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superbiatch
01-10-2007, 00:01
I moved into my new apartment in February so only really caught the tail end of winter. Its now getting a bit chilly and i'm wondering how expensive my heating actually is to run?

Its a brand new build, i have a seperate megaflow water tank which i found out to my detrement is very expensive to run leaving it on all the time, when i received my first electric bill - so don't want the same to happen with my heating.

My heaters are really modern slimline looking, and each one has its own digital timer control. I have no control over the energy input (i've read some people control their own input levels) but i assume its on some kind of cheap tarrif and is stored in a central point within my block. Incidentally i can't change my electricity supplier as the management company who run the building have a deal with the supplier which means we all buy together for cheaper. Every year they find us the cheapest supplier (supposedly).

Has anyone got any idea how to use them in the cheapest/energy efficient way? The plan is to have it on in bedroom and living room 1st thing in the morning for an hour, then just the living room of an evening depending on how cold it is. Btw, each one has its own thermostatic control, so ive been trying to keep it to just under 20.

Sorry for long-winded post, just don't want to end up with a massive bill :)

dragon
01-10-2007, 00:36
I moved into my new apartment in February so only really caught the tail end of winter. Its now getting a bit chilly and i'm wondering how expensive my heating actually is to run?

Its a brand new build, i have a seperate megaflow water tank which i found out to my detrement is very expensive to run leaving it on all the time, when i received my first electric bill - so don't want the same to happen with my heating.

My heaters are really modern slimline looking, and each one has its own digital timer control. I have no control over the energy input (i've read some people control their own input levels) but i assume its on some kind of cheap tarrif and is stored in a central point within my block. Incidentally i can't change my electricity supplier as the management company who run the building have a deal with the supplier which means we all buy together for cheaper. Every year they find us the cheapest supplier (supposedly).

Has anyone got any idea how to use them in the cheapest/energy efficient way? The plan is to have it on in bedroom and living room 1st thing in the morning for an hour, then just the living room of an evening depending on how cold it is. Btw, each one has its own thermostatic control, so ive been trying to keep it to just under 20.

Sorry for long-winded post, just don't want to end up with a massive bill :)

Youd need to know what the maximum rating for the heaters is, then how much your paying per unit.

Then just mutiply the Cost per unit (1kw/hr) by the current draw of the heater.

Of course if it has a high/med/low setting it may not draw its full rated current but if you know how much your paying per unit and the maximum its going to draw then you'll know the MOST its going to cost you.


assuming its a 1kw heater and your paying 12p/unit it would cost you 12p an hour to run..

Although I have no idea what it costs for a unit of electricity thesedays since I don't pay the bill currently (that's probably going to change soon :( )

bopdude
01-10-2007, 00:40
It's been a long time since I had anything to do with storage heaters, but, a quick outline. The heating of the bricks within the heater is done over night on a cheaper tarrif, the output or heating was controlled via a 'flap' of sorts, the more open the flap was, the more heat came out ( a very crude explanation ) sorry if I'm stating the obvius. Can you give us the make and model of the heaters, might be able to give a bit better guide that way :tu:

Angua
01-10-2007, 00:42
IIRC the electricity for the storage heaters is usually taken at night then the heat is released throughout the next day. You should be on a day and night rate charge for electricity and well worth having the water heat up in the night & use first thing, also run things such as washing machines & tumble dryers in the night saves quite bit of dosh.

Chris
01-10-2007, 00:51
The golden rule with a storage heater is not to let a draught get to it - air flow makes them discharge more quickly, and seeing as they only charge up overnight (some have an early afternoon top up though, IIRC), once the heat is gone, it's gone.

Keep your doors closed, and then go and give the person who put storage heaters into a modern flat a good kicking. They are a poor, outmoded technology that has no place in any modern building!

greencreeper
01-10-2007, 01:07
I used to have them when I lived in Seacroft - in a Council flat. Very expensive to run. I just had the one (of two) running in the living room. I made the mistake of turning them all on. The meter needed water cooling, it was spinning that fast :p: I was on a token meter at the time. I think it used about 50p a night. Also had 6KW immersion heater - also pricey. Anyway, back to the heaters. They would charge overnight - they were all on a seperate circuit, that had a timer (controlled by the electricity supplier). Between midnight and one they would start charging (and emitting heat) and would stop about seven-to-eight in the morning. During this time, the electricity would switch to a cheaper tariff. Economy7 I think it was called. I could control how long the heater charged for, but I always had it set to maximum - for reasons I'm getting on to. Now, during the day, even with the heating turn down (basically a flap control, like Bop says), the heater would be HOT - I accidently burnt stripes into my wrist with it. Just caught it a glancing blow when hanging out the washing. Sizzle :cry: Trouble is, the heat would run out around ten on a night, and by eleven it would be heatless. Many a winter I sat watching TV with a hot-water bottle on my feet, wrapped in a blanket. I had a fan heater but it cost too much to run, and due to the size of the room, the heat didn't last once the heater was turned off. Terrible times.

