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View Full Version : Two questions from a newbie


Monkfish
02-12-2004, 15:08
I'm trying to install some cable conduit in preparation for my NTL installation from the access point in the pavement outside my house. I'm sure NTL engineers are competent but routing cables in my property might be tricky and I don't like the idea of visible cables pinned to my brickwork.



1. How many cables will be taken from the pavement point? I need to know the diameter of the pipe-work to cement alongside my driveway. It might narrow to only 10mm at one point. Will that be okay? Obviously I'll include a drawstring.



2. Does that ugly box have to be stuck on the front of my house? Does NTL need guaranteed access to it? I would prefer the box to be located in my study, and the cable piped all the way from the pavement (especially considering that I'm laying the pipe!). At the very least I would like the box in my front garage.



Any ideas?

Thanks guys :)

gary_580
02-12-2004, 15:47
NTL will install a nice green plastic tube for you under the surface for the cable to reach your house.

In my experience they will install the grey box on the house where ever is closest to the point you need the service. If you have TV only, then near the TV if your having phone and TV then somewhere between the two etc etc. I have the grey box installed on the side of my house inside my garden.

Your best bet is to talk to the guy doing it. If your saving him some spade work im sure he might go someway towards your needs.

ian@huth
02-12-2004, 16:12
NTL will install a nice green plastic tube for you under the surface for the cable to reach your house.

In my experience they will install the grey box on the house where ever is closest to the point you need the service. If you have TV only, then near the TV if your having phone and TV then somewhere between the two etc etc. I have the grey box installed on the side of my house inside my garden.

Your best bet is to talk to the guy doing it. If your saving him some spade work im sure he might go someway towards your needs.

Hi Monkfish :welcome:

There are usually two cables to your property, one coax and one telephone. Quite often though the nice green plastic tube is only buried a couple of inches below the surface which can be problematic in the future. If you are thinking of installing conduit and then concreting over it the best idea may be to dig the trench where you want the cabling to go and leave it open for the installer to do his bit then concrete it over later as 10mm may possibly be too tight.

Normally the cable is taken to a grey or brown box on the outside wall of your property, mine is down the side. I cant see why this has to be outside as they would only need access to it when doing something to your installation that also involves being inside your house. Someone more in the know may come along and tell you if there is a technical reason for it being outside.

I would draw up a few different scenarios for routing the cables before the installer arrives and go through what you want with him before he starts work.

Monkfish
02-12-2004, 16:45
Thanks guys that's a start anyway.

So it looks like I will have two cables (I'm only having phone and broadband ATM) from the pavement up my drive into my garage. The box will be fitted in the garage, and then two cables from there up my internal conduit to my study. From there I have access to the necessary cabling throughout the house (i.e. twin core for phone and coax for Internet).

There's bound to be a problem somewhere. ;)

Thanks again. :)

paulyoung666
02-12-2004, 16:53
isnt the cable a 2 in 1 affair , a large one for internet / tv and a thinner one moulded onto it for the telephone , well it is around here anyway :D :D

i assume from your previous post that you are intending to have your modem installed in your study ????????? :)

Monkfish
03-12-2004, 12:32
>you are intending to have your modem installed in your study?

Yes, that's correct.

Despite NTL's website checking availability and allowing me to sign up for a phone line, there is now some doubt whether my street is actually wired for a phone connection. :(

As I was typing this, I decided to double-check... and guess what? I can't even get broadband!! So how can NTL's website allow me to sign up to these services? It says it checks for availability! What sort of screwed up company is this! It's a bloody good job the conduit only cost me £20 and I hadn't started installing it yet.

I wrongly assumed that because I live in a metropolitan area and the council (and Mrs T) allowed our newly laid pavement to be dug up for this damn cable, that it would at least supply all the services! So no Telewest and only NTL TV! Looks like I'm stuck with BT and their 1GB limit and expensive setup!

I'm not a happy bunny. This newbie has now decided to stick with his old dial-up connection and Blair can stuff his Broadband Britain!

SMHarman
03-12-2004, 14:48
isnt the cable a 2 in 1 affair , a large one for internet / tv and a thinner one moulded onto it for the telephone , well it is around here anyway :D :D
It is Siamese coax as they call it, so it is one cable to pull through the pipe, but it has multiple cores, copper cables in / around it.

SMHarman
03-12-2004, 14:49
As I was typing this, I decided to double-check... and guess what? I can't even get broadband!! So how can NTL's website allow me to sign up to these services? It says it checks for availability! What sort of screwed up company is this! It's a bloody good job the conduit only cost me £20 and I hadn't started installing it yet.

I wrongly assumed that because I live in a metropolitan area and the council (and Mrs T) allowed our newly laid pavement to be dug up for this damn cable, that it would at least supply all the services! So no Telewest and only NTL TV! Looks like I'm stuck with BT and their 1GB limit and expensive setup!

