Any BB progress in S.London? [Archive]

gallego1

25-09-2003, 23:35

Originally posted by bigitup_j
my FACT is: 75,000 homes currently being upgraded to broadband in south london. don't know exactly where or when it shall be finished though.
:)

How can this be a fact. we can all say a figure of x000's of homes in an area will be on bb SOON

To give this comment some credibility why not state the areas (that is if you know) that are being upgraded.

I have been following the various versions of this thread since last summer (2002) and including the ficticious letter and still there are comments like " an area of S. London has been upgraded this week". YET no one in the street can confirm that this has been done or even knows what street it was.

Either we start to give the truth and that is we are looking until 2005 or whatever the present date is (depending who you speak to ) for BB in x Videotron areas or we stop being so vague and give precise postcoded areas that were done in the previous week

Otherwise this will go round the usual roundabouts and the same people will start the :bigcry: and it gets closed again

What will this achieve?

Sweet F.A. as the thread will reincarnate again, more roundabouts, more closures

:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

dialanothernumb

26-09-2003, 08:45

Originally posted by Undisputedtruth
I wish it was true. I live in SE London where it is allege BB would be made available in my area.:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :shrug:

I know of no one using NTL bb in my area or those surrounding it.

Don't you already have adsl? or do you just want to have the choice?

I'm switching to adsl some time next month and am full of trepidation

D

rippedoff

26-09-2003, 10:34

Originally posted by gallego1
How can this be a fact. we can all say a figure of x000's of homes in an area will be on bb SOON
To give this comment some credibility why not state the areas (that is if you know) that are being upgraded.
I have been following the various versions of this thread since last summer (2002) and including the ficticious letter and still there are comments like " an area of S. London has been upgraded this week". YET no one in the street can confirm that this has been done or even knows what street it was.
Either we start to give the truth and that is we are looking until 2005 or whatever the present date is (depending who you speak to ) for BB in x Videotron areas or we stop being so vague and give precise postcoded areas that were done in the previous week
Otherwise this will go round the usual roundabouts and the same people will start the :bigcry: and it gets closed again
What will this achieve?
Sweet F.A. as the thread will reincarnate again, more roundabouts, more closures

:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

HEAR! HEAR! Just what I was saying when I opened this thread - I am glad someone is listening!
OTHERS............. Pay attention please!
:spin:

bigitup_j

26-09-2003, 11:06

the 75,000 upgrade thing, is from an ntl manager. i will be able to tell you more information from 1st october (2003) onwards.
hopefully i can bring you good news!

Undisputedtruth

26-09-2003, 11:11

rippedoff

26-09-2003, 12:01

Originally posted by bigitup_j
the 75,000 upgrade thing, is from an ntl manager. i will be able to tell you more information from 1st october (2003) onwards.
hopefully i can bring you good news!

If you are going to bring us more of your 'facts' after 1st October, please substantiatate your claims in some way that will give it (and you) some credibility. If you cannot give it credibility, I wouldn't bother if I was you!

We want FACTS - SUBSTANTIATED ! NOT RUMOURS !
Is that too much to ask for?

:shrug:

Chris

26-09-2003, 13:15

Originally posted by rippedoff
If you are going to bring us more of your 'facts' after 1st October, please substantiatate your claims in some way that will give it (and you) some credibility. If you cannot give it credibility, I wouldn't bother if I was you!

We want FACTS - SUBSTANTIATED ! NOT RUMOURS !
Is that too much to ask for?

:shrug:

Seeing as you want facts, if they come from anywhere they are going to come from the very ntl staff that are often attacked in this forum, apparently for the crime of >shock, horror< being ntl staff. This is called 'biting the hand that feeds you'.

Without wishing to aim this suggestion at any specific member of this forum, can I suggest that if we need help from ntl staff we start treating them with the same respect as everyone else and stop making demands one moment and then issuing put-downs the next?

Undisputedtruth

26-09-2003, 13:58

I can well understand Rippedoff frustration in not receiving substantial information.

I can remember Rippedoff showing respect to NTL staff. Due to his own experiences with NTL, like many thousands of customers, he has learnt not to respect them. This is not RO fault but NTL. I'm afraid in this case NTL will have to learn how to earn respect. The honeymoon period for NTL has ended years ago!

Chris

26-09-2003, 14:02

Originally posted by Undisputedtruth
I can well understand Rippedoff frustration in not receiving substantial information.

I can remember Rippedoff showing respect to NTL staff. Due to his own experiences with NTL, like many thousands of customers, he has learnt not to respect them. This is not RO fault but NTL. I'm afraid in this case NTL will have to learn how to earn respect. The honeymoon period for NTL has ended years ago!

I too can understand why people are frustrated. Faceless corporations can be infuriating to deal with, especially when they keep claiming 'coming soon' and then not following through by delivering. I can't disagree with you on the issue of respect; NTL has let a lot of people down.

But I do think we need to try to separate our skepticism of NTL the faceless bureaucracy from the individual staff members that frequent this forum. They are all individual people who deserve respect and most of them are actually trying to help.

Undisputedtruth

26-09-2003, 14:07

I have seen RO behaving amicably, asking sensible questions. Yet, he has faced a number of abuses. He has received very little or no help from NTL staff. Most of them has abused him in the past. Therefore, these people would have to try exceptionally harder to earn RO respect.

rippedoff

26-09-2003, 14:39

Originally posted by Undisputedtruth
I have seen RO behaving amicably, asking sensible questions. Yet, he has faced a number of abuses. He has received very little or no help from NTL staff. Most of them has abused him in the past. Therefore, these people would have to try exceptionally harder to earn RO respect.

