detrimental use of your broadband connection

[linwelin]

I got a letter from VM yesterday saying.

detrimental use of your broadband connection

now i am on 50mb i upgraded to it last month, was told it would be an extra £5 a month, well my BB bill is now £45 vm is a bloody rip off! but i am more ****ed off with the letter i received from VM i upgraded mostly because it was suppose to be just an extra £5 but also because its suppose to be UNLIMITED!!! what is the deal with this ? is UNLIMITED not really UNLIMITED ? i had a peak on the official VM forums and there is a long list with people who have also got this letter.

can any VM employee take a look into this matter ?

[weesteev]

Is there not contact details on the letter to discuss this issue? I don't believe that any call centre staff can help with this as there is a specific team in Swansea that deal with this.

[Parlyboy]

Look at the fair usage policy it's all detailed in there. The detrimental use means that you've probably been clogging the pipe in your area during peak time, like I did by downloading Blu Ray's. I got this letter as well

My solution was to do my normal lighter downloads before 9pm and then schedule the chunky download for after 9pm, better still after midnight. I also find that kicking off a big download at 7am before I go to work means it finishes in about 90 mins and doesn't impact on the fair usage policy.

You have to be fair to the neighbours and it'll probably have been one of them complaining that the network was going slow that triggered VM to investigate. Just remember the connection is shared and if you can schedule the downloads for off peak you'll not have an issue.

PB

[Taf]

A reply I received on the same question of "unlimited"

unlimted as it no limits to what you can download. you wont get disconnected for going over a download limit.

The speed is and always has been limited. you can't expect unlimted speeds the speed has always had limits. the traffic volume hasn't.

So in networking terms its unlimted

[linwelin]

Just had a quick look on there site and for 50mb it still says N/A for download limits for the fair useage policy

http://shop.virginmedia.com/help/traffic-management/traffic-management-policy.html

so how can they send this letter to those on 50mb when they states there is no useage policy on that line.

im not going to bother phoning VM all you get is lie after lie with them, i dont think vm employees really know what is going on at vm.

---------- Post added at 13:25 ---------- Previous post was at 13:21 ----------


My solution was to do my normal lighter downloads before 9pm and then schedule the chunky download for after 9pm, better still after midnight. I also find that kicking off a big download at 7am before I go to work means it finishes in about 90 mins and doesn't impact on the fair usage policy.

that is what i do, i hammer the connection late at night, i am a moderate user in the hours they state, but we have 5 PC's 2 xbox's and 1 wii all useing the connection.

[RobboEdin]

Just had a quick look on there site and for 50mb it still says N/A for download limits for the fair useage policy

http://shop.virginmedia.com/help/traffic-management/traffic-management-policy.html

so how can they send this letter to those on 50mb when they states there is no useage policy on that line.

im not going to bother phoning VM all you get is lie after lie with them, i dont think vm employees really know what is going on at vm.

---------- Post added at 13:25 ---------- Previous post was at 13:21 ----------



that is what i do, i hammer the connection late at night, i am a moderate user in the hours they state, but we have 5 PC's 2 xbox's and 1 wii all useing the connection.

STM is simply a component of the FUP.

There is no STM for the faster products but the FUP will still be invoked if your overall use of the shared resource is having a detrimental effect on other users.

[Sirius]

I got a letter from VM yesterday saying.

detrimental use of your broadband connection

now i am on 50mb i upgraded to it last month, was told it would be an extra £5 a month, well my BB bill is now £45 vm is a bloody rip off! but i am more ****ed off with the letter i received from VM i upgraded mostly because it was suppose to be just an extra £5 but also because its suppose to be UNLIMITED!!! what is the deal with this ? is UNLIMITED not really UNLIMITED ? i had a peak on the official VM forums and there is a long list with people who have also got this letter.

can any VM employee take a look into this matter ?

Make sure you ask them what level of usage triggered the letter. How can they send you a letter unless you exceeded a limit that they have set ????

