View Full Version : 50mb self-install
royaltiger
24-05-2010, 10:10
Hope to be having an upgrade to 50mb broadband on Thursday if I can make the appointment, but wanted to know why this product is not able to be a self installation, I understand all it involves is replacing the modem and supplying a router or is there more involvment, I have had no problems with past upgrades done by myself, it just makes it so much easier not having to wait and fit my time around virgins and be given a 5 hour window of expectation knowing the engineer will turn up 5 mins before deadline, It would help if the time was narrowed down a bit as the engineer must have a schedule that is probably in some kind of installation order, surely its not that complicated today.
Easy answer is to make vm more money. A modem install is just an install whether its 10, 20 or 50 meg...
royaltiger
24-05-2010, 11:47
I dont understand if its about money then why dont they install all modems on all the tiers, why the restriction on the 50mb, and then the cheeck to charge an installation fee when its just a swap over
Because it is seen as a premium service. Much like the install charge on the V+ box.
Nothing is done any differnetly on these installs, any muppet could install them provding the service is active....
royaltiger
24-05-2010, 12:54
This is why I was hoping it would be an option for a self install, if your confident and have a good idea of what you are doing it would make more sense to post it out and free up an engineer to deal with someone less confident, and also it saves the customer an installation fee, which really should not be charged for as the service is already installed, I wonder if any customers who upgraded had the installation fee waivered by complaining about it or had 2nd thoughts.
Ignitionnet
24-05-2010, 13:06
The engineer may be required to correct power level issues. The 50Mbps service is touchier on power levels as it spans 4 downstream frequencies and the move from the older network to the new one comes with different power levels too.
At some point this will probably change but for now VM's service, VM's rules, if you aren't happy with them the simple option is to not take 50M.
royaltiger
24-05-2010, 13:39
, if you aren't happy with them the simple option is to not take 50M.
They sent me a letter as an existing loyal customer you can upgrade for just £8 a month, then you get the plus a one off installatiion fee, my aggrievment is everything is already installed its just swapping over, and the engineer will probably be 5 minutes max.
As we cannot even send out replacement modems for 50Mb, the will be no self install option for the forseeable future.
And in relation to the four hour window, you need to realise that its not like delivering a parcel, every job is diffrent, an engineer could go to a house that is set up with the correct power levels and its a simple swap and be out of there in 15mins, or there could be issues which could take up to an hour to fix.
The reason an engineer is required is to show the customer a 50meg speedtest, make sure xp machines are tweaked and to install a router and dongle if needed. As you can tell on this forum, some people are obsessed with getting 50meg everytime at all times.
royaltiger
28-05-2010, 11:13
Just had the mispleasure of the 50MB upgrade, I wasn't in at the time but left the daughter at home to let the engineer in, I did not think I had to explain much to her other than they are changing the modem. So I come home to find the new modem plugged into the wall in the lounge, the only problem was there is no computer there, thats in the study which the engineer walks by to get to the lounge, the pc is still connected up with the old 20MB modem, so from what I gathered he split the feed that goes to the V+ box plugged that to the back of the 50Mb modem, plugged it in to the wall and left an ethernet cable hanging out of the back of the modem connected to thin air, and suggested to daughter I may want to swap that with the old modem, Surely when you upgrade its just a case of swapping over the modems I cannot believe I have just had to pay an extortionate installation fee and ended up swapping the modems myself in probably less than 2 minutes. He may not be a mind reader and gets many requests to move cables and modems elsewhere around the house, but surely if in doubt the bare minimun of work must be to just swap over the modems.So I have now phoned Virgin to complain about the poor quality, bring back the self installation its less painful. :td:
As you're using 3-4 times as many signal paths for 50Mb as 10-20Mb a self install is not an option.. The engineer should check/tweak the signal levels which can NOT be done via a self install route..
royaltiger
28-05-2010, 11:32
Surely if your old modem is working fine there should be no reason to do anything with power levels. Its always the same excuses used by all the engineers they blame the last installer for not checking, or he has checked and decided it needs a tweak but it did not really need a tweak in the first place, all these modems should work on a bare minimum default "power level" and just be swapped over and fine tuning done at the offices. And sorry you hit the nail right on the head about the parcel, its exactly like delivering a parcel, as I have just had to connect my modem up myself.
royaltiger
28-05-2010, 11:34
So how does he know my signal levels are correct when the modem was not connected to the pc
You sure he didn't have his own laptop??
