NTL routing problem today?

[Longwave]

I've been having trouble accessing certain sites all day today, with web pages timing out at random, but if I hit refresh it often works on the second or third try, only to fail again a few minutes later. I'm in Coventry, if that makes any difference.

In a traceroute to www.bbc.co.uk, hop 7 (inside NTL's network) almost always never responds:

2 6 ms 5 ms 5 ms 10.254.32.1
3 9 ms 7 ms 8 ms brhm-t2cam1-b-ge-wan43-103.inet.ntl.com [213.106.228.153]
4 8 ms 8 ms 7 ms brhm-t3core-1b-ge-012-0.inet.ntl.com [195.182.176.73]
5 8 ms 7 ms 8 ms bir-bb-b-so-100-0.inet.ntl.com [213.105.174.5]
6 11 ms 9 ms 10 ms nth-bb-a-so-300-0.inet.ntl.com [62.253.185.105]
7 * * * Request timed out.
8 14 ms 15 ms 36 ms tele-ic-1-so-110-0.inet.ntl.com [62.253.185.78]
9 14 ms 15 ms 13 ms 212.58.238.189
10 13 ms 14 ms 13 ms 212.58.238.149
11 15 ms 16 ms 15 ms 212.58.224.81

A trace to a server located in Telehouse, London, goes through New York for some reason:

2 5 ms 7 ms 16 ms 10.254.32.1
3 7 ms 7 ms 8 ms brhm-t2cam1-a-ge-wan43-103.inet.ntl.com [213.106.228.25]
4 11 ms 8 ms 8 ms brhm-t3core-1a-ge-012-0.inet.ntl.com [195.182.176.57]
5 8 ms 8 ms 7 ms bir-bb-a-so-100-0.inet.ntl.com [213.105.174.1]
6 18 ms 13 ms 12 ms win-bb-b-so-110-0.inet.ntl.com [62.253.185.142]
7 12 ms 31 ms 11 ms win-bb-a-ge-000-0.inet.ntl.com [213.105.172.161]
8 * * * Request timed out.
9 * * * Request timed out.
10 83 ms 81 ms 82 ms po8-0.nykcr3.newyork.opentransit.net [193.251.243.105]
11 81 ms 82 ms 81 ms po7-0.nykbb3.newyork.opentransit.net [193.251.241.242]
12 * 14 ms 15 ms 134.222.230.122
13 15 ms 15 ms 35 ms ldn-s2-rou-1002.uk.eurorings.net [134.222.231.62]
14 14 ms 14 ms 14 ms kpn-gw-sup-tfm4.jump.net.uk [194.153.169.237]
15 14 ms 15 ms 14 ms 43-246.rbsov.bogons.net [85.158.43.246]
16 14 ms 15 ms 13 ms oliver.bytemark.co.uk [80.68.81.90]

Re-running the trace a minute later takes me an entirely different route, still with severe packet loss inside NTL's network:

2 7 ms 7 ms 6 ms 10.254.32.1
3 8 ms 10 ms 6 ms brhm-t2cam1-a-ge-wan43-103.inet.ntl.com [213.106.228.25]
4 8 ms 8 ms 8 ms brhm-t3core-1a-ge-012-0.inet.ntl.com [195.182.176.57]
5 9 ms 8 ms 7 ms bir-bb-a-so-100-0.inet.ntl.com [213.105.174.1]
6 7 ms 8 ms 7 ms bir-bb-b-ae0-0.inet.ntl.com [62.253.185.154]
7 10 ms 10 ms 9 ms nth-bb-a-so-300-0.inet.ntl.com [62.253.185.105]
8 * * * Request timed out.
9 * * * Request timed out.
10 * * 15 ms bre-bb-b-ge-000-0.inet.ntl.com [213.105.174.226]
11 * * 15 ms ldn-s2-rou-1022.uk.eurorings.net [134.222.231.225]
12 17 ms 17 ms 23 ms 134.222.230.122
13 13 ms 14 ms 15 ms ldn-s2-rou-1002.uk.eurorings.net [134.222.231.62]
14 14 ms 29 ms 16 ms kpn-gw-sup-tfm4.jump.net.uk [194.153.169.237]
15 13 ms 13 ms 13 ms vl310-bytemark-peer-statler.jump.net.uk [194.153.169.220]
16 13 ms 14 ms 13 ms oliver.bytemark.co.uk [80.68.81.90]

Anyone else seeing similar issues today?