[Parlyboy]

http://help.virginmedia.com/system/selfservice.controller?CONFIGURATION=1002&PARTITION_ID=1&TIMEZONE_OFFSET=&USERTYPE=1&VM_CUSTOMER_TYPE=Cable&CMD=VIEW_ARTICLE&ARTICLE_ID=353053&RELATED_ARTICLE_CLICK=1&RELATED_ARTICLE_NAME=Detrimental%20Users%20Program %20-%20FAQs

This states the detrimental use policy, it applies to all platforms including 50Mb

Not saying that I agree with it just that VM are covered in the small print. Like I said in my earlier post just modifying when you do the bulk downloads solves the issue.

PB

EDIT: Oh and when I spoke to CS they stated it wasn't based on amount download but that I was hogging the local bandwith during peak hours and potentially denying my neighbour their service.

[Sirius]

http://help.virginmedia.com/system/selfservice.controller?CONFIGURATION=1002&PARTITION_ID=1&TIMEZONE_OFFSET=&USERTYPE=1&VM_CUSTOMER_TYPE=Cable&CMD=VIEW_ARTICLE&ARTICLE_ID=353053&RELATED_ARTICLE_CLICK=1&RELATED_ARTICLE_NAME=Detrimental%20Users%20Program %20-%20FAQs

This states the detrimental use policy, it applies to all platforms including 50Mb

Not saying that I agree with it just that VM are covered in the small print. Like I said in my earlier post just modifying when you do the bulk downloads solves the issue.

PB

EDIT: Oh and when I spoke to CS they stated it wasn't based on amount download but that I was hogging the local bandwith during peak hours and potentially denying my neighbour their service.

But there has to be a set point where they decide you are a problem. Bit like the police changing the speed limit each day but not telling you what it is when they issue a speeding fine.

[Fspiders]

You gotta laugh at the nerve of VM. They advertise 50mb and are more than happy to take your money. But if you use the 50mb then they threaten you. If VM can't handle people using a service that they're paying for then they shouldn't provide them with that service.

Imagine Tesco's 10 item only aisle limiting customers to 5 items per customer in peak times and then telling customers that they still have to pay for 10 items even though they are only allowed 5.

VM should not be allowed to charge the full rate for a service they are capping by 75%. VM would soon change there policy if customers got a 75% discount every time they were capped.

They can't cap you on 50mb, so they threaten you. You might as well get the cheaper 30mb and save yourself some money and the threats. If you abuse the system by using what you pay for at least you'll only get capped.

[Boggart]

But there has to be a set point where they decide you are a problem. Bit like the police changing the speed limit each day but not telling you what it is when they issue a speeding fine.

Based upon conversations I have had with others that have had these letters, most of them were able to work out that they were downloading more than 200Gig of data during the hours that Virgin were advising the detrimental use over.

[linwelin]

Based upon conversations I have had with others that have had these letters, most of them were able to work out that they were downloading more than 200Gig of data during the hours that Virgin were advising the detrimental use over.

if you are talking about in a day, there is no way i download anywhere near that each day, for a total of 24 hours i would probably download around 25 to 30 gig, which to be honest is not a lot.

VM say its unlimited when it is clearly not, you can throw all this FUP rubbish at me all you want, but its not truly unlimited!

---------- Post added at 17:53 ---------- Previous post was at 17:51 ----------

You might as well get the cheaper 30mb and save yourself some money and the threats. If you abuse the system by using what you pay for at least you'll only get capped.

when i phoned to upgrade my BB i was actually wanting there 30mb service, since i was one of the lucky ones to get my superhub free i though heck ill just get the free upgrade to the 30mb i was also on DOCIS 3 and acording to VM own FAQ on there forum i was entitled to the free upgrade, but the person i was speaking to said he could not give me it for free and that i had to pay £30 activation fee. He said instead he could offer me the 50mb for an extra £5 a month, but even that has not materialized lol VM bloody joke.

[Boggart]

if you are talking about in a day, there is no way i download anywhere near that each day, for a total of 24 hours i would probably download around 25 to 30 gig, which to be honest is not a lot.

VM say its unlimited when it is clearly not, you can throw all this FUP rubbish at me all you want, but its not truly unlimited!

