I can't get cable but my neighbours can.

[trevbroughton]

Ok, this is the situation:

I live in a block with up to twelve flats / offices. Their are about eight retail units beneath the flats / offices.

The whole building is owned by the same landlord.

The land registry title register actually list the whole block as one address / register.

One flat in the block has cable services, I believe they have them installed although the currrent tenant might not be using them, from the outside I have identified where they go.

The whole block has about 4 covers round it labelled CATV, which appear to have ducting underneath them, 2 of them under windows of my flat.

I have tried to register with virgin, but the only address listed for my postcode is the one other flat in my block that already has cable. Anyway I click the link that says something like 'Because your address is not listed we will need to take some more information', (this takes you to the spotters form).

However I have lived in this property for just about 12 months, and have tried this form perhaps as much as eight times dispersed throughout that time and still heard nothing back.

Just incase you were wondering the flat that is connected up is no further than 200 metres away as the cable would run, and my guess is its considerable less than that, however that flat is furthest from mine.

So I was wondering if anyone else who has had similar experiences and could help.

I can take pictures and attach them to the thread if anyone is interested.

[Kymmy]

Welcome to the forum

You may find that there isn't a spare cable available and no space in the ducting to get a new one in.

[trevbroughton]

I understand your response but that seems unlikely as if I try to place an order for a property to the opposite side of me to the one that can get cable it says thats fine.

The big manhole like cover that says CATV on it is also immediately below my living room window.

[zing_deleted]

you really need to get a spotter out to have a look and at least then you should be given a reason. I see you have tried this a few times though and been ignored.

[trevbroughton]

I have put in yet another spotters form, it said they will contact me within 72 hours. Though it said that many times before.

[zing_deleted]

I could call them and become the squeaky wheel

[trevbroughton]

Your welcome to try, I have also phoned them and heard every excuse going, including:

Your property has been blacklisted.
Your building has been blacklisted.
We have been refused entry in the past.
Your property is unsuitable.

Some of those might make sense if they hadn't already installed into the building before or the building was locked.

and one girl was extremely confused and thought I wanted to change my address on their system, after I was put through to Customer Services by Sales; and she kept asking and asking for my account number.

[trevbroughton]

Just heard back from spotters, odd todays request responded to within hours, yet others not for weeks. Anyway he says I am good to go just need permission from landlord / neighbouring tenants.

[jungleguy]

Just heard back from spotters, odd todays request responded to within hours, yet others not for weeks. Anyway he says I am good to go just need permission from landlord / neighbouring tenants.

That might be because the spotter actually got your details!

[trevbroughton]

Seems that way to be honest. The spotter said I will be only the third connection in this road. He said he had been inundated with requests for my street. Guessing most if not all were for this flat.

The sales rep in the local shopping centre who originally tried to sign me up, has apparently been faxing off a spotters form for my flat 3 times a week.

I guess they ignore most the spotters requests or they go in the wrong direction somehow.

Just for the record, must have completed the spotters form online over 8 times, over the phone with a sales rep 3 times and left a message on that VM thing once. Plus the sales rep in the shopping centre who has been faxing the form 3 times a week.

Maybe all the forms have reached him at once.

---------- Post added at 12:37 ---------- Previous post was at 12:35 ----------

Also a point to note, the spotter called me from Hemel Hempstead, I am in High Wycombe.

The decision that they can install is based on pictures from Google streetview.

[trevbroughton]

Latest Update:

Virgin Media are only willing to install, directly up the front wall of the building, according to the Spotter.

Landlord would like cable to run along with other cables for both BT, Virgin and all the sky dishes.

My thoughts, the landlord is being a little awkward yes, but to run the cable along the back is not unachievable and would definitely make more sense, would also make it easier to connect more flats up if necessary at a later date.

As an alternative the landlord might be willibng to allow the cable to be taken in at ground level below my flat to the rear and be connected into my flat this way.

Is there some sort of maximum length the cable can be? I don't think either of these routes would be fantastically long, I will post the cable lengths I reckon they'd be if anyones interested.

Coincidently running the cable along the back wall should prevent the need for virgin to run the cable under the pavement as their is an existing connection.

I would be willing to run the cable if supplied by virgin along the back wall to the existing Brown Box and into my flat which would mean all they need to do is terminate the cables at both ends.

Is there anyway to get this situation progressed?

[weesteev]

At the end of the day this appears to be down to the decision of the landlord, not an uncommon problem when fitting cable these days. Without the correct wayleave agreements from the landlord then Virgin wont connect the property.

As for cable lengths, there is no maximum or minimum length of cable to feed a property, there are different grades of siamese coax that can be used depending on the distance.

Is it your entire block that cannot get service or just yourself?

Hope this helps

[trevbroughton]

Saturday I received a wayleave form from the spotter which I passed to the landlord's agent. The agent called me and asked me to confirm where the cable would run so I emailed them the attached pictures.