[AbyssUnderground]

The DNS has gone tits up again as well. Every site takes an age to look up. I know its DNS because even my server upstairs takes an age to look up!

[Toto]

I've had a problem most afternnon connecting to a games server in Europe, frequent disconnects, looks like a problem at ntl's data centre in Winnersh.

C:>tracert 80.239.233.101

Tracing route to 80.239.233.101 over a maximum of 30 hops

1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 192.168.1.1
2 16 ms 29 ms 8 ms 10.30.80.1
3 8 ms 11 ms 12 ms swan-t2cam1-b-ge92.inet.ntl.com [80.0.254.129]
4 9 ms 8 ms 8 ms swan-t2core-b-ge-wan61.inet.ntl.com [195.182.176
.9]
5 12 ms 11 ms 11 ms win-bb-b-so-710-0.inet.ntl.com [62.253.187.241]

6 * * * Request timed out.
7 * * * Request timed out.
8 26 ms 26 ms 23 ms po14-0.pascr2.Paris.opentransit.net [193.251.128
.105]
9 * * 18 ms ldn-b2-link.telia.net [213.248.100.37]
10 14 ms 17 ms 12 ms ldn-bb1-link.telia.net [80.91.249.186]
11 * * * Request timed out.
12 * * * Request timed out.
13 *

[pdjkeelan]

A thread was posted by Blizzad on the forum for World of Warcraft under technical support asking for traceroutes of users that were having trouble accessing WoW e.g. frequent disconnects starting earlier today.

Every single user reporting the problem was NTL or Virgin Internet (which is owned by NTL).

http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=77857984&sid=1&pageNo=1

Could anyone here that works for NTL report this problem to engineers ASAP please :)

[mutejute]

same here in warwick. frequent disconnects in world of warcraft. now im trying to connect gazillion times but it wont connect.

[Toto]

A thread was posted by Blizzad on the forum for World of Warcraft under technical support asking for traceroutes of users that were having trouble accessing WoW e.g. frequent disconnects starting earlier today.

Every single user reporting the problem was NTL or Virgin Internet (which is owned by NTL).

http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=77857984&sid=1&pageNo=1

Could anyone here that works for NTL report this problem to engineers ASAP please :)

Right, great...one big problem though, Blizzards hosts their European Website on the same server hosts as their games servers, can't get to that site. :)

[scrotnig]

I cannot access my own website (hosted in the states) or most sites not physically located in the UK, though there are exceptions to this.

I know the sites aren't down because if I use a Tiscali dialup they are fine.

[sdjl]

I cannot access my own website (hosted in the states) or most sites not physically located in the UK, though there are exceptions to this.

I know the sites aren't down because if I use a Tiscali dialup they are fine.
Same. Using my servers IP's i can access them fine, just not via domain names. Irritating.

David

[scrotnig]

Same. Using my servers IP's i can access them fine, just not via domain names. Irritating.

David
You're lucky to even get that far. I cannot access via IP either.

If I change proxies and find one that works I can access for a bit, then after about five minutes it stops again. Yet this site and some others are fine.

I have reported it, but they didn't really know what I was getting at, they asked me for some example sites and then proceeded to question me as to what the sites were about.

So there is an issue, but it's impossible to get anyone at ntl to acknowledge or even understand it.

It might be one for someone who still works there who has contacts to pick up and pass it on.

[SOSAGES]