Thank you for your support UDT. Although I agree with you, I think we are in danger, yet again, of this thread going way off topic, and back into a total slanging match. Some folk are already attempting to turn it into that, but let's try and ignore them.
Let's keep this thread ONLY on the topic of what is FACTUAL or SUBSTANTIATED information about BB progress (if any) in London.
:spin:

Chris

26-09-2003, 14:40

Originally posted by rippedoff
Thank you for your support UDT. Although I agree with you, I think we are in danger, yet again, off this thread going way off topic, and back into a total slanging match. Some folk are already attempting to turn it into that, but let's try and ignore them.
Let's keep this thread ONLY on the topic of what is FACTUAL or SUBSTANTIATED information about BB progress (if any) in London.
:spin:

I wish you success, I really do, but I'm not sure what you would accept as factual information or where you are expecting it will come from?

rippedoff

26-09-2003, 14:51

Originally posted by towny
I wish you success, I really do, but I'm not sure what you would accept as factual information or where you are expecting it will come from?

If you do not know what facts are, or can't work out what may be factual or substantiated, then there is little point of trying to explain to you.
But... simple things like..."I am in SW16... I now have BB from ntl:" or "I have a letter telling me engineers are coming tomorrow to install BB... I live in Tulse Hill - I'll let you know"...... or one of your trusted ntl: staff buddies who may know FACTS about BB rollout actually sharing that information - I do not believe that NOBODY in ntl: knows what is going on..............
:confused: :confused:

Chris

26-09-2003, 14:57

Originally posted by rippedoff
If you do not know what facts are, or can't work out what may be factual or substantiated, then there is little point of trying to explain to you.
But... simple things like..."I am in SW16... I now have BB from ntl:" or "I have a letter telling me engineers are coming tomorrow to install BB... I live in Tulse Hill - I'll let you know"...... or one of your trusted ntl: staff buddies who may know FACTS about BB rollout actually sharing that information..............
:confused: :confused:

You see my point though. I ask you a perfectly reasonable question and you find it impossible to answer without just a shade of a dig. Of course I understand the concept of 'fact'; that isn't what I was asking and you know it.

Now tell me this: If you find it so hard to keep a civil tongue in your head, what right have you to expect that one of my 'ntl buddies' (as you call them) is going to give you the time of day, let alone share company information with you?

EDIT: Who are the 'ntl buddies'? Is that like the pro-ntl mob?

rippedoff

26-09-2003, 15:01

Originally posted by towny
You see my point though. I ask you a perfectly reasonable question and you find it impossible to answer without just a shade of a dig. Of course I understand the concept of 'fact'; that isn't what I was asking and you know it.

Now tell me this: If you find it so hard to keep a civil tongue in your head, what right have you to expect that one of my 'ntl buddies' (as you call them) is going to give you the time of day, let alone share company information with you?

EDIT: Who are the 'ntl buddies'? Is that like the pro-ntl mob?

For your benefit........ I will repeat..............

Thank you for your support UDT. Although I agree with you, I think we are in danger, yet again, of this thread going way off topic, and back into a total slanging match. Some folk are already attempting to turn it into that, but let's try and ignore them.
Let's keep this thread ONLY on the topic of what is FACTUAL or SUBSTANTIATED information about BB progress (if any) in London.

:confused: :shrug:

Chris

26-09-2003, 15:10

Originally posted by rippedoff
For your benefit........ I will repeat..............

Thank you for your support UDT. Although I agree with you, I think we are in danger, yet again, of this thread going way off topic, and back into a total slanging match. Some folk are already attempting to turn it into that, but let's try and ignore them.
Let's keep this thread ONLY on the topic of what is FACTUAL or SUBSTANTIATED information about BB progress (if any) in London.

:confused: :shrug:

And so shall I, with added emphasis:

I wish you success, I really do, but I'm not sure what you would accept as factual information or where you are expecting it will come from.

I have gone out of my way to draw attention to the London Broadband issue in the past on this forum. I genuinely think it is unfair for NTL to keep everyone hanging on by saying 'coming soon' all the time. But I also think that some people have been so negative towards ntl staffers on this forum that I think it is a little pointless for you to demand their goodwill now by asking them to post the details you have asked for. Your response to Bigitup in this very thread (http://www.nthellworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?postid=59572#post59572) was way out of line given that he was making a genuine offer of help. Perhaps you could give him one good reason why he should do anything more to help you?

rippedoff

26-09-2003, 15:15

Originally posted by towny
And so shall I, with added emphasis:

I wish you success, I really do, but I'm not sure what you would accept as factual information or where you are expecting it will come from.

I have gone out of my way to draw attention to the London Broadband issue in the past on this forum. I genuinely think it is unfair for NTL to keep everyone hanging on by saying 'coming soon' all the time. But I also think that some people have been so negative towards ntl staffers on this forum that I think it is a little pointless for you to demand their goodwill now by asking them to post the details you have asked for. Your response to Bigitup in this very thread (http://www.nthellworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?postid=59572#post59572) was way out of line given that he was making a genuine offer of help. Perhaps you could give him one good reason why he should do anything more to help you?

