What's going on at .com? [Archive]

andygrif

04-09-2003, 10:27

Originally posted by handyman
Possibly he is refferring to the fact he's trying to pick fights with the mods.

Well I don't think it is fair to criticise without knowing the full story, which you don't.

And as the full story is in the process of a high-level complaint about someone's actions in the PMs, it would also be unfair to discuss it until it is resolved.

By that way - i like most of the mods over there - Just one that seems to want to make life difficult for me. If that person wants to provoke argument, I will defend my corner.

I'm not asking about conspiracys - just curious to know what's going on.

andygrif

04-09-2003, 10:28

Originally posted by orangebird
I have noticed any goading or threatened bans. What are you referring to?

I've spoken to three separate people who have been threatend recently. Must stress that I haven't been.

Graham F

04-09-2003, 10:29

Originally posted by andygrif
Well I don't think it is fair to criticise without knowing the full story, which you don't.

And as the full story is in the process of a high-level complaint about someone's actions in the PMs, it would also be unfair to discuss it until it is resolved.

By that way - i like most of the mods over there - Just one that seems to want to make life difficuly for me.

I'm not asking about conspiracys - just curious to see what's going on.

So why bring it up if you are not willing to discuss it:rolleyes:

andygrif

04-09-2003, 10:32

Originally posted by Scooby
So why bring it up if you are not willing to discuss it:rolleyes:

Er...I didn't. I was looking at the bigger picture, until someone questioned my motives. It would be unfair for the person I am talking about to spill the details of my complaint, until the matter is resolved. After that if you wish to know then I will tell you.

Graham F

04-09-2003, 10:34

no sorry i disagree you came here and made some sweeping statements without backing it up someone questions you on it and you say sorry can't discuss it :confused:

andygrif

04-09-2003, 10:38

Originally posted by Scooby
no sorry i disagree you came here and made some sweeping statements without backing it up someone questions you on it and you say sorry can't discuss it :confused:

Try re-reading what I posted.

The issue about users being threatened - I have backed up (see above)

The issue about users being goaded into arguments - you can see that happening for yourself if you read the threads - I am not just referring to me here by the way (that would be petty) I am talking about many instances with several users.

Ignoring of direct calls to action by users towards the mods - as above.

This morning the site is down? Well you can see that for yourself.

Someone questioned my motive (of which I don't really have one)
and suggested that I was attempting to pick 'fights' with the mods. This is untrue, and I defended that point with fact.

Anything else you would like me to substantiate?

th'engineer

04-09-2003, 10:40

well its definately down anyone any ideas why :shrug:

andygrif

04-09-2003, 10:43

Originally posted by th'engineer
well its definately down anyone any ideas why :shrug:

Looks like they're having some sort of database upgrade, saw all of the folders a moment ago when checking.

One has to wonder why, if it might be removed soon anyway.

Graham F

04-09-2003, 10:44

you haven't backed anything up, to back something up you bring some evidence which so far you haven't got any which is in this thread.

Yes the site is down at the moment but i'm sure this isn't the first time this has happened is it?!?

orangebird

04-09-2003, 10:47

Originally posted by th'engineer
well its definately down anyone any ideas why :shrug:

May be just a software update as handyman said earlier.

As for goading customers and provoking them into arguments, I'm sorry but that's just unfair. Everyone of the mods on .com are as helpful as they can be. 90% of the time, the only reason an argument ensues is because the customer don't hear the answers they want to the questions they asked....:shrug:

Mods are there essentially to ensure smooth running of the site, and to act on a customers behalf when all other attempts to resolve an issue have failed. They give up an awful lot of their own time (with not that great compensation a lot of people assume they get...) and genuiely want to help. I should know, I used to date one of them.....

andygrif

04-09-2003, 10:51

Originally posted by orangebird
May be just a software update as handyman said earlier.

As for goading customers and provoking them into arguments, I'm sorry but that's just unfair. Everyone of the mods on .com are as helpful as they can be. 90% of the time, the only reason an argument ensues is because the customer don't hear the answers they want to the questions they asked....:shrug:

Mods are there essentially to ensure smooth running of the site, and to act on a customers behalf when all other attempts to resolve an issue have failed. They give up an awful lot of their own time (with not that great compensation a lot of people assume they get...) and genuiely want to help. I should know, I used to date one of them.....

I don't disagree. As I mentioned, I like the almost all of the mods over there. I think they are very good at what they do, and actually do care about both the site and the customers' interests.

andygrif

04-09-2003, 10:52

Originally posted by Scooby
you haven't backed anything up, to back something up you bring some evidence which so far you haven't got any which is in this thread.

Yes the site is down at the moment but i'm sure this isn't the first time this has happened is it?!?

Well I know that you can't look at specific instances on the .com site as it is not operational at this time. However as soon as it is back up, I will give you some links to the kind of behaviour I describe - not all of them containing posts from me:D

handyman

04-09-2003, 10:55

There seems to have been a slight problem with the database.
Please try again by pressing the refresh button in your browser.

An E-Mail has been dispatched to our Technical Staff, who you can also
contact if the problem persists.

We apologise for any inconvenience.

I get this? Although that is when trying to directly access a part of the forum.

andygrif

04-09-2003, 10:56

I'm sure it will be back soon

Florence

04-09-2003, 11:03

I get the standard VBullitin page saying the forums are down please try later Frank.:shrug: was on earlier and everything wes working. suppose there goes the PM I sent Craig then in reply to his...

timewarrior2001

04-09-2003, 11:04

Form time to time we have all seen the mods get a little tetchy some people can be touchy, especially in the Cap thread.
yes the mods get some stick and they have been known in the past for banning people for very little. But after I had an absence form the site it seems most of the dodgy mods were eliminated, dont see many of the old ones now.

I cant honestly say I haven't had any toruble there, I've had arguments with people, I've even had very usefull discussion via Pm with one of the mods and found out a lot of stuff.
Like everyone unfortunately I have my likes and dislikes and that even comes to moderators, some of them are good, some are bad.
One works very hard posting in threads, the other seem to use PM to solve troubles.

there is still unresolved issues for me with some policies they have over there, but its nothing thats worth issuing complaints about. Just my views on a certain filter ;)

trebor

04-09-2003, 11:16

there has got to be something going on at .com there always is ;)
as for me I am no longer a member, I did not like or agree with the way the site was being moderated. it appeared to me that anybody who criticised ntl got grief not help. when I signed up the site used to help people with ntl related problems, now it just seems they are there to defend ntl and deny anything which is not good news for ntl.
I don't like and I don't miss it.
this is all just my personal opinions and feelings about .com

ic14

04-09-2003, 11:34

Anyone notice how the colour scheme has changed on there?
And how the message is signed Frank.

Ben

04-09-2003, 11:34

I don't care :D

.co.uk for meeeee ! :D

Mick

04-09-2003, 11:36

Originally posted by ic14
Anyone notice how the colour scheme has changed on there?
And how the message is signed Frank.