im having same issue and so are 3 of my buddies on NTL
its the end of the world
Tracing route to 213.248.123.57 over a maximum of 30 hops
1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 192.168.0.1
2 9 ms 26 ms 18 ms 10.28.12.1
3 20 ms 12 ms 21 ms rdng-t2cam1-b-ge95.inet.ntl.com [62.253.122.145]
4 13 ms 15 ms 24 ms winn-t2core-b-ge-wan62.inet.ntl.com [195.182.176
.157]
5 11 ms 8 ms 11 ms win-bb-b-so-600-0.inet.ntl.com [62.253.184.117]
6 30 ms 32 ms 34 ms win-bb-a-ge-000-0.inet.ntl.com [213.105.172.161]
7 21 ms 18 ms 25 ms gfd-bb-b-so-100-0.inet.ntl.com [213.105.172.130]
8 * * * Request timed out.
9 * * 30 ms telia-1.gw.opentransit.net [193.251.252.22]
10 30 ms 33 ms 34 ms prs-bb1-pos7-1-0.telia.net [213.248.65.221]
11 37 ms 51 ms 39 ms ffm-bb1-pos6-0-0.telia.net [213.248.64.109]
12 55 ms 35 ms 36 ms hbg-bb1-pos6-1-0.telia.net [213.248.64.41]
13 57 ms 81 ms 68 ms s-bb1-pos5-0-0.telia.net [213.248.64.29]
14 53 ms 59 ms 53 ms s-b3-link.telia.net [80.91.249.88]
15 53 ms 54 ms 68 ms s-hdn-i3-link.telia.net [80.91.249.69]
16 * * * Request timed out.
17 * * * Request timed out.
18 * * * Request timed out.
19 * * * Request timed out.
20 * * * Request timed out.
21 * * * Request timed out.
22 * * * Request timed out.
23 * * * Request timed out.
24 * * * Request timed out.
25 * * * Request timed out.
26 * * * Request timed out.
27 * * * Request timed out.
28 * * * Request timed out.
29 * * * Request timed out.
30 * * * Request timed out.
Trace complete.

[marv69]

Cant play wow get it sorted ntl :p

[bywater]

Issues in Coventry with loads of sites inacessable due to pages timing out. Why O why did I persaude NTL to get me to stay with them after the last time. This as been a regular occurence almost on a weekly/monthly basis now for the last year. When is it going to get sorted ?:td:

[machead]

same in manchester

been crap all day

[CandyKoRn00]

As soon as my contract with NTL runs out, I'm totally switching provider..

I only started with NTL last month and already this is the second problem I've had.

[scrotnig]

I am now paying £24.99 a month for a broadband connection, yet also paying 4.5p per minute to actually get on the internet using a dialup connection.

[mshhal]

May be more than just routing problems. I'm using BTconnect from work and the ntlworld.com site seems to be unavailable.

[Toto]

Its all gone belly up, my speed tests are really bad, and the wow eu site is full of posters unable to connect from their ntl connections.

Nothing on the server status page though.

[scrotnig]

Its all gone belly up, my speed tests are really bad, and the wow eu site is full of posters unable to connect from their ntl connections.

Nothing on the server status page though.
The best I got from tech support was to check that my site was up - which it is - and to try changing proxies - which I already knew but which largely doesn't work for this problem.

[Toto]

Dare I call technical support?

Yeh, don't think so, I'll sit back I think, and go have a cuppa.

[scrotnig]

Dare I call technical support?

Yeh, don't think so, I'll sit back I think, and go have a cuppa.
If you can get them to grasp the nature of the problem it'd be worth it. But they seem to think that all it means is that all these sites are down and it's not an ntl issue.

I have tried twice and I cannot get them to understand what I'm saying...not in a language sense, they seem able to speak English ok, it's that they can't see the nature of the problem.

[Sparechange]

Aye having big problems, started in the last few hours (possibly earlier). Browsing difficulties, repeated disconnects from games etc etc

[Toto]

If you can get them to grasp the nature of the problem it'd be worth it. BUt they seem to think that all it means is that all these sites are down and it's not an ntl issue.

I have tried twice and I cannot get them to understand what I'm saying...not in a language sense, they seem able to speak English ok, it's that they can't see the nature of the problem.

I can't be arsed to be honest, I really can do other things, and I should :)

[Monserrat]

I can't access World of Warcraft either.

I've tried the obvious, and it seems to fall in line with the rest of you guys on here. It doesn't seem to depend on where you are in the UK, just the fact that you are on NTL.

[mutejute]

man! its been all day like this. tried to connect to WoW from morning until now. *sigh*

[pdjkeelan]

It was better about 15mins ago for all of 5 minutes, then went back to the normal disconnects and bad routing.

[Sparechange]

For the WoW players, there's this post:

http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=77857984&pageNo=1

looks pretty conclusive :) All NTL/Virgin users posting.

edit: from that thread (just posted now)
FYI, I'm at work at the moment, but my wife is at home and just spoken to NTL - they have confirmed that this is their fault / problem, and that it has been escalated for a fix.

[scrotnig]

For the WoW players, there's this post:

http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=77857984&pageNo=1

looks pretty conclusive :) All NTL/Virgin users posting.

edit: from that thread (just posted now)
People affected cannot access that though.

[Sparechange]

People affected cannot access that though.

Takes a few tries but I'm affected and I can (eventually).

[AbyssUnderground]

Now very few sites are working for me. When they do they are slow. This site, weirdly, works fine :confused: And always does when there are DNS issues :confused:

WTF is going on NTL, FIX IT!!! :mad:

[scrotnig]

Same here, things have now got worse and I even had trouble accessing CableForum about ten minutes or so ago.

I am sure this will be fixed soon...ToS are reporting that someone at WoW has spoken to someone at ntl and they have network issues in London, or something.

[Albie]

Get it sorted, NTL. :mad:

[PBL]

just spoke to broadband support, ntl seem to be pointing the finger at telia for the issues with world of warcraft

[Monserrat]

Who/what are Telia? Are they the backbone for NTL?

[AbyssUnderground]

Same here, things have now got worse and I even had trouble accessing CableForum about ten minutes or so ago.

I am sure this will be fixed soon...ToS are reporting that someone at WoW has spoken to someone at ntl and they have network issues in London, or something.

Issues in London does explain the DNS problems or the fact I can't access my own server which is all but 5m away from me up in my loft! It works fine locally but I can be f*****d if I can access it through its URL. NTL will have DNS servers in other places but London. If they don't thats just asking for trouble if there are routing issues.

Also, NTL is the only ISP I know of that has ever has a DNS issue. WTF!

Who/what are Telia? Are they the backbone for NTL?

Aren't NTL their own backbone? They have enough cable laid out.

[PBL]

Telia are the ISP that blizzard use

I believe they are scandinavian originally, but now operate across europe...

[pdjkeelan]

If it was a problem with Telia why is it only effecting users of NTL? No other ISP is having this problem...

[AbyssUnderground]

I should mention I just changed my primary DNS to 194.168.8.100 and the issues have disappeared. Seems 194.168.4.100 is causing these issues.

EDIT: Spoken too soon I think, its slow looking up again.

[bigcat]

Browsing is a joke here in Teesside, just rang work (I work in the Network Dept in NTL, well for another 2 weeks till its all gone to Telewest), and they aint aware of any issues either. But then again, they wouldn't be as Telewest Network Surveillance should be picking up any issues now..

[AbyssUnderground]

Browsing is a joke here in Teesside, just rang work (I work in the Network Dept in NTL, well for another 2 weeks till its all gone to Telewest), and they aint aware of any issues either. But then again, they wouldn't be as Telewest Network Surveillance should be picking up any issues now..

Im in Teeside too, TS6, its a joke I agree. I can just about browse the main sites I use but my own sites are only intermittantly accessible.

[Sparechange]

The reason NTL are blaming Telia is (probably) because a few WoW users told them the tracert (to the WoW servers) stopped at Telia. Blizzard said a few times (on that thread) that this is perfectly normal, their Telia servers cannot be pinged directly.

[scrotnig]

This seems now to have been fixed.

Well done ntl.

(I rather foolishly took someone's advice and had a quick look on "another site" on this subject, I made three posts and two of them got immediately deleted. Reminds me what a great job the guys here do!)

[Toto]

OK, WoW is working fine for me, and out of UK sites are now loading OK.

[sdjl]

Alright for some. I'm still having issues.

[vileda]

still having problems in sunderland with this, it is NOT fixed

---------- Post added at 17:43 ---------- Previous post was at 17:00 ----------

And is this normal?


Pinging www.ntlworld.com [212.250.162.12] with 32 bytes of data:

Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=119
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=29ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=19ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=36ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=37ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=25ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=24ms TTL=119
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=29ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=19ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=24ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=119
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=24ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=119
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=26ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=30ms TTL=119
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=33ms TTL=119
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=119
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=119
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=19ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=18ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=119
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=19ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=24ms TTL=119
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=45ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=24ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=156ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=32ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=31ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=119
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=30ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=174ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=31ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=28ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=26ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=35ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=46ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=35ms TTL=119
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=30ms TTL=119
Reply from 212.250.162.12: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=119

Ping statistics for 212.250.162.12:
Packets: Sent = 90, Received = 76, Lost = 14 (15% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 18ms, Maximum = 174ms, Average = 27ms
Control-C
^C

[Druchii]

No it's not normal.

I get the same thing at various times of the day.