I'm not a happy bunny. This newbie has now decided to stick with his old dial-up connection and Blair can stuff his Broadband Britain!
Whats the first few letters of your postcode? SW18?

paulyoung666
03-12-2004, 16:49
>you are intending to have your modem installed in your study?

Yes, that's correct.

Despite NTL's website checking availability and allowing me to sign up for a phone line, there is now some doubt whether my street is actually wired for a phone connection. :(

As I was typing this, I decided to double-check... and guess what? I can't even get broadband!! So how can NTL's website allow me to sign up to these services? It says it checks for availability! What sort of screwed up company is this! It's a bloody good job the conduit only cost me £20 and I hadn't started installing it yet.

I wrongly assumed that because I live in a metropolitan area and the council (and Mrs T) allowed our newly laid pavement to be dug up for this damn cable, that it would at least supply all the services! So no Telewest and only NTL TV! Looks like I'm stuck with BT and their 1GB limit and expensive setup!

I'm not a happy bunny. This newbie has now decided to stick with his old dial-up connection and Blair can stuff his Broadband Britain!



are you on analogue tv or is it digital ???????? :)

bob_builder
03-12-2004, 17:50
are you on analogue tv or is it digital ???????? :)
I think Monkfish said he did not currently have any NTL services and was not getting TV installed (just phone and broadband) but that the only service available to him is NTL TV!

paulyoung666
03-12-2004, 19:22
I think Monkfish said he did not currently have any NTL services and was not getting TV installed (just phone and broadband) but that the only service available to him is NTL TV!


its ok , i am confused as well now :D :D :D


maybe a bit of clarification might be in order ;)

Monkfish
04-12-2004, 13:09
Yes that's right Bob. I'm not interested in digital TV, but just thought it was time to change to broadband and as the NTL phone line was a quid cheaper per month than BT and we're low users and could transfer our BT number across that we might as well have that too.

I can't believe they dug up our pavement and didn't install all the facilities. That sounds like some type of cheap scam to me! BT offered to wire up the country at their own expense back in the 80s. But no! Mrs T had to tender it out to a multitude of foreign companies. And this is what we end up with!

Sorry about the moan, but I had just assumed that it was people who lived next to cows that had trouble getting broadband, not town dwellers who'd already had their pavements dug up.

And I found this fact out myself by ringing up and asking direct questions. If I hadn't, when was NTL going to reveal this little gem of information to me? When the engineer turned up I guess. "Oh, I'm sorry mate, but you can't have phone or broadband from this point".

This also begs the question whether they can still actually include these additional connections without digging up the street again. If they were at all competent (which I'm starting to doubt) then they should have a facility to pull through the necessary wires.

If this is the case, then how many people in our street have to "express a preference" for NTL before they undertake this work?

And to answer SMHarman: my postcode is RM7 7BX, which is Romford East London. Not precisely metropolitan, but it is still a London borough.

BTW, thanks again for everyone's input :)

paulyoung666
04-12-2004, 13:16
it may be worth finding out how many ppl would be interested in digital and if the service exists at the end of your road then you may stand a chance :)

bob_builder
06-12-2004, 13:12
I can't believe they dug up our pavement and didn't install all the facilities. That sounds like some type of cheap scam to me! BT offered to wire up the country at their own expense back in the 80s. But no! Mrs T had to tender it out to a multitude of foreign companies. And this is what we end up with!

This also begs the question whether they can still actually include these additional connections without digging up the street again. If they were at all competent (which I'm starting to doubt) then they should have a facility to pull through the necessary wires.
I believe that the cables are not the problem but the equipment used to feed the cables. So it should not be necessary to dig up the street to lay new cables but just update the equipment.

bob_builder
06-12-2004, 13:14
And to answer SMHarman: my postcode is RM7 7BX, which is Romford East London. Not precisely metropolitan, but it is still a London borough.
AFAIK, London is one of the worst places in the country for availability of digital cable services!

Monkfish
06-12-2004, 13:34
I think I might badger NTL some more to see what it will take to get our street upgraded.

SMHarman
06-12-2004, 14:05
I believe that the cables are not the problem but the equipment used to feed the cables. So it should not be necessary to dig up the street to lay new cables but just update the equipment.
Many of the London Videotron cabled areas were poorly cabled and do require recabling though. Wandsworth is one example, Romford may be another.

Monkfish
06-12-2004, 21:48
Makes sense. They probably assumed that Essex boys & gals only watch TV and never go near a computer. ;)

Halcyon
07-12-2004, 12:27
I have my brown box in the garage.
Means its hidden away and better protected too.