Sorry Towny........ I am not going to rise to your bait. Tough !
:wavey:

Chris

26-09-2003, 15:27

Originally posted by rippedoff
Sorry Towny........ I am not going to rise to your bait. Tough !
:wavey:

And I respect you for that. :wavey: ;)

gallego1

26-09-2003, 16:31

I can see another roundabout and re incarnation again!!!

WHY does this topic ALWAYS end up in a slanging match? and from the people who suggest that they are in the know

Chris

26-09-2003, 16:34

Originally posted by gallego1
I can see another roundabout and re incarnation again!!!

WHY does this topic ALWAYS end up in a slanging match? and from the people who suggest that they are in the know

Who's slanging? I am attempting to understand the parameters of the debate and suggesting reasons why I think the question posed in this thread is unlikely to be answered in the way that has been requested.

And let me assure you, (assuming of course your post had me in mind, perhaps I'm flattering myself) ... I am not in the know. Nor do I know anyone who is.

gallego1

27-09-2003, 10:16

Originally posted by towny
Who's slanging? I am attempting to understand the parameters of the debate and suggesting reasons why I think the question posed in this thread is unlikely to be answered in the way that has been requested.

And let me assure you, (assuming of course your post had me in mind, perhaps I'm flattering myself) ... I am not in the know. Nor do I know anyone who is.

Sorry for misinterpretation of your posts. However I think that the Question is very simple. When will xvideotron customers have BB and interactive TV?

The answers we would like are :-
a) When is CR3, BB and all the wonderfull other bits that other regions can use be brought to x videotron areas.

b) True facts are SW99 0aa was updated last night or sw99 0aa will be recieving engineer visits over the next week.

Not as already expressed on this thread *000 homes in london to be upgraded

We all know we will be upgraded in somebodys lifetime but ours would be preferred

What usually happens in these threads is that people who have little or no interest in the london area start complaining that we are wasting everybodys time with our requests.

What would they feel like if London was the first area to have eg CR4 , 5 mb BB with NO CAP and they kept having the "coming soon " label attached to their regions for 2-3 years Wouldnt they be doing the same as RO and UDT and others are doing at present

I think they would

I agree that this topic should stay on topic without being used as a "wingeing" match for those that have BB and those that dont

Remember we all pay the same for our Services except others have more of a service eg RED button for extra interactivity than others.

gallego1

03-10-2003, 16:03

the 75,000 upgrade thing, is from an ntl manager. i will be able to tell you more information from 1st october (2003) onwards.
hopefully i can bring you good news!

The sound of silence is appearing onm this thread now. First we went round in circles and then we had an offer of more info from 01/10/03

And look NOTHING

So is it true that 75000 homes are currently being upgraded or this part of the usual wind up on the "bb in South London "Topic

We are soon coming to the 1st aniversary of "the letter" from C Collinson, will we get another one with similar hope I wonder.

Could it be we are getting no info from Ntl as their marketing director has recently gone to work for a bank in a similar role. Maybe that is why I am getting less mail from them now

Chris

03-10-2003, 16:11

bigitup_j

03-10-2003, 16:29

The sound of silence is appearing onm this thread now. First we went round in circles and then we had an offer of more info from 01/10/03

And look NOTHING

So is it true that 75000 homes are currently being upgraded or this part of the usual wind up on the "bb in South London "Topic

We are soon coming to the 1st aniversary of "the letter" from C Collinson, will we get another one with similar hope I wonder.

Could it be we are getting no info from Ntl as their marketing director has recently gone to work for a bank in a similar role. Maybe that is why I am getting less mail from them now
Sorry about the delay.
anytime soon...
any news, and i WILL tell you. and i won't post any rumours, only hard facts, nothing else.
:)

gallego1

03-10-2003, 23:39

As I suggested previously, I think those 'in the know' are either not inclined to be helpful due to their treatment at the hands of some forum members, or simply not able to make statements backed up with the level of evidence demanded at the top of this thread.

Maybe what you are saying has some truth but in the beginning there were some very helpful comments which were looked upon favourably until the letter of November 2002. I believe at that point any future point raised was held to be part of the BIG CONSPRIRACY OF THE LONDON PLAN and all future threads have ended up in slanging matches between people who have BB and interactive CR3 etc and couldnt care about the peope who have not and the people that don, and have constantly threatened to close posts.

It was suggested that we have our own section on the forum but that was denied due to "other regions would want one" and why not. Each region is different.

Frankly, rumour and suggestion is the bread and butter of a discussion forum and I would be more than happy to accept a rumour - with a generious pinch of salt of course - than any official communication from ntl marketing. But it has been made quite clear that rumours will be looked upon very unkindly in this thread.

We can all wind each other up until the cows come home but when "official "sources cannot get the info consistant thats when people get p*****d off with the whole situation

The info has always been sometime in 2003 then RO gets an email saying 2005 and you phone customer services and they say it will be before christmas 2003
but i dont know when and that all in the same day.

* all comments mentioned pre june 03 were on Nthellworld.com forums*

gallego1

03-10-2003, 23:41

Sorry about the delay.
anytime soon...
any news, and i WILL tell you. and i won't post any rumours, only hard facts, nothing else.
:)

Hoping its what we want to hear and Xmas presents from NTL in the form of BB

OR

That 2005 is the correct date after all

Lets hope for some people is the first one

gallego1

19-10-2003, 23:40

Interesting twist to this thread

No more roundabouts and re-incarnations of a similar theme. Just SILENCE.