I heard back today, the landlord has apparently walked up and down the street and confirmed that I can have cable. He says the cable can't be fitted on the front as in the pictures but can be fitted on the rear. Which is an alleyway down the back of the building towards the other flat in the block which has cable.

He is not happy with signing the wayleave form which I quote is "because it is not them taking out the service and it does not specify where the cables will run." Apparently they will "hapily produce a signed letter on landlords headed paper stating the cable may be ran along the rear of the building and any damage to the fabric of the building must be put right at mine / VM expense." depending on whether I or VM install the cable.

Like I say there is one flat in the block which already has cable so I am at a loss as to why I can't; also presumably they would have also had to have wayleave.

Would some pictures help?

Below is the email I sent the agent and I have attached the relevant PDF:
Hi

Attached is a PDF of some Google Streetview shots with approx cable routes.

FYI, the cable would be no thicker than 10mm and is essentially an aerial cable, this would run from one of two ducts in the pavement (immediately below my flat) both situated between the retail units at ground level, would run straight up the wall and come out in my flat just above skirting board level.

Neither of the cable routes should be particularly noticable.

If these do cause problems I can see two further possibilities for routing the cable.

1. Take the cable into the building near ground level and through communal entrance hall at ground level to rear of block and enter flat though rear wall. (In order to do this cable could be run through false ceiling)

2. Existing Virgin Media connections to flat X and X which come out in at the end of the back alley could be potentially used to supply my flat, it would be a significantly longer cable run which VM might not be too keen on but definitely possible to neatly route a cable this way to my flat,

I note their are existing Virgin cables on the frontage of other buildings on X Street so don't think a route up the front should be unacceptable.

If you do wish for me to make myself available to show someone from Crendon Properties the possible routes in more detail I would be happy to do so.

Trev Broughton

PS I monitor this mailbox 9-5 M-F and the CC'd mailbox at all times, so an email reply is fine.

[weesteev]

The route all sounds fine, is that the front or rear of the property though?

Also the cable wont be 10mm thick as its not just Coax thats run up to your property but a Siamese cable which is up to 18mm thick.

Your are right in saying that if other properties in the street are fed this way then it shouldnt be a problem, the netowrk was probably built with that in mind (Tee's feeding from the front of the buildings) but permission was never granted for install shence the reason the properties are listed as "unserviceable".

Hopefully you get things sorted, looks like its moving in the right direction now though.

[trevbroughton]

Sadly the route in those photo's is the front of the property which is what the landlord has turned down, hence the issue.

They have not turned down the alternate routes I suggested but the feedback from the spotter is that VM will not do those routes. One being to take the cable straight into the building by that grey goor immediately above the ducting and stright through the building to the rear and upto my flat, which might be mutually acceptable but undiscussed.

And the other which landlord says they will agree in writing if acceptable to VM is to take the cable straight along the back from existing connections to the other connected flat in the block towards my flat.

I will see if I can get some approximates for what the cable length would be and some pictures.

Sadly I think I am being penalised for doing the right thing because I can see other flats that are on the opposite side of the street and have the same landlord which have a cable run straight up the front.

Sadly this last bit is somewhat of a rant:

Unfortunately unless someone in VM can connect me up legally I have been left with 3 options - none of which am I too keen on.

1. run the cable which I would only be able to connect up illegally - if I wanted to do that I would have already.
2. get sky - defies the point as I want the fast broadband from VM and the on-demand telly.
3a. move home, which wont fix the issue unless i leave this town as its only got a very small percentage covered by Virgin.

---------- Post added at 22:20 ---------- Previous post was at 21:48 ----------

I guess what I need to happen is to have someone actually come out and look, which is yet to happen.

Probably a silly question but one of some importance does wayleave have to be given on Virgin Media's special form or would the letter I described be enough if it would I will get them to go ahead and write it.

[weesteev]

Wayleave in itself is a permission for VM to install, access and maintain its network on a building or peice of land, without it we run the risk of problems in future. As its stands, an install couldnt be done without it.

If the wayleave agreement needs to be amended then our wayleave team can liaise with your landlord and work out whats required if the T&C's on the form are not specific enough to what the landlord requires. At the end of the day, as long as both parties are happy then there shouldn't be a problem.

One thing to consider... even if you completed the cable run yourself, the property still wouldn't be saleable for service as we still wouldn't have a wayleave agreement, so I would seriously advise against this.

My advice at this stage is speak with your landlord and see what concerns they have about the proposed cable install to the front of the property and let me know, I can speak with our wayleave team and see what can be arranged. Also, can you PM me your address and postcode and I can check out what would be required for an install to the rear of the property.

Thanks

[trevbroughton]

I was not proposing avoiding wayleave just assisting Virgin Media in complying with the landlords request.

Seems the landlord is concerned that by signing the wayleave he is putting the company name to something? (The landlord is a Limited company) I thought that was the precise point. Though apparently they would be happy to agree in writing for cables to be installed at the rear. It might be that he requires a little educating in the subject.