Frank is .com's site editor, why shouldn't his name be signed in the message? :confused:

Florence

04-09-2003, 11:44

The colour scheme hasn't changed that is just the default forum down page in the default colours.. The forums use custom colours selected by Frank. :)

ntluser

04-09-2003, 12:37

Originally posted by Kitty
I get the standard VBullitin page saying the forums are down please try later Frank.:shrug: was on earlier and everything wes working. suppose there goes the PM I sent Craig then in reply to his...

I get the same message.

It's possible that they could be either having some technical problem with their server, doing routine maintenance or upgrading the software.

Just checked the home page and as there is no message about maintenance or software upgrades, I reckon they have some technical problem.

Hopefully, it will all be resolved soon and things will be back to normal!

BBKing

04-09-2003, 12:39

The colour scheme for the forum is a bit different, from the original closed message I saw at about 10am. More...blue.

Hmm.

homealone

04-09-2003, 12:42

I didn't notice this earlier

The latest forum posts section is currently unavailable due to a major version upgrade to the forum. Please bear with us while we work to integrate the latest threads on the homepage back into the new version.

Richard M

04-09-2003, 12:52

It says VB v3 Beta 5 at the bottom so he is upgrading the forums.
Not exactly a major conspiracy. :rolleyes:

ntluser

04-09-2003, 12:53

Originally posted by homealone
I didn't notice this earlier

Thanks for that, homealone.

I didn't see it either but at least there is some explanation as to why the forums are down. Hopefully members will find this thread when they read 'the forums are down' message.

Florence

04-09-2003, 13:09

Interesting we test the new versions in private so we know its ok before we upgrade so not to lose any information of the busy forum..

orangebird

04-09-2003, 13:21

Considering the the site is not an official CS source, I think ntl aren't too worried about having the forum down for a few hours. :)

ntluser

04-09-2003, 13:31

Originally posted by orangebird
Considering the the site is not an official CS source, I think ntl aren't too worried about having the forum down for a few hours. :)

Hi Orange, I think you're right. It's nice for NTL customers to have a choice of so many forums and if the new software will mean a better quality experience and involves only a short break in service then I think we will all be the better for it and it will be well worth the wait!!

Gareth D

04-09-2003, 14:41

Should be back up about 15:00

handyman

04-09-2003, 15:01

well im logged in but I cant do owt yet :)

Does look rather nazzy

bob_a_builder

04-09-2003, 15:47

There but all the non NTL sections have gone - will they ever return ?

Jules

04-09-2003, 15:50

Looks like it is all back up and running again with just a slight colour change

th'engineer

04-09-2003, 15:51

its a bit bright for the eyes, do not change any colors andre

Undisputedtruth

08-09-2003, 21:55

Originally posted by andygrif
Well I know that you can't look at specific instances on the .com site as it is not operational at this time. However as soon as it is back up, I will give you some links to the kind of behaviour I describe - not all of them containing posts from me:D

Basically I've got suspended for apparently for no good reason. Craig is unwilling to discuss anything further on this matter. I believe a number of people were not convinced by Craig's argument in suspending me.

Escapee

08-09-2003, 22:00

Oh well, I got my post edited as "company confidential" and a PM about it that I am not given access to read!

The info was not confidential when I posted it because all people affected had been informed by meeting, letter, email and powerpoint presentation.

I was only asking to spare a thought for these guys because I personally know the majority affected in South Wales.

I guess someone complained again about bad news getting out!!!

Russ

08-09-2003, 23:19

Well if there's anything about NTL that .com won't allow you to post, it'll be welcomed on here :)

Escapee

09-09-2003, 07:30

Russ D saidWell if there's anything about NTL that .com won't allow you to post, it'll be welcomed on here

Thanks for that Russ, I did leave the posting on .com until it had been officially announced but it was still obviously not welcome.

I would ask if I thought it was something contraversial or could possibly taken the wrong way. (due to past experiences)

MrInsignificant

09-09-2003, 16:12

Hi peeps.

I have found the occasion to be very upset at some of the posts made by the moderators at NTHell. I have been more angry at the posts made by NTL employees following the company line who do not have the restrictions of having to appear impartial on that forum. That said, the moderators do a wonderful job and I see them helping people with technical queries all the time. But mention something against NTL policies or behaviour and you are automatically pounced upon by the NTL crew from hell.

orangebird

09-09-2003, 17:13

Originally posted by Russ D
Well if there's anything about NTL that .com won't allow you to post, it'll be welcomed on here :)

Russ, I think the reason that Escapees post was removed was because there was no official confirmation that the redundancies had been announced, no other reason. Surely, if you were in that position, you'd rather those that were about to lose their jobs were informed before members of a website knew?
:shrug:

Anyhow, aren't we all a little old to be running off to various TOS's to tell tales now? :rolleyes:

Undisputedtruth

09-09-2003, 21:12

Originally posted by MrInsignificant
Hi peeps.

I have found the occasion to be very upset at some of the posts made by the moderators at NTHell. I have been more angry at the posts made by NTL employees following the company line who do not have the restrictions of having to appear impartial on that forum. That said, the moderators do a wonderful job and I see them helping people with technical queries all the time. But mention something against NTL policies or behaviour and you are automatically pounced upon by the NTL crew from hell.

A mere mention of the NTL crew as proMods and you get a load of nonsense from them and Craig J. I think Craig J has taken on the cause of NTL. Things are sooo sensitive on nthw.com that if you mention the word proNTL they will suspend you. So much for free speech.

Russ

09-09-2003, 22:49

Originally posted by orangebird
Russ, I think the reason that Escapees post was removed was because there was no official confirmation that the redundancies had been announced, no other reason. Surely, if you were in that position, you'd rather those that were about to lose their jobs were informed before members of a website knew?
:shrug:

Anyhow, aren't we all a little old to be running off to various TOS's to tell tales now? :rolleyes:

The 'bird makes a good point - if such a post involves people's jobs in that way then of course that would be different.

carlingman

09-09-2003, 23:59

Originally posted by Undisputedtruth
A mere mention of the NTL crew as proMods and you get a load of nonsense from them and Craig J. I think Craig J has taken on the cause of NTL. Things are sooo sensitive on nthw.com that if you mention the word proNTL they will suspend you. So much for free speech.

Right puts on flame retardent suit.

For the benefit of others that dont read that site your above statement is from your side of the fence only.

As Craig has pointed out you were not suspended solely as an outcome of one thread and but as a team decision between the Mods/Admin not just one Craig J as you seem to think.

From what I have read over there your constant labelling of people as "pro ntl" when they had anything other than negative remarks to say about the company was becoming tiresome to many.

Then when warned you added a tag to your signature in a deliberate attempt to goad one of the the Admin and other members into an argument.

And further to this when challenged you made posts about NTL Staff being liars.

No doubt you and others that frequent the other forum dont need or want me to post examples.

You were forewarned publicy and privately but you still chose to persist and insult people and goad others.

I also agree that people should not be censored, gagged for voicing an opinion within reason and long as it does not become personal towards other members.

Freedom of speech is one thing I agree with but constantly breeching the T&Cs you agreed to when signing up to the forum is another.

Lets hope this does not carry over on to this site.

:cool: :cool:

homealone

10-09-2003, 00:12

Undisputedtruth

10-09-2003, 01:34

Originally posted by carlingman
Right puts on flame retardent suit.