---------- Post added at 17:53 ---------- Previous post was at 17:51 ----------



when i phoned to upgrade my BB i was actually wanting there 30mb service, since i was one of the lucky ones to get my superhub free i though heck ill just get the free upgrade to the 30mb i was also on DOCIS 3 and acording to VM own FAQ on there forum i was entitled to the free upgrade, but the person i was speaking to said he could not give me it for free and that i had to pay £30 activation fee. He said instead he could offer me the 50mb for an extra £5 a month, but even that has not materialized lol VM bloody joke.

No, not per day.. I think it is a months worth of downloads during the hours up to 9PM.

With regards the upgrade to 30Meg.. As you say if you already have the SuperHub there should be no charge.. You should complain!

[Nopanic]

Is there not contact details on the letter to discuss this issue? I don't believe that any call centre staff can help with this as there is a specific team in Swansea that deal with this.

Liverpool..

[Peter_]

Liverpool..
Who?

[Nopanic]

Who?

2nd line take the call from those letters .. abuse and such ..

[Ignitionnet]

Best tell the Internet Security Team in Wales that, they might like to know that ex-Telewest second line technical support are taking their calls :)

---------- Post added at 19:14 ---------- Previous post was at 19:12 ----------

if you are talking about in a day, there is no way i download anywhere near that each day, for a total of 24 hours i would probably download around 25 to 30 gig, which to be honest is not a lot.

Given it's as much as most people use in a month it is a lot whichever way you look at it.

Again not saying I agree with it but if you think 750 - 900GB / month is not a lot you're going to be in a tiny minority.

VM don't charge enough for their 50Mb to keep it totally unlimited. If you want that kind of usage VM just can't be recommended, try Be Unlimited or Sky.

[Nopanic]

Best tell the Internet Security Team in Wales that, they might like to know that ex-Telewest second line technical support are taking their calls :)[COLOR="Silver"]

Don't think they are an inbound department, could be wrong though..

[Boggart]

Best tell the Internet Security Team in Wales that, they might like to know that ex-Telewest second line technical support are taking their calls :)[COLOR="Silver"]

---------- Post added at 19:14 ---------- Previous post was at 19:12 ----------



I think Internet Security in Wales are responsible for monitoring and getting the letters sent out, but as the VM Staffer advised, I am pretty sure the calls generated by those letters go to 2nd Line in Albert Dock.

[candy1567]

it actually states in the detrimental use policy that if u download 350 gig in a 28 day period between the hours of 9am to 9pm then u will recieve one of these letters.

(tried to put the link in to the detrimetal use policy but couldn't lol, but its on a post in the first page)

[Sigma]

it actually states in the detrimental use policy that if u download 350 gig in a 28 day period between the hours of 9am to 9pm then u will recieve one of these letters.
It does indeed: -

The customers we have contacted so far have an average peak time usage (between 0900 and 2100) of over 350GB in 28 days. That’s equivalent to downloading 56,000 music tracks or 318 movies or 227 hours (9.5 days) of HD iPlayer content.
But that 350GB figure is an average, and it does then go on to say that they don't have a set figure and it's down to whether your particular usage is affecting other customers in your area.

[Nopanic]

Best tell the Internet Security Team in Wales that, they might like to know that ex-Telewest second line technical support are taking their calls :)

---------- Post added at 19:14 ---------- Previous post was at 19:12 ----------



Given it's as much as most people use in a month it is a lot whichever way you look at it.

Again not saying I agree with it but if you think 750 - 900GB / month is not a lot you're going to be in a tiny minority.

VM don't charge enough for their 50Mb to keep it totally unlimited. If you want that kind of usage VM just can't be recommended, try Be Unlimited or Sky.

Defo not Swansea mate .. :woot:

[linwelin]

It does indeed: -


But that 350GB figure is an average, and it does then go on to say that they don't have a set figure and it's down to whether your particular usage is affecting other customers in your area.

but how is anyone suppose to know that lol

if i shift all my downloads to after 9pm and stop them all at 9am will i still get a Detrimental Usage letter ?

so if i was for talk sake to download 700 gig in one night between 9pm and 9am would i be getting sent a Detrimental Usage Letter ? or does anything downloaded after 9pm not count ?