SO what has happened to these very lucky 75000 homes in a certain location towards the s.e of the country approx 70 miles from the channel tunnel in a n.westerly direction

Are they enjoying CR3 etc OR are they still watching CR1 with the favourite lists that can be reorganised to their hearts content.

My guess would be the latter.

UNLESS somebody knows different. :rolleyes:

Dizzy

21-10-2003, 17:03

I'm going to try and help here, i am ntl staff and used to work for the team in London responsible for upgrading it to Broadband. I will only give information I know to be true and will not get drawn into debate or speculation into what future plans have.

Over the last 12-18 months work has been carried out to make parts of South London Broadband serviceable. The reasons you have problems finding out which areas have been upgraded is because we use different terminology internally when releasing areas to Broadband and this is not easily translated into postcodes or geographic areas.

Basically 9 'job areas' have been released which equals about 90,000 homes, this sounds like a lot and in many respects is, however it is a mere drop in the ocean compared to the number of homes that still need to be upgraded. ntl is comitted to upgrading the rest of London but as you have already seen this takes a long time.

I will try to obtain a list of postcodes for anyone who is interested but it will be far to many to post. Once I have got hold of this I will update you and you can PM me for it

Gogogo

21-10-2003, 17:59

I'm going to try and help here, i am ntl staff and used to work for the team in London responsible for upgrading it to Broadband. I will only give information I know to be true and will not get drawn into debate or speculation into what future plans have...

Nice to hear from you Dizzy and welcome.

Now, are you in a position to explain exactly what the nature of the problem is?

1. Is it the qualitiy of exVideotron network cabling to the homes of customers?

2. Is it that the street green boxes have to be updated?

3. Is it just that funds are limited and little is set aside for development?

Can you provide any firm answers to these questions.

From one who is even more dizzy.

:Peaceman:

Dizzy

21-10-2003, 22:15

Hi Gogogo

I'll be honest with you, I am not technical enough to go into detail about the issues with the ex-videotron network but you are basically right on all 3 counts. none of the ex-vcl network in London (other than the upgraded areas) can currently support broadband, the team that have conducted the upgrades so far first go in and survey in detail each area and ascertain what exactly needs to be done, in some cases this turns out to be the cabling in the street needs to be relayed but in most cases its the green cabinets that need upgrading, rebuilding etc, they have carried out these surveys right across london.
There is funding for this work but but it is limited as i'm sure you can imagine ntl has to be careful where it spends its money at the moment and although London is extremely important so is developing new products and remaining competive in the market place.

I believe there currently securing the funding for next years work and I believe (personal opinion not necessarily that of ntl) that once this is sorted you will see a big improvement in London.

Gogogo

22-10-2003, 07:47

Dizzy, thank you for your response.

:wavey:

bigitup_j

22-10-2003, 09:36

the delay...
ntl aren't that fast. i have to wait for a while...i'll tell you any news as soon as i get it. :)

gallego1

23-10-2003, 09:30

Dizzy, thank you for your response.

:wavey:

I agree, Thanks Dizzy

I believe that this is the type of response that was needed. Straight facts.

But I am sure that someone now will contradict Dizzy's last post and confusion will begin again

rippedoff

06-11-2003, 14:17

Dizzy

18-11-2003, 11:13

There is a new rumour about!
It is that us poor souls in South London may be able to get wireless BB !

Two questions in relation to this rumour

1. Does anyone know if this is fact ?

2. I know there was trials of wireless BB in South London - what happened about the trials - was anybody a trialist - what was the outcome- develop or not to develop?

Cheers..........

(oh PS.... anyone know what IS happening yet in S. London?

:sulk:

This is purely rumour, wireless has been looked at in the past as an option and will no doubt be looked at again in the future but has never got past the drawing board stage even though the trials were relitively successful.

Plans for London are still progressing but as you are more than aware the wheels turn slow

gallego1

18-11-2003, 15:46

This is purely rumour, wireless has been looked at in the past as an option and will no doubt be looked at again in the future but has never got past the drawing board stage even though the trials were relitively successful.

It this is truly another rumour, why was I told this by a sales rep from ntl about 3 weeks ago

Secondly Why are the sales reps communicating this info if it is not true???? :confused:

Gogogo

18-11-2003, 16:03

It this is truly another rumour, why was I told this by a sales rep from ntl about 3 weeks ago Secondly Why are the sales reps communicating this info if it is not true???? :confused:

Frankly, NTL sales reps tell you anything you want to hear. I've known NTL sales reps tell me Broadband etc coming in six months, this was two years ago. They are still telling people this rubbish. I don't think they know anything except calculating commission.

:eek:

Undisputedtruth

19-11-2003, 00:17

Frankly, NTL sales reps tell you anything you want to hear. I've known NTL sales reps tell me Broadband etc coming in six months, this was two years ago. They are still telling people this rubbish. I don't think they know anything except calculating commission.

:eek:

They are replaying the tape of excuses for good ole Videotroners. :bigcry:

rippedoff

05-12-2003, 14:13

Remember one of the earlier rumours? BB in South London before Christmas 2003!
Well it is nearly Christmas, and no sign whatsoever of BB arriving!
New Year Resolution must be to move to Sky/BT package!

Have a Merry Christmas one and all!