For the benefit of others that dont read that site your above statement is from your side of the fence only.

As Craig has pointed out you were not suspended solely as an outcome of one thread and but as a team decision between the Mods/Admin not just one Craig J as you seem to think.

From what I have read over there your constant labelling of people as "pro ntl" when they had anything other than negative remarks to say about the company was becoming tiresome to many.

Then when warned you added a tag to your signature in a deliberate attempt to goad one of the the Admin and other members into an argument.

And further to this when challenged you made posts about NTL Staff being liars.

No doubt you and others that frequent the other forum dont need or want me to post examples.

You were forewarned publicy and privately but you still chose to persist and insult people and goad others.

I also agree that people should not be censored, gagged for voicing an opinion within reason and long as it does not become personal towards other members.

Freedom of speech is one thing I agree with but constantly breeching the T&Cs you agreed to when signing up to the forum is another.

Lets hope this does not carry over on to this site.

:cool: :cool:

When people are constantly defending NTL and attacking those who speak out against NTL then is it any wonder they are tagged with the proNTL label. It is not a co-incidence that the proNTL mobs are mainly employers and some misguided customers. They hate the tag because they know it highlights their operations. As a result they are very hypersensitive to the word proNTL mob. The word is no more insulting than describing the political nature of a party, ie are they on the far left or far right?

No, I was not trying to goad Craig into an argument but of one of discussion. For the audience please see the link. http://www.nthellworld.com/forum/showthread.php?p=496277#post496277 . Carlingman and Craig thinks it is acceptable for someone to pay a ÃƒÆ’Ã¢â‚¬Å¡Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â£300 bill even though it was caused by the failure of NTL's equipment. I used the sales of goods act to validate my reasoning. As you clearly see how Carlingman falls under the definition of the proNTL mob and attacks those who speaks out against NTL. In fact there is nothing I posted in that thread which breaks the site's terms and conditions.

There is a serious issue of free speech and to poorly interpret the site's terms and conditions to censor my free speech is clearly wrong. I repeat again - where is the post in that thread which breaks the terms and conditions?

I'm not the only person that says customer services are liars. If it is nthw.com to ban those that says customers services are liars then most of the true customers will be banned by now. I repeat again - am I the only person that says customer services are liars?

Russ

10-09-2003, 08:49

Originally posted by Undisputedtruth
I repeat again - am I the only person that says customer services are liars?

If you saying that all CS are liars - then yes, you are probably the only one.

homealone

10-09-2003, 09:18

As you clearly see how Carlingman falls under the definition of the proNTL mob

and if that continues to be your only argument against a well constructed post, that "just happens" to disagree with you, you will not gain any credibility with me, either.

Quit the stupid labels & reply to the issues discussed - attempting to discredit an poster by putting them in a box invented by you is just the sort of thing that got up peoples noses on com - and does you no credit at all.

- I, personally, find it insulting that you behave, thus, on these forums - and, as you know, I will report posts I feel overstep the mark.

Please further your "cause" by ceasing to label people as "pro NTL" & calling Customer Service staff liars - then we might listen to what you are actually saying.

andygrif

10-09-2003, 09:58

Originally posted by carlingman

As Craig has pointed out you were not suspended solely as an outcome of one thread and but as a team decision between the Mods/Admin not just one Craig J as you seem to think.

From what I have read over there your constant labelling of people as "pro ntl" when they had anything other than negative remarks to say about the company was becoming tiresome to many.

Then when warned you added a tag to your signature in a deliberate attempt to goad one of the the Admin and other members into an argument.

And further to this when challenged you made posts about NTL Staff being liars.

In the interests of balance, none of us, apart from Craig and UDT are actually in posession of all of the facts. And Craig did not choose to publicise these facts.

I don't think anyone could seriously label ALL CS staff as liars, although from a customer's point of view the phrase 'I'll have someone call you back tomorrow' could easily put them into this category if we let them.

As for the pro/anti labelling that was going on, I believe this was originated by someone labelling someone else as ANTI-ntl. Although I may be wrong on this.

Russ

10-09-2003, 10:02

Originally posted by andygrif
In the interests of balance, none of us, apart from Craig and UDT are actually in posession of all of the facts.

Exactly. And as we all know, the Admins over there rarely (if ever) comment on individual cases so we'd only have UDT's version which would not make way for a balanced idea of what happened.

Chris

10-09-2003, 10:55

Originally posted by Undisputedtruth
As you clearly see how Carlingman falls under the definition of the proNTL mob

The very word 'mob' has connotations of disorderliness, rabble, possibly even a criminal gang. Is it any wonder that people get upset when you label them part of a 'mob' for nothing worse than disagreeing with you?

I have no idea of the details of your case and frankly that's not the point. You expect people to respect your opinion even if they disagree with it ... well, you might just get that respect if you in turn respect others with whom you disagree.

Escapee

10-09-2003, 11:52

orangebird saidRuss, I think the reason that Escapees post was removed was because there was no official confirmation that the redundancies had been announced, no other reason. Surely, if you were in that position, you'd rather those that were about to lose their jobs were informed before members of a website knew?

I only posted facts after the people affected had been put on the "at threat of redundancy list" These people had been informed by Letter, email, verbally and by powerpoint presentation at a meeting. The region had been generally informed two days previously about forthcoming redundancies and some people knew about them a few days before that.

I had some flak before for putting two and two together over the last redundancies when my guess was correct, so this time I just waited until it was official before I posted about it. If I had wanted to jump the gun around tues/wed I could of just posted the info on another site!
I could go and post rumours about another department currently looking at reducing numbers if that was my intention.

Perhaps it was another poor communications problem, and an ntl employee complained because they didn't know the facts and were miffed that someone outside the company did, this is something that very often happens. perhaps it's another example of some employees not liking any bad news about the company getting out.

All I did was post in a thread about redundancies that was wishing the affected CS people all the best, I only asked for us to all spare a thought for the people that had been "Officially" informed that they were under threat that very day in the latest round. Please remember that I personally know at least 75% of the employees in the departments affected, and many of them I still consider as good former collegues and some are still personal friends.

Anyhow, aren't we all a little old to be running off to various TOS's to tell tales now?

I dont think it's a case of running off to another site, I dont think you will find any evidence of this in the past. I even said elsewhere in my post that the person who edited my thread probably received a complaint by some employee who was not affected, not informed and possibly miffed at outsiders knowing.
The news was probably all around the pubs in Cardiff anyway, I certainly know that a matter of hours later in a pub in Cardiff the affected ntl guys that I was drinking with were discussing the official news. If it was my intention I could of posted the news a few days before it was official, It was more a combination of my PM's not working on the site since my post, and the fact that someone else was allowed to post about the very news in another thread later on without any warnings.:rolleyes:

dialanothernumb

10-09-2003, 11:55

I did spend a bit of time trawling through the thread on .com that was started by UDT.

You do sound pee'd off, and you sound like you have had a good reason to be. Many of us have experienced glitches through to plain bad service from NTL and other companies that leave us fuming.

But what I also read was a few peole genuinely offering to help and some pretty ill-tempered posts from various quarters, just escalating the situation way off course. Now it'll be practically impossible to address UDT's real original issue. That's a shame.