[AdamD]

Oh my, that's not good then, my router tells me I downloaded.....



June 2011 (Incoming: 540542 MB / Outgoing: 148902 MB)

540gb? That can't be right, or am I reading it wrong? heh

[Nopanic]

527GB, but it depends on your area, if no one else is using their connections, it appears nothing is triggered.

[kwikbreaks]

At what physical level does one users excessive load start impacting others?

Optical node?
CMTS card?
CMTS?

How many connections would that represent?

[Nopanic]

At what physical level does one users excessive load start impacting others?

Optical node?
CMTS card?
CMTS?

How many connections would that represent?

If it's not on VM site, its not been released for public knowledge.

That's not be being funny, but if I were to share something VM didn't want sharing I would lose my job. That's not to say I know.

[qasdfdsaq]

It's not particularly sensitive information nor is it hard to figure out - and there's plenty of information not on the website that VM have no problem with people knowing so that in itself isn't really a defining factor.

[kenoliver]

Based upon conversations I have had with others that have had these letters, most of them were able to work out that they were downloading more than 200Gig of data during the hours that Virgin were advising the detrimental use over.

So how do I stand with this?

Last week I downloaded a box set series from iTunes about 40 gig :erm:

we are watching it via our Apple TV, within the next few days we will have gone through the set and will download the next series

Again this will be about 40 gig, if I carry on doing this until we have watched all the series, at what point am I likely to get told off? :shocked:

I decided to go for 30 meg BB just so I could do this, rather than buy the shows online or via the high street, did I get that wrong :confused:

I thought I had read all the T&C's regarding unlimited Downloads, were did I miss the relevant part regarding these letters :(

[Ignitionnet]

At what physical level does one users excessive load start impacting others?

Optical node?
CMTS card?
CMTS?

How many connections would that represent?

CMTS ports?

How many connections depends. In areas like mine there's over 250 of them on the one upstream so across the four upstreams connected to the downstream group 500 - 1000.

So if I were to cane upstream and cause problems I'd be affecting about 250 people, if I were to do the same to downstream then more.

Of course my response would be to ask what they are doing cramming more people onto an upstream port selling the tiers they do than ntl were back when I worked for them like 7 years ago and the top upstream was 300kbps.

[kwikbreaks]

Thanks.

So VM have monitoring running right down to that level then. Given that close eye on their network how come they let capacity problems build to the point where it takes them months to fix while all the time selling connections to new punters?

[Ignitionnet]

Thanks.

So VM have monitoring running right down to that level then. Given that close eye on their network how come they let capacity problems build to the point where it takes them months to fix while all the time selling connections to new punters?

Because what they consider a capacity problem and what you or I might consider a capacity problem are quite different things.

CMTS port is the last intelligent point on the cable network before the subscribers so for sure they and every other cable company in the world will have visibility of the utilisation on them.

Capacity upgrades can take a while to complete, VM don't care about signing subscribers up in areas where they know there are capacity problems.

[theoldbill]

Had a curious side-discussion with 2nd line last week about capacity etc, and the guy told me they handle detrimental use calls where customers are leeching 300-400gig *PER DAY*. I'd be so tempted to come out and ask them what the hell they're up to at that level of usage!

He also said he hadn't (up to that point) handled any 100meg customers who had received letters...

[kwikbreaks]

I'd be tempted to ask how the hell they manage that...

http://www.betaarchive.co.uk/download_arrival.php
(2+3) Downloading for 1 day(s) at 5000 KB/s will use approx. 411.99 GB

If they do then unless they are on 100Mbps (and the VM bod said they weren't) then the downloads clearly weren't slowing their connection down by much so I'd be tempted to ask why they seem to be getting priority over all the other users who apparently are being slowed down.

(In short I call BS)

[theoldbill]

I'd be tempted to ask how the hell they manage that...

http://www.betaarchive.co.uk/download_arrival.php
(2+3) Downloading for 1 day(s) at 5000 KB/s will use approx. 411.99 GB

If they do then unless they are on 100Mbps (and the VM bod said they weren't) then the downloads clearly weren't slowing their connection down by much so I'd be tempted to ask why they seem to be getting priority over all the other users who apparently are being slowed down.