Monkfish
07-12-2004, 19:47
Good to know. Shame there won't be a cable connected to it. ;)

Halcyon
10-12-2004, 12:01
Oh I chopped the cable off and connect directly to the green box through Giga-Wifi ;-)

Monkfish
10-12-2004, 17:12
Sorry, I was alluding to the fact that my box won't have a cable connected to it, because NTL haven't wired my street for anything other than Digital TV. :)

paulyoung666
10-12-2004, 17:36
Oh I chopped the cable off and connect directly to the green box through Giga-Wifi ;-)


:disturbd: :disturbd: :disturbd: , you are kiding arent you :erm: :D :D :D

ian@huth
10-12-2004, 18:21
Sorry, I was alluding to the fact that my box won't have a cable connected to it, because NTL haven't wired my street for anything other than Digital TV. :)

Seems strange that there is only DTV and not phone lines. I would have thought that if you can get DTV you should also be able to get BB as they both use the same cable (wire).

paulyoung666
10-12-2004, 18:46
Seems strange that there is only DTV and not phone lines. I would have thought that if you can get DTV you should also be able to get BB as they both use the same cable (wire).


seems rather strange to me also :confused: :confused:

Monkfish
10-12-2004, 20:12
You know I thought that. The first two NTL bods I spoke to didn't mention any service restrictions; the third said I couldn't get the phone, and only the forth said I couldn't get broadband either. Maybe another ring is in order...

{time passes}

Well I just gave them another ring and the guy on the phone said, yes, no problem, all services are available.

This company does not instil me with confidence! :rolleyes:

slowcoach
10-12-2004, 23:28
At least it is all systems go now........... Or is it? :tu: :td:

Monkfish
11-12-2004, 11:44
They are going to ring me back to confirm the facts from their central database. :rolleyes:

SMHarman
11-12-2004, 13:59
Hmm, wouldn't trust that. Their central database said my postcode was not in a service area, some guy from the database team came out and then I could have DTV, BB and Telco and a bill of about £1000 a year. The potential loss of revenue for not knowing this should really encourage them to sort this out.

poolking
11-12-2004, 14:44
Your best bet would be to get an engineer to physically check what services are available in your street.

I would have thought both services would be pulled through at the same time, not just one?

Monkfish
13-12-2004, 17:49
I'm going to go for it. I installed the conduit in my garage today. I'll sign up, get the engineer out and then see what's what. If it's no go, then no big deal, I'll just invoice them for my work. ;)

Monkfish
14-12-2004, 17:38
The deed is done. Not too happy that I've got to wait 4 weeks for installation.

poolking
14-12-2004, 17:52
The deed is done. Not too happy that I've got to wait 4 weeks for installation.
So they finally confirmed that you are cabled for phone and BB. What a farce like Keystone Cops. :D

quadplay
14-12-2004, 17:52
To be fair, 4 weeks isn't disasterous considering it's Christmas. Some areas are better than others, but my parents in the CB11 (non-cabled) area nearly had to wait from 10th December to 20th January for a Sky+ installation! Luckily, there was a cancellation, and we've now got an install booked on Christmas Eve - you might be able to squeeze in a cancellation too with ntl.

paulyoung666
14-12-2004, 17:55
To be fair, 4 weeks isn't disasterous considering it's Christmas. Some areas are better than others, but my parents in the CB11 (non-cabled) area nearly had to wait from 10th December to 20th January for a Sky+ installation! Luckily, there was a cancellation, and we've now got an install booked on Christmas Eve - you might be able to squeeze in a cancellation too with ntl.


good point , if you can make yourself available at short notice , it might be worth ringing them up and asking them :tu:

Monkfish
14-12-2004, 21:59
To answer Poolking: no only broadband. I didn't want to push my luck with the phone. I'll wait for the engineer to turn up and see what he finds.

Yes, it makes sense to give them a ring and tell them I'm available anytime. All I need now is a decent and cheap NIC. Any suggestions?

poolking
14-12-2004, 22:07
Still strange why they would only pull coax through and not the phone at the same time.

Monkfish
15-12-2004, 11:30
Our cable was laid years ago in the first wave of Digital TV nonsense. This was before telephone deregulation I believe. I think SMHarman was close to the button when he said:



"Many of the London Videotron cabled areas were poorly cabled and do require recabling though. Wandsworth is one example, Romford may be another."



This might be the case.:dig:

quadplay
15-12-2004, 12:34
As I understand it, Romford and the surroundings (Harold Hill, Harold Wood, etc.) were done by Encom, and are actually relatively good as far as cable quality goes in that area. Some of my relatives live around there, and they've got no complaints about the service they've had from Encom/Videotron/Cable & Wireless/ntl... They just wish they'd settle on a name! ;)

Monkfish
16-12-2004, 15:28
Thanks Jimbo, that makes me feel a little better. :)