---------- Post added at 11:43 ---------- Previous post was at 11:38 ----------
As it's all about the same install.. Threads merged and moved to Installations
So how does he know my signal levels are correct when the modem was not connected to the pc
Red tools on his pda
---------- Post added at 12:31 ---------- Previous post was at 12:30 ----------
You sure he didn't have his own laptop??
---------- Post added at 11:43 ---------- Previous post was at 11:38 ----------
As it's all about the same install.. Threads merged and moved to Installations
Most Service technicians dont have a laptop
---------- Post added at 12:35 ---------- Previous post was at 12:31 ----------
Surely if your old modem is working fine there should be no reason to do anything with power levels. Its always the same excuses used by all the engineers they blame the last installer for not checking, or he has checked and decided it needs a tweak but it did not really need a tweak in the first place, all these modems should work on a bare minimum default "power level" and just be swapped over and fine tuning done at the offices. And sorry you hit the nail right on the head about the parcel, its exactly like delivering a parcel, as I have just had to connect my modem up myself.
I see your point, im sure you could manage the self install, but alot of folk arent as clued up as you are. You dont understand how the virgin media network works either.
There are issues with downstream power levels which cant be fixed at the office, the signals need to be adjusted manually by adding devices like attenuators. Also there are upstream issues where the 50meg is more sensitive than other platforms.
Surely your daughter has a part to play in this, he would have confirmed what work was to be done.
pip08456
28-05-2010, 12:45
Surely your daughter has a part to play in this, he would have confirmed what work was to be done.
My thoughts as well. The engineer would normally check the speed on the PC after install and if the OS is XP install TCP Optimiser.
Red tools on his pda
---------- Post added at 12:31 ---------- Previous post was at 12:30 ----------
Most Service technicians dont have a laptop.
:clap: Wasn't sure but I knew there had to be some way of checking :clap:
Jonnymeg
28-05-2010, 21:26
You could just swap the modem and it would probably be fine but the thing is that Virgins 50mb is their premium product and they want it installed correctly (forget you install for a sec).
They don't want people having slow speeds due to incorrect power levels thus the need for a tech visit. If you self installed and it were slow i am sure you would be going mad that you are paying a premium for a premium service that is crap.....and that is bad.
Surely you can see their need to try and protect their golden egg.
The install fee does not make money. Realistically how much do you think it costs to install a customer on 50meg? My guess is somewhere around £100-£150.
calmpitbull
28-05-2010, 21:44
50 meg is a tech install because:
-All wiring/levels are checked and adjusted if necessary (it usually is!)
-An official speedtest is done to make sure the product performs as it should
-To optimise windows XP as necessary
-To Install wireless router and USB dongle as necessary
Admittedly some customers could do some of the above, but not all. I think for £35 install its value for money.
I don't know what happened in your install, the tech should have replaced the modem in its existing position, I would have made sure I was at home to question such a thing. You may have got unlucky and got a bit of a muppet installer which is a shame.
Nedkelly
28-05-2010, 22:29
Dont forget the 50 meg uses a different upstream freq to 10 and some 20 meg customers .Note not all 20 meg modems are on the 50 meg ubrs :)
the pc is still connected up with the old 20MB modem, so from what I gathered he split the feed that goes to the V+ box plugged that to the back of the 50Mb modem, plugged it in to the wall and left an ethernet cable hanging out of the back of the modem connected to thin air
so now you have 70 MB :p:
saabmania2
29-05-2010, 07:54
-To optimise windows XP as necessary
i would emagine that most customers these days have Vista or windows 7 would they not "optimise" the service for these then??