I am trying to work out if the landlord is trying to be awkward.

I guess that if a wayleave was produced that specified the cables would run where he would prefer some gentle arm twisting would be more likely to get it signed.

[weesteev]

Hi Trev

Thanks for the address details you sent. I do have one query though... how do you propose we install to the rear of the property? From what I can see this would be impossible as we have no way of getting a duct route to the rear of the property. Any property with service in this street should be fed from the front as that is where all our access network is located.

From a construction point of view, there is nothing we could do to change the entry point for the cable connection, I believe the spotter was correct in saying our only option would be access from the front of the property. The issue now is down to wayleave only, I would suggest you find out exactly what the issue is with the landlord giving permission and give me a shout. Hopefully we can sort it out from there.

Thanks

[trevbroughton]

I have attached the somewhat longer route the cable would need to run down the rear of the property.

I reckon including internal cabling this would not be more than 60metres so it would definitely be possible with 1x 100metre roll.

Is there any chance it would happen?

[weesteev]

Hmm, 100m is a conservative estimate but also based mostly on Internal cabling (from the Isolator to the final device) and not such a large distance being external, that just seems too long to provide service.

The main problem I can see for this installation i show it would be fitted and what access the tech's would need to fit this, not only that but gaining the relevant permissions to do such a job as this install breaches many flats to serve yours. Also if it does go ahead, then theres the chance that the other tenants will query why they cant have service the same way and then before you know it you have 12 drop cables bunched together dropping off the back of the building.

I really don't think this would be an option, probably why the spotter wouldn't entertain the idea. At the end of the day we need to consider what an install tech would be able to do in the time available and not leave you high and dry with an incomplete installation. The other problem being what if we need to repull the cable in future due to a fault or damage... we would have the same access problems and due to the nature of the cable route we would need a crew that can work at heights which may not be available in this area.

I still firmly believe the spotter is correct in saying the only option is to install along the front of the building for many of the reasons mentioned. I am surprised that the landlord is being obstructive but its understandable if they aren't sure what they are signing for.

[trevbroughton]

Well I have been thinking about this for a while and have just spent a couple of quid on documents from Companies House.

So I will get intouch with the company secretary because maybe it is the agent standing in my way, and the people they say they been asking don't appear on those documents so quite possibly don't have the authority to make the decisions.

I have just taken a look at the wayleave document and I can see sections that I can well believe might make them uncomfortable to sign.

I have no idea if they might change their tune on where the cables can be run.

[trevbroughton]

Unfortunately the landlord is still dictating no cable up the front of the building and no signing a wayleave agreement, though they will give written permission for the 40 meter cable run at the rear.

I have lost contact with / given up on my spotter as he paid insufficent postage when he sent me the forms out in the first place and frankly seems rude particularly when I phoned him as he just imediately said he would phone me back and hung up before I could give him my number, I was not suprised when he never did.

I would still like Virgin but between their seeming disinterest and my landlords inflexibility I give up.

My landlord has said they will provide written permission for a dish so sounds like thats going to be the way I have to go.

Unless virgin could meet halfway on the wayleave (accept a letter written by the landlord and install a run down the rear of the building, the same route which my phoneline runs.

I agree my landlord is being unreasonable but I can't change that and it should be Virgin's interest sign up new customers so they need to be flexible, I am not asking them to lift a concrete drive to run the cable.

Anyway unless some miracle occurs with Virgin, I am going to request sky.

And as annoyed as I am with my landlord at present I might request a 120cm dish(if I could afford one).

[weesteev]

Unfortunately the landlord is still dictating no cable up the front of the building and no signing a wayleave agreement, though they will give written permission for the 40 meter cable run at the rear.

I have lost contact with / given up on my spotter as he paid insufficent postage when he sent me the forms out in the first place and frankly seems rude particularly when I phoned him as he just imediately said he would phone me back and hung up before I could give him my number, I was not suprised when he never did.

I would still like Virgin but between their seeming disinterest and my landlords inflexibility I give up.

My landlord has said they will provide written permission for a dish so sounds like thats going to be the way I have to go.

Unless virgin could meet halfway on the wayleave (accept a letter written by the landlord and install a run down the rear of the building, the same route which my phoneline runs.

I agree my landlord is being unreasonable but I can't change that and it should be Virgin's interest sign up new customers so they need to be flexible, I am not asking them to lift a concrete drive to run the cable.

Anyway unless some miracle occurs with Virgin, I am going to request sky.

And as annoyed as I am with my landlord at present I might request a 120cm dish(if I could afford one).

Hi Trev

If you still want to go ahead then drop your address and contact details over to cablemystreet@virginmedia.co.uk and this will be passed to the local planning team to see if your idea for a cable run is viable. Our team is pretty busy at the moment but you will get a response.

Best of luck mate and let us know how it go's, your house isnt in my franchise areas so I wont see the project when it comes through.

;)