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View Full Version : They know about your Installation problems and don't care


laurei
28-01-2008, 21:04
They know about your Installation problems and don't care, The real reason for your installation problems from the point of view of someone who's installed thousands - an open letter to Avonline and Virgin and Richard Branson (http://www.leakedmemo.com/an-open-letter-to-richardbransonavonline-plc-and-virgin-media/) which y'all should read before you complain - not that Sky and Bt are better, just what you've let your country become. Can I ask for comments??
Love Laurei.

Nedkelly
28-01-2008, 21:34
A great read any installers wish to add there comments :)

sollp
28-01-2008, 21:55
Wow, well written,(as far as im concerned). But by reading the reply from the MD avonline its getting smudged over by what should be happening but clearly isnt. As usual the MD is stating what has been agreed in meetings ect but like most companys this goes out the window, as to apply it all would mean more emplyees,more costs, ect.

Think youll find this is happening in most of the contractors and to a lesser degree within VM itself.

on in an hour!
28-01-2008, 22:07
They know about your Installation problems and don't care, The real reason for your installation problems from the point of view of someone who's installed thousands - an open letter to Avonline and Virgin and Richard Branson (http://www.leakedmemo.com/an-open-letter-to-richardbransonavonline-plc-and-virgin-media/) which y'all should read before you complain - not that Sky and Bt are better, just what you've let your country become. Can I ask for comments??
Love Laurei.
first of all there are a couple of contradictory statements in there (mostly to do with time for tasks) ((but no suprise given the amount of stuff the OP had to remember))
secondly OH MY GOD,i didnt know theses draconian companies still existed!! i started installing cable for a contractor in sep 94,the conditions mentioned in the letter were exactly the same (in some cases worse..i.e. in-house fights,real fights,between installer and sups/managers,due to all of the things mentioned in the letter,and a few more!!) steadily though,from NYNEX to C & W to ntl and now VM there has been a progressive lean to making the contract partners feel part of the company they are installing for,such as branded uniforms,vans and all the benefits in-house employees get.(in the early days we had plain blue uniform,which we paid for i might add,contractor branded vehicles and the ever present threat of seeing a nice new NYNEX van and crew doing 2 am and 2 pm installs,usually on terraced houses!! while we had 8 full installs as a 2-man crew (that is cable from cab to house and everything else in the hse) up here in the N/W those companies seem to have been sussed and ( by their own stupidity/ignorance in dealing with their techs) have fallen by the wayside.we have had about 8 that i can think of in the past 14 yrs (there are more but i cant recall them,they came and went,thick and fast) techs up here now are on an achieveable bonus,if what i see posted in their yard is anything to go by,they work a standard 5 day week (tues to sat) and all seem happy with it,i expect theres a few disgruntled ones but arent there always.when i worked for cobra they were told by the government they werent classed as a 'construction company' and as such we techs couldnt be self-employed on the old SC60 scheme,as a result they dropped our price per job to compensate for the NI contributions they had to pay to match each employees contribution!! the final straw came in 98 when they were forced to give us holiday pay. their solution: we will take 8% each week from your wage then give it you back as 'holiday pay' when you take your leave!!! fortunately i came in-house in jan 99 and left all that behind,but i really do feel for the guy whos wrote this letter and commend him for standing up to the bully boys from the dark ages..but i bet it doesnt get anywhere,if you made a noise as a contractor you were out and youre name passed around all the other cable contractors as a troublemaker...'youll never work in cable again' came the cry....god how i wished that were true :D edit: me i mean,not the letter writer!

Jonnymeg
28-01-2008, 22:36
A great read any installers wish to add there comments :)

Well, how do you answer that?

At the end of the day there are issues with ALL businesses and working practices. I have never been 100% happy in any job? Have you?

Each contractor employs different methods of operation and i can say in my personal experience i have little to warrant such a tirade.
Of course there are plenty of issues i would like to see addressed but it the main most things are OK as far as it can be taking into account the balance required between what the business needs and what the workers need.

My customers always get the best service i can deliver. And if i can't meet their expectation i make sure that i pass them on to someone who can.

sollp
29-01-2008, 22:51
Well, how do you answer that?

