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View Full Version : Moving to complete new VM installation - some advice please?


Billius
31-08-2009, 13:15
Hi all, I've qot a few questions in preparation for a new VM fit next week that I hope people can help me with please:

I'm moving from Sky+ HD and BT Phone + Broadband 3 to VirginMedia bundle
Im getting XXL Broadband, V+ HD (M+) TV and (L) phoneline

Can I ask some simple questions as though I'm a technical person I have little knowledge of cable setups:

1/ I've requested to transfer my BT number to Virgin. BT have said that they'll complete this transfer on 12th Sept. My current Virgin installation is set for the 7th. Does this mean that
a) I'll have everything working apart from the phone side?
b) the phone side will work but it will be on another temporary number or
c) am I soon going to get a call/letter from virgin saying my installation has been delayed to coincide with BT?
d) When does BT 'terminate' everything? - I was going to rely on services overlapping (well maybe not a working phone number from BT - but definately broadband) - that way if I wasn't happy with Virgin I could still go back (within 28 days you can cancel for a full refund?)

2/ My property had some old NTL wires/box on the outside wall of my terrace - I just checked and whoever fit my drive chopped/buried the house end of the cable - groan. I imagine if I can find the twin cable then they'll fit a new box on the outside of the house - but -
a) how does this then get split between TV, BB and Phone? My BT phone line comes in elsewhere into the house and ends up at a master socket on the opposite side of the house to the old wires coming from the NTL/NYNEX box.
b) how to they wire in old telephone/extensions?
c) and how to they normally wire to the TV/STB and BB Router? I have STB(with Cables from Sky LNB) coming into my lounge, a dedicated ADSL socket and my router in back upstairs bedroom and phone coming into hall - what are they prepared to do in terms of wiring?
d) if I can't find end of old cable what will they do? I can see a loop of the cable popping up and down a hole on the pavement but no idea what they could do with that...

3/ General question - how are all the signals partioned/multiplexed and what is the effect of sharing these cables (to the street cabinet) in terms of bandwidth allocation? e.g. if I am getting 40+Mbps on my router/pc what happens when I watch HD TV? any difference between VOD content/iPlayer content and 'normal' HD channels?

4/ Is it worth wiring the Ethernet port up on the STB? What is the benefit? (seems slightly counter intuitive connecting one part of the setup to a signal derived from the same cable ....)

5) I love the quality of Sky+ HD on HD channels (normally BBC HD and Sky1, C4 HD) -
a) how does this compare to what I'll get with V+HD?
b) what does the SD picture look like? the SD picture on Sky is pretty good IMHO

6) Anything else to watch out for on the day? I've got all sorts of gear hanging off my network, NASes, PCs, PS3, Yamaha DSPZ-7, Samsung Series9 LCD - I'm expecting this all to _just work_ - no tweaking, changing MTUs etc right?

7/ Once I cancel Sky (1 pack, Sky+ and HD) I'll be saving £27 pm. What can I still do with this setup?

The system was definately setup more than a year ago - so I'm hoping I'm not in any contract (they don't reset your contract if you change/downgrade channel mix do they?)

So... a) are they likely to come and take back SkyHD box?
b) if they don't will I still be able to get free channels? (is there a difference between 'freeview' and 'freesat' BTW) including HD? e.g. BBCHD?
c) or will I need a 'FreeSat card'? [with a freesat card will Sky+ record/pause functions work?]
d) I read on another forum that you can just leave your normal Sky card in and the record functions on the SkyHD+ box will continue to work (for the free channels) - is this right?

I appreciate any feedback you can give me.

Thanks

Bill

jungleguy
01-09-2009, 23:09
With so many questions I'm surprised you placed an order.

Has BT given you the date of the 12th? Number ports get closed down and completed on day of install.

2. if the cable from the road to the house is damaged then your install may fail, you'll need to ring VM and ask them to book a 2 man crew. You'll loose your install date. (they can splice, safer to request 2 man crew)

Sky broadcast HD at 720, VM at 1080.

Billius
02-09-2009, 08:24
Thanks for your answers.

Virgin are all booked for this friday 4th. BT are moving number on the 12th.
Another person told me VM will give me a temporary number for the phone.

