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TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?
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Old 14-01-2011, 18:12   #376
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Re: TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?

Further problems caused by the TT bot (among others) with a forum login system.
http://www.simplemachines.org/commun...topic=416928.0
Some of the IPs noted there are those used by the TT bot. It appears the poster is not actually aware of the TT scanner bot so this is fairly unbiased evidence from someone with no axe to grind and no connection with any campaigns.

It looks like they too are seeing people being logged out because of the bot visits, and the IP's listed for the problem bots, include those used by the TT bot.
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Old 14-01-2011, 20:11   #377
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Re: TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?

Which of those IP addresses are those used by the TT bot, please, and are all the rest doing the same thing as TT (as some of them are Verizon, Telekom SA, and hosting houses such as Softlayer)?
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Old 14-01-2011, 20:44   #378
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Re: TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh View Post
Which of those IP addresses are those used by the TT bot, please, and are all the rest doing the same thing as TT (as some of them are Verizon, Telekom SA, and hosting houses such as Softlayer)?
the ones like

Quote:
deny from 62.24.181.134
deny from 62.24.181.135
those are the normal ones the stalker bot comes from, although other IP's have been observed earlier in the process
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Old 14-01-2011, 21:11   #379
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Re: TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?

Thank you, BC1 - are the other bots from other IP addresses causing the same issue?
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Old 14-01-2011, 22:40   #380
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Re: TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh View Post
Thank you, BC1 - are the other bots from other IP addresses causing the same issue?
As I have had absolutely no contact with these people, then the content on the link is all that any of us have to go on unless someone signs up to the forum to join the discussion. I felt the value of the link was that these people did NOT appear to know anything about any campaign or the significance of the identity of the bots.

But what is being reported (users being kicked off a forum) is remarkably similar to what was reported on Phoenix Broadband Advice Community forum - and from the dates on this other forum, it would seem to be STILL happening.

I have just now contacted the forum to ask for further details and tell them of the origin of the bots from those 62.24... IP addresses. So I might have answers to your questions in a few days.
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Old 14-01-2011, 23:02   #381
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Re: TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?

Thank you for this - if bots from other ISPs are causing the same issue on that site, I wonder if it is due to the same reason? (we need to be careful of the old "correlation does not imply causation" fallacy, do we not?).

On that note, I notice that the forum that is having issues distributes/uses the same forum software as Phoenix Broadband (which was having the log out issues) - SMF (Simple Machines Forum).
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Old 14-01-2011, 23:40   #382
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Re: TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