(In short I call BS)

Yes you could argue that if contention was so bad then their own speeds should suffer also.

Reminds me of the 'bad boy pipes' on adsl that Plusnet used to put you on in the early days for heavy downloaders (i.e. let them battle with themselves for bandwidth).

[Nopanic]

It's not particularly sensitive information nor is it hard to figure out - and there's plenty of information not on the website that VM have no problem with people knowing so that in itself isn't really a defining factor.

Sadly I don't work for you.

[kwikbreaks]

I also realise that I put the wrong number in - 50Mbps is ~ 6MBps at full tilt not 5000KBps but apart from it being unlikely any source could deliver 6MBps 24x7 my error isn't that great and my argument is unchanged.

(2+3) Downloading for 1 day(s) at 6 MB/s will use approx. 506.25 GB

[Ignitionnet]

Had a curious side-discussion with 2nd line last week about capacity etc, and the guy told me they handle detrimental use calls where customers are leeching 300-400gig *PER DAY*. I'd be so tempted to come out and ask them what the hell they're up to at that level of usage!

He also said he hadn't (up to that point) handled any 100meg customers who had received letters...

Interesting how even though they can far more easily affect their local area, they eat half the local capacity in one direction and more than half in the other, 100M customers are being left alone for now.

Isn't like they pay that much more, £10 per month for twice the bandwidth.

Oh well, never claimed to understand VM's policies, they're an example of what happens when marketing, capacity planning and engineering collide.

---------- Post added at 14:57 ---------- Previous post was at 14:54 ----------

I'd be tempted to ask how the hell they manage that...

http://www.betaarchive.co.uk/download_arrival.php
(2+3) Downloading for 1 day(s) at 5000 KB/s will use approx. 411.99 GB

If they do then unless they are on 100Mbps (and the VM bod said they weren't) then the downloads clearly weren't slowing their connection down by much so I'd be tempted to ask why they seem to be getting priority over all the other users who apparently are being slowed down.

(In short I call BS)

It's how TCP works. The more connections you have open the bigger the slice of the bandwidth you get (well you get more of the same size slices really), so you can comfortably crowd out other people while seeing minimal impact yourself. Simples.

[kwikbreaks]

So do you believe that there are some VM customers using 400GB a day?

[Dave9946]

As a victim of these letters ourselfs I was told some interesting things by the security department over the issue.

First off there is no way they will tell you what useage triggered the letters as the guy in the security department told me that detailed information for peak hours dont for the time period that a customer would get in touch with them with reguards to the letter exist as that information is not stored after that time. Was also told that they have no records to the exact dates the letter covers anyway as there system does not keep or store that information. Also the only information they could provide that far back would be based on an average per hour by total useage over a 24 hour period. So in effect they would only currently be able to provide information for peak hours as an average based on what you would also have downloaded during offpeak hours to. Say 100GB off peak and 20GB peak would be 120GB giving a peak useage of 60GB based on total useage devided by per hour. I might be wrong but I'll bet nodoby from VM will suggest anything otyherwise with reguards to this?

When asked as to why the details of useage and the dates related to the letter are not given in the letter the guy in the security department would not go into that side of things, I really have to wander why not?.

Interesting again is that they did confirm that it would be an easy process to speed cap "offenders" instead of sending these letters out after a certain useage. But it was decided that the letter writing process is a far more effective process for virgin to free up capacity than speed capping. When asked what the message is suggesting with reguards the the 50MB connection the guy refused to offer an opinion even though a member of the CEO did say it's advertised for more useage, which it's clearly not.

Also this AUP is a total load of crap as no matter whats said it's not covered in there terms as if it were they would not allow a customer (who they claim to be only 5 month into a new contract) to leave without a penalty charge and without giving any 30 day notice as they would at least try to change the the superhub thats only had 5 months use!. I really must go back to my past posts on the issue because there is possably something there I said that virgin read because they were very quick to let us go over?.