At the end of the day there are issues with ALL businesses and working practices. I have never been 100% happy in any job? Have you?

Each contractor employs different methods of operation and i can say in my personal experience i have little to warrant such a tirade.
Of course there are plenty of issues i would like to see addressed but it the main most things are OK as far as it can be taking into account the balance required between what the business needs and what the workers need.

My customers always get the best service i can deliver. And if i can't meet their expectation i make sure that i pass them on to someone who can.

I wouldn't call it a tirade more like he has written down in great detail how he see's the problem.

How many times have you heard someone say, "this is cr*p", only to be told, "explain yourself and give me a solution". Well i think this person has gone beyond that and put it down in great detail, something you need to do when complaining on this scale.

WHISTLED
29-01-2008, 23:04
Open cabinet, testing for flammable gases (5min or 30min without keys).

Thats the best bit - The 30 mins is the time it takes to kick teh door off and leave it hanging on its hinges

sollp
30-01-2008, 22:03
Thats the best bit - The 30 mins is the time it takes to kick teh door off and leave it hanging on its hinges

Oh yes!! We've put brand new doors on some of our mux cabinets, which have a different key, and within weeks of these being fitted they are busting the locks and doors already. Even though they have the new key, or had it and have lost them already.

WHISTLED
30-01-2008, 22:32
Thats what shoes are for, stop complianing haha

Hugh
30-01-2008, 22:34
Yes, but unfortunately the local toe-rags then have fun inside it, enhancing connectivity.

I speak from experience (victim, not perp).

WHISTLED
30-01-2008, 22:37
I have to be honest, every time i see one open I want to pull all the wires out and take the labels off.

BUT I DONT THINK PEOPLE SHOULD NOR DO I DO IT!

laurei
01-02-2008, 14:57
As for contradictions, that´s the point, the contradictions are all part of an atmosphere where you can´t do anything right: I´ve spoken to Virgin and Avonline area managers who all agree it´s the case.. and I too was was told by my supervisor that I would never work for Virgin Media again. Ripping wires out of a mux, let´s be honest who hasnt felt like it, but as much as the british public suck for ever letting all of their contact with the outside world go through one questionable company (& such dodgy looking cabs)... think of the old grannies that will lose those emergency pagers, (and it could probably result to manslaughter).

I tell you what theres nothing worse than it being dark, cold, raining/snowing on the last install, busting to do a p**s and having to break into a cab, or even bending over to do a jumper on the bottom strips with a broken krone/sid/pouyet tool.

I spent some time in Wales with the guys and they seem to think it´s all right but in other areas theres a constant turnover of guys, in Crawley everyone walked off site! (but because Avonline are so big they just sent crews from other sites) Seriously I think installers should get together, if everyone got together and fought it none of the stuff would happen, I mean there´s not even a single union with complete representation throughout virgin media installaions, thats the recipe for this disaster. I´m not saying a union´s going to work at the moment, not everyone´s going to pay 5 quid a month for a union with dim chance of recognition (and doesn´t recruit), but everyone needs to come together as one for free, to talk about what to do next, and that way there will be stronger numbers for any action that does get decided.(even if its deciding to all join the same union) So I´m asking for everyone who´s an installer to PM /email me/whatever your details, we´ll keep it private, tell me your experiences (any good?) and we´ll build something that´ll work. What say you?

Bad Cable
07-02-2008, 19:44
Laurence,

When did you EVER get up a 5 a.m. to get to work in Guildford? (10-15 mins from you!!!) more like 8.30 - 9 a.m. or when someone called you...

:dunce:

laurei
18-05-2008, 04:45
With Avonline losing Birmingham and Midlands on May the 1st I can't say I didn't tell you so that Avonline jobs (http://www.leakedmemo.com/an-open-letter-to-richardbransonavonline-plc-and-virgin-media/) are badly done... Don't blame the techs all the time, everyone gives up for a reason (and that includes coming to work early). Love Laurei

PS1
27-05-2008, 14:11
that article is outstanding and ABSOLUTELY spot on. i worked for avonline for 5 years and on many occasions wanted to write something like that( but didnt have time lol).i totally agree with every single word.

