Virgin make me mad!!

[Gary L]

Sometime last month Virgin Media changed their support service for
broadband problems and instead of just ringing 150 from a Virgin phone
now you have to dial a premium rate number. 25p/min + 10p connection
charge. No letters or emails to notify customers of this change in the
package they were offered, just happened overnight.

Yesterday I had a fault with my modem which refused to show ready, so
I rang. Same call centre in India that it always was, but now they spend
the first minute telling you that the call is chargeable, asking if
you're the billpayer, over 18, confirming name and address etc. But
hang on, says I, you cant really be charging me to report a fault with your
equipment? No, assures the call centre, if the fault is at our end
then we refund the call. After ten minutes of diagnostics, he agrees there
is a fault with the modem and decides to book an engineer visit, which of
course takes him another ten minutes. Finally, visit booked for
sometime today, and I *must* agree to be home because if he comes and I'm notin, I'll be charged £10. Naturally I asked if the reverse applies, i.e. if
the engineer fails to arrive (not uncommon!) will they pay *me* £10?
Unfortunately the irony doesn't seem to translate well and he is
confused before saying that no, of course that wouldn't be the case.

Later last night I noticed the modem lights were back on so I tried to
connect and was successful, so I phoned to cancel the engineer. No way
of doing that without ringing the same premium number, so as soon as
he answers I interrupt his warning spiel and tell him I only want to
cancel an appointment, as the fault has been corrected. I can hear him
industriously tapping away on his keyboard and five minutes later, hey
presto, appointment cancelled. So I ask the obvious question, I'll not
be charged for this call either, right? Ah, no, says he, you will be -
you're cancelling an appointment. I'm dumbstruck! So what should I do
then, *not* cancel an appointment and when he shows up simply tell him
he's not wanted? No, says he, that would apply the 'failed callout'
charge of £10. Just to rub salt in, the earlier call I'd made will now
*also* be chargeable, because as there is no fault there now the
engineer has no way to prove the fault was at their end. I spend
another two minutes arguing the stupidity of that and then suddenly realise
I'm paying 25p/min for the privilege of arguing with someone who doesn't
care, so I hang up and dial Customer Services.

They refuse to refund either call, and tell me that because I didn't
disconnect when I got the warning about the call charge, I 'accept'
the charges applied. But how do I report that there is a fault, then?
Well, you cant, you have to pay to do that and then hope that Virgin accept
the fault is with them later, something over which you have no control
and which they have a vested interest in not being truthful about. I'm
being icily polite but firm and insist that I wont be paying those
call charges, sorry. Paraphrasing them "tough, its already on your bill".
"well, I'll cancel the direct debit then and just pay the bill minus
the two calls". "then we'll charge you £5 per time for not paying by
direct debit". "okay, I'll continue to pay by direct debit, but 'cap' the
forthcoming bill to reflect the two calls". "then we'll disconnect you
and apply charges for *that*". And then a direct quote "we'll put the
bill in the hands of our debt collection agency and you will find it
difficult to arrange credit in the future. They will call at your
house and take goods to the value of your debt".

At that point I admit I lost my cool and told them that their
statement was a deliberate and intimidating lie, as their debt collector had no
legal rights, and that I now wanted to speak to a manager, who simply
stated that they could not waive those charges and if I wanted to
appeal against it I should call technical support who were the only people
with the power to do that. But that costs me *another* call, which they'll
not refund, to try to get a *previous* call refunded says I. Sorry,
says the manager, thems the breaks.

How on Earth can such a process be allowed? Surely the unfair contract
terms act doesn't permit Virgin to unilaterally change the charge for
technical support and insist that you pay something you never agreed
to at the outset of the contract? And wouldn't the same act prevent them
from applying a 'new' charge and preventing the customer from any way
of disputing it? We're talking about a total cost of about £3 here but
that isn't the point - Virgin are intimidating their customers into
accepting charges to report that *they* have a fault! Where the hell do you go with a company who insist they are always right and that the customer
has no redress?