Also how would the AUP cover or apply where a given connection is over subscribed so VM sign more customers up because even though it's over subscribed there is apparent spare capacity because people are not fully using the bandwidth during the day. If new customers then did start to use the service how is the AUP applicable to fairly borderline customers who are fine but then getting a letter because the capacity has gone up and the AUP trigger has caught up a load of perfectly reasonable bandwidth users. That could happen a number of times to the same customers if virgin keep signing up new customers for that connection\line. And some claim the AUP is covered in there policy?????, I very much doubt it.

[kwikbreaks]

Also this AUP is a total load of crap as no matter whats said it's not covered in there terms as if it were they would not allow a customer (who they claim to be only 5 month into a new contract) to leave without a penalty charge and without giving any 30 day notice.That one is reasonably easy to understand. Getting high usage customers off the network may well defer an upgrade. I doubt they would bother trying to keep a potentially loss making customer.

[Dave9946]

That one is reasonably easy to understand. Getting high usage customers off the network may well defer an upgrade. I doubt they would bother trying to keep a potentially loss making customer.

Not as such it's about wanting paying customers to not use the service so they can keep over subscribing to customers who dont really use the service during the day. Untill such a point where VM provide actual figures I and others can reserve the right to not be accused of being excesive users because they have never yet provided any letter receipient of these letters with the bandwidth details they have used and have admitted they dont hold\have the information by the earliest time a letter receipient could get in touch with them over the matter.

[kwikbreaks]

VM are the ones running the business. If retaining a customer was more profitable for them than losing that customer then imo they'd retain them. They may not give you the relevant data but I don't believe that they haven't got it themselves.

[Dave9946]

They may not give you the relevant data but I don't believe that they haven't got it themselves.

I'd have thought that myself but seeing as it's the internet security people who send the letters out and who assumingly monitor the useage then to be told by them they dont have such detailed information by the first chance a customer contacts them over it indicated they have reasons to never tell a customer the details.

So either they do have the information and lie to customers who ask for it for any given reason or it's as I was told and they have a deliberate policy to delete the detailed "detrimental" part and store as a 24 hour only useage than a hour by hour useage.

[Ignitionnet]

So do you believe that there are some VM customers using 400GB a day?

Certainly.

[qasdfdsaq]

I did 500GB once just to try it.

[kwikbreaks]

So do you believe that there are some VM customers using 400GB a day?
Certainly.
I'm gobsmacked. I can easily believe qasdfdsaq's one-off but to persist at that level on a regular basis shows some remarkable tenacity.

[Ignitionnet]

I'm gobsmacked. I can easily believe qasdfdsaq's one-off but to persist at that level on a regular basis shows some remarkable tenacity.

It's quite easy. Newsgroups.

[imranm]

400GB per day, every day on average will be around say ~12TB/mth

Where are people storing all of this data that they're allegedly downloading and when do they get chance to go through it all etc

I do a fair amount, usually HD movies etc but seriously, don't some folk have day jobs, a life :D

[kwikbreaks]

It's quite easy. Newsgroups.It wasn't where to get it it was what the hell you'd do with it all. A full BlueRay is ~ 25GB so 400GB would be 16 BlueRays which is > 24hrs worth of video. If lower quality is acceptable then 720p is ~ 5GB so you'd have 80 of those. Now I know Hollywood+Bollywood don't release 80 movies a day so I guess it must mostly be pr0n - unless my mum was telling me porkies serious vision defects would surely follow.

[imranm]

Fair enough even if they do download large amounts of video content when do they watch it all?

[Milambar]

I don't mind admitting that since reading about this, I have become afraid to actually use my connection for a few simple reasons.

1) I'm too far away from a digitally enabled exchange to get anything more than 256kbps ADSL according to the sam knows tool.
2) I rely on my internet connection to keep in touch with my friends via msn (phones don't wok, I'm deaf).

So, since reading about these "detrimental use" messes, I have stopped downloading anything, no games from STEAM, no non-essential game patches, no music from iTunes, and I have stopped uploading my photogaphs to my photobucket and sharing my pictures was something I used to enjoy.

I simply can't afford to risk my internet connection.

As such, I feel it to be heavy handed and extremely unfair of VM, and feel that the limits should be published so that we can abide by them, and not be afraid to use our connections.

