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ZrByte
30-10-2004, 21:52
well my new car continues to suprise me. I was driving out of work today when I hear this very loud squealing sound coming from the front of the car, ive heard it before when it was cold but this was louder (I suppose it could be cold related since it is colder today compared to last time).
It seemed to get to its loudest just after pulling away, not really while accelerating or breaking. It has no effect on the car at all except the fact that it annoys the crap outta me.
Im trying to think of a way to describe the sound and the best I can come up with is screaching, or squaling.
Basicly I was just wondering if anybody had any ideas what it might be?
Its a vauxhall corsa (b) merit 93 if thats relivant.

Chris W
30-10-2004, 21:53
Fan belt?

ZrByte
30-10-2004, 21:58
Fan belt?

Ahhh, you might be onto something there, I remember when my aunties needed a new fan belt and it sounded similar to mine (this was a few years ago mind you). guess I should have that looked at then.
Does anybody know if I check that myself?

Xaccers
30-10-2004, 22:03
Do cars still have fan belts these days? Don't fans all use electric motors or is that just bigger cars?
Most likely your alternator belt if it sounds like a live hampster being squashed

Chris W
30-10-2004, 22:05
my 90 metro had a fan belt but then i don't know too much about cars... hence why i have just spent £260 on trying to get it fixed and failing... :( :mad:

ZrByte
30-10-2004, 22:05
Do cars still have fan belts these days? Don't fans all use electric motors or is that just bigger cars?
Most likely your alternator belt if it sounds like a live hampster being squashed

I done a quick google and the alternator belt keeps coming up with no mention of fanbelts, so that is looking more likeley. And yes it does sound like a live hampster being squashed actually :) that summed it up pretty well. is there anyway I can check to see if it is that or is it time to see a mechanic?

Chris W
30-10-2004, 22:10
I done a quick google and the alternator belt keeps coming up with no mention of fanbelts, so that is looking more likeley. And yes it does sound like a live hampster being squashed actually :) that summed it up pretty well. is there anyway I can check to see if it is that or is it time to see a mechanic?

have you got a haynes manual? or could you pop into halfords and have a read of one :disturbd:

Maggy
30-10-2004, 22:12
Just turn the radio up louder. :angel:



Incog.

ZrByte
30-10-2004, 22:14
Just turn the radio up louder. :angel:



Incog.

Thats not working either :p: though I am getting a nice CD player cheap off a friend so that'll do. The noise seems much louder outside the car though as I noticed today, methinks turning up the radio might not be enough in this case.

have you got a haynes manual? or could you pop into halfords and have a read of one :disturbd:

My dad might have one for his, I didnt think of that, I'll ask him when he gets back.

iadom
30-10-2004, 22:18
Does the car have power steering, it could be the PS belt or the alternator belt.

Sprinkle some talcuum (sp) powder on them overnight and see if that reduces the noise the following day.

swoop101
30-10-2004, 22:19
It sounds like your ancillary belt (formerly fan belt) is either on it's way out or needs tightening.
As you don't know much about it yourself, just take it to a service center for them to check for you. If you leave it you will find yourself having further problems in a little while.

edit: in answer to the above post, squirt some WD40 on it to shut it up.

MovedGoalPosts
30-10-2004, 22:23
Once upon a time we called it a fan belt as the belt connected between a pulley on the engine, providing the source of the belt moving, and then wound round the alternator and the radiator cooling fan at the same time. Most modern cars, both in the name of efficiency, and to make the engineering easier with engines now orientated sideways rather than front to back (more passenger space in same car length), have an electric fan to cool the radiator, which is used only when cooling is needed, so keeping the engine at a more constant temperature. Thus today's cars frequently cannot have a fan belt, as it does not connect a fan, all it connects is the engine and alternator. Note if you had no alternator (which usually mounts alongside the engine) the battery wouldn't get recharged.