Windows 7 and vista optimizes itself
alot of folk get over excited with power levels, the important one is upstream if that's 56 or lower the chances are your connection is fine, I've played about in training and got full 20meg at -12 downstream and +20
saabmania2
29-05-2010, 08:35
Windows 7 and vista optimizes itself
alot of folk get over excited with power levels, the important one is upstream if that's 56 or lower the chances are your connection is fine, I've played about in training and got full 20meg at -12 downstream and +20
ah ok i didn't realise that, thanks for clearing it up for me though :D
royaltiger
29-05-2010, 12:19
Perhaps I am missing the point somewhere, If you are having your broadband upgraded surely you take out the old modem and replace with the new 50MB, not leave it in place and then install the new modem in a different room with no pc , this is my gripe, I was not available to wait at home for the installation and saw no reason to leave any instructions on what was happening other than a modem is being replaced, surely the engineer is given a big clue by seeing a pc in a room with a virgin modem connected to it. If power levels, signals and attenuators are as important as they are made out to be all the tweaking should have been done on the feed into the pc,and not on a new split feed from the V+ box, I am not as clued up in the distribution and running of a broadband network as others are but my point still seems to be proved that power levels dont need to be that accurate if I can take the modem from the lounge and just plug it into the old 20 mb connection, which I assumed would be done by the engineer in the first place, as vanman says perhaps I'm on a new 70mb tier. £35 might sound good as an installation fee calampitbull but dont forget you then need to add another £20 for the activation, now we're up to £55 for an upgrade which I consider all the infastructure to be in place anyway.
Yes it is weird, the ONLY time you ever see that happening is when the customer wants the original spur left (perhaps maybe a combined business/residential install)
You do though seem intent on calling VM rotten even for simple mistakes (we all make them) and the fact that they actually charge for an install..
May I suggest you complain directly to VM as you;re likely to get an answer as to what the engineer did and why..
royaltiger
29-05-2010, 13:05
Yes it is weird, the ONLY time you ever see that happening is when the customer wants the original spur left (perhaps maybe a combined business/residential install)
You do though seem intent on calling VM rotten even for simple mistakes (we all make them) and the fact that they actually charge for an install..
I have always been quite happy with virgin, its a poor simple mistake though Kymmy,I'll accept and understand a charge on brand new install but not existing loyal customer with cabling and services already in place, there is another argument about being charged more as an existing customer but i'll leave that to others.
May I suggest you complain directly to VM as you;re likely to get an answer as to what the engineer did and why..
Phoned virgin they were going to call back as they were busy... not heard yet
With 50Mb everyone regardless of being New or Existing customers are supposed to be charged £35 for for installation and £20 for activation.
It is classed as a Premium Package and you always pay more for Premium services.
If i do a 50Mb i also check for any old style isolators that need replacing , any uneeded splitters , i also go to the tap and get a new connector on there. An old modem could work with a higher upstream than a new 50Mb.
As for your installer hes messed up pretty badly as he never took your old modem away like he should and now youve moved the modem im guessing theres a now redundant splitter at your tv reducing the signal levels into your STB and raising your upstream?
royaltiger
29-05-2010, 17:42
With 50Mb everyone regardless of being New or Existing customers are supposed to be charged £35 for for installation
.
2 minutes to swap over a modem
and £20 for activation .
flick a switch
Priceless
---------- Post added at 17:42 ---------- Previous post was at 17:32 ----------
As for your installer hes messed up pretty badly as he never took your old modem away like he should and now youve moved the modem im guessing theres a now redundant splitter at your tv reducing the signal levels into your STB and raising your upstream?
correct, I have a 3 way splitter , one feed to V+ in lounge, 2nd to V box upstairs and 3rd now redundant, and a spare modem which could be used for someone else.
2 minutes to swap over a modem
flick a switch
Priceless
You want the 50Mb service then you pay the asking price that Virginmedia want, no payment no service.
a spare modem which could be used for someone else.
It will be registered against your account so cannot be used anywhere else.
royaltiger
29-05-2010, 19:36
You want the 50Mb service then you pay the asking price that Virginmedia want, no payment no service.
I now pay £45 a month rental for it.
It will be registered against your account so cannot be used anywhere else.
Then it should be unregistered by virgin otherwise it makes a mockery of the installation fee by blatantly wasting money on a perfectly working virgin owned modem that should be able to be recycled for another customer.
Then it should be unregistered by virgin otherwise it makes a mockery of the installation fee by blatantly wasting money on a perfectly working virgin owned modem that should be able to be recycled for another customer.
It is just the way the system works and unless an engineer picks it up the is nothing that can be done as it will not work on another account while listed against your account.
http://www.emailgoodies.faketrix.com/content/pix/pc/original-files/tech-support-monkeys.jpg
Jonnymeg
31-05-2010, 10:11
blatantly wasting money on a perfectly working virgin owned modem that should be able to be recycled for another customer.
The sad thing is that it wold probably cost more to return the modem, clean it up and reissue it to someone else. The cost of these things (prob from china) in bulk is likely to be much less than you think.
The biggest costs in installing are probably the manpower in handling the modem itself.
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