[Dave9946]

As such, I feel it to be heavy handed and extremely unfair of VM, and feel that the limits should be published so that we can abide by them, and not be afraid to use our connections.

They dont publish there limit on the pretence that they dont know what they are untill you have gone beyond them and triggered the letter, yeah right. Yet they knowingly and suspiciously neglect to state within the detrimental letters to the dates in question and actual useage in question. Even after that at the earliest point you could contact the security department over the useage figures they will tell you they dont have them and dont keep such detailed useage figures for that long. Another member seems to think yes they do have them. But it's got to be asked why the lie of not having the useage figures by the department who monitors your useage in the first place?. They clearly have a motive for never providing the useage figures either within ther letter or upon request. As untill anyone else can say otherwise there has never to date been any known person who upon request has ever been provided with the apparent detrimental useage figures for the peak time period that triggered the letter.

Anyone who works for VM care to offer an opinion as to why the company does not detail the useage at the time in the letter or to why customers are told they dont hold the figures when the security department is contacted to have them requested when it's almost certain they do still have those figures?.

[imranm]

I don't mind admitting that since reading about this, I have become afraid to actually use my connection for a few simple reasons.

1) I'm too far away from a digitally enabled exchange to get anything more than 256kbps ADSL according to the sam knows tool.
2) I rely on my internet connection to keep in touch with my friends via msn (phones don't wok, I'm deaf).

So, since reading about these "detrimental use" messes, I have stopped downloading anything, no games from STEAM, no non-essential game patches, no music from iTunes, and I have stopped uploading my photogaphs to my photobucket and sharing my pictures was something I used to enjoy.

I simply can't afford to risk my internet connection.

As such, I feel it to be heavy handed and extremely unfair of VM, and feel that the limits should be published so that we can abide by them, and not be afraid to use our connections.

You're paying good money for your Internet connection so don't be reluctant to use it :) From the activities you've described I highly doubt you'll be reaching anywhere near "detrimental" use (even though no one can say with certainty what that figure is)! Download away... :D

[kenoliver]

unless my mum was telling me porkies serious vision defects would surely follow.

Gota be the quote of the week :)

You just can't beat quality humour (outstanding) :cool:

---------- Post added at 11:49 ---------- Previous post was at 11:42 ----------

I don't mind admitting that since reading about this, I have become afraid to actually use my connection for a few simple reasons.

1) I'm too far away from a digitally enabled exchange to get anything more than 256kbps ADSL according to the sam knows tool.
2) I rely on my internet connection to keep in touch with my friends via msn (phones don't wok, I'm deaf).

So, since reading about these "detrimental use" messes, I have stopped downloading anything, no games from STEAM, no non-essential game patches, no music from iTunes, and I have stopped uploading my photogaphs to my photobucket and sharing my pictures was something I used to enjoy.

I simply can't afford to risk my internet connection.

As such, I feel it to be heavy handed and extremely unfair of VM, and feel that the limits should be published so that we can abide by them, and not be afraid to use our connections.

Maybe a bit over the top to stop uploading photo's

But this is a fair point to make,

Although I still use my connection for normal use, I have postponed downloading a box set of TV programmes from iTunes (40 GB) until I can get some definitive ruling on this

Customer should be able to get some guidance, and not just receive a letter like this, out of the blue

[kwikbreaks]

I have postponed downloading a box set of TV programmes from iTunes (40 GB) until I can get some definitive ruling on this They always quote 9 til 9 as peak hours. Starting a download after 9pm shouldn't by rights trigger any letters (although I've seen claims it can).

Most of the time if I want to download anything sizeable I schedule it to start at midnight as I have a PC which runs 24x7 anyway. I certainly wouldn't let this policy stand in my way of using the connection any way I want apart from that. I think it's just a question of not taking the mickey. That said looking back over my usage I haven't done 500GB in a month let alone a day - I don't need 50Mbps for sure but as it was only £5 dearer than 20Mbps at the time and came with a freebie Superhub with dual band N wireless and a gigabit switch it looked a good deal (Oh for a damned crystal ball).