What more do you want to achieve UDT?

I happen to agree with the comments that some have made about the atmosphere changing at .com, but I have a choice of sites to go to now and I can pick and choose. I don't really want the same stuff that's putting me off .com, boiling over here too:smokin:

andygrif

10-09-2003, 12:27

Originally posted by dialanothernumb

I happen to agree with the comments that some have made about the atmosphere changing at .com, but I have a choice of sites to go to now and I can pick and choose. I don't really want the same stuff that's putting me off .com, boiling over here too:smokin:

Well I don't think that is likely, as the mods here don't seem to have an agenda. It troubles me that the moderation of .com does stray into to provoking some people at times - which I haven't seen here.:D

orangebird

10-09-2003, 12:29

Give it a rest! It's turning into another version of ntlhell here.... :rolleyes:

If you don't like the way a site behaves, then don't visit it. It's not as if you don't have a choice of ntl sites to use is it?.....

dialanothernumb

10-09-2003, 12:37

Hey, I just found Knapps office again! I'm like a pig in clover... so who cares what's going on elsewhere, it's happening here!:D

orangebird

10-09-2003, 13:13

Originally posted by dellwear
Come on OB, I think you'll find the majority of posts were in favour of .com, in the main, the people that frequent this board also frequent the other, and will probably do so until .com is closed down. Because of this we all see whats going on, and I think that you can see from this thread that none of us have any malicious intents toward .com.

I see no malicious intent either - just a lot of unnecessary whinging.

I personally think that things here have calmed down a lot recently, and I find your comments above about nthell offencive.

Offensive? Unfortunately, now the nthellwoe forum has been removed, I can't supply links to the threads I'm thinking about, but in it's hey day, ntlhell was highly and personally offensive - Russ D may be able to back me up here.... :shrug:

I and most others are sad to see .com go, and we still stick up for it in the main, I can see some on the points raised in this thread are valid, .com does have its odd troll, but that doesn't mean we all tar all the posters over there with the same brush, we couldn't, we are some of the posters.

Yes, the feeling over at .com has changed, but that is mostly to do with the fact that it is about to close not because the mods or anyone else is goading people.

Who said .com is going? Has there been an official announcement?
All sites have the odd troll - I still don't understand why members have to flit between the two sites to complain about it....and please tell me where I tarred all posters with the same brush?? :confused:

I really feel for the mods over there, they get stick time and time again and they really do help customers, I'm not saying that there isn't the odd time I don't agree with there comments or actions but come on OB just because someone banned there comes here to spout off doesn't mean we all have a personal vendetta against the other site.:mad:

So what's to gain from spouting off? The point is???

Anyway aside from all that - I'm sure if I posted 'the sky is blue' you'd reply to the contrary..... :rolleyes:

downquark1

10-09-2003, 13:16

Who said .com is going? Has there been an official announcement?
All sites have the odd troll - I still don't understand why members have to flit between the two sites to complain about it....and please tell me where I tarred all posters with the same brush??

Community is coming out soon, isn't it? Surely NTL aren't stupid enough to pay for two forums. Unless Frank continues running it for free, which is entirely possible.

orangebird

10-09-2003, 13:18

Originally posted by Andre
Oh not it is not. :nono:

Fair point, but this thread now appears to be turning into a Craig/NTHW.com bashing session, and that is something we do not want here.

Feel free to discuss away, but please don't turn this thread into a slanging match about anyone (except ntl of course!) :p

That was kind of my point Andre - this site is about ntl and their services, not whether members do or don't agree with goings on on another site - Which is exactly why ntlhell was set up... :rolleyes: Understand now why I used the comparison?

Escapee

10-09-2003, 13:33

I only brought the subject up about other sites because of this.

Orangebird post 44Anyhow, aren't we all a little old to be running off to various TOS's to tell tales now?

I would like to make it clear that I have never run off to any site to start a thread complaining about another site or mod, and I have never bombarded anyone with abuse on any site either. I will admit to receiving it on two occassions though, and the one was from a member who had recently joined who started trouble and made a complaint/serious allegation about me and has never to my knowledge been seen since!

If I have a post edited such as the one that I was discussing which is not very often (Twice I think), I try to find as many of the facts that I can. I appreciate that the mods on any site not just .com have the interest in the feelings of the majority of members, you will notice in my very first thread bringing up the subject of my edited post that I did not point the finger at any mod, I said it was possibly a case of the mod not being informed of the redundancies hence being rightly cautious or an ntl employee complaining about bad news getting out again.
I would of thought that my thread would of been re-instated or an invitation to reword it when the information was verified.

After all, the last thing ntl need is more bad press!

trebor

10-09-2003, 13:33

Originally posted by towny
The very word 'mob' has connotations of disorderliness, rabble, possibly even a criminal gang. Is it any wonder that people get upset when you label them part of a 'mob' for nothing worse than disagreeing with you?

I have no idea of the details of your case and frankly that's not the point. You expect people to respect your opinion even if they disagree with it ... well, you might just get that respect if you in turn respect others with whom you disagree.

why does the phrase "criminal gang" remind me of ntl :shrug:

I also have no idea about udt's case but I have to more or less agree with him. it is only my opinion but I feel in general the .com site has become very poorly run, very unfairly modded and is now nothing more than a mouth piece for NTL.
I no longer contribute to the site, it is just to much hassle. :td:

trebor

10-09-2003, 13:40

Originally posted by orangebird
Give it a rest! It's turning into another version of ntlhell here.... :rolleyes:

If you don't like the way a site behaves, then don't visit it. It's not as if you don't have a choice of ntl sites to use is it?.....

you to have a choice orangebird, if you don't like what people post here, then perhaps you should take your own advice.

orangebird

10-09-2003, 14:00

Originally posted by trebor
you to have a choice orangebird, if you don't like what people post here, then perhaps you should take your own advice.

Very lame Trebor - I like this site, and I visit here for lots of reasons, one of then being to help customers if and when I can.
Sure, I could just not visit. That's one person less to help customers....carry on like that and it'll turn into a bitching site, nothing more, nothing less. :shrug:

:rolleyes:

Stuart

10-09-2003, 14:05

Originally posted by Undisputedtruth
No, I was not trying to goad Craig into an argument but of one of discussion. For the audience please see the link. http://www.nthellworld.com/forum/showthread.php?p=496277#post496277 . Carlingman and Craig thinks it is acceptable for someone to pay a ÃƒÆ’Ã¢â‚¬Å¡Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â£300 bill even though it was caused by the failure of NTL's equipment. I used the sales of goods act to validate my reasoning. As you clearly see how Carlingman falls under the definition of the proNTL mob and attacks those who speaks out against NTL. In fact there is nothing I posted in that thread which breaks the site's terms and conditions.

UDT, read the post by kitty at http://www.nthellworld.com/forum/showpost.php?p=496266&postcount=69.

It seems whoever made the calls found a way aroumd the barring.

Also, just because somebody does not agree when NTL are criticised, that does not make them pro NTL. I have disagreed with you in the past, and I am definately not pro NTL. Neither am I anti NTL.

Nemesis

10-09-2003, 14:14

Originally posted by orangebird
Sure, I could just not visit.