:rudo: :rudo: :rudo: :rudo: :rudo: :rudo: :rudo:

Chris

05-12-2003, 14:17

Merry Christmas rippedoff :wavey: looks like it's still 'coming soon' - I'd get yourself Sky Plus for Christmas to cheer yourself up if I were you.

bigitup_j

05-12-2003, 14:49

i'm trying to get info out of ntl, through a certain manager, who i shall not name...but he ain't giving anything away!! cursed person, it's been especially "cold" since nthw.com closed! probably scared :D

all i can say is...'coming soon', he said it was important to get broadband to london...so ntl do recognise the need for bb...which is good, but nothing is happening.

tum-dee-tum :zzz:

BBKing

05-12-2003, 16:03

BB in South London before Christmas 2003!

Well, there is cable BB in ex-VCL South London before Christmas 2003, not all of it admittedly, but nevertheless a true rumour it seems. Worth putting the record straight here.

gallego1

05-12-2003, 22:21

Well, there is cable BB in ex-VCL South London before Christmas 2003, not all of it admittedly, but nevertheless a true rumour it seems. Worth putting the record straight here.

Ok but how many people will be able to use before chistmas 2003 its only 3 weeks away

BBKing

06-12-2003, 00:00

Well, the four-figure number who have it, for a start.

bigitup_j

06-12-2003, 10:21

i remember a few weeks ago, ntl send adverts through the post to some london homes because bb was just enabled. so a lot of people would have signed up, as ntl bb is a very popular product. by the christmas they will have 1 million bb customers, they have 910,000 as of mid-november!!
plus, i can't see ntl releasing bb in any more london regions until january, because they only have about 3 weeks to do installs and it may not be enough time.

homealone

06-12-2003, 11:36

gallego1

09-12-2003, 12:37

Just phoned Sales Team again

No date as yet, When I mentioned that i was told by sales team previously that they had quoted a xmas 2003 date he wanted names of who told me.

So the untruth continues but now they want the names of whos giving out this duff info. Does that mean in future we will get silence as they will be to scared to say anythin

bomber

09-12-2003, 13:51

I just thought I'd pop on NTHW and see how things were progressing with the whole S London BB fiasco...... nothing new I see....

I went to ADSL back in June (still keeping my NTL TV/Phone package) and I have never looked back. I would suggest others do the same.

I would also suggest that if you go down the same route as me that you negotiate with NTL CS for a discount/credit on your NTL monthly bill for the inconvenience of

a) Having a BT line installed (if you don't already have one)
b) The monthly rental of your BT ADLS enabled line

This is what I did (but I am not prepared to discuss the fiscal amounts).

Without the discount, it would have not been financially viable for me to have kept the NTL TV package, NTL phone and, BT line and ADSL provider, I would simply have SKY TV and not NTL anything.

Another fact: What swayed me to go down this route was a call from NTL CS saying that in my area, SE24, they could not guarantee any BB before 2007! Basically they said it would either be 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006 or 2007 at the latest!

Bomber

Gogogo

09-12-2003, 15:50

Well, there is cable BB in ex-VCL South London before Christmas 2003, not all of it admittedly, but nevertheless a true rumour it seems. Worth putting the record straight here.

So how about putting one more record straight. So all that misinformation given by NTL staffers that Videotron cabling was not up to standard was then nothing but being economical with the truth. So we can assume then there is nothing wrong with Videotron cabling.

:erm:

BBKing

09-12-2003, 21:32

So how about putting one more record straight. So all that misinformation given by NTL staffers that Videotron cabling was not up to standard was then nothing but being economical with the truth. So we can assume then there is nothing wrong with Videotron cabling.

:erm:

So ntl were either
1) deliberately holding off launching broadband in the capital of the UK while organising a conspiracy of misinformation to put about a false story about the cabling being poor or
2) getting their fingers burnt with previously incorrect predictions and thus staying schtum while upgrading the network piecemeal to support broadband *reliably* (this is the key) and launching it on the quiet.

Now, tell me which one you think is correct and why.

Gogogo

09-12-2003, 22:13

So ntl were either
1) deliberately holding off launching broadband in the capital of the UK while organising a conspiracy of misinformation to put about a false story about the cabling being poor or 2) getting their fingers burnt with previously incorrect predictions and thus staying schtum while upgrading the network piecemeal to support broadband *reliably* (this is the key) and launching it on the quiet.
Now, tell me which one you think is correct and why.

By your own admission you have made it clear in your previous post that BB services are being supplied over exVideotron cabling. This seems to indicate that employees rather than the company have been misinforming customers in Videotron areas. I have never seen any official communication from the company in relation to BB services on Videotron cabling, only people like you who deny BB can be carried on Videotron cabling and have lectured us to the effect that Videotron cabling was unsuitable when apparently it is suitable. So why do you mislead us?

BBKing

10-12-2003, 11:47

By your own admission you have made it clear in your previous post that BB services are being supplied over exVideotron cabling. This seems to indicate that employees rather than the company have been misinforming customers in Videotron areas. I have never seen any official communication from the company in relation to BB services on Videotron cabling, only people like you who deny BB can be carried on Videotron cabling and have lectured us to the effect that Videotron cabling was unsuitable when apparently it is suitable. So why do you mislead us?

You haven't answered my question, presumably an oversight on your part, so I'll repeat it:

Now, tell me which one you think is correct and why.

Videotron cabled it poorly and cheaply, fact, hence broadband couldn't launch at the same time as everywhere else, fact. ntl are fixing the cabling in VCL areas, fact, it's a long, slow job, fact, as it's fixed and proved working it's launching, fact.

