View Full Version : please could someone post this to the Virgin support newsgroups....
I am not a newsgroups user so am slightly lost when it comes to posting to them, so I wonder if someone would be kind enough to post this potential fault report to the support newsgroups on my behalf so that a Level 2 tech can see if and pass on the details to the appropriate dept.
Below is the traceroute, hops 4, 5 and 6 are the problem area, there seems to be some problem with the router connecting the Virgin backbone to the Internap one, how do I know this? because in games I am getting severe packet loss and lag spikes as a result (I've been dropped from just about every server this week, this is just one example) and slow browsing to some websites.
I am sure that most people will find this trace route acceptable, but it isn't for gaming, hops 4, 5 and 6 produce varying results when tested over a period of time (I can set pingplotter running for a few hours if needed) with results ranging from the 217ms listed here, to over 1000ms and back down, this causes issues for gaming and I'd like to report this potential error to Virgin so that they can investigate it but do not see why I should learn to use a newsgroup when for other ISP's a simple email will do the job.
Sadly this has been going on for over a week now (I firstly put it down to extra traffic over xmas but even at 3am it was still going on) and I know I'm not the only one getting fedup with it in this street and it's likely that if it continues I'll cancel and go with BE - for me this is a major letdown after 4 years of perfect service from NTL/Virgin and I'd rather not have to do it - I just want the problem fixed lol.
Can anybody help? It would be very much appreciated if you could, thanks.
C:\Users\ryan>tracert 69.25.205.241
Tracing route to 69.25.205.241 over a maximum of 30 hops
1 7 ms 7 ms 7 ms reig-cmts-04-lback-20.network.virginmedia.net [8
0.6.138.1]
2 9 ms 7 ms 7 ms hers-core-1b-ge-018-1295.network.virginmedia.net
[80.3.33.165]
3 19 ms 12 ms 8 ms pop-bb-b-so-501-0.network.virginmedia.net [213.1
05.175.41]
4 39 ms 10 ms 7 ms tele-ic-2-as0-0.network.virginmedia.net [62.253.
184.6]
5 217 ms 92 ms 107 ms cr1-eqix-peer.wdc005.internap.net [206.223.115.1
29]
6 105 ms 107 ms 107 ms cr2-cr1.wdc005.internap.net [66.79.146.202]
7 108 ms 108 ms 106 ms nym009-wdc005-1079-cr1.nym009.pnap.internap.net
[66.79.146.109]
8 108 ms 107 ms 107 ms cr2-cr1.nym009.internap.net [66.79.146.198]
9 110 ms 107 ms 115 ms bsn006-nym009-9-cr1.bsn006.internap.net [66.79.1
58.9]
10 109 ms 106 ms 103 ms bsn004-bsn006-792-mpr1.bsn004.internap.net [66.7
9.145.34]
11 141 ms 205 ms 211 ms border11.te7-1-bbnet1.bsn.pnap.net [63.251.128.4
1]
12 106 ms 103 ms 103 ms 69.25.205.241
Trace complete.
P.S. Please don't try and educate me that there is not a problem, I've given the trace route to both the server provider (in USA and Holland) and several colleagues in IT and they all had the same conclusion as me, the connection between Virgin and Internap is inconsistent and causing lag, and of course for the last 4 years I've not had any problems like this aside from within the last 2 months.
Thankyou!
Have you reported the problem to VM's 1st line tech support?
P.S. Please don't try and educate me that there is not a problem, I've given the trace route to both the server provider (in USA and Holland) and several colleagues in IT and they all had the same conclusion as me, the connection between Virgin and Internap is inconsistent and causing lag, and of course for the last 4 years I've not had any problems like this aside from within the last 2 months.
Thankyou!
Well in that case I'm sure that your experts are quite capable of helping you through to the newsgroups...
In case they need help the full set-up procedure is HERE (http://www.virginmedia.com/myvirginmedia/newsgroups/)
Have you reported the problem to VM's 1st line tech support?
You mean India? Yes they offered to send an engineer, they didn't understand that the problem wasn't between me and Croydon, only from there on.
@Kymmy, hehe yep that's a fair cop, which is the newgroup I'd need? I use Thundernews for downloading but have never posted, not a clue how to, the only virgin one I can find on there is free.uk.binaries.virginmedia.users.photos.original guessing that isn't the one?
Still doesn't mean I will post, it'll probably take me all day to work it out, believe it or not, not every network technician in the world knows how to post to a newsgroup :)
OK so what was the conclusion of your calls to India, did you refuse the engineer? If not what were his findings?
RobboEdin
31-12-2009, 11:10
You mean India? Yes they offered to send an engineer, they didn't understand that the problem wasn't between me and Croydon, only from there on.
@Kymmy, hehe yep that's a fair cop, which is the newgroup I'd need? I use Thundernews for downloading but have never posted, not a clue how to, the only virgin one I can find on there is free.uk.binaries.virginmedia.users.photos.original guessing that isn't the one?
Still doesn't mean I will post, it'll probably take me all day to work it out, believe it or not, not every network technician in the world knows how to post to a newsgroup :)
To get any help in the newgroup, you will have to post for yourself. The service is directed at Virgin Media customers and is specific to your account if you want any help.
Here is full instructions on how to use the newsgroups but you do need to use Outlook Express/Windows Mail for it to work, unless you can trsansfer the settings to Thunderbird.
How to use Newsgroups click HERE (http://www.virginmedia.com/help/cable/newsgroups/using-outlook-express.php#posting)
the one you need is virginmedia.support.broadband.cable
http://www.virginmedia.com/myvirginmedia/newsgroups/
@Russ I did decline the visit politely, the person I spoke to just didn't understand that the problem was intermittent and at Croydon not with me at Reigate, they just said there was no problem with my connection and they'd get an engineer out which imho would just be a waste of everybody's time.
I had an engineer out about a month ago for an unrelated issue and he told me this entire area is over-subscribed.
@RobboEdin thanks I will give it a go.
Don't get me wrong I'm not complaining, I've had 4 years of perfect service, it's just a little frustrating not to be able to email someone a log and get something in the system so it can be looked at, especially when it started about a week after I posted on another forum how fantastic and reliable the Virgin network was LOL.
Edit: thank you Moldova.
@Russ I did decline the visit politely, the person I spoke to just didn't understand that the problem was intermittent and at Croydon not with me at Reigate, they just said there was no problem with my connection and they'd get an engineer out which imho would just be a waste of everybody's time.
I had an engineer out about a month ago for an unrelated issue and he told me this entire area is over-subscribed.
@RobboEdin thanks I will give it a go.
Don't get me wrong I'm not complaining, I've had 4 years of perfect service, it's just a little frustrating not to be able to email someone a log and get something in the system so it can be looked at, especially when it started about a week after I posted on another forum how fantastic and reliable the Virgin network was LOL.
Edit: thank you Moldova.
The reason I'm asking is we have high-level contacts at VM who have the power to get things done but that offer of assistance is usually reserved for those who have already contacted VM support but got nowhere with it.
With the best intentions we don't usually pass on issues from people who (for whatever reason) have declined their assistance.
As you can see Ian we are providing you with the means and instructions to post yourself and it does have to be from your connection as that is the one the 2nd line guys will check.
If still unsure get a friend to help you and remember they normally answer within 4 hours.
well the major stumbling block at the moment is I can't find my VM details to be able to post to that newsgroup ooopsy.
I know I got sent a card a while back with the details on so I will go digging through the kitchen cupboard, sure it's in there.
Thanks for help so far.
@Russ I appreciate what you're saying but what use would an engineer's visit be for a possible routing issue 30 miles away? All it would do is waste the engineers time because he wouldn't be able to fix the issue physically here in my front room.
Ignitionnet
31-12-2009, 12:01
P.S. Please don't try and educate me that there is not a problem, I've given the trace route to both the server provider (in USA and Holland) and several colleagues in IT and they all had the same conclusion as me, the connection between Virgin and Internap is inconsistent and causing lag, and of course for the last 4 years I've not had any problems like this aside from within the last 2 months.
Thankyou!
That traceroute shows nothing to be honest. The 'wdc' part of the router name in hop 5 obviously, I thought, stands for Washington DC. Takes a while for light to get from London to Washington DC and back so that jump in pings is normal and some fluctuation to the router itself is to be expected due to Control Plane Policing and CPU loading on the router.
The ping to the last hop is fairly smooth.
What you should try is to ping that last hop say 500 times - ping -n 500 69.25.205.241 which will show the issue more clearly. The traceroute you've posted doesn't show anything conclusive unfortunately.
For your reference my own traceroute from Mortlake, South West London:
5 10 ms 7 ms 7 ms pop-bb-b-ae2-0.network.virginmedia.net [195.182.178.86]
6 17 ms 7 ms 7 ms tele-ic-2-as0-0.network.virginmedia.net [62.253.184.6]
7 96 ms 94 ms 95 ms cr1-eqix-peer.wdc005.internap.net [206.223.115.129]
8 106 ms 108 ms 107 ms cr2-cr1.wdc005.internap.net [66.79.146.202]
9 109 ms 106 ms 127 ms nym009-wdc005-1079-cr1.nym009.pnap.internap.net[66.79.146.109]
10 119 ms 108 ms 123 ms cr2-cr1.nym009.internap.net [66.79.146.198]
11 107 ms 108 ms 106 ms bsn006-nym009-9-cr1.bsn006.internap.net [66.79.158.9]
12 101 ms 99 ms 108 ms bsn004-bsn006-792-mpr1.bsn004.internap.net [66.79.145.34]
13 102 ms 99 ms 131 ms border11.te8-1-bbnet2.bsn.pnap.net [63.251.128.104]
14 102 ms 100 ms 100 ms 69.25.205.241
Ping statistics for 69.25.205.241:
Packets: Sent = 95, Received = 95, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 98ms, Maximum = 192ms, Average = 107ms
---------- Post added at 12:01 ---------- Previous post was at 12:00 ----------
well the major stumbling block at the moment is I can't find my VM details to be able to post to that newsgroup ooopsy.
I know I got sent a card a while back with the details on so I will go digging through the kitchen cupboard, sure it's in there.
Thanks for help so far.
Not needed Ian-S you can post from a VM connection on there just fine without the need to authenticate.
Looking again at your trace:
3 19 ms 12 ms 8 ms pop-bb-b-so-501-0.network.virginmedia.net [213.1
05.175.41]
4 39 ms 10 ms 7 ms tele-ic-2-as0-0.network.virginmedia.net [62.253.
184.6]
5 217 ms 92 ms 107 ms cr1-eqix-peer.wdc005.internap.net [206.223.115.129]
Those higher first hop pings are probably delay from a firewall/router, either software or hardware, allowing the ping through and/or setting up a NAT session.
Just ran a nice looong test. There's really nothing much to see from here unfortunately. Might be a local problem but I just can't replicate what you're seeing, at least not with ICMP :(
Same story from tools.virginmedia.com:
PING 69.25.205.241 (69.25.205.241) 56(84) bytes of data.
64 bytes from 69.25.205.241: icmp_seq=1 ttl=115 time=101 ms
64 bytes from 69.25.205.241: icmp_seq=2 ttl=115 time=100 ms
64 bytes from 69.25.205.241: icmp_seq=3 ttl=115 time=100 ms
64 bytes from 69.25.205.241: icmp_seq=4 ttl=115 time=100 ms
64 bytes from 69.25.205.241: icmp_seq=5 ttl=115 time=101 ms
--- 69.25.205.241 ping statistics ---
5 packets transmitted, 5 received, 0% packet loss, time 4000ms
rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 100.683/100.905/101.044/0.314 ms
PING 69.25.205.241 (69.25.205.241) 56(84) bytes of data.
64 bytes from 69.25.205.241: icmp_seq=1 ttl=115 time=100 ms
64 bytes from 69.25.205.241: icmp_seq=2 ttl=115 time=100 ms
64 bytes from 69.25.205.241: icmp_seq=3 ttl=115 time=100 ms
64 bytes from 69.25.205.241: icmp_seq=4 ttl=115 time=100 ms
64 bytes from 69.25.205.241: icmp_seq=5 ttl=115 time=100 ms
--- 69.25.205.241 ping statistics ---
5 packets transmitted, 5 received, 0% packet loss, time 4003ms
rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 100.823/100.913/100.986/0.352 ms
well the major stumbling block at the moment is I can't find my VM details to be able to post to that newsgroup ooopsy.
That is because you are using a different provider. You must use News.virginmedia.com as your newsgroup provider and then download the list of groups. You will then be able to post on the group you need. Note that you do not need a user name or password as it detects you are on virgin media from your ip address
Sephiroth
31-12-2009, 12:16
If you're on Vista or Windows 7 If you're on Vista or Windows 7, you could use Windows Live Mail (a standard part of your system).
You'd click the "Newsgroups" link at the bottom of the screen and then Tools/Accounts then Add/Newsgroup Account.
Give your Display Name (like Ian-S), your e-mail address (can be fictitious) then your server address for the newsgroup which is "news.virginmedia.com".
You'll then be able (via the Newsgroups menu item) to select the Virgin media icon on the left of a search panel, click on "All" and wait a few minutes till it's finished listing thousands of newsgroups.
Scroll down to "Virginmedia.support.broadband.cable" and double click it.
And you're there. You can post your stuff.
Hope that helps you get omto the Newsgroup and report your woes AFTER you've adopted BBings' suggestions.
thanks Broadbandings, that's interesting that you're fine on pretty much the same route.
I phoned tech support again and the lady confirmed there was a problem in the area since 29th and it would be fixed by 4th Jan - I'm happy with that, at least I know the problem isn't me and roughly when it'll be fixed.
Re the newsgroups, it was the grabit software causing the problem, finally worked out that Outlook is now called Mail and got it working in that :)
Ignitionnet
31-12-2009, 12:24
thanks Broadbandings, that's interesting that you're fine on pretty much the same route.
I phoned tech support again and the lady confirmed there was a problem in the area since 29th and it would be fixed by 4th Jan - I'm happy with that, at least I know the problem isn't me and roughly when it'll be fixed.
Re the newsgroups, it was the grabit software causing the problem, finally worked out that Outlook is now called Mail and got it working in that :)
Pleasure. I'm not sure about that 4th January fix date, it's the end of the network change freeze and tech support seem to quite like parading it around as being the end of all issues ;)
I'd pop a note on the newsgroups anyway for peace of mind. As you know it's not unknown for tech support to get it wrong or simply make it up because they don't know.
If you want to use my post above as a baseline or point of reference on please feel free, the newsgroup guys and gals know me quite well, poor them, I'm an ex-staffer and general pain in the arse when things go wrong for me or I have an axe in need of grinding :D
In other news I must be mellowing in my old age, usually when I see IT bods who get it a bit wrong I jump all over them - I often forget that not everyone has been lucky enough to work with the biggest routers in the world on huge multinational networks as I have and that smaller models can work quite differently :)
ah lol I get yer, I also got the lady to change my modem back to the old Ambit 256 from the 50Mb one (curved top, blue lights) cos it was problematic to say the least (random reboots, loads of errors in log), so you never know, fingers crossed.
I will try get something onto the newgroup shortly, but if you beat me to it I'm not going to complain, it's just a shame that VM seem to be having so many issues recently, I know quiet a few people round here that have got fedup and cancelled, oh well, less contention for me then :)
Thanks
Sephiroth
31-12-2009, 12:38
.....
In other news I must be mellowing in my old age, usually when I see IT bods who get it a bit wrong I jump all over them - I often forget that not everyone has been lucky enough to work with the biggest routers in the world on huge multinational networks as I have and that smaller models can work quite differently :)
ROTFL.:clap:
Ignitionnet
31-12-2009, 12:47
ah lol I get yer, I also got the lady to change my modem back to the old Ambit 256 from the 50Mb one (curved top, blue lights) cos it was problematic to say the least (random reboots, loads of errors in log), so you never know, fingers crossed.
I will try get something onto the newgroup shortly, but if you beat me to it I'm not going to complain, it's just a shame that VM seem to be having so many issues recently, I know quiet a few people round here that have got fedup and cancelled, oh well, less contention for me then :)
Thanks
Apparently there's a huge drive next year towards improving the local networks that have been the source of so many issues for people, and along with this the equipment that connects to them. Service reliability will hopefully improve for most.
Better late than never!
LOL.
Well, could a buggered modem cause this? The reason I ask is that since I changed back to the 20Mb modem (took 14 attempts for them to activate it mind you heh), all seems to be ok, pingplotter results are acceptable, no packet loss, average ping not far off best etc. etc. and best of all I went into an iRacing practice session and two guys, one from Michigan and another that sounded strangly like Boss Hog from Dukes of Hazard both said I was fine - about two hours ago on the same server I was blinking like a cat on heat.
I didn't think that was possible, but I'm open to any ideas :)
I am going to leave it a few days though, racing on new years eve is probably a recipe for disaster given how American's usually celebrate new year (if you're wondering what the hell I've been going on about it's iRacing.com (http://www.iracing.com) and we have our own server for NR/fRactor stuff in Holland).
I'm now hoping a modem can cause this cos otherwise the network has a horrible sense of humour :)
Thanks all for help, I'll try post some logs to the newsgroup but the Mrs is chomping at the bit to go out.....
Apparently there's a huge drive next year towards improving the local networks that have been the source of so many issues for people, and along with this the equipment that connects to them. Service reliability will hopefully improve for most.
Better late than never!
Yes thats something i will be glad to see ;)
Ignitionnet
31-12-2009, 14:14
LOL.
Well, could a buggered modem cause this? The reason I ask is that since I changed back to the 20Mb modem (took 14 attempts for them to activate it mind you heh), all seems to be ok, pingplotter results are acceptable, no packet loss, average ping not far off best etc. etc. and best of all I went into an iRacing practice session and two guys, one from Michigan and another that sounded strangly like Boss Hog from Dukes of Hazard both said I was fine - about two hours ago on the same server I was blinking like a cat on heat.
I didn't think that was possible, but I'm open to any ideas :)
I am going to leave it a few days though, racing on new years eve is probably a recipe for disaster given how American's usually celebrate new year (if you're wondering what the hell I've been going on about it's iRacing.com (http://www.iracing.com) and we have our own server for NR/fRactor stuff in Holland).
I'm now hoping a modem can cause this cos otherwise the network has a horrible sense of humour :)
Thanks all for help, I'll try post some logs to the newsgroup but the Mrs is chomping at the bit to go out.....
If your modem was repeatedly rebooting it points to a problem with it anyways - I have had some issues with mine but these are under certain kinds of load, not related to gaming.
For sure a faulty modem could cause the symptoms you describe. See how it goes Ian.
Cheers.
---------- Post added at 14:14 ---------- Previous post was at 13:59 ----------
Yes thats something i will be glad to see ;)
Indeed!
well the (old) new modem isn't making much difference, still 15% packet loss over the entire network and a ping that's up and down like an old crows knickers :), I'll get some logs created from pingplotter and post them to the newsgroup, I'll maybe wait till Saturday, doubt tech support will be working tomorrow (I wouldn't blame them for taking the day off).
Cheers
Ignitionnet
31-12-2009, 17:40
If you're seeing loss over the entire network it'd certainly point to the issue being somewhat more local.
yeah it's changed since earlier, it was just those 3 hops earlier, virgin > internap > new york but back about half hour ago it was on all hops, maybe it's just load and the packets are getting dropped at peak time.
Digital Fanatic
31-12-2009, 17:55
well the (old) new modem isn't making much difference, still 15% packet loss over the entire network and a ping that's up and down like an old crows knickers :), I'll get some logs created from pingplotter and post them to the newsgroup, I'll maybe wait till Saturday, doubt tech support will be working tomorrow (I wouldn't blame them for taking the day off).
Cheers
Newsgroups are manned 365 days 8am-10pm ;)
In other news I must be mellowing in my old age,
I'd have to agree - you've become pretty pleasant and helpful lately ;) :D
Ignitionnet
01-01-2010, 12:13
I'd have to agree - you've become pretty pleasant and helpful lately ;) :D
Just a blip. Normal service will be resumed shortly :D
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