's Siamese, it's only telco and catv cable stuck together, you can just get some telco and catv but you might find the telco isn't in use if it goes upstairs
vBulletin® v3.8.11, Copyright ©2000-2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.