If the belt is a little bit slack, or worn, then the squealing sound, will occur. tightening it is relatively simple, The alternator usually has one point secured with a bolt through a slightly curved slot, Loosen the bolt, rotate the alternator slightly so the belt has more tension, and retighten. Replacing the belt can be done the same way.

For a garage mechanic, it's a five minute job, so don't let them claim otherwise.

swoop101
30-10-2004, 22:26
I have just replaced the belt on my car today.
It is about 2.5m long and runs the alternator, water pump, power steering and air conditioning. :shocked:

MovedGoalPosts
30-10-2004, 22:29
I have just replaced the belt on my car today.
It is about 2.5m long and runs the alternator, water pump, power steering and air conditioning. :shocked:

That's what you get for having a posh car with lots of toys.

swoop101
30-10-2004, 22:34
That's what you get for having a posh car with lots of toys.

:p: :p: :p: :p:

Russ
30-10-2004, 22:36
Just turn the radio up louder. :angel:

I know a girl who once had an MG Metro Turbo and when the engine started to smoke she'd just light up a cigarette to mask it all :D

homealone
30-10-2004, 22:39
<snip>
edit: in answer to the above post, squirt some WD40 on it to shut it up.

nooooooo - a belt is used to 'take off' a source of rotational energy, if it is squealing then it is slipping, which is bad.

- lubricating a slipping belt will help it sound less stressed, but won't help it turn the thing it is supposed to turning - which is also bad. :)

swoop101
30-10-2004, 22:43
nooooooo - a belt is used to 'take off' a source of rotational energy, if it is squealing then it is slipping, which is bad.

- lubricating a slipping belt will help it sound less stressed, but won't help it turn the thing it is supposed to turning - which is also bad. :)


Don't panic, it just shuts it up for a short while to let you know what it is that is making the noise. WD40 does not have the lubricating power to make the belt slip, the profesionals do this on a regular basis so that they can listen to an engine properly.

Xaccers
30-10-2004, 22:53
I done a quick google and the alternator belt keeps coming up with no mention of fanbelts, so that is looking more likeley. And yes it does sound like a live hampster being squashed actually :) that summed it up pretty well. is there anyway I can check to see if it is that or is it time to see a mechanic?


Best to get a haynes manual, if you don't want to buy one, your local library may have one (avoid the one on child birth, or in car nookie)

Basically your alternator will probably be on a bracket, you can loosen the nut and bolt that hold's it to the engine, pull the alternator to tighten it against the belt and then tighten the nut and bolt to hold it in place.
Course I'm not a mechanic so don't blame me if things go horribly wrong :D
Check your service intervals too, maybe it's time for your cambelt to be changed, or maybe it's gonna be soon, if so, get that done at a garage and get them to check all your belts.

MovedGoalPosts
30-10-2004, 23:15
Basically your alternator will probably be on a bracket, you can loosen the nut and bolt that hold's it to the engine, pull the alternator to tighten it against the belt and then tighten the nut and bolt to hold it in place.

er didn't I just say that 2nd paragraph: http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/showpost.php?p=329481&postcount=12 ;)

Xaccers
30-10-2004, 23:25
er didn't I just say that 2nd paragraph: http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/showpost.php?p=329481&postcount=12 ;)

I know that now, but between starting my reply and posting I was waylayed by the security guard wanting to see my israel pics :D

MovedGoalPosts
30-10-2004, 23:41
I know that now, but between starting my reply and posting I was waylayed by the security guard wanting to see my israel pics :D

Some people's timing is just so inconsiderate :dozey:

SMHarman
31-10-2004, 01:25
have you got a haynes manual? or could you pop into halfords and have a read of one :disturbd:
They shrink wrap them these days. The local library has them.