Nooooooooooooooooooooooo

Dont leave us OB, we need you ....:wavey:

orangebird

10-09-2003, 14:27

Originally posted by Andre
I know 'OB' :)

I wasn't aiming the 'This will not turn into a **** off Craig/NTHW.com' comment at you, sorry if it came across that way. :)

It was a general (sweeping) statement that was basically supporting the comments that you made about this site is not here to turn into another ntlhell-we are all here to help ntl's customers.

Let's not lose sight of that please everyone. :)

No apologies needed Andre - I'm sure my first post on this thread came across a fairly 'sweeping' too - and it wasn't meant to.

I think we're both on the same page...I'm just not as eloquent at putting across as you just have :)

PS Thanks Nemesis! :blush: :wavey:

trebor

10-09-2003, 14:29

Originally posted by orangebird
Very lame Trebor - I like this site, and I visit here for lots of reasons, one of then being to help customers if and when I can.
Sure, I could just not visit. That's one person less to help customers....carry on like that and it'll turn into a bitching site, nothing more, nothing less. :shrug:

:rolleyes:

it is no more lame than your original post of "give it a rest"
which I hope is not the best help and advice you provide.
so stop bitching about people bitching or your worst fears will come true, this is site will become another nthell.

trebor

10-09-2003, 14:35

it's not panto season already is it ;)

Nemesis

10-09-2003, 14:37

ok, best scouse accent on

CALM DOWN CALM DOWN

There is no need for fighting, or bitching. Nobody seems to agree with what TOS is doing at the moment. It's their loss really. coming over here and bitching itn't going to solve your issues over there.

Shaun

10-09-2003, 15:15

Originally posted by orangebird
Anyway aside from all that - I'm sure if I posted 'the sky is blue' you'd reply to the contrary..... :rolleyes:

Yes, .com is going eventually, unless Ntl have changed their mind about community, and I have missed the announcement. Somehow I think not.

As far as your comment above, I'll post as when I like, where I like, I'm not going to bite my tongue just because my post might upset you. If thats what you want then I'm afraid your going to be disappointed, I'll be bullied by no one especially someone that works for Ntl.

But for your information I did actually deleted my post that you refer to above even before you managed to finish your reply because I didn't want to get embroiled in your pointless arguments (again).

If you don't like what I have to say thats your problem, but please don't think I have nothing better to do with my time than wind you up. :upyours:

edit - spelling

andygrif

10-09-2003, 15:29

Originally posted by orangebird
Give it a rest! It's turning into another version of ntlhell here.... :rolleyes:

If you don't like the way a site behaves, then don't visit it. It's not as if you don't have a choice of ntl sites to use is it?.....

Come on OB, I know you're capable of more constructive posts than that:)

It's not whether I like or dislike a way that some people on a site may or may not behave - when that site is owned by ntl then it forms customer opinion as to the whole company. That is my point - not whether I approve of someone's moderation or a user being barred or not.

orangebird

10-09-2003, 15:38

Originally posted by andygrif
Come on OB, I know you're capable of more constructive posts than that:)

It's not whether I like or dislike a way that some people on a site may or may not behave - when that site is owned by ntl then it forms customer opinion as to the whole company. That is my point - not whether I approve of someone's moderation or a user being barred or not.

I just think that there is plenty more good stuff on this site to discuss, rather than the actions of another site. End of. :)

Nemesis

10-09-2003, 15:50

Originally posted by Andre
That just about sums it up really. :)

We did not set this site up to discuss NTHW.com/ntl hell etc, we are here to discuss ntl.

I know ntl own NTHW.com, but this thread really isn't helping anyone. :(

Well said ..

andygrif

10-09-2003, 16:17

Originally posted by orangebird
I just think that there is plenty more good stuff on this site to discuss, rather than the actions of another site. End of. :)

I would largely agree with that sentiment, however not too long ago you also posted in this thread:

Originally posted by orangebird

Russ, I think the reason that Escapees post was removed was because there was no official confirmation that the redundancies had been announced, no other reason. Surely, if you were in that position, you'd rather those that were about to lose their jobs were informed before members of a website knew?

You said earlier, if you don't like something, don't take part in it. Well I would ask you why you continue to take part in a thread you have no interest in.

orangebird

10-09-2003, 16:21

Originally posted by andygrif
I would largely agree with that sentiment, however not too long ago you also posted in this thread:

You said earlier, if you don't like something, don't take part in it. Well I would ask you why you continue to take part in a thread you have no interest in.

:rolleyes:

Because, I didn't like the way it was implied that .com were being little hitlers about it, removing a post without reason etc... If no-one else was goung to give the full story, then I wanted to. Simple. I like both sites (hell, I even like ntlhell!), and think all sites have too much to offer to get caught up in threads like this - which is why this is my last post on the subject. :)

andygrif

10-09-2003, 16:25

Originally posted by orangebird
:rolleyes:

Because, I didn't like the way it was implied that .com were being little hitlers about it, removing a post without reason etc... If no-one else was goung to give the full story, then I wanted to. Simple. I like both sites (hell, I even like ntlhell!), and think all sites have too much to offer to get caught up in threads like this - which is why this is my last post on the subject. :)

But that's the point - you don't want to take part in a thread, and think other shouldn't either - yet when something you think warrants being discussed crops up you rightly take part.

This is all anyone is doing on this thread - and because one post makes you hit reply, you should not judge others when they find a different post to reply to.

I'm not saying you should or shouldn't be on any site - all I'm pointing out is the slightly hypocritical nature of what you said (in my own opinion of course, and with no offence intended):)

orangebird

10-09-2003, 16:30

Originally posted by andygrif
But that's the point - you don't want to take part in a thread, and think other shouldn't either - yet when something you think warrants being discussed crops up you rightly take part.

This is all anyone is doing on this thread - and because one post makes you hit reply, you should not judge others when they find a different post to reply to.

I'm not saying you should or shouldn't be on any site - all I'm pointing out is the slightly hypocritical nature of what you said (in my own opinion of course, and with no offence intended):)

Last post (I mean it this time...)

The original reason I posted in this thread was not about others 'taking part' in a thread - it's about posting untruths/half truths/telling tales. I do not think I am being hypocritical. :) (although you are of course entitled to your own opinion and no offence taken :) )

andygrif

10-09-2003, 16:32

Originally posted by orangebird
Last post (I mean it this time...)

The orignal reason I posted in this thread was not about others 'taking part' in a thread - it's about posting untruths/half truths. I do not think I am being hypocritical. :)

But what may be a half truth is still at least part fact, and is still 100% opinion - and anyone is as entitled to their opinions as the next person.

Escapee

10-09-2003, 16:45

orangebird saidBecause, I didn't like the way it was implied that .com were being little hitlers about it, removing a post without reason etc...

I'll take it that wasn't aimed at me because I actually said more than once that the mod who edited my post was probably acting on a complaint. I have no idea what part of my post was supposed to be company confidential because, as I said my PM does not seem to work anymore!

I was a bit miffed that another member (ntl employee) was able to start a thread about 90 days notice, ie: the same subject without the so called confidential info being edited. I also noticed that this poster was not jumped on because he/she is an employee possibly affected by the job losses.