[kenoliver]

They always quote 9 til 9 as peak hours. Starting a download after 9pm shouldn't by rights trigger any letters (although I've seen claims it can).

Most of the time if I want to download anything sizeable I schedule it to start at midnight as I have a PC which runs 24x7 anyway. I certainly wouldn't let this policy stand in my way of using the connection any way I want apart from that. I think it's just a question of not taking the mickey. That said looking back over my usage I haven't done 500GB in a month let alone a day - I don't need 50Mbps for sure but as it was only £5 dearer than 20Mbps at the time and came with a freebie Superhub with dual band N wireless and a gigabit switch it looked a good deal (Oh for a damned crystal ball).

Thanks for that may try starting it off at midnight on the next download

My Mac is on 24/7 so that would make sense

Still waiting for a reply from VM as to were I stand with it, so will wait and see

[Mick Fisher]

They always quote 9 til 9 as peak hours. Starting a download after 9pm shouldn't by rights trigger any letters (although I've seen claims it can).

Most of the time if I want to download anything sizeable I schedule it to start at midnight as I have a PC which runs 24x7 anyway. I certainly wouldn't let this policy stand in my way of using the connection any way I want apart from that. I think it's just a question of not taking the mickey. That said looking back over my usage I haven't done 500GB in a month let alone a day - I don't need 50Mbps for sure but as it was only £5 dearer than 20Mbps at the time and came with a freebie Superhub with dual band N wireless and a gigabit switch it looked a good deal (Oh for a damned crystal ball).
:LOL:
Exactly what I thought about 20 to 30meg :D

[qasdfdsaq]

Single mode dual band though, so it can use one band or the other but not both.

[beasty54]

They always quote 9 til 9 as peak hours. Starting a download after 9pm shouldn't by rights trigger any letters (although I've seen claims it can).


I think everyone is pretty safe to be downloading whatever they want between 9pm and 9am. I had 2 letters last year so i stopped downloading between 9am and 9pm unless its something i really need, even then i make sure i set a limit of 10gb during peak times. I'm still downloading between 750gb and 1TB a month but i make sure 90% of it is downloaded off peak so i don't have any more letters from VM, so far they have left me alone.

[Ignitionnet]

That XBox content really adds up huh.

---------- Post added at 20:42 ---------- Previous post was at 20:40 ----------

Fair enough even if they do download large amounts of video content when do they watch it all?

Some planks download just because they can. Don't feel they're getting their monies worth if they aren't running flat out.

[Kymmy]

Can I remind members that if you can't be civil towards each other then either leave the thread or use the ignore feature. Last post removed

[kwikbreaks]

Single mode dual band though, so it can use one band or the other but not both.
I can't use either on mine now - both of them are serving their most useful function so far as loft insulation :).

[Kymmy]

Can I also remind members that if you have an issue with any moderator requests that it should be discussed in private with the team member or any other member of the moderation team.

[beasty54]

That XBox content really adds up huh.


Indeed it does, luckily money is no issue so i just have to get it all.

[Ignitionnet]

Indeed it does, luckily money is no issue so i just have to get it all.

Goodo, no need to clock up a few hundred GB per month of torrents then. :)

[beasty54]

Goodo, no need to torrent then. :)

Nope not at all, absolutely no need.

[Ignitionnet]

Nope not at all, absolutely no need.

Not really relevant to the thread but given the XBox can only hold 250GB do you have an expansion kit of some sort?

I'd love one if such an option existed.

[Sirius]

I tend to stream most of my stuff now instead of using the newsgroups and i would never use torrents. By using a good vpn it is very easy to watch live stuff straight from the states. UK channels are covered pretty well by the various players that have sprung up over the last year. I don't even have a paid for newsgroup account anymore as i don't need it. The best bit is i dont have to have my media centre server running all the time anymore that stored all my downloaded content. :) happy days

[beasty54]

Not really relevant to the thread but given the XBox can only hold 250GB do you have an expansion kit of some sort?

I'd love one if such an option existed.

Nope, thats the beauty of a 50mb connection, once my HDD is full i can delete older games and content and then if i ever feel the need to play them again i'll re-download them.