Charlie_Bubble
01-10-2007, 01:50
I moved into my new apartment in February so only really caught the tail end of winter. Its now getting a bit chilly and i'm wondering how expensive my heating actually is to run?

Its a brand new build, i have a seperate megaflow water tank which i found out to my detrement is very expensive to run leaving it on all the time, when i received my first electric bill - so don't want the same to happen with my heating.

My heaters are really modern slimline looking, and each one has its own digital timer control. I have no control over the energy input (i've read some people control their own input levels) but i assume its on some kind of cheap tarrif and is stored in a central point within my block. Incidentally i can't change my electricity supplier as the management company who run the building have a deal with the supplier which means we all buy together for cheaper. Every year they find us the cheapest supplier (supposedly).

Has anyone got any idea how to use them in the cheapest/energy efficient way? The plan is to have it on in bedroom and living room 1st thing in the morning for an hour, then just the living room of an evening depending on how cold it is. Btw, each one has its own thermostatic control, so ive been trying to keep it to just under 20.

Sorry for long-winded post, just don't want to end up with a massive bill :)

You should get a sepecrate bill for your electricity. You need to check this to see what your current tariffs are. You should have at least 2 different charges, daytime and night time/economy. You may have more than this. My own electricity has 4 different tariffs, weekday daytime, weekday evening, night time and weekend daytime. Each has a different charge, with weekday daytime being the most expensive. All of your hot water and heating should be connected to a seperate circuit that is only switched on by your electricity meter when the economy tariff cuts in. You need to check your bill to have an idea of what your tariffs are.

I have a megaflow water heater and they are very good water heaters, but you need to make sure that yours is only used by the economy circuit. Your tank should have 2 separate heaters on it with 2 separate switches on the wall. One of these is economy and the other will have the tank on all the time. work out whichis which and only have the economy one switched on. Use the other one as a booster if you are home all day and need some hot water.

I normally only have one of my storage heaters on at a time except during the most severe winter temperatures. I have a big heater in my living room and a smaller one in the hallway. I start by having the one in the hall on low, then switch it up a little when it gets a bit colder. During the colder months I have the bigger one switched on and when it gets very cold I put the hallway one on again. You have to have the doors of your rooms open, but it works ok like this for me.

Alien
01-10-2007, 05:48
It's a shame you haven't got gas powered central heating, as a combination condensing boiler [I think that's what it's called] is really cheap to run. IIRC, mine has a minimum efficiency of something like 83%. I think the most it's ever cost me, when it's been really cold, has been about £25-30/month, & that's for heating & hot water.

SMHarman
01-10-2007, 07:15
Right this is an apartment building...
Since dodgy gas caused Ronan Point to explode
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronan_Point
All new buildings constructed after November 1968 and over 5 storeys were required to be able to resist an explosive force of 5 lbs per square inch (psi). Existing buildings were allowed to resist an explosive force of 2.5 psi, provided that the gas supply was removed and flats were refitted for electric cooking and heating. The gas supply was removed from Ronan Point and the other eight blocks on the estate.
I'm guessing that sb's new apartment block is over 5 stories so subject to this and has been bouilt to the lower requirement. This is pretty common.

So electric it is, no changing that.

You should also find the place is built to new building regulation with Part L compliance
http://www.energysavingtrust.org.uk/housingbuildings/regulations/
This will reduce drafts (as noted by ChrisT) to a minimum - also increases the risk of mold and mildew as there is nowhere for condensation to go.

So storage heaters themselves, as others have said, a heat absorbant block of concrete or something that gets charged on the cheap rate electric and then discharges during the day / night. The trick is to work out how much charge you need before it is discharged / hits the time to get recharged again. You could think of them a bit like solar outdoor patio lights in reverse, charge at night discharge during the day / eve.

So keep them on as low as possible output diruing the day so come evening you get heat (unless you are there all day) The way of working out the cost has already been said.

Power consumption x rate, but they should charge on a lower overnight rate. The building construction should also help keep the heat in.