I just think we should have an even playing field no matter what site, I do not criticise everything that ntl does and have infact sided with ntl employees on more than one occassion where there has been someone ranting who has got hold of the wrong end of the stick. I do however point out bad things in ntl and on these occassions I get jumped on rather like a boxer who opon losing complains that the ring was too soft, the ropes were slack or he was butted etc but will not agree with the facts.

I don't think there is anything in my thread where I said or implied that anyone was being a little Hitler, but I can understand ntl management asking for bad news to be censored!

orangebird

10-09-2003, 16:50

Originally posted by Escapee
orangebird said

I'll take it that wasn't aimed at me because I actually said more than once that the mod who edited my post was probably acting on a complaint. I have no idea what part of my post was supposed to be company confidential because, as I said my PM does not seem to work anymore!

I was a bit miffed that another member (ntl employee) was able to start a thread about 90 days notice, ie: the same subject without the so called confidential info being edited. I also noticed that this poster was not jumped on because he/she is an employee possibly affected by the job losses.

I just think we should have an even playing field no matter what site, I do not criticise everything that ntl does and have infact sided with ntl employees on more than one occassion where there has been someone ranting who has got hold of the wrong end of the stick. I do however point out bad things in ntl and on these occassions I get jumped on rather like a boxer who opon losing complains that the ring was too soft, the ropes were slack or he was butted etc but will not agree with the facts.

I don't think there is anything in my thread where I said or implied that anyone was being a little Hitler, but I can understand ntl management asking for bad news to be censored!

I don't think it's a case of bad news bring censored...I just don't think a custoer website is the appropriate place to post internal employee information on, period. Just for the record, I don't thnk the 90 days post should have been allowed either. :)

Undisputedtruth

10-09-2003, 19:04

Originally posted by Russ D
If you saying that all CS are liars - then yes, you are probably the only one.

I never ever said all CS are liars. It is a bit like saying all Metropolitan police officers are racist. My comments refers only to customer services as a body and not all individual CSRs. Perhaps a better word to describe NTL is institutional liars.

carlingman

10-09-2003, 19:07

Originally posted by homealone whichever side of any notional fence one sits - that is a bloody good post.

Thanks and for those who have not read back it was for my post 47.

:)

Originally posted by undisputed truth When people are constantly defending NTL and attacking those who speak out against NTL then is it any wonder they are tagged with the proNTL label. It is not a co-incidence that the proNTL mobs are mainly employers and some misguided customers. They hate the tag because they know it highlights their operations. As a result they are very hypersensitive to the word proNTL mob. The word is no more insulting than describing the political nature of a party, ie are they on the far left or far right?

No, I was not trying to goad Craig into an argument but of one of discussion. For the audience please see the link.
http://www.nthellworld.com/forum/sh...6277#post496277

Carlingman and Craig thinks it is acceptable for someone to pay a ÃƒÆ’Ã¢â‚¬Å¡Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â£300 bill even though it was caused by the failure of NTL's equipment. I used the sales of goods act to validate my reasoning. As you clearly see how Carlingman falls under the definition of the proNTL mob and attacks those who speaks out against NTL. In fact there is nothing I posted in that thread which breaks the site's terms and conditions.

There is a serious issue of free speech and to poorly interpret the site's terms and conditions to censor my free speech is clearly wrong. I repeat again - where is the post in that thread which breaks the terms and conditions?

I'm not the only person that says customer services are liars. If it is nthw.com to ban those that says customers services are liars then most of the true customers will be banned by now. I repeat again - am I the only person that says customer services are liars?

Ill adopt your style of posting here and will only choose the bits I wish to answer.

In your opinion everyone who has anything decent to say about NTL is Pro NTL roughly translated means if they disagree with you then they are Pro Ntl ÃƒÆ’Ã‚Â¢ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¡Ã‚Â¬ ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â€šÂ¬Ã…â€œ whatever.

The thread you linked too please tell me where I said I though it was acceptable for them to pay the ÃƒÆ’Ã¢â‚¬Å¡Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â£300 bill ??

Maybe the post that broke the T&Cs was not in thread as you will see if you read my original post 47 here ÃƒÆ’Ã‚Â¢ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¡Ã‚Â¬ ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â€šÂ¬Ã…â€œ I mean all of it not just picked the bits you wanted to hear you will see I pointed out the reason was not one thread or posts but multiple postings and again it was not just Craig J but a team decision.

Anyhow I am not going defend Craig any more on this issue as I am sure he is big enough and man enough to come and fight his own corner if he so chooses.

And lastly as your never going to let this Pro NTL tag drop maybe I will as it invoked strong feelings all round over there so nuff said.

:cool:

Undisputedtruth

10-09-2003, 19:09

Originally posted by scastle
UDT, read the post by kitty at http://www.nthellworld.com/forum/showpost.php?p=496266&postcount=69.

It seems whoever made the calls found a way aroumd the barring.

Also, just because somebody does not agree when NTL are criticised, that does not make them pro NTL. I have disagreed with you in the past, and I am definately not pro NTL. Neither am I anti NTL.

Fingers still point towards NTL for their equipment failure I'm afraid. Sales of goods act still applies.

Undisputedtruth

10-09-2003, 19:12

Originally posted by trebor
why does the phrase "criminal gang" remind me of ntl :shrug:

I also have no idea about udt's case but I have to more or less agree with him. it is only my opinion but I feel in general the .com site has become very poorly run, very unfairly modded and is now nothing more than a mouth piece for NTL.
I no longer contribute to the site, it is just to much hassle. :td:

I received a number of PMs from customers frustrated by Craig and the proNTL mob. It seems Craig is leading the crusade on NTL causes.

MrInsignificant

10-09-2003, 19:26

Originally posted by Undisputedtruth
I received a number of PMs from customers frustrated by Craig and the proNTL mob. It seems Craig is leading the crusade on NTL causes.

I have to agree here. I don't even bother reading any of Craigs posts anymore becouse they invariably are biased and tainted with sarcasm. He really does appear to have mounted a huge NTL chip on his shoulder. I try to be as fair minded as possible about people but the very air around .com has a strench of NTL arrogance. I'm glad I found this site. At least I can give opinions and help where possible without having to worry about whether I have said something that might upset the NTL crew from hell.

Apologies if this is not what this is all about and its just my 2 penneth worth. I don't particularly have any grudge. I just don't like what .com has turned into, even in the limited time I have visited it.

trebor

10-09-2003, 19:50

Originally posted by Undisputedtruth
I received a number of PMs from customers frustrated by Craig and the proNTL mob. It seems Craig is leading the crusade on NTL causes.

As I have said already, in general I agree with you .com is now a poor and unhelpful site. but I would caution naming names it will no doubt end in trouble. the best thing you could do is stop using the site and take up your problems direct with NTL, after all, as hard as it may be they are the only people that can actually help you or compensate you if your problems are of that nature.
beyond that just carry on with the bad publicity campaign, let people know what bad service you have had, get on your soap box and shout :D

Undisputedtruth

10-09-2003, 19:53

Well reading the thread title "What's going on at .com?" implies you can discuss the activities at nthw.com . Craig has took upon himself to make life uncomfortable to those that speaks out against NTL and at the same time further the causes of NTL. Therefore, it is valid to discuss the activities of Craig J in the interest of free speech and to clear any misunderstandings which has arisen from his behaviour. I'm for one is interested in whether his colleagues approve of his behaviour?