[Sirius]

Sometime last month ++++++++++++SNIP+++++++++++ redress?

Welcome to the Highest standard of Virgin customer Service. That last statement translates as follows.


STUFF YOU CUSTOMER

[slowcoach]

The “Bloke in the Pub” tells me that VM are thinking of replacing the Bangalore call centre with a UK one staffed by parrots, the thinking being that it will not only be cheaper for VM but the parrots will probably have as much idea initially, with the prospect of picking things up faster as they go along, customers will be more able to understand them and to top it all the call will be more amusing making customers more inclined to call again.
Well let's face it, it isn't very amusing at the moment.

Instead of calling I place the call cost in a jar and explain to the cat what the problem is, obviously the cat can't give me the answer to the problem but it does give me a sympathetic look, and hey! and I'm getting richer by the day.

[xpod]

Although you had to obviously call the premium rate number for the initial assistance you should have been able to just call Customer Services on 150 to canel any appointment after that i think.....or indeed take up any other issues with regard to charges etc.

[photodude]

I don't call them back, because when I do, the fault usually comes back;)

[Tech_Boy]

The call to cancel the engineer should have been refunded as well.
If a customer comes through to me to cancel an engineer, I'll run diagnostic tools to see if there are any underlying issues that would need to have an engineer out.

If there are no issues I cancel the engineer, if there are issues I tell the customer and leave the appointment in place.

Either way if a customer is trying to cancel an engineer, and therefore save us money, the customer should not have to pay for the call.

[york]

Have you made a complaint to Trading Standards? Surely this is a case of entrapment? you have been given no options to avoid charges from the outset even tho you were originally reporting an accurate fault which was thier cause/responcibility.

[Toto]

Have you made a complaint to Trading Standards? Surely this is a case of entrapment? you have been given no options to avoid charges from the outset even tho you were originally reporting an accurate fault which was thier cause/responcibility.

Entrapment, is that a law covered by Trading standards?

[xpod]

I don't call them back, because when I do, the fault usually comes back

:)
We`ve certainly experienced the joys of calling up to have X & Y fixed only to end up with X,Y & Z messed up.Quite a common feature it seems:rolleyes:

[Sloper]

I feel your pain Gary L! My trouble stopped a little short of yours though, as when they tried to arrange an engineer visit, I told them not to bother. I had a feeling the connection would come back of its own accord... just like it did after the 2 hour outage the night before (they didn't report any faults in my area THAt night, either :confused::mad:)
Incidentally, we also lost TV for the same period :mad:

In Comet last week, I was approached my a Sky rep who told me they had an offer on and could HALVE my total bill for phone, TV and internet! Anyone here any experience with them? I see they are providing HD TV channels (VM are not)

[Toto]

I feel your pain Gary L! My trouble stopped a little short of yours though, as when they tried to arrange an engineer visit, I told them not to bother. I had a feeling the connection would come back of its own accord... just like it did after the 2 hour outage the night before (they didn't report any faults in my area THAt night, either :confused::mad:)
Incidentally, we also lost TV for the same period :mad:

In Comet last week, I was approached my a Sky rep who told me they had an offer on and could HALVE my total bill for phone, TV and internet! Anyone here any experience with them? I see they are providing HD TV channels (VM are not)

Price may be cheaper, but the quality of service may just be as comparable as the one you have had from Virgin, so going with that I'd say you were better with Sky.

Be careful though and read the small print "Could HALVE" is a lot different from "Will HALVE".

[Mick Fisher]

I feel your pain Gary L! My trouble stopped a little short of yours though, as when they tried to arrange an engineer visit, I told them not to bother. I had a feeling the connection would come back of its own accord... just like it did after the 2 hour outage the night before (they didn't report any faults in my area THAt night, either :confused::mad:)
Incidentally, we also lost TV for the same period :mad:

In Comet last week, I was approached my a Sky rep who told me they had an offer on and could HALVE my total bill for phone, TV and internet! Anyone here any experience with them? I see they are providing HD TV channels (VM are not)
Sky TV services are leap years ahead of VM's offering IMHO. As for other services I have no idea. The IP they bought out was not thought highly of and I suspect original personnel with original strategies will still be running the show. I don't believe it is ever a good idea to put all your eggs in the same basket. Be look a good alternative to VM BB and BT have served me well for telephony with only 2 service interuptions in 30 years at this address.

[the_traveller]

Dear 'Gary1',
It would be useful if you could remember in future to acknowledge that you're quoting somebody else rather than allowing readers to believe this is your own post. Many thanks, the original poster

[moaningmags]

If I have to book an engineer for a customer the call charge is refunded
as soon as the call is ended.
If I have to raise an issue to 2nd line for further investigation the call charge
is refunded as soon as the call is ended.
If I have to raise a fault to anywhere else and it's not on the status page
the call charge is refunded as soon as the call has ended.
The start and end time of the call is in my notes in hour/minute/seconds format.
When I book a tech the customer is informed they will be charged £10 if either
no-one is home or the only person home is under 18.
I also inform the customer that is the tech is booked for 8am-12pm and he arrives
at 12:10pm to call in and he will be given a credit for £10.
It works both ways.
Customer calls to cancel tech, the call charge is refunded, he's opening up a
tech visit for someone who needs it more.
Yes, we have the spiel at the start calls are 25ppm and 10p connection charge.
ICSTIS requires this by law, we have no choice it has to be said, I've got it down
to 8 seconds.
"Hi, you're thru to virgin media technical support speaking to me, calls are
25ppm 10p connection charge, mobiles and other networks may vary, how can i help?"
This is the training I was given, don't know how it compares to others.

On the other side as a customer, I had to call in a few weeks ago as I could
sign into Broadband extras but couldn't play the games, this needed raising to
2nd line, (refundable call as far as I'm concerned) the indian agent said it would
have to be confirmed it was fault on Virgins end, I argued the point, told him he
would be refunding the call as his job was done and he had escalated it, also
told him I'd be calling customer care in 10 mins to confirm he had credited the call
cost.
Did exactly that and yes, he credited the cost of the call.
In Gary Ls' case I would have refunded both calls.

[eth01]

Virgin make you mad?

Virgin make my blood boil...

:mad:

[the_traveller]

If I have to book an engineer for a customer the call charge is refunded as soon as the call is ended.
If I have to raise an issue to 2nd line for further investigation the call charge
is refunded as soon as the call is ended.
If I have to raise a fault to anywhere else and it's not on the status page
the call charge is refunded as soon as the call has ended.
The start and end time of the call is in my notes in hour/minute/seconds format.
When I book a tech the customer is informed they will be charged £10 if either no-one is home or the only person home is under 18.
I also inform the customer that is the tech is booked for 8am-12pm and he arrives at 12:10pm to call in and he will be given a credit for £10.
It works both ways.
Well if thats the policy, why wasn't I told that when I called? Even after challenging him about it, he still didn't tell me that I'd get a credit if he failed to show. And just to rub salt in the wound, the moron failed to cancel it anyway, as the engineer showed up! I want to check whether they charged me for a failed callout, but I'm going to have to wait until I calm down a bit before I dare check!

On the other side as a customer, I had to call in a few weeks ago as I could
sign into Broadband extras but couldn't play the games, this needed raising to
2nd line, (refundable call as far as I'm concerned) the indian agent said it would have to be confirmed it was fault on Virgins end, I argued the point, told him he would be refunding the call as his job was done and he had escalated it, also told him I'd be calling customer care in 10 mins to confirm he had credited the call cost.
Did exactly that and yes, he credited the cost of the call.
Hmmmm, Virgin assured me it wasn't possible to check my calls until the following day, as the info updated only at midnight. If thats a pile of bovine excrement as I suspected and as your post seems to indicate, it'd be nice to know for sure so I can add that to my apparently never-ending complaint!
In Gary Ls' case I would have refunded both calls.
Its a pity then that I, the original poster of this thread, didn't get you on the phone!

[moaningmags]

I think they're right that it takes 24 hours for the calls you've made to show on your account. (I could be wrong about them being right about this but it's not my area so I've never been told)
But they can check immediately if a credit has been been applied and if they say they can't, they need retraining! I know how to check this and I work in tech support, not customer service or billing.
Again they can check exactly the same way to see if a £10 charge has been applied.
Again if they can't they need retraining.

I love the job I do, I take every customers' issues as my responsibility in as far
as I can. If I don't know the answer to a customers query, for example, PWP is a major
hassle for me, I know very little about it, then I'll get the info required, usually from 2nd line, if I don't understand what they're telling me I'll ask for an explanation.
I expect the same from the person on the other end of the phone when
I have to call in regardless of whether it's VM, the electric company or the gas company.
And to those that struggle to do this, I'd say get a new job.

[Mick Fisher]

I think they're right that it takes 24 hours for the calls you've made to show on your account. (I could be wrong about them being right about this but it's not my area so I've never been told)
But they can check immediately if a credit has been been applied and if they say they can't, they need retraining! I know how to check this and I work in tech support, not customer service or billing.
Again they can check exactly the same way to see if a £10 charge has been applied.
Again if they can't they need retraining.

I love the job I do, I take every customers' issues as my responsibility in as far
as I can. If I don't know the answer to a customers query, for example, PWP is a major
hassle for me, I know very little about it, then I'll get the info required, usually from 2nd line, if I don't understand what they're telling me I'll ask for an explanation.
I expect the same from the person on the other end of the phone when
I have to call in regardless of whether it's VM, the electric company or the gas company.
And to those that struggle to do this, I'd say get a new job.
:clap::clap::clap:
If only every agent had your attitude. :)

[smarty]

I feel your pain Gary L! My trouble stopped a little short of yours though, as when they tried to arrange an engineer visit, I told them not to bother. I had a feeling the connection would come back of its own accord... just like it did after the 2 hour outage the night before (they didn't report any faults in my area THAt night, either :confused::mad:)
Incidentally, we also lost TV for the same period :mad:

In Comet last week, I was approached my a Sky rep who told me they had an offer on and could HALVE my total bill for phone, TV and internet! Anyone here any experience with them? I see they are providing HD TV channels (VM are not)

I can only coment on Sky TV as I have no experience of their Internet or Phone services.
Sky TV is simply way ahead of VM. I had VM TV installed simply beacause by doing so I got a £7.00 reduction in my 'Phone charge. I really didn't want or need it. But now having tried it I cannot beleive how bad the TV service really is!
The menu system is so slow and clunky, the picture quality is worse than sky (more compression - blocky pictures) and the remote control must have been designed by a 5 year old, it falls out of your hand. On top of that the VM service breaks down frequently, the red button never works and the STB needs weekly re-boots. All in all a VERY poor service compared to SKY.
In the 8 years I have had Sky I have never had to call them for any loss of service and never has the STB needed re-booting.

In VM's favour, their Internet service is far better than I ever had on ADSL with AOL, and consistantly get 20Mbps at any time of day or night.

Their 'phone service is comparable in most ways to that offered by BT, but I will be cancelling the 'phone in December, after 12 months because I was lied to about caller ID being available in my area and will return to BT.
Again with BT I cannot recall in 21 years that the 'phone service was ever dead, I just wish now that I had never taken up the VM 'phne sytem.
In the 10 months I have been with VM it has failed at least 6 times, usually due to a local power-cut. This doesn't affect BT as they have battery back-up in their exchanges.

I will stay with VM for broadband as it is a very good service, but the telephone and the (free) TV that comes with it can go ASAP.