Alien
01-10-2007, 07:48
Right this is an apartment building...
Since dodgy gas caused Ronan Point to explode
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronan_Point
Miss Hodge survived, despite being blown across the room by the explosion - as did her gas stove, which she took to her new address after the explosion.
:shocked:

I'm guessing that sb's new apartment block is over 5 stories so subject to this and has been bouilt to the lower requirement. This is pretty common.

So electric it is, no changing that.
"Apartment" is just a fancy &/or American name for a flat. I live in a block of flats, which has only 2 stories, & there are plenty of 2 story blocks of flats about.

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 10:12
Wow - thanks for all the replie, i go to bed and wake up to this :)

OK, a few answers for you.

I pay 10.49 per unit of electricity, this is all the time. We are not on any special tarrif but we also don't pay a standing charge - this is non-negotiable and in with my contract unfortunately.

My heaters are not like the old fashioned ones fitted in council high rises (had those before), they are slimline ones and after reading some information it seems they are called 'panel heaters' - similar to these http://www.discountedheating.co.uk/shop/acatalog/Consort_24_Hour_Timer_Panel_Heaters.html

My 'apartment' :p: block has 80 apartments over 14 floors, they are ex-council bought and redeveloped - here is the website to give you an idea http://www.parklandskirkby.co.uk/home

---------- Post added at 09:12 ---------- Previous post was at 09:08 ----------

I have a megaflow water heater and they are very good water heaters, but you need to make sure that yours is only used by the economy circuit. Your tank should have 2 separate heaters on it with 2 separate switches on the wall. One of these is economy and the other will have the tank on all the time. work out whichis which and only have the economy one switched on. Use the other one as a booster if you are home all day and need some hot water.

I've managed to work out my water heater and if i generally put it on for an hour a night, thats enough. Its so well insulated it actually stays warm for at least 24 hours :)

Chris
01-10-2007, 10:16
Well, they aren't storage heaters, so you can ignore most of the responses in this thread. ;)

They are not so different from bar heaters, they have an element inside that heats up when switched on.

To calculate your running costs, take your leccy price - 10.49 pence for one Kilowatt/Hour - and multiply by the power output of the heater. This should be on a rating plate somewhere on the heater. If you can't find it, try to look up your exact model online. Is it one of the ones you linked to?

If you have 0.5Kw heaters, that's 10.49 x 0.5 - 5.245 pence per heater per hour.

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 10:19
Well, they aren't storage heaters, so you can ignore most of the responses in this thread. ;)

They are not so different from bar heaters, they have an element inside that heats up when switched on.

To calculate your running costs, take your leccy price - 10.49 pence for one Kilowatt/Hour - and multiply by the power output of the heater. This should be on a rating plate somewhere on the heater. If you can't find it, try to look up your exact model online. Is it one of the ones you linked to?

If you have 0.5Kw heaters, that's 10.49 x 0.5 - 5.245 pence per heater per hour.

I'm sorry for all the messing about, i'm finding this out as i'm going along as the idiots who sold me the place aren't exactly 'informed'

I can't find the exact model online because i think it was a foreign one from norway, need to find the paperwork tonight when i get home from work. But going on what you're saying - they don't seem as expensive as storage heaters?

Chris
01-10-2007, 10:23
Probably not, but in absolute terms they are still a little pricey. I suppose in your favour is that you're in a flat, which won't need nearly as much heating as a draughty old house.

Your leccy price is a bit high as well. I don't know what kind of bulk purchase discount your landlord is getting, but I don't think he's passing it on to you.

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 10:28
Probably not, but in absolute terms they are still a little pricey. I suppose in your favour is that you're in a flat, which won't need nearly as much heating as a draughty old house.

Your leccy price is a bit high as well. I don't know what kind of bulk purchase discount your landlord is getting, but I don't think he's passing it on to you.

Thanks for your help Chris :) Thats worrying me a little less now - just gonna try and find my exact model, i also have a stainless steel electric heated towel rail in the bathroom, but tend to not use this.

By law they are not allowed to overcharge us for our electricity because in effect they are taking the choice away from us to pick our own supplier (i took this up with them at the time). But i do keep an eye on prices and we're not paying much more than most who also pay a standing charge - so i suppose we're saving there.

Chris
01-10-2007, 10:37
A landlord can either charge you for what you use, if you have a meter, or based on your floorspace and installed appliances if you don't.

In the former case, you should get a bill detailing your usage. In the latter, you will just get a bill from him for your share of the total electricity used by the whole building.

If he's billing you based on usage he is allowed to include your share of the standing charge in the bill. I don't know whether he's doing that by inflating your price per unit (or even if that's allowed).

If you're billed based on the size of your flat and what you have installed, then there's little incentive for you to be careful with your heaters as cutting down your own leccy usage will not necessarily have a direct, appreciable effect on your bill (as your savings will simply be shared among all tenants).

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 10:39
A landlord can either charge you for what you use, if you have a meter, or based on your floorspace and installed appliances if you don't.

In the former case, you should get a bill detailing your usage. In the latter, you will just get a bill from him for your share of the total electricity used by the whole building.

If he's billing you based on usage he is allowed to include your share of the standing charge in the bill. I don't know whether he's doing that by inflating your price per unit (or even if that's allowed).

I have my own meter in between mine and my neighbour, so get accurately charged (i've evn checked this ;))

Chris
01-10-2007, 10:40
In that case, I think your heating and billing arrangements are as good as you can expect them to be ... all you can do is be sensible about which heaters you switch on, and when.

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 10:52
In that case, I think your heating and billing arrangements are as good as you can expect them to be ... all you can do is be sensible about which heaters you switch on, and when.

These are them http://www.noboheatinguk.com/products_series14_e4eu.html Athough i can't see the output watt to work it out :confused:

At least i have a much better idea now tho, thanks v much - can't give you anymore rep until i spread it around a bit :shocked:

Chris
01-10-2007, 10:59
Elsewhere on the same site:

http://www.noboheatinguk.com/pdf/s14_e4eu.pdf

Your model has variable output from 0.5kW to 2kW, depending on how high you turn up the heat. So anything from about 5p to 20p per heater per hour.

20p per hour is very expensive, especially for multiple heaters. Hopefully you won't need to run them all at high heat very often!

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 11:03
Elsewhere on the same site:

http://www.noboheatinguk.com/pdf/s14_e4eu.pdf

Your model has variable output from 0.5kW to 2kW, depending on how high you turn up the heat. So anything from about 5p to 20p per heater per hour.

20p per hour is very expensive, especially for multiple heaters. Hopefully you won't need to run them all at high heat very often!

You're a star, have been looking for just that :)

I think i'll be nipping down to boots for a new hot water bottle ;)

Chris
01-10-2007, 11:19
Just keep the doors closed and only heat the rooms you're using. You should be ok.

---------- Post added at 10:16 ---------- Previous post was at 10:13 ----------

Hang on - just reading that PDF again - they aren't variable output, they're different models with differing outputs depending on which one you buy. So you're back to looking for a rating plate again ... actually all you need is the precise, complete model number, the PDF gives the output for each. For example the E4EU 0500 is the 0.5kW model and the E4EU 2000 is the 2kW model.

---------- Post added at 10:19 ---------- Previous post was at 10:16 ----------

According to this page:

http://www.noboheatinguk.com/techdata_spec.html

You can tilt them forwards for decorating behind - you may find the rating plate or a full model number there.

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 11:19
Just keep the doors closed and only heat the rooms you're using. You should be ok.

---------- Post added at 10:16 ---------- Previous post was at 10:13 ----------

Hang on - just reading that PDF again - they aren't variable output, they're different models with differing outputs depending on which one you buy. So you're back to looking for a rating plate again ... actually all you need is the precise, complete model number, the PDF gives the output for each. For example the E4EU 0500 is the 0.5kW model and the E4EU 2000 is the 2kW model.

I've looked at that PDF and i've definitely got the biggest one in my living room. It has a big area to heat because its open plan living/dining and kitchen. Does that mean no matter what heat i have it on it will always be using 2kW?

The others are quite small ones, will check out exact models later.

Chris
01-10-2007, 11:25
If it's the biggest one, then its output is 2kW no matter what you do.

Remember though that it's only emitting that level of heat while it's switched on. When your room reaches the temperature set on the thermostat, the heater will cut out and only come on again occasionally to keep the temperature constant.

It only costs you 20p per hour to use if it runs constantly for that hour. It gets tricky at this point to work out what it's actually using to maintain your temperature - short of standing over it for an hour with a stopwatch and recording how much time it spends switched on, I'm not sure what you can do.

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 11:39
OK, that doesn't seem to hard to keep track of. If i keep the heat realistic and use only when needed, and keep the thermostat at an acceptable temperature so it doesn't keep switching on and off.