Escapee

10-09-2003, 20:14

Andre saidDiscuss by all means, but please do not attempt to turn this thread into a place to $lag off individuals, that is not what the site is here for.

Point taken!

I have never got involved in the arguments surrounding individual people being banned etc before, but I must admit that it has looked like people were being picked off one by one that didn't fit in with the sites criteria.

I have allways stated that there was however a hiden agenda when ntl took over, I don't think any of us are silly enough to believe the managers involved were full of commitment or doing it for the customers benefit.

The takeover certainly gagged overnight all the disgruntled employees that posted in those days:rolleyes:

downquark1

10-09-2003, 20:43

MrInsignificant

10-09-2003, 21:35

Originally posted by Andre

Fair point, but this thread now appears to be turning into a Craig/NTHW.com bashing session, and that is something we do not want here.

Feel free to discuss away, but please don't turn this thread into a slanging match about anyone (except ntl of course!)

I will consider myself smacked on the bottom. Thank you and can I have another, Sir ?;)

andygrif

11-09-2003, 10:10

Originally posted by Andre
Please remember everyone-this site is not here to have digs @ NTHW.com (or any other site for that matter)

NTHW.com do not cause the problems with ntl customer's billing/EPG/broadband/email etc-ntl do. ;)

Yes, but the thing to remember Andre, is that .com is owned by ntl. In many people's opinions the site is being consumed into the overall ntl malaise of refusing to admit there are serious problems, and generally becoming as un-user friendly as the company itself. This is the issue being discussed.

If .com flied in the face of its owners and delivered consumer action on many of the long-term problems we all have to endure, then I don't think this thread would exist.

Stuart

11-09-2003, 10:20

Originally posted by Undisputedtruth
Well reading the thread title "What's going on at .com?" implies you can discuss the activities at nthw.com . Craig has took upon himself to make life uncomfortable to those that speaks out against NTL and at the same time further the causes of NTL. Therefore, it is valid to discuss the activities of Craig J in the interest of free speech and to clear any misunderstandings which has arisen from his behaviour. I'm for one is interested in whether his colleagues approve of his behaviour?

Whilst discussing the activities of Craig J, please remember he has been known to sue for defamation.

andygrif

11-09-2003, 10:33

Originally posted by scastle
Whilst discussing the activities of Craig J, please remember he has been known to sue for defamation.

You can't sue for defamation if you have a right of reply.

Stuart

11-09-2003, 10:40

Originally posted by andygrif
You can't sue for defamation if you have a right of reply.

I don't think that worked for certain members of ntlhell

andygrif

11-09-2003, 10:56

Originally posted by Andre

It is the ntl heirarchy that is the issue-top managers that don't give a to$$ about customers as long as they can justify their existance and get paid each month, and seeing as .com don't have any influence over the decisions that are made that affect customers-I will not allow this thread to waste time b!tching about them (or, as I've said any other website) It's is counter productive & totally missing the issue of why we are all here in my opinion. :)

The ntl heirarchy also express control over the .com site - which brings us both to the same page I think.

andygrif

11-09-2003, 10:57

Originally posted by scastle
I don't think that worked for certain members of ntlhell

And did he actually win anything?

Russ

11-09-2003, 11:33

Originally posted by scastle
Whilst discussing the activities of Craig J, please remember he has been known to sue for defamation.

Has he?

In the past CJ and I have been known to lock horns and some might describe his style as being somewhat abrasive, but this isn't the site to take pop shots at him. If people think he's changed since NTL's intervention then blame them, not him.

Stuart

11-09-2003, 11:48

Originally posted by Russ D
Has he?

In the past CJ and I have been known to lock horns and some might describe his style as being somewhat abrasive, but this isn't the site to take pop shots at him. If people think he's changed since NTL's intervention then blame them, not him.

Well, I seem to remember a while back that there was a thread about it on ntlhell a while ago.

Anyway, I wasn't having a go at Craig. Personally, I have no problem with him. I was just warning UDT that he/she might end up on the wrong end of a court action.

andygrif

11-09-2003, 11:52

Originally posted by scastle
Well, I seem to remember a while back that there was a thread about it on ntlhell a while ago.

Anyway, I wasn't having a go at Craig. Personally, I have no problem with him. I was just warning UDT that he/she might end up on the wrong end of a court action.

I'll say it again....you cannot sue someone for defamation / slander / libel if that person has adequate right of reply - which they obviously do becuase this is an open discussion forum.

Also, bringing a defamation case against someone is a hugely expensive day out - and being a civil case is not something you can claim legal aid for (to bring - you can to defend yourself).

Defiant

11-09-2003, 11:52

CJ gets upset about anything. Thats no doubt the reason why he edits more than any other mod on their and pm's abuse at people

Chris

11-09-2003, 12:23

Originally posted by andygrif
I'll say it again....you cannot sue someone for defamation / slander / libel if that person has adequate right of reply - which they obviously do becuase this is an open discussion forum.

This is not true. An offer of the right of reply is a valid defence against a libel action, which may lead to you being held not liable, or if held liable may reduce the damages awarded against you, but it is by no means a get-out clause.

If I post on here that you are a *** *** *** with a perverse liking for *** *** *** (which of course you arent! ;) ) the fact that you can come back on here and deny it does not prevent you from then sueing me. You can argue that your good name has been besmirched even though you took an opportunity to deny my claims.

Otherwise, open discussion fora would effectively be exempt from the laws of libel and slander, and they are not. The only places that are absolutely exempt are Parliament and courtrooms, while other official institutions and individuals my have qualified exemption under certain circumstances.

andygrif

11-09-2003, 12:31

Originally posted by towny
This is not true. An offer of the right of reply is a valid defence against a libel action, which may lead to you being held not liable, or if held liable may reduce the damages awarded against you, but it is by no means a get-out clause.

<snipped>

Otherwise, open discussion fora would effectively be exempt from the laws of libel and slander, and they are not. The only places that are absolutely exempt are Parliament and courtrooms, while other official institutions and individuals my have qualified exemption under certain circumstances.

No you're right, I phrased it badly. I could sue you even if you didn't say anything at all about me - but the fact the you didn't say it would remove the case from any court pretty quickly. Thanks for pointing out my terrible use of the English language!

MrInsignificant

11-09-2003, 12:34

Originally posted by towny
If I post on here that you are a *** *** *** with a perverse liking for *** *** *** (which of course you arent! ;) ) the fact that you can come back on here and deny it does not prevent you from then sueing me.

How do you know he isn't ?

Just kidding :D

Russ

11-09-2003, 13:28

Originally posted by scastle
Well, I seem to remember a while back that there was a thread about it on ntlhell a while ago.

With respect, do you believe everything they say over there?

Stuart

11-09-2003, 13:37

Originally posted by Russ D
With respect, do you believe everything they say over there?

Well, no. But there does seem to be a LOT of friction between the two sites.