ZrByte
31-10-2004, 02:17
Thanks a lot everybody, gonna go the library next time they are open, monday now methinks. Really can't afford to have someone do it for me so ill have a look myself.
My car sounds like chitty chitty bang bang at the moment though. We replaced the exhaust the other day and the braces that hold it on at the back near the bumper where too tight so that vibrates against the bumper every now and again, also either the bonnet catch or hinge is loose so that rattles and now ive got the alternator belt to add to the list :)

Xaccers: Ive only just got the car and have no service history so I have no idea when it is due for its cambelt change, the car has clocked a high mileage though and if it was done on a regular basis, based on its current mileage its due in about 8,000 miles. If I remember correctly on the corsa its supposed to be either every 40,000 miles or 3 years, wichever comes first.

basa
31-10-2004, 09:47
It is certainly NOT the cambelt squealing !! If that slips (it's toothed btw) you would know as there would be a big bang (as the pistons hit the valves !!) and the engine would stop instantly !!

The noise is almost certainly your alternator drive belt. Some older cars used to squeal if the distributor points cam got dry - but most modern cars use electronic ignition with no contactor points.

You have to slightly slacken the two alternator mounting bolts (slacken these only about half a turn - enough so the alternator can actually rotate slighly not loose so you can turn them by hand) and then loosen the bolt in the elongated slot that allows the alternator to move forward to tighten the belt. I use a large screwdriver to lever the alternator body against the belt tension and hold it tight whilst retightening the adjuster bolt. You can then re tightnen the mounting bolts.

Nidge
31-10-2004, 10:40
I know a girl who once had an MG Metro Turbo and when the engine started to smoke she'd just light up a cigarette to mask it all :D


You know my wife to then Russ :Yikes: :Yikes: :Yikes: :Yikes:

paulyoung666
31-10-2004, 10:46
It is certainly NOT the cambelt squealing !! If that slips (it's toothed btw) you would know as there would be a big bang (as the pistons hit the valves !!) and the engine would stop instantly !!

The noise is almost certainly your alternator drive belt. Some older cars used to squeal if the distributor points cam got dry - but most modern cars use electronic ignition with no contactor points.

You have to slightly slacken the two alternator mounting bolts (slacken these only about half a turn - enough so the alternator can actually rotate slighly not loose so you can turn them by hand) and then loosen the bolt in the elongated slot that allows the alternator to move forward to tighten the belt. I use a large screwdriver to lever the alternator body against the belt tension and hold it tight whilst retightening the adjuster bolt. You can then re tightnen the mounting bolts.


not necessarily a big bang , some engines dont lunch themselves when the belt goes , why they all dont is beyond me :disturbd:

iadom
31-10-2004, 10:56
I thought that some Corsa's had a chain driven cam, what engine does yours have?



http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/index.php?url=/carbycar/index.htm

What's Good

Ageing design but still a different and practical shape for a supermini. 12' 3" long by 5' 3" wide. Weighs from 835kg to 960kg. Plenty of room in the back of the 5-door version. Doesn't make demands on the driver. Good engines, especially the ultra-economical chain-cam 57bhp Suzuki 1.0 litre 3-cylinder 12-valve, often badged 'Breeze'. 74bhp 1.2 16v engine is also chain-cam. 49bhp and 66bhp 1.5 litre Isuzu diesels and 59bhp 1.6 litre GM diesel. Most powerful was 107bhp 1.6 16v GSI. Generally reliable, last well and cheap to run. Vauxhalls generally had below average warranty repair costs in 2003 Warranty Direct Reliability index (index 84.4 v/s lowest 31.93). Link:- www.reliabilityindex.co.uk (http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/redirect.php?http://www.reliabilityindex.co.uk/default.html?apc=311) Petrol and diesel models 1995-2000 had average breakdowns, problems and faults in 2003 Which survey.


What's Bad

Still based on the Nova floorpan, so stodgy and characterless to drive. 1.4s have suffered cat problems. Awarded Two-Star NCAP crash safety rating in 1997. Short runs may lead to sticking valves on 16-valve models (usually cured by switching to a high detergent petrol). See 'Recalls' about timing belt pulleys which need renewing at least every 40,000 miles. On 1.4 16v timing belt also drives the water pump, so if this fails it will lead to timing belt failure. Most likely reason for the water pump to fail is lack of water (coolant) so check this regularly. Also on 16v engines EGR valve can gum up leading to hesitation while cruising. Reports of repeated failures of heater matrixes. Central locking can fail due to failure of a small, brittle, badly designed casting (part 90540614). Costs less than £6, but £50 + VAT to get it fitted. Quite common for front section of exhaust of 1.0 12v to fail due to metal fatigue from vibration.
What to Watch Out For

Could have been a courier's car or a driving school car ('Engineering Education Trust' on the V5 = BSM). Clutch cables can be troublesome (cheap to replace). Heavier diesel engines promote high front tyre and suspension wear. All Corsas prone to front suspension wear. Check driveshafts for clonks by reverse turns in both directions. Cracking around door hinges on 'A' pillars of 2-door models (also look for cracks in the paint on 'B' pillars - an MOT failure point). Feel front discs for grooves, 'shouldering' and wear. Beware of any noises from the water pump (see 'What's Bad'). Check front carpets for damp signifying failed heater matrix.
Recalls

1995: static sparking during refuelling. 1997 (1993-1996 1.4 & 1.6 16vs only - 27,000 cars): Possibility of plastic cambelt idler pulley breaking which can snap cambelt. 1998 (diesel K to N reg: 26,000 cars): live cable may rub against bonnet hinge, lose insulation and cause a fire; (1.0 12v, P to R reg: 8,000 cars): cable may touch engine inlet manifold. (Vauxhall Recall Helpline: 01582 427200) 1998: Vauxhall Corsa diesel (K to N reg: 26,000 cars): live cable may rub against bonnet hinge, lose insulation and cause a fire. (3/6/98.) Vauxhall Corsa 1.0 12v (P to R reg: 8,000 cars): cable may touch engine inlet manifold. (3/6/98: Specific Helpline: 01189 458500.)February 2000: Saftety recall to reinforce front seat rails and replace fatigued or worn front seatbelt buckles. 9/3/2001 500,000 cars recalled to fit re-inforcing plates to front seat runners to prevent rails from fracturing. 9/3/2001 also recalled again to replace seat belt buckles with quality assured buckles.

ZrByte
03-11-2004, 02:19
I thought that some Corsa's had a chain driven cam, what engine does yours have?



http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/index.php?url=/carbycar/index.htm

What's Good

Ageing design but still a different and practical shape for a supermini. 12' 3" long by 5' 3" wide. Weighs from 835kg to 960kg. Plenty of room in the back of the 5-door version. Doesn't make demands on the driver. Good engines, especially the ultra-economical chain-cam 57bhp Suzuki 1.0 litre 3-cylinder 12-valve, often badged 'Breeze'. 74bhp 1.2 16v engine is also chain-cam. 49bhp and 66bhp 1.5 litre Isuzu diesels and 59bhp 1.6 litre GM diesel. Most powerful was 107bhp 1.6 16v GSI. Generally reliable, last well and cheap to run. Vauxhalls generally had below average warranty repair costs in 2003 Warranty Direct Reliability index (index 84.4 v/s lowest 31.93). Link:- www.reliabilityindex.co.uk (http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/redirect.php?http://www.reliabilityindex.co.uk/default.html?apc=311) Petrol and diesel models 1995-2000 had average breakdowns, problems and faults in 2003 Which survey.


What's Bad

Still based on the Nova floorpan, so stodgy and characterless to drive. 1.4s have suffered cat problems. Awarded Two-Star NCAP crash safety rating in 1997. Short runs may lead to sticking valves on 16-valve models (usually cured by switching to a high detergent petrol). See 'Recalls' about timing belt pulleys which need renewing at least every 40,000 miles. On 1.4 16v timing belt also drives the water pump, so if this fails it will lead to timing belt failure. Most likely reason for the water pump to fail is lack of water (coolant) so check this regularly. Also on 16v engines EGR valve can gum up leading to hesitation while cruising. Reports of repeated failures of heater matrixes. Central locking can fail due to failure of a small, brittle, badly designed casting (part 90540614). Costs less than £6, but £50 + VAT to get it fitted. Quite common for front section of exhaust of 1.0 12v to fail due to metal fatigue from vibration.
What to Watch Out For

Could have been a courier's car or a driving school car ('Engineering Education Trust' on the V5 = BSM). Clutch cables can be troublesome (cheap to replace). Heavier diesel engines promote high front tyre and suspension wear. All Corsas prone to front suspension wear. Check driveshafts for clonks by reverse turns in both directions. Cracking around door hinges on 'A' pillars of 2-door models (also look for cracks in the paint on 'B' pillars - an MOT failure point). Feel front discs for grooves, 'shouldering' and wear. Beware of any noises from the water pump (see 'What's Bad'). Check front carpets for damp signifying failed heater matrix.
Recalls

1995: static sparking during refuelling. 1997 (1993-1996 1.4 & 1.6 16vs only - 27,000 cars): Possibility of plastic cambelt idler pulley breaking which can snap cambelt. 1998 (diesel K to N reg: 26,000 cars): live cable may rub against bonnet hinge, lose insulation and cause a fire; (1.0 12v, P to R reg: 8,000 cars): cable may touch engine inlet manifold. (Vauxhall Recall Helpline: 01582 427200) 1998: Vauxhall Corsa diesel (K to N reg: 26,000 cars): live cable may rub against bonnet hinge, lose insulation and cause a fire. (3/6/98.) Vauxhall Corsa 1.0 12v (P to R reg: 8,000 cars): cable may touch engine inlet manifold. (3/6/98: Specific Helpline: 01189 458500.)February 2000: Saftety recall to reinforce front seat rails and replace fatigued or worn front seatbelt buckles. 9/3/2001 500,000 cars recalled to fit re-inforcing plates to front seat runners to prevent rails from fracturing. 9/3/2001 also recalled again to replace seat belt buckles with quality assured buckles.


Mine doesnt seem to be mentioned :) 1.2 8v, im getting a haynes manual tomorrow so may be able to tell a bit more about mine based on the engine number.


Small update - The Alternator belt is fine, infact it looks like the previous owner had the same idea since it looks like it was replaced not so long ago. Its actually the alternator itself that needs replacing.
This is what ive been told, bearing in mind im repeating things I dont 100% understand so I might not get this quite right. ive been told one or more of the bearings in my alternator have gone and it is resisting against the alternator belt, this is fine for light use on the alternator (Radio on during daylight, or lights with heater on low) but as soon as the load on the alternator increases and it starts spinning faster it starts pulling on the belt and making it slip. This has the same basic symptoms as a worn alternator belt but tightening/replacing the belt will have no effect.

Ive got a busy week ahead of me from the looks of things, I'll be working full-time at work (im only normally a lowly part-timer).
I need to take off the bit my wipers attatch onto on the front of my car (scuttle?) to get access to the bonnet hinge to stop it rattling.
I need to jack up my car to replace the braces on my current exhaust to stop it vibrating.
Installing a CD player, and fixing my alternator. :D
And thats not even including the various decorating jobs I will helping with at my sisters new house :)

Thanks again for all your help everybody, should have it fixed in the next week or so.

basa
03-11-2004, 09:28
not necessarily a big bang , some engines dont lunch themselves when the belt goes , why they all dont is beyond me :disturbd:

You are quite right Paul. A very few engines have enough clearance between the piston crown at t.d.c. and the valve at full extension. Therefore no collision. The engine will still stop though ! However in most engines if the valve stops at full push down after the cam belt has broken the piston crown will collide with it on its way up to t.d.c. - bang !!

Fortunately for me the old Ford Escort engines was one which avoided this self destruct attitude. !! :shocked:

zoombini
03-11-2004, 09:31
Sounds like a trip to the car breakers yard is called for.

pop80_uk
03-11-2004, 10:28
Alternator bearings, but you have already said this! :)

Just get a new alternator, not hard to fit, one adjusting bolt and a long fixing bolt to remove, work from the bottom of the car upwards. Easy enough job Id say 1hr for a novice mechanic. Replace the belt as well when your at it. They are only £4 - 6 and you then know its been done.

PS You can tell when a belt is going as it begins to fray around the edges and the teeth begine to crack (rubber fatigue) If you push on the top of any belt you should be able to push a finger nails tip length down. This shows it is the correct tension.

Any help you need PM me.

gary_580
03-11-2004, 11:07
I done a quick google and the alternator belt keeps coming up with no mention of fanbelts, so that is looking more likeley. And yes it does sound like a live hampster being squashed actually :) that summed it up pretty well. is there anyway I can check to see if it is that or is it time to see a mechanic?

Fan belts used to go around the Crankshaft pulley, Fan pulley and the alternator pulley. In more modern cars the fan is electric and as a result the belt only goes around the alternator and the cranckshaft pulley, hence why its now called an alternator belt.

Typically at this time of year the pulleys get damp and you have your heater blower on and lights on resulting in increased load on the alternator which causes the belt to slip.

Either replace it or tighten it up

gary_580
03-11-2004, 11:11
if you have a Partco motorfactor in your town go there for you belt and possibly alternator, they will be much cheaper than Halfords

ZrByte
03-11-2004, 21:19
if you have a Partco motorfactor in your town go there for you belt and possibly alternator, they will be much cheaper than Halfords

We do, I allready went there for my exhaust the other week, as soon as Ive got some money I think I'll be going there to get this alternator sorted, though we do have an alternator specialist nearby so I might try them first.

Ramrod
03-11-2004, 21:58
Fan belt?Thats the one! :tu: :)

Tricky
03-11-2004, 22:25
Call in at a local garage say the belt is slipping and they'll usually tighten it up for free (takes 5 mins top) which will stop the squeak, they may say the belt has started to fray which is why it has started to slip and that'll cost you £20 max. If you suddenly get a couple of red lights (battery especially) this means the belt has come off all together and it's a good idea to stop cos it will normally mean your water pump is not working and this make your Corsa a little warm (no that's not how to get a hot hatch).

ZrByte
03-11-2004, 22:32
Call in at a local garage say the belt is slipping and they'll usually tighten it up for free (takes 5 mins top) which will stop the squeak, they may say the belt has started to fray which is why it has started to slip and that'll cost you £20 max. If you suddenly get a couple of red lights (battery especially) this means the belt has come off all together and it's a good idea to stop cos it will normally mean your water pump is not working and this make your Corsa a little warm (no that's not how to get a hot hatch).

The belt is perfect condition and is as tight as it will go. Its the alternator itself wich is causing the problem since it is resisting the belts pull and making it slip :)

gary_580
03-11-2004, 22:36
The belt is perfect condition and is as tight as it will go. Its the alternator itself wich is causing the problem since it is resisting the belts pull and making it slip :)

belt might have stretched

also if your going to an alternator specialist they will prolly change the bearings quite cheaply. Worth asking. Theres nothing else in an alternator really that can make a noise.

Have you tried taking the belt off and spinnig the alternator by hand ?

tkiely
03-11-2004, 22:44
interested to see about the exhaust breaking in the recall bit, today i got an mot on my car and saw a corsa 1.0 having its exhaust MIG welded up. The mechanic said they fail all the time, its a £50 fix which will last three years if lucky! value or what?

to get to the point, sounds like a fanbelt prob to me