there wasnt one single person working there when i did that wouldnt totally agree with everything mention, but many were not prepared to speak up about it, as the few that did soon became unemployed.

the mentioned strike would be a great option ,providing the WHOLE team stuck by it,
we tried it once(after threatening it about a thousand times aweek),and all we got (from the powers to be ) was a phone call saying, they were on the way from bristol to our yard and any engineer still there when they arrived would be out of a job.

and on any other occasion an issue was raised, the old, IF YOU DONT LIKE IT , LEAVE!!!! response was given to us.

luckily i ve got a great job now that im very happy with(and all aspect of), however, i do sympathize with anyone working for avonline(especially mates i still know there) as i know what they have to put up with and some of them deserve a lot more.

DSMap
28-05-2008, 20:42
Hi to everyone, as this is my first post. I am installer working in the midlands under map electrics. I have just read the open letter and I must say that I can relate to almost everything on there. Although I would say that under map things seem to be slightly better than avonline. I was sent over to work in birmingham with about another 8 techs from the leics site. We were sent there to try and win the contracts for map and consequently this happened.

I started working for map at the age of 19 after attending a 2 week training course. I then spent about a week working with various crews on the site and then teamed up with someone else in our own crew. What the managers didnt tell me was that the guy who they teamed me up with was a drunk and one of the most lazy people I had ever met! I spent a further 2 weeks working with this guy and then he decided to leave me on my own on a full dig job with 7 drill outs..........After this I was beginning to wonder if this was the right job for me! The tech I worked with was then sacked after this incident. Eventually after 2 manning for a while they gave me a 1 man spot. Great...I thought......I can work at my own pace and wont be slowed down by anyone else. How wrong could I have been. I started one manning with 9 jobs most days and never had time to rest. I was getting home by 6-7 most nights. Eventually I got faster at the job and things started to get better.

After about 9 months though i took some time off due to having a newborn daughter. When I returned back to work I couldnt really cope with the workload and my Fault rates and complaints increased due to this. As a pumishment ( I guess) I was put back on too 2 manning. This was actually a breath of fresh air......I had company throughout the day and the workload could be shared. The site I work at has now changed. Because of the brand that virgin represents i.e a respectable brand which values the customer, the workload has been decreased to 6-7 jobs for a 1 man and 4-5 for a 2 man. This has made things better because you dont feel as rushed and you can concentrate on the quality rather than the quantity. The consequence to this is that the wages have now dropped quite dramatically and although the workload is less the hours are still the same because you spend longer trying to make the quality better. I would say that the staff moral at my yard is the lowest I have ever seen, the lads come in with their complaints and try to make themselves heard but nothing actually gets heard.

I am not trying to say that this is the worst company in the world to work for but things definately need to change. There is talk of the minimum wage increasing, this is only going to happen though when virgin see an improvement across all of the map sites. This means that all of the KPI's would have to improve i.e fault rates, completion rates, complaint rates and also monthly quality audits. This means that every single tech on every site would have to improve before the wages are increased. The site that I work for has been one of the best performing sites for a while, but in reality this wouldnt matter because if other sites are not improving then the wage would never change.

One of the biggest complaints from the techs on my site is that the work carried out demands alot more of a better wage than the one currently given. To be a cable installer and a good one I mean you have to utilise many skills throughout your day. It seems to be that other companys like bt etc are more respected wheras cable installers are seen as cowboys. I think that this could be down to the high staff turnover seen at many sites. Lads are brought in with the offer of a great career and great earnings but are then greatly dissapointed with the reality of the job. You are signed into atleast a years contract but if you want to leave before the year is over then you have to pay back a certain percentage of the cost of the training course. This could be upto 2500 pounds. You can then see why lads leave after the year is out. It can be a vicious circle!

I think that the job could be great if alot of things changed but after talking to alot of my colleagues it seems to be that the cable industry has been the same for many years. I came into this job as a fresh faced teenager excited to be starting a new career but now 2 years down the line I am sorely dissapointed! Hopefully things can only get better.

Thanks for taking the time to read this and hopefully It isn't too much of a depressing first post!

Feenix
01-06-2008, 01:55
Quantity > Quality in VM's eyes. It's the same on service. Same **** different day imo.