To deny that VCL didn't cable it poorly means that you think they cabled it well and therefore you must have some other reason why ntl didn't launch their top-selling product in VCL London two years ago along with non-VCL London. Let's hear that reason.

The number of people on broadband in the SE London area now is higher than it was a few months ago (fact) when people started commenting on here about leafleting and sales campaigns in the SE area advertising broadband (fact), which sounds very much like official communication from ntl to me.

*Things don't stay the same*

I anticipate a day where virtually all VCL customers can get cable broadband, but it certainly won't be by Christmas 2003. I deliberately don't comment on launch dates because I *don't* want to mislead, so don't accuse me of it.

I think what a reasonable person would conclude is that ntl are *doing something about cable broadband in VCL areas*, slowly certainly, but nevertheless true. This has been frequently denied on here and elsewhere by mad trolls like UDT, who I notice is rather quiet at the moment.

Gogogo

10-12-2003, 12:54

You haven't answered my question, presumably an oversight on your part, so I'll repeat it:

Where? What follows below is another statement from you, which I am not in a position to challenge, what goes on in SE London I wouldn't know. By the way, NTl is a corporate entity and what employees, who may not be in executive posts, have to say may not always be in tune with what the company believes ought to be communicated.

Videotron cabled it poorly and cheaply, fact, hence broadband couldn't launch at the same time as everywhere else, fact. ntl are fixing the cabling in VCL areas, fact, it's a long, slow job, fact, as it's fixed and proved working it's launching, fact. To deny that VCL didn't cable it poorly means that you think they cabled it well and therefore you must have some other reason why ntl didn't launch their top-selling product in VCL London two years ago along with non-VCL London. Let's hear that reason. The number of people on broadband in the SE London area now is higher than it was a few months ago (fact) when people started commenting on here about leafleting and sales campaigns in the SE area advertising broadband (fact), which sounds very much like official Videotron cabled it poorly and cheaply, fact, hence broadband couldn't launch at the same time as everywhere else, fact. ntl are fixing the cabling in VCL areas, fact, it's a long, slow job, fact, as it's fixed and proved working it's launching, fact. To deny that VCL didn't cable it poorly means that you think they cabled it well and therefore you must have some other reason why ntl didn't launch their top-selling product in VCL London two years ago along with non-VCL London. Let's hear that reason. The number of people on broadband in the SE London area now is higher than it was a few months ago (fact) when people started commenting on here about leafleting and sales campaigns in the SE area advertising broadband (fact), which sounds very much like official communication from ntl to me.

You were one of the contributors to this site and the .com site who gave a very strong impression as did other NTL employees, that the Videotron cabling was poor and unsuitable for carrying BB, now it appears your tune has changed and suddenly we are seeing BB on Videotron cabling is possible after all. Indeed as you say: *Things don't stay the same* a new tune is being sung!

I anticipate a day where virtually all VCL customers can get cable broadband, but it certainly won't be by Christmas 2003. I deliberately don't comment on launch dates because I *don't* want to mislead, so don't accuse me of it. I think what a reasonable person would conclude is that ntl are *doing something about cable broadband in VCL areas*, slowly certainly, but nevertheless true. This has been frequently denied on here and elsewhere by mad trolls like UDT, who I notice is rather quiet at the moment.

No one is accusing you of anything apart from having indicated as others have in the past that Videotron cabling was rubbish and could not carry BB. I've never mentioned dates in these posts.

Ok. Indeed I would like to believe I'm a reasonable person, it is obvious NTL is extending availablity of BB on Videotron in SE London postcodes I'm in no position to say otherwise. UDT having been naughty is I believe banned. What I can say is there are no visible signs that NTL are doing anything in regard to upgrading videotron cabling in this area, which is no where near SE London. As we hope to be buying a new property soon in Hertfordshire I've now lost interest in this area. We are NTL telephony and NTL dial up internet customers here.

:banghead:

asdf

10-12-2003, 14:05

who gave a very strong impression as did other NTL employees, that the Videotron cabling was poor and unsuitable for carrying BB, now it appears your tune has changed and suddenly we are seeing BB on Videotron cabling is possible after all.

Have you ever thought that maybe new cable was pulled through the existing VCL pipes and this new cable is capable of broadband, thus slowly opening up broadband cable to London?

Gogogo

10-12-2003, 14:16

Have you ever thought that maybe new cable was pulled through the existing VCL pipes and this new cable is capable of broadband, thus slowly opening up broadband cable to London?

Well, if that is the case then why doesn't BBKing say so, based on what he has written so far this possibility has not been mentioned. The thought of kilometre of kilometre of Videotron cabling being ripped out from the under streets of SE London is mind boggling to say the least. Have you witnessed this amazing event?

Oh and bye the way, I'm not challenging NTL BB access availability in SE London
only that now suddenly we are learning Videotron cabling with a little maintenence here and there is capable of carrying BB this possibilty has been denied on many ocassions by NTL staffers.

:spin: :banghead:

asdf

10-12-2003, 14:19

Gogogo

10-12-2003, 15:22

I have not witnessed this as I don't live anywhere near London, I'm just saying from past posts this seems the logical explanation. Gogogo, do you really think that ntl (in their "need lots of money" situation) would not release their highest profit product if they could? There were obviously very good reasons why they couldn't launch it at the time, I imagine mostly down to not having themoney to upgrade the network, which they have a bit of now and are doing it slowly.

Here we go again. Now asdf, did you read what I have written on this subject above.

Let's spell it out. BBKing has recorded for us that NTL BB is being rolled out on existing Videotron cabling, with a little modification here and there. He has not written that Videotron cabling has been entirely ripped out which is your suggestion. I am happy to accept that slowly SE London postcodes denied NTL BB are now happily receiving it, some will no doubt have it within the next 1 to 10 years.

Money, oh yes, indeed NTL is not short of money, after all it has recently rehired the failed exCEO, Mr Barclay Knapp at ÃƒÆ’Ã¢â‚¬Å¡Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â£3,500 a day to advise it from New Jersey, USA. There is considerable revenue flowing in to NTL finances. All we long suffering Videotron customers are asking is quite simple. We have been promised BB month after month, coming soon, coming soon. So what is the logic of this situation - result customers in Videotron cabled areas want to know what is going on. Where is it and why are we not being told by senior NTL executives, it's not too much to ask.

Not one NTL senior executive has bothered to say anything, so all this info from NTL staffers that Videotron cabling is not suitable is nonsense, all this NTL has no money is nonsense.

As we hope to be moving out of this Videotron area in the coming months I no longer have a personal axe to grind. Just for once let's see some truth. Let's not have another rehash of rubbish explanations.

:banghead:

asdf

10-12-2003, 23:02

Here we go again. Now asdf, did you read what I have written on this subject above.

Let's spell it out. BBKing has recorded for us that NTL BB is being rolled out on existing Videotron cabling, with a little modification here and there. He has not written that Videotron cabling has been entirely ripped out which is your suggestion. I am happy to accept that slowly SE London postcodes denied NTL BB are now happily receiving it, some will no doubt have it within the next 1 to 10 years.

Maybe I've missed something but BBKing has not stated how much of the VCL cabling has been repaired/re-pulled etc. Nor has he stated whether hubsites, headends, UBRs have been upgraded.

What is your reason that NTL did not launch the product then, I'm really interested in knowing why *you* think NTL didn't release broadband?

gallego1

11-12-2003, 00:08

Not one NTL senior executive has bothered to say anything, so all this info from NTL staffers that Videotron cabling is not suitable is nonsense, all this NTL has no money is nonsense.

Dont forget the infamous correspondence regarding "VCL upgrades in 2-3 weeks" in Nov 2002 from Customers Services NTL

Only later to be found out that this particular mailshot was sent IN ERROR and then silence from NTL staff unless you include the rumours on here & .com site which have never bourne truth. Has anyone seen an ntlvan man in the street looking at these cables? I certainly havent

gallego1

11-12-2003, 00:27

Videotron cabled it poorly and cheaply, fact, hence broadband couldn't launch at the same time as everywhere else, fact. ntl are fixing the cabling in VCL areas, fact, it's a long, slow job, fact, as it's fixed and proved working it's launching, fact.

Why does it appear that it is being done in sections only around the south east area instead of each borough having equal portions of this investment

The number of people on broadband in the SE London area now is higher than it was a few months ago (fact) when people started commenting on here about leafleting and sales campaigns in the SE area advertising broadband (fact), which sounds very much like official communication from ntl to me.

Because that is where ntl have concentrated its efforts.

I anticipate a day where virtually all VCL customers can get cable broadband, but it certainly won't be by Christmas 2003. I deliberately don't comment on launch dates because I *don't* want to mislead, so don't accuse me of it.

So some people will never get it according to the above statement.

So, as you do not wish to give any launch dates, in fear of the members complaining that the date has passed and nothing has happened. When REALISTICALLY will myself, rippedoff and other posters likely to see these advertisements requiring us to call 0800 183 1010 to sign up for the new highspeed broadband service available in NTL cabled streets Replies in years will be sufficient, unless you want to comment on the possible month as well, but that may lead to the unrest in the camp which we want to avoid.

Gogogo

11-12-2003, 08:10

Maybe I've missed something but BBKing has not stated how much of the VCL cabling has been repaired/re-pulled etc. Nor has he stated whether hubsites, headends, UBRs have been upgraded. What is your reason that NTL did not launch the product then, I'm really interested in knowing why *you* think NTL didn't release broadband?

OK, yes, BBKing has indeed in earlier posts, if you look back, that some cabling had to be replaced, not much it seems, and green boxes needed attention. Dizzy's responses have also been quite enlightening in regard to what is going on.

Why hasn't BB been extended to areas like this? The answer NTL executive level incompetence. We also have long memories, as CWC customers we expected the free service of ntlworld would be extended to us. We waited ages for this service and we were fobbed off with all sorts of reasons why we couldn't have it. Eventually, of course the service was extended. with no explanation for the long delay, and after the fiasco with the CD installation disks we had about six weeks of free use until NTL slapped the monthly charge on it. Frankly, I believe NTL is appallingly managed at senior levels, it's just an old boys club and customers concerns are not a priority. We are informed by Dizzy that all Videotron areas are on the list, certainly, I accept the need for upgrading parts of the network, even though it doesn't bother me anymore.

My point is that we are told so often that Videotron cabling was poor and yet suddenly here we are reading that Videotron areas are now receiving BB.

:banghead:

Gogogo

11-12-2003, 08:15

Dont forget the infamous correspondence regarding "VCL upgrades in 2-3 weeks" in Nov 2002 from Customers Services NTL Only later to be found out that this particular mailshot was sent IN ERROR and then silence from NTL staff unless you include the rumours on here & .com site which have never bourne truth. Has anyone seen an ntlvan man in the street looking at these cables? I certainly havent

Are yes, that famous letter from Collinson, what a bunch of pratts. Again that letter was an example of the contempt and disrespect NTL executives have towards their customers. If schools and colleges were run in the manner of the NTL school of management, the management staff would be replaced pdq. Don't see NTL vans in this area very often these days, I suspect many NTL customers gave up and went to BT.

:rofl:

asdf

11-12-2003, 19:56

Oh, so ntl didn't roll out broadband in areas of London because of managerial incompetance? And it could of been rolled out at anytime?

*shrugs* right.

BBKing

11-12-2003, 22:31

gallego:

So, as you do not wish to give any launch dates, in fear of the members complaining that the date has passed and nothing has happened. When REALISTICALLY will myself, rippedoff and other posters likely to see these advertisements requiring us to call 0800 183 1010 to sign up for the new highspeed broadband service available in NTL cabled streets Replies in years will be sufficient, unless you want to comment on the possible month as well, but that may lead to the unrest in the camp which we want to avoid.

I don't wish to give any launch dates because:

a) I don't know them, I could guess based on data I have available, but I won't on principle
b) I don't want to raise people's hopes - people are complaining in this very thread about being given dates that turn out to be untrue by people who don't know, so I propose to be honest and up front. Sorry if this offends.

My advice (and read back on this) is unchanged - go ADSL if you want broadband and if ntl/blueyonder is not available in your area. I see some of you have taken this excellent advice.

Gogogo:

BBKing has recorded for us that NTL BB is being rolled out on existing Videotron cabling, with a little modification here and there

Please don't misquote me. Where did I say a 'little modification'? Nice to see you're being consistent though, as you said:

we can assume then there is nothing wrong with Videotron cabling

and now you're saying

existing Videotron cabling, with a little modification here and there

If there's nothing wrong with it, why modify it?

You were one of the contributors to this site and the .com site who gave a very strong impression as did other NTL employees, that the Videotron cabling was poor and unsuitable for carrying BB, now it appears your tune has changed and suddenly we are seeing BB on Videotron cabling is possible after all. Indeed as you say: *Things don't stay the same* a new tune is being sung!

New tune? Well, a few months ago you couldn't get broadband in VCL areas. Now you can, in parts, because of work done and paid for by ntl. Should the tune still remain the same in spite of the facts?

gallego1

13-12-2003, 14:30

Gogogo

13-12-2003, 18:42

After reading some of the other threads and forums, it seams that a lot of people are desserting the ntl bb ship. After all we may not BB in Sth london as it appears that others' services are more reliable and have better CS relationships with their clients :wavey:

Well, for our part we hope once we've sold our little pile here in Harrow, soon hopefully, to move to Hertfordshire and we will see whether NTL full services including BB will be there, otherwise no messing around we will not hesitate we will use BT BB if available.

Thanks BBKing for keeping us informed, I can see your motives are well intentioned and good and you want to keep people informed on developments. Apologies if I offended you. None of this is your fault, just poor public relations from NTL.

:wavey:

bigitup_j

13-12-2003, 20:32

ntl brings out the worst in everyone. ntl is the number one cause of family disputes in my house!!

gallego1

17-12-2003, 15:59

Here is a reply I have received to day from London Customer Mgmt Team and it conflicts with what has been said previously.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thank you for your e mail regarding Broadband availability.

It is with regret that I inform you that this service is still not available
in your postcode. As you may be aware, you live in the ex-Videotron area of
London which is the oldest cabled area. Major construction work is necessary to upgrade the cabling network to support this service. This work would involve digging up most of the busiest highways of inner London. We do not currently have a date, even an estimation, of when this will be available.

Please be aware that all of our services are subject to availability.

I am sorry that my response cannot be a more favourable one.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

So we do have to wait for ntlvan man with a shovel and spade.

(highlighting has been done by me and not the original sender)

bigitup_j

28-01-2004, 20:11

gallego1

30-01-2004, 23:44

well, i have some interesting information
i checked out a london postcode on the ntl sales site www.sales.ntl.com , which previously had no broadband...and guess what, it NOW has it!!
try out your postcode, you may be pleasently supprised!
:D

It dosent with mine

Still wants to offer me dial-up, and family tv package and a phone when I have them all :rofl:

BTW was it a south/west london postcode

bigitup_j

30-01-2004, 23:46

no an se9 postcode, which is eltham

gallego1

31-01-2004, 00:13

no an se9 postcode, which is eltham

Wasnt that the area that was previously mentioned as being available?

Have you tried a SW or W Postcode?

Dizzy

10-02-2004, 22:08

rippedoff

11-02-2004, 10:24

I can only re-iterate what I have said before which is that ntl are committed to upgrading London for Broadband. I know you have seen little or no progress over the past months but I can assure you that this will change over coming months.

I cannot give you more information at this time but will try to pass on any information I receive as and when I know it is accurate and confirmed.

The upgrade of London will be slow so as BBking has previously said if you are in a hurry for Broadband you should consider alternatives.

As said in previous posts, I have been told in an official ntl: reply that it will be 2006 at the earliestbefore SW16 will get BB - which in reality means probably 2007 before it actually appears, if at all. By then, existing ntl: customers who want BB will have gone back to BT and probably have SKY. That is certainly what I am doing once my current 'deal' with ntl: comes to an end! (I might even go before!)
Therefore, I do not know what is likely to change, as you say "this will change over the coming months
:(