As for the cable - I'll have a look for it today - but I'd be better of with a new cable wouldn't I? The one there already has been through the wars and is at least 12 years old...

Given the massive interest in people upgrading or getting new 50Mb installations after the price drop, people are already complaining of installation slots not being until Oct - so I'd rather not lose my slot this Friday - I'll post what happens.

Sky broadcast all HD media in 1080i. They once had plans to broadcast some in 720p (e.g. sport) and some in 1080i - but they ended up saving costs by just having everything at 1080i.

Bill

Pog66
02-09-2009, 12:55
1) Virgin will install a new phone socket which will have a new number until the existing one get's ported.
However - the existing BT socket will still be live therefore if you leave the phone plugged in to that one you will still have access to the existing number through that. You will pay for both services for the week or so tehy overlap

2) I would think that this would be check by cabling team prior to actual installation but probably better to phone up and check

b) they generally don't - they will put a new socket in usually alongside existing BT one. If you ask nicely (with tea & biscuits) they may connect up the extensions. If not a search on this forum should come up with instructions on how to do it yourself.
c) Line is split on external box - generally you can specifiy where you want the separate BB & TV lines to come in and they will generally try & run it round the exterior of the house

3) They run on separate frequencies so not an issue

5) Don't have HD option at the moment but you have much LESS HD choice on Virgin than Sky

7a) - in theory yes - but my old sky box is still sitting there a year after changing
b) did get free channels for a couple of months but no longer (although I haven't plugged it in for a while to check)

horseman
04-09-2009, 08:36
Just spotted this too late probably to be of any use -

2. a) Obtain Install Team managers name (you may need this later)
b) Depending of distance between your CTE box and property boundary for Teeing off and whether grass,lawn, patio'ed, fenced, concrete etc ensure you engage the "install crew" to determine the route the cable will take and whether protected by conduit and depth laid.
c) Ascertain whether install is temporary splice or "permanent"

6. Your own equip is least of your problems -
a) Obtain techs mangers name if different from "cable crew"
b) Ask for Downstream/upstream power and SNR levels and note these
c) If Cable modem has not been provisioned by time tech leaves ensure you have a stated time frame in which to powerup and try.
d) If you are using a PC direct to SACM in order to use webpage "user" provisioning then it may be easier to clone mac address across to your router when you insert that.
e) If you successfully provision your user account then you need to check power levels/SNR by accessing SACM(VMNG300?) @ "192.168.100.1" on browser.
f) perform pings and traceroute to bbc.co.uk, and speedtest to VM's game server with 2 concurrent file downloads. Record these.

You'll need to search for optimum levels but XXL tier/DOCSIS3 irequires more optimal settings and unfortunately some techs leave the install with these set at extremes that leave less margin for thermal creep in street amps and induced noise injected from elsewhere.

You have many "opportunities for failure" within this install scenario - if VM manage to accomplish this without you having to ring 150/151 then they deserve an "Atta-Boy" award... and virtual handshakes allround!

Good Luck

Billius
05-09-2009, 01:57
Hi all,

Just a little update on my 'installation' today....

Actually yesterday (Thur) with my neighbours help we went on a 'find the missing cable' hunt (as there was nothing going into the old box on the wall)

Dug up some of drive near house, also a trench in flower bed - nothing. Finally jiggled some loose cement/concrete around on pavement/drive (to be able to tug 'looped' end of cable) - tada - broken end - i.e. when my driveway was put, they cut the cable at the pavement.

So... phoned up VM to tell them they would need to lay new cable - even asked them whether this meant I'd need a two man crew - foreign gentlemen in call centre assured me everything was fine and not to worry.

First thing this morning - got call from engineer who would be with me in 10 mins - not bad - nice 8am start.

10 minutes later he looked a bit bemused as he approached - 'you've got no cable'....
I told him about phone call previous day - he said he'd call manager - he then requested 'an emergency pulling crew' who would be out in the afternoon (hopefully)

He was going to go then - but talked to his boss again who suggested he do a 'dry installation' - i.e. get the cable into the house, and get internal house stuff done - fine made sense.

So, we discussed cable routing - the only issue being how to get the TV and Cable modem cable across to my hifi stand (where there is ethernet to send to rest of house). Phone socket could live on the wall where the cable had come in - I only care about a DECT basestation there - so no need to touch the BT internal old wiring.

He suggested if I wanted to try and pull through cable under the floor (using a speaker cable to pull through) it would probably be neater - I got to work on this while he completed new phone sockets and work in the cabinet across street.

So, a while later he'd done as much as he could do and I was still struggling with stuck cables under a laminate floor - gah! - he left ALL the boxes - a D-Link Dir-615, and a SA VM+HD box (no Netgears, no Samsungs) - plus a splitter for the engineers in the afternoon to put on wall behind my hifi for the BB and TV.

As he was about to leave he asked ' do you want us to activate the port' - he explained that regardless of the BT number port date of the following week - if they activated the port at the exchange it would happen today. - As I didn't have any cable connecting me to the Vm network yet I said that 'NO - please don't do that yet as I'll have no phone until the installation is complete' he agreed but made the comment it could be a good idea 'as one less thing for the guys to do later today'. I still said no. So off he went.

I managed eventually to pull through both the new VM coax and my speaker cables - so all ready for those cable installers...

Tried using my existing BT phone later in the afternoon and was struggling to dial any numbers (even though dialtone)

Phoned up 17:25, got intouch with a friendly scot, who was a bit surprised that they'd left me half done (and by the sounds of it BT number ported).

He then kept me on hold (regularly checking I was ok) while we waited 30 mins to get through to installation compaints.

Finally he was tolday that the pulling crew 'are on the way to you right now', and that the 'installations chief technician will call you tomorrow to check everything is working'. Fair enough.

2 hours later - I called up - this time customer service ciould not get through to installations, and could not guarantee anyone coming tomorrow - but did verify that there is a note on my account for the chief technician to call tomorrow.

So... lets see what tomorrow (no today) brings....

And thanks for all the really detailed answers and advice. I look forward to being in a position to test my SNRs!

Bill

p.s. have been trying to figure out my new network topology - I've knocked up some diagrams - hopefully option 2 will work - any comments very welcome:

Bill's Network Diagrams (http://www.atpinnells.com/Docs/Bills%20Network%20Topology.pdf)

Billius
05-09-2009, 09:06
Saturday 7:45 am.

2-Man cable pulling team have turned up. They'll get cable across street - but no further than pavement - need ANOTHER team to connect to house....

Billius
05-09-2009, 20:32
So to continue - what happened next:

Called up Virgin Customer care - eventually they agreed to put me through to installations - who weren't going to talk to me as I was not virgin engineer/contractor - but when I said to look at account notes with name of principal technician who was due to call me to check on completion they ended up patching me through to the guy.

He thought it had all be completed! Then offered to come out personally at a time convenient this afternoon to sort it all out.
Wired loose cable to house. Connected both ends of cable mode/tv cable in house, put splitter behind HiFi.

He tested TV (needed channels initialising with a phone call from him)

I connected D-Link 615 to my network (which I'd rewired - see above - option 2) then on my PC ended up stuck as the virgin activation page did not like Windows 7 - so continued on my Mac - all up and running

Speedtest.net reports 49,54,56 Mbps DL (London, 42 Maidenhead) and 1.6Mbps UL. Wifi on Mac reports almost the same

Speedtest Result (http://www.speedtest.net/result/557563568.png)

So overall happy to have a brand new installation with new cable from a cabinet not 40 yards away, all connected into my network and working nicely.

Only niggle - the installation teams I've dealt with needed to be much more joined up with customer services - I got it all done in the end but only through expedited channels and good will - not through a smoothly orchestrated system.

Also no new Samsung V+ boxes available and also no Netgear - only D-Link 615. SA box is a bit slow and the OSD/GUI is low res and clunky.

Thanks for all the advices and answers.

Ta.

Bill

Pushkar
05-09-2009, 21:02
Yeah I had problems with telephone installation when I joined Telewest a couple of years ago, but since then - a nice decent service.

For the Netgear router, it's not that good compared to the D-Link, which is decent (could be better, but it's 'free'!)