By George i think she's got it!! :D

Mr_love_monkey
01-10-2007, 14:14
I could always offer to come round and keep you warm??? :)

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 14:15
I could always offer to come round and keep you warm??? :)

3 hours journey for 30 seconds of action, i'll give it a miss hun :p:

Mr_love_monkey
01-10-2007, 14:18
Personally, give how expensive these heaters are to run (and how ineffectual they are as well, most of the time) - I think it's criminal they put them in at all, rather than using a gas system - but I guess it's all to do with cutting costs

---------- Post added at 13:18 ---------- Previous post was at 13:17 ----------

3 hours journey for 30 seconds of action, i'll give it a miss hun :p:

30 seconds????? you've got to be joking - I ain't doing it twice!

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 14:22
Personally, give how expensive these heaters are to run (and how ineffectual they are as well, most of the time) - I think it's criminal they put them in at all, rather than using a gas system - but I guess it's all to do with cutting costs

Not at all, its safety. There was a gas explosion about 20 years ago in a block near to my mums where luckily no one died but the whole side was blown out the building. So i believe gas appliances aren't allowed anymore - which is a shame cos my friend offered to lend me his Calor Gas GTi ;)

---------- Post added at 13:18 ---------- Previous post was at 13:17 ----------

30 seconds????? you've got to be joking - I ain't doing it twice!

hehe :D

Mr_love_monkey
01-10-2007, 14:26
Not at all, its safety. There was a gas explosion about 20 years ago in a block near to my mums where luckily no one died but the whole side was blown out the building. So i believe gas appliances aren't allowed anymore - which is a shame cos my friend offered to lend me his Calor Gas GTi ;)


Well from the post SMHarman posted earlier, it reads to me that as long as the building can withstand a blast of 5psi, then it can have gas, and those that can't, don't have gas? - which points to a cost saving exercise (but I could have read it wrong).

RUSTY
01-10-2007, 14:38
economy 7 depending on the area is a tad under half price, use mine for one storage heater in a cold kitchen, cheap hot water, dishwasher, shower, wash......ect ect.runs from 01:00 till 18:00hrs.main heating is gas boiler for rads and top up hot water.some older tarrifs have daytime boosts.

zing_deleted
01-10-2007, 14:42
Have a word with your apartment management cuz I only pay a little over 5p per unit of electric

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 14:45
Well from the post SMHarman posted earlier, it reads to me that as long as the building can withstand a blast of 5psi, then it can have gas, and those that can't, don't have gas? - which points to a cost saving exercise (but I could have read it wrong).

Now come on, talking technical to me now! I'm not sure about any of that, so i'm nodding in agreement :)

---------- Post added at 13:45 ---------- Previous post was at 13:43 ----------

economy 7 depending on the area is a tad under half price, use mine for one storage heater in a cold kitchen, cheap hot water, dishwasher, shower, wash......ect ect.runs from 01:00 till 18:00hrs.main heating is gas boiler for rads and top up hot water.some older tarrifs have daytime boosts.

Apparently we can't be on economy 7 for some reason - but valid points I will look into it :)

Have a word with your apartment management cuz I only pay a little over 5p per unit of electric

Is that right Zing??? Hmmmm, now i'm getting wound up :rolleyes: Does that include a standing charge?

zing_deleted
01-10-2007, 14:46
There isnt a standing charge I get charged 12 p per unit for the first so many a year (and this is but a fraction of what I use) then it drops to 5p per unit( so for about 2 months per year I pay more than you but then for 10 months I pay half )

Hugh
01-10-2007, 14:50
Have a word with your apartment management cuz I only pay a little over 5p per unit of electric
I'm with npower, and I pay
Night - 4.340p per kWh (that's when the dishwasher and washing go on, using timers)
Day - 11.960p per kWh

No standing charge, paid by monthly direct debit.

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 14:51
There isnt a standing charge I get charged 12 p per unit for the first so many a year (and this is but a fraction of what I use) then it drops to 5p per unit( so for about 2 months per year I pay more than you but then for 10 months I pay half )

I've got my last 8 bills (since i've been there) and they have always been 10.49 per unit as far as i can remember. Must check!

zing_deleted
01-10-2007, 14:51
im with npower online tarrif fixed direct debit and 80 quid discount a year

Charlie_Bubble
01-10-2007, 16:06
I'm with EDF. My Tariff is as follows:
Daytime: 11.72p per unit (Ok as I am normally at work)
Eve & W/E: 9.07p per unit
Night: 4.39p per unit
Economy: 3.8p per unit
I have a standing charge of 11.17p per day.

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 16:09
How come some properties get economy 7 and some don't? I'm wondering why they agreed to this price fix which is 24/7 :confused: and i'm stuck with it til at least next september - as the contract was only signed recently :(

Chris
01-10-2007, 16:12
Economy 7 is for premises with storage heaters. The cheap tariff is for use overnight while you charge the heaters up. A house or flat should not be on Economy 7 if it does not have storage heaters installed.

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 16:17
Economy 7 is for premises with storage heaters. The cheap tariff is for use overnight while you charge the heaters up. A house or flat should not be on Economy 7 if it does not have storage heaters installed.

Ah right, i understand.

I've opened up a can of worms i think on here :dozey:

SMHarman
01-10-2007, 16:35
My 'apartment' :p: block has 80 apartments over 14 floors, they are ex-council bought and redeveloped - here is the website to give you an idea http://www.parklandskirkby.co.uk/home

Well from the post SMHarman posted earlier, it reads to me that as long as the building can withstand a blast of 5psi, then it can have gas, and those that can't, don't have gas? - which points to a cost saving exercise (but I could have read it wrong).
Which I imagine means they did not upgrade the structure, but the cladding and the interior fitments. So a building that back then was not designed to 5psi.

zing_deleted
01-10-2007, 17:06
imo storage heaters are poop anyway. Get one of them portable calor gas fires and warm the room up your in

SMHarman
01-10-2007, 17:12
imo storage heaters are poop anyway. Get one of them portable calor gas fires and warm the room up your inA portable gas heater is not exactly cheap to run, those gas bottles are GBP20 each (if I recall).
And besides it is illegal in this case.

zing_deleted
01-10-2007, 17:32
in that case id be buying thermal undies ;)

I forgot everyone on this forum is a law abiding citizen ;) :)

SMHarman
01-10-2007, 17:48
in that case id be buying thermal undies ;)

I forgot everyone on this forum is a law abiding citizen ;) :)

15kg of butane is 20.99
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butane
Molar mass 58.08 g/mol
Density 2.52 g/l, gas (15 °C, 1 atm)
425 and 411 kJ/mol for the two types of C-H bonds of energy with that and some stoichiometry you should be able to work out a cost ber Kw of the gas in that bottle. I would imagine it will be more than 10.5p/Kw though.

zing_deleted
01-10-2007, 18:03
fairy snuff but imo Super is being skanked

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 19:18
A portable gas heater is not exactly cheap to run, those gas bottles are GBP20 each (if I recall).
And besides it is illegal in this case.

Oops, that was my fall back plan :(

SMHarman
01-10-2007, 19:36
Oops, that was my fall back plan :(
To be honest I'm guessing they are illegal as well it is a gas appliance in a tall building and could just as easily cause the same type of explosion.
I also don't think that they would save you money. Running your 2kw heater 24/7 would cost about 18 a week. I doubt if you put a 15kg gas bottle in one of those 2KW gas heaters and turned it on full the gas would last all week, an unscientific way of saying even if your electric is more than some are paying it is still cheaper to heat the place with the electric heaters than with a gas heater.

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 19:42
To be honest I'm guessing they are illegal as well it is a gas appliance in a tall building and could just as easily cause the same type of explosion.
I also don't think that they would save you money. Running your 2kw heater 24/7 would cost about 18 a week. I doubt if you put a 15kg gas bottle in one of those 2KW gas heaters and turned it on full the gas would last all week, an unscientific way of saying even if your electric is more than some are paying it is still cheaper to heat the place with the electric heaters than with a gas heater.

Thanks for simplifying that, seems i'm pretty much up the creek with a big leccy bill :)

Time to invest in a new coat me thinks ;)

Hugh
01-10-2007, 20:02
Don't forget the thick sheepskin slippers.......;)

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 20:36
Brrrrrr.... getting a bit cold now :rolleyes:

Mr_love_monkey
01-10-2007, 21:00
Brrrrrr.... getting a bit cold now :rolleyes:

I refer you to my previous offer :)

popper
01-10-2007, 21:04
Thanks for simplifying that, seems i'm pretty much up the creek with a big leccy bill :)

Time to invest in a new coat me thinks ;)

OC you could think different if your really worryed about the cost over the winter, the old tricks work just as well today, that being keeping the cold air out and the hotter air in as much as possible by, double backing your curtains and fixing offcuts of old carpet to the door gaps at the bottom.

you can even go out an buy cheap temp winter double glazing kits for your windows and fitting these as extra thermal barriers in the cold times of year.

http://www.diyplas.co.uk/double_glazing_and_insulation.asp

http://www.diyplas.co.uk/Category.asp?catid=3&subcatid=176

http://www.diyplas.co.uk/Product.asp?catid=3&subcatid=371

stopping the cold air coming in means less heat loss and so cheaper electric bills all round.

theres also nice cheap and easy stickyback draft excluders for placing around door frames on a long roll you could use to help keep out the cold.

you could even put up kite mark approved insulating ceiling tiles above a shallow false ceiling to help keep the heat in if you cant get/have access to the rafters/loft etc if your in the place for a long time.

its also a good idea to have a backup or at least an extra heat source, i like using those cheap oil filled electric stand alone radiators,they dont get very warm, but if you put one behind the wall side of your bed , the heat travels through the bed over time and its nice and warm there and in the room when you need/want it for instance.

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 21:06
OC you could think different if your really worryed about the cost over the winter, the old tricks work just as well today, that being keeping the cold air out and the hotter air in as much as possible by, double backing your curtains and fixing offcuts of old carpet to the door gaps at the bottom.

you can even go out an buy cheap temp winter double glazing kits for your windows and fitting these as extra thermal barriers in the cold times of year.

http://www.diyplas.co.uk/double_glazing_and_insulation.asp

http://www.diyplas.co.uk/Category.asp?catid=3&subcatid=176

http://www.diyplas.co.uk/Product.asp?catid=3&subcatid=371

stopping the cold air coming in means less heat loss and so cheaper electric bills all round.

theres also nice cheap and easy stickyback draft excluders for placing around door frames on a long roll you could use to help keep out the cold.

you could even put up kite mark approved insulating ceiling tiles above a shallow false ceiling to help keep the heat in if you cont get/have access to the rafters/loft etc if your in the place for a long time.

Thanks for that, i'm really well insulated but there is always room for improvement :)

popper
01-10-2007, 21:27
another one people forget, is turning down your fridge and freezers in the really cold winters, these alone take masses of electric as they constantly turn on and off the gas coolant pump, you can save a lot of electric there too if your not lucky enough to afford the best low energy applyences etc.

for fun, and semi portability (more than long term electric savings,but it would save lots), iv even looked at running a PC and LCD off solar power and a big battery pack, it can work but i cant afford the industrial batterys or a large pannel facing the large south windows yet.

LCD's use a hell of a lot less electric compaired to a generic desktop CRT monitor, as do the rather neat small car PC kits ,compaired to desktop models, these car PCs are more than good enough to browse and do everyday web stuff other than high wattage PC gameing etc.

SMHarman
01-10-2007, 23:44
Also traditional light bulbs provide a good source of heat, see in winter that heat from the bulbs provides ambient heating as well as light

---------- Post added at 17:44 ---------- Previous post was at 16:28 ----------

Thanks for simplifying that, seems i'm pretty much up the creek with a big leccy bill :)

Time to invest in a new coat me thinks ;)Dunno about up a creek. Are you at home all day? I thought you worked. Assuming the latter
Do these things have timers or do you just switch it on. Anyway you switch it on and set a room temperature on it. For say the next hour it piles out 2kw of heat and gets the room up to temp. That has cost you 20p. For the next say 5 hours until you go to bed it is on for say 1/4 of the hour keeping the room at that temp, so 5 hours at 5p 25p. So to keep that room warm for 6 hours cousts you 45p
You might run the one in the bedroom which will have a lower current draw overnight at a lower temp so say 30m at 1kw 5p and then 8 hours at 2p 16p = 21p.

You should be able to keep the place warm for less than a quid a day on weekdays and maybe two to three on the weekend (or stay tucked up with MrLM). Don't know how that fits in your budget though.

superbiatch
01-10-2007, 23:56
Dunno about up a creek. Are you at home all day? I thought you worked. Assuming the latter
Do these things have timers or do you just switch it on. Anyway you switch it on and set a room temperature on it. For say the next hour it piles out 2kw of heat and gets the room up to temp. That has cost you 20p. For the next say 5 hours until you go to bed it is on for say 1/4 of the hour keeping the room at that temp, so 5 hours at 5p 25p. So to keep that room warm for 6 hours cousts you 45p
You might run the one in the bedroom which will have a lower current draw overnight at a lower temp so say 30m at 1kw 5p and then 8 hours at 2p 16p = 21p.

You should be able to keep the place warm for less than a quid a day on weekdays and maybe two to three on the weekend (or stay tucked up with MrLM). Don't know how that fits in your budget though.

I am at work all day, and they do have timers so i'll have to set just the ones i want on at the right time. And i'll go visit friends at the weekend ;)

Sorry MrLM :p:

zing_deleted
02-10-2007, 00:06
Also traditional light bulbs provide a good source of heat, see in winter that heat from the bulbs provides ambient heating as well as light

---------- Post added at 17:44 ---------- Previous post was at 16:28 ----------

Dunno about up a creek. Are you at home all day? I thought you worked. Assuming the latter
Do these things have timers or do you just switch it on. Anyway you switch it on and set a room temperature on it. For say the next hour it piles out 2kw of heat and gets the room up to temp. That has cost you 20p. For the next say 5 hours until you go to bed it is on for say 1/4 of the hour keeping the room at that temp, so 5 hours at 5p 25p. So to keep that room warm for 6 hours cousts you 45p
You might run the one in the bedroom which will have a lower current draw overnight at a lower temp so say 30m at 1kw 5p and then 8 hours at 2p 16p = 21p.

You should be able to keep the place warm for less than a quid a day on weekdays and maybe two to three on the weekend (or stay tucked up with MrLM). Don't know how that fits in your budget though.

am I missing something? storage heaters do not work like that they use power to heat the bricks then the hot bricks release the heat into the room through some kinda venting . Its not like you can turn it on or off when you want

superbiatch
02-10-2007, 00:12
am I missing something? storage heaters do not work like that they use power to heat the bricks then the hot bricks release the heat into the room through some kinda venting . Its not like you can turn it on or off when you want

Sorry Zing, after long winded convo with Chris W i realised i didn;t even have storage heaters (altho thats what i was told they were by the house builders!) blonde moment!

They are electric panel heaters, sorry for messing you about :rolleyes:

zing_deleted
02-10-2007, 00:24
:)

I think you need to get all the residents together and confront the landlord or whatever about the electric supplier though. I would say your being well scanked

goto uswitch.com and put in some bullplop figures for your postcode and see what is available in your area and what prices they charge I bet you a pound to a peice of the plop your landlord is selling you the prices are a fraction of what your stuck with

Alien
02-10-2007, 05:48
for fun, and semi portability (more than long term electric savings,but it would save lots), iv even looked at running a PC and LCD off solar power and a big battery pack, it can work but i cant afford the industrial batterys or a large pannel facing the large south windows yet.
What about using car batteries instead?

Chrysalis
05-10-2007, 07:58
im with npower online tarrif fixed direct debit and 80 quid discount a year

seems you are lucky as its area dependent. As to why there is a postcode lottery its something I might bring up with my MP because after you have revealed what you paying I cant see how its right.

I am currently with atlantic and pay 9.21p per unit this is for day and night in addition I have a standing charge at 6.280p per day adding up to £5.71 on a quaterly bill. I knew mine wasnt that expensive when I seen my sister was paying over 15p per unit.

Npower quote page offers me this.

Tariff Rate excl. VAT Rate incl 5% VAT
Standard
first 728 kWh per year 16.500p per kWh 17.32p per kWh
additional kWh per year 8.360p per kWh 8.78p per kWh
Sign Online†
first 728 kWh per year 21.040p per kWh 22.09p per kWh
additional kWh per year 5.340p per kWh 5.61p per kWh
Economy 7
day rate:
first 728 kWh per year 18.510p per kWh 19.44p per kWh
additional kWh per year 8.810p per kWh 9.25p per kWh
night rate:
kWh 3.830p per kWh 4.02p per kWh
Sign Online Economy 7†
day rate:
first 728 kWh per year 20.180p per kWh 21.19p per kWh
additional kWh per year 7.000p per kWh 7.35p per kWh
night rate:
kWh 3.000p per kWh 3.15p per kWh
Standard prepayment
kWh 8.800p per kWh 9.24p per kWh
standing charge £ 26.650 per quarter £ 27.98 per quarter
Economy 7 prepayment
day rate 9.570p per kWh 10.05p per kWh
night rate 3.920p per kWh 4.12p per kWh
standing charge £ 31.010 per quarter £ 32.56 per quarter


So if I prepay I get rates in line with you otherwise I am worse off then I am now.

edit

ok had another look it seems I can save a lot of money if I am using a lot of units, I checked my meter and I would probably save in the long run but there is something fishy going on with my units which I will make a new thread about.