In fact the mods at .com seem to hate any site they decide is a competitor (including this one).

Russ

11-09-2003, 13:44

Originally posted by scastle
Well, no. But there does seem to be a LOT of friction between the two sites.

In fact the mods at .com seem to hate any site they decide is a competitor (including this one).

Yes there HAS been a lot of friction between the two sides. On occasion I have been caught up in it and it tends to bring out the worst in you. Saying that, over the last few months ntlh seemed to have 'turned over a new leaf' which I'm pleasantly surprised at, and as a result there now seems to be little or no friction.

I don't think the mods hate any 'competition', but it would seem that many people automatically see any 'rival' sites as automatically anti-nthw.com. IMO the mods just go with the flow - many people within NTL (incorrectly) still see us as an anti-nthw.com site and I think they just reflect that

andygrif

11-09-2003, 14:33

Originally posted by MrInsignificant
How do you know he isn't ?

Just kidding :D

You'll be hearing from my lawyers:D

Macca

11-09-2003, 15:56

Originally posted by Russ D
many people within NTL (incorrectly) still see us as an anti-nthw.com site and I think they just reflect that

I don't see this site as anti-nthw.com or ntl but threads like this do nothing to improve how this site may be perceived by people within ntl.

MrInsignificant

11-09-2003, 19:16

Well this takes the biscuit. This thread was second to top and I didnt look at the date of the thread when I replied.

http://www.nthellworld.com/forum/showthread.php?t=38757

Does this thread closure look just a little bit like over-reaction just to me or does anyone else see it ?

Undisputedtruth

11-09-2003, 20:22

Originally posted by towny
This is not true. An offer of the right of reply is a valid defence against a libel action, which may lead to you being held not liable, or if held liable may reduce the damages awarded against you, but it is by no means a get-out clause.

If I post on here that you are a *** *** *** with a perverse liking for *** *** *** (which of course you arent! ;) ) the fact that you can come back on here and deny it does not prevent you from then sueing me. You can argue that your good name has been besmirched even though you took an opportunity to deny my claims.

Otherwise, open discussion fora would effectively be exempt from the laws of libel and slander, and they are not. The only places that are absolutely exempt are Parliament and courtrooms, while other official institutions and individuals my have qualified exemption under certain circumstances.

I think it is going to be hard job for you to put your case across. Let's remember why the sites were set up in the first place. Not exactly a good start for NTL's case. All of the problems NTL were caused by NTL in the first place. To attempt to silence an outspoken customer because of their outrageous behaviour is nothing short of disgrace. Remember, it was NTL that started it first! There are mountains of evidence against NTL in any case. A judgement against NTL will enhance their poor reputation even further. The only way out for NTL is to act reasonably and communicate with their customers. Anyway - what is exactly NTL's case? :confused:

Undisputedtruth

11-09-2003, 20:30

Stuart

11-09-2003, 20:41

Originally posted by Undisputedtruth
Scastle, what are you on about? Why would Craig take to court? I have done nothing wrong. Are they really desparate, that they will try anything to suppress others?

UDT, I was merely pointing out that Craig has apparently tried to sue people on forums because he considers what they say to libelous. According to NTLHell anyway.

Admittedly what they have said about him is far worse than anything I have seen you say.

Undisputedtruth

11-09-2003, 21:01

Originally posted by scastle
UDT, I was merely pointing out that Craig has apparently tried to sue people on forums because he considers what they say to libelous. According to NTLHell anyway.

Admittedly what they have said about him is far worse than anything I have seen you say.

What exact have they been saying about Craig?

The Diplomat

11-09-2003, 21:05

Why not ask over there... this site has not been formed for this purpose imo. :)

Graham F

11-09-2003, 21:06

Originally posted by The Diplomat
Why not ask over there... this site has not been formed for this purpose imo. :)

Spot on IMO :D

Undisputedtruth

11-09-2003, 21:08

Originally posted by MrInsignificant
Well this takes the biscuit. This thread was second to top and I didnt look at the date of the thread when I replied.

http://www.nthellworld.com/forum/showthread.php?t=38757

Does this thread closure look just a little bit like over-reaction just to me or does anyone else see it ?

I think it is an over-reaction on Craig's part. I would imagine Craig Jones is Welsh, hence he is very sensitive about it. However, it was funny.;), though one must question whether these sort of jokes should be allowed in this current politically correct society. I can remember Orangebird passing a racist comment on this site against Rippedoff and the mods done nothing about it.

Mick

11-09-2003, 21:18

Originally posted by Undisputedtruth
<Snip> I can remember Orangebird passing a racist comment on this site against Rippedoff and the mods done nothing about it.

Because it was not racist. Simple. :dozey:

Shaun

11-09-2003, 21:24

Can we not close this thread? It really isn't serving a purpose anymore. If you don't like the way .com is going, vote with your mouse and leave.

I don't see the point in this constant bitching, it's just making things worse.:(

Stuart

11-09-2003, 21:39

Originally posted by Undisputedtruth
What exact have they been saying about Craig?

UDT, I can't go into that because the part of the forum it was in (the .com site complaints section) has been deleted.

The Diplomat

11-09-2003, 21:42

Originally posted by scastle
UDT, I can't go into that because the part of the forum it was in (the .com site complaints section) has been deleted.

And quite rightly so. :)

homealone

11-09-2003, 21:53

Originally posted by dellwear
Can we not close this thread? It really isn't serving a purpose anymore. If you don't like the way .com is going, vote with your mouse and leave.

I don't see the point in this constant bitching, it's just making things worse.:(

I agree dellwear. I reported udt's personal comment about ob, which I felt was totally out of order.

Thanks Dr Plummer for your input.

- and can the thread please be closed.

Stuart

11-09-2003, 22:01

Originally posted by scastle
UDT, I can't go into that because the part of the forum it was in (the .com site complaints section) has been deleted.

And to be honest, I wouldn't if I could. Anything that happens between Craig and the other site should be reported by either him or them.

Undisputedtruth

11-09-2003, 22:11

Originally posted by homealone
I agree dellwear. I reported udt's personal comment about ob, which I felt was totally out of order.

Thanks Dr Plummer for your input.

- and can the thread please be closed.

homealone, you would report any post which are not NTL friendly or those that do not put the proNTL mob in a good light. It is not apersonal comment aimed at Orangebird. I was alarmed by her racists comments which of course would break the terms and conditions. Telling anyone to go back to their country runs the risk of being called a racist. I don't blame Rippedoff for taking offence to Orangebird's comments.

Mick

11-09-2003, 22:21

Originally posted by Undisputedtruth
homealone, you would report any post which are not NTL friendly or those that do not put the proNTL mob in a good light. It is not apersonal comment aimed at Orangebird. I was alarmed by her racists comments which of course would break the terms and conditions. Telling anyone to go back to their country runs the risk of being called a racist. I don't blame Rippedoff for taking offence to Orangebird's comments.

You report posts that are against your views, quite frankly you have no idea how a discussion forum works without diving into a thread and causing unrest by classing everyone you disagree with as the 'proNTL mob'. A change of record is so desperately needed by you.

Originally posted by homealone
- and can the thread please be closed.

It certainly can be. :tu: