View Full Version : Throwing the cable over the roof.
Had a virginmedia guy out to throw the cable over the roof to feed the services to the room at the rear of the house (it's a terraced house, nothing special).
We told VM that we want the services in the back and that the cable will simply need throwing over the roof.
The guy arrived at 8:45 on Saturday (he was booked for the afternoon slot of 12 - 6pm!) and simply said "oh no we're only insured to two meters up a ladder) and starting rambling on about how drilling through the wall might "knacker the wall and skirting".
I wasn't home and my Mrs accepted his sorry excuses for an early finish and I'm now here wondering what cable is used and what connectors I'll need to do the job myself.
While I'm here I'm wondering what options to VM there are (that are fast with their connections whilst cheap).
I hope you can help me get my VM just 4 meters away from its current location. As VM can't.
1st welcome to CF
2nd call VM CS and tell them your not happy with the service you got.
Mate of mine wanted the cable thrown over the roof of his house a couple of years ago and was told that they can't do it any more because of Health & Safety issues.
Kinda stinks, but I do understand where they are coming from.
smeagoly1
10-06-2008, 12:55
Could the guys installing, not just plug the cable through the nearest front wall to the street access, then tack cabling along the bottom of the walls, to the room you desire?
Just wonder as they done this on my very first Cable install, from front of house, up the stairs to the back bedroom. Mind you this was Telewest many years ago.
In my second home, the VM guy installed the cabling through from back of house to front, and i couldn't even see the cable, it was such a good install.
Any other homes in your street with cable? ask to see how theirs are set up.
I have to add that I can well understand H&S wise why the guys don't want to go up onto the roof. But not knowing the first hand, was surprised they didn't offer another alternative.
Oh I so wish for my cable days again.
1st welcome to CF
2nd call VM CS and tell them your not happy with the service you got.
Thanks. And I'm not even going to go there. It took me weeks to convince myself the £75 charge was worth it. Though actually they sent me the gear through on installation as it was quicker than waiting for a techie to install it for me and I work online and needed the net. So they saved themselves the installation there.
Mate of mine wanted the cable thrown over the roof of his house a couple of years ago and was told that they can't do it any more because of Health & Safety issues.
Kinda stinks, but I do understand where they are coming from.
It's ridiculous. I don't want him to climb anything, he can stand firm on the planet and THROW the cable over the roof. We're talking 20' or so here.
The guy just couldn't be bothered as it was a sunny day and a weekend I feel.
I have public liability insurance also, and its not that difficult to insure yourself on a ladder too by the way. In fact, I think climbing all over your house is covered for the £40 a year I pay. I'm sure Richard Branson has it cheaper than that per workman too.
Could the guys installing, not just plug the cable through the nearest front wall to the street access, then tack cabling along the bottom of the walls, to the room you desire?
Just wonder as they done this on my very first Cable install, from front of house, up the stairs to the back bedroom. Mind you this was Telewest many years ago.
In my second home, the VM guy installed the cabling through from back of house to front, and i couldn't even see the cable, it was such a good install.
Any other homes in your street with cable? ask to see how theirs are set up.
I have to add that I can well understand H&S wise why the guys don't want to go up onto the roof. But not knowing the first hand, was surprised they didn't offer another alternative.
Oh I so wish for my cable days again.
He bloody could have done, you're right. He could have even left me the cable and I'd have done it myself and still paid the £75 providing it was done quickly and stress-free. They / he missed out on that one hey?
I just want to know what cable it is now, so I can go get myself some, live the contract out and move providers.
Just to clarify. The Work at Height Regulations 2005 (came into force on 6 April 2005), apply to all work at height where there is a risk of a fall liable to cause personal injury.
They place duties on employers (in this case Virgin Media.) the self employed, and any person that controls the work of others (for example facilities managers or building owners who may contract others to work at height) - :erm:
As part of the Regulations, duty holders must ensure:
All work at height is properly planned and organised,
Those involved in work at height are competent,
The risks from work at height are assessed and appropriate work equipment is selected and used;
The risks from fragile surfaces are properly controlled; and equipment for work at height is properly inspected and maintained. There is a simple hierarchy for managing and selecting equipment for work at height. Duty holders must:
Avoid work at height where they can,
Use work equipment or other measures to prevent falls where they cannot avoid working at height and where they cannot eliminate the risk of a fall, use work equipment or other measures to minimise the distance and consequences of a fall should one occur.
The Regulations include schedules giving requirements for existing places of work and means of access for work at height, collective fall prevention (eg guardrails and working platforms), collective fall arrest (eg nets, airbags etc), personal fall protection (e.g work restraints, fall arrest and rope access) and ladders.
Falls from height remain the most common kind of accident causing fatal injuries and according to HSE statistics, Latest figures show that 45 people died from a fall from height at work in 2006/07 (48 for 2005/06).
Taking into account the above. The figures reflect the effect that the introduction of the legislation has had upon the industry. Before this, the figures where (on average) much higher.
Under the above circumstances, you cannot (really) blame the installer as he has more to lose than you - potentially his life.
Si thee :Sprint:
Again!
You THROW the cable. Not need to climb.
Anybody actually know what cable I need or are we discussing the regulations and this bloke that calls himself an installation guy.
Raistlin
10-06-2008, 17:52
I think you need screened RJ6 cable (preferably something that's designed to cope with the extremes of the weather - if you're putting it over the roof it's going to get a battering).
Note though that if an engineer has to come out because of problems with your installation you might get a hefty bill.
Wicked_and_Crazy
10-06-2008, 17:57
Throwing a cable over the roof is iffy, why cant you go up the wall and through the loft?
RDDearing
10-06-2008, 18:37
Without wishing to rile the OP I don't think the technicians are in any way "lazy" because they won't do a particular route. Even if they don't climb a ladder and avoid the HSE argument, are you going to be happy if any roof damage occurs during the throw (I assume its a tiled roof, guttered etc).
Perhaps a comprimise with the engineers is possible whereby (following another suggestion in this thread) the cable is run up the wall and through the roof space and then back down the rear wall - it might even pay you to run a messenger line along such a route prior to the engineer revisiting so that they can just pull through the route?
I do agree with others that running your own cable may cause further hassle with VM down the road.
I think you need screened RJ6 cable (preferably something that's designed to cope with the extremes of the weather - if you're putting it over the roof it's going to get a battering).
Note though that if an engineer has to come out because of problems with your installation you might get a hefty bill.
Thanks you. Wow. That thread was long, perhaps I should of just asked what cable it was.
Throwing a cable over the roof is iffy, why cant you go up the wall and through the loft?
You're right mate. The cable could have either been thrown over the roof, drilled through from the front room (terrace remember) to the pantry, and then to the room at the rear. It's about 4 meters away from the current Box location, though feeding it around the rooms (and there's a gap under the doors as it's laminate now and used to be carpet) would have used more cable it would have left no marks nor drill holes, and would have been quick to do. Especially for £75.
Without wishing to rile the OP I don't think the technicians are in any way "lazy" because they won't do a particular route. Even if they don't climb a ladder and avoid the HSE argument, are you going to be happy if any roof damage occurs during the throw (I assume its a tiled roof, guttered etc).
Perhaps a comprimise with the engineers is possible whereby (following another suggestion in this thread) the cable is run up the wall and through the roof space and then back down the rear wall - it might even pay you to run a messenger line along such a route prior to the engineer revisiting so that they can just pull through the route?
I do agree with others that running your own cable may cause further hassle with VM down the road.
The cable guy was in a rush at 9am, for an appointment promised between about 12 and 6 I think it was. He came in and spoke to my Mrs and as she couldn't suggest anything he just quickly turned negative and just didn't seem to want to do it. He quickly hurried out.
I've been with VM since Cable and Wireless. They're tosh through and through but their Broadband is spot on in my road and I'm a web guy.
I've had LOADS of problems with each company that bought out the last and have never bothered to complain on geo numbers, speaking to overseas centre's and just never getting the person that's helpful.
I'd much rather do it myself now.
No offence to ALL the cable guys, just this one in a rush.
So it's a RJ6 yeah?
jungleguy
11-06-2008, 10:25
in the old days an installer would only go as high as his ladder. If he had a short ladder he'd call another installer with a longer ladder.
Unfortunately this rule of thumb no longer applies, and the new rule of thumb is 2nd floor is too high and non serviceable. (ground floor, first floor then second floor)
As for throwing the cable over the roof. They just don't do it.
I would NOT bother ringing customer services, your wasting your time and money.
If the tech could have routed the cable through the house he should then should have done it that way. If this is an option ring sales and raise a new work order, and book it for an am slot.
why couldnt you throw a string over the roof that he could tie the cable to and pullover ?????
Raistlin
11-06-2008, 12:15
In order to allow the OP to just move on from here, and assuming that they have read all of our dire warnings about not doing it, can someone please confirm my thoughts that it's a screened cable of type RJ6 that they need?
Thanks :)
kryogenik
11-06-2008, 14:47
:edit:
Not sure enough to say, sorry.
Sounds like a bone idle installer anyway, but I wouldn't have lobbed a cable over a roof either. If anything went wrong, VM would be to blame. H & S gone mad, sure, but them's the breaks.
Jonnymeg
12-06-2008, 22:15
:edit:
Not sure enough to say, sorry.
Sounds like a bone idle installer anyway, but I wouldn't have lobbed a cable over a roof either. If anything went wrong, VM would be to blame.
WRONG!
If anything went wrong the installer would be to blame!
VM do not employ their own installers, all installs are done through contractors that will charge their workers for putting right any damage.
I would not throw a cable over the roof because we are not allowed to do it anymore, simple as.
Not only is there a H&S risk involved there is also a heightened risk of damage to the cable from wear and tear due to excessive heat from the sun and friction when the cable moves in the wind.
Regardless of the attitude the installer was right to say no.
If you want to get it done your way i would drill all the holes, clear plenty of space along the route and get them out again.
sprattgraham
12-06-2008, 23:50
Easy solution lie to VM
1) Get the cable and connectors needed and install it don’t have to go through the wall just go though the loft if needed see if a Ariel installer will do it doesn’t have to touch VM stuff
2) Call VM and ask for a self install if they argue tell them the connection is in place don’t tell them you did it.
3) If it plays up at any point and the tech asks why it doesn’t have there connectors tell them it was like it when you moved in.
I've been with VM since Cable and Wireless. They're tosh through and through but their Broadband is spot on in my road and I'm a web guy.
Am I right in thinking you just want Broadband installed? If so, why don't you just have it installed in the front room, get a router, and go wireless/homeplug from there? Job done me thinks...
Nedkelly
13-06-2008, 07:44
No installer should throw a cable over the roof unless they have permisson of the insatll manger and there is no other way .In this area they go through the loft all the techs have 3 tier ladders and have the safety equipment to up them it must be different for each area :)
kryogenik
13-06-2008, 08:12
WRONG!
Ok, Ok.. So I didn't know VM's installers were contractors.
Don't have a kitten over it.
Jonnymeg
13-06-2008, 16:33
Ok, Ok.. So I didn't know VM's installers were contractors.
Don't have a kitten over it.
Is that mornington crescent NG16?
kryogenik
16-06-2008, 12:41
Is that mornington crescent NG16?
No, ISAHAC R4
As an engineer we DO NOT throw cables over roofs . we are not sky.
We do have a national field standards guide to abide by and it includes not throwing cable over roofs.
Raistlin
16-06-2008, 21:33
1. Thanks for the clarification
2. :welcome: to the site :)
on in an hour!
17-06-2008, 17:46
In order to allow the OP to just move on from here, and assuming that they have read all of our dire warnings about not doing it, can someone please confirm my thoughts that it's a screened cable of type RJ6 that they need?
Thanks :)
its RG6..couple of points here..firstly the cable would need weighting if it was thrown from the floor,and theres no guarantee (as mentioned previously)that it wouldnt cause any damage. secondly..and more importantly..the reason we dont go over the roof is that its very hard to fix the cable,so as a consequence it will blow about in the wind,eventually wearing away on the ridge tiles.who then would pay to replace it?? ;)
ccarmock
21-06-2008, 23:00
I'm just about to get NTL/Telewest business broadband and phone installed, and want it to be installed in the attic, which is a home office.
Reading here where one posted mentioned that the highest an installation engineer will go is 2 metres, that would seem to preclude takign the cable up from the external box to the eaves of the house (it's a standard 2 floor house). However I have read other people mentioned they will run a cable through the attic to get to the other side of a property.
I had an issue with Sky when I wanted their dish put on to a vent stack at that back of the house which is at the lower edge of the roof. The engeineer refused. When calling Sky they had to send out what they call their special heights team.
Hopefully this won't be an issue as since this is a new install and a business account they are doign a survey before the actual install.
I wonder if people think installing into the attic should be OK and they'll go up that far?
Lastly does the phone line have a seperate cable from the green box or does it come in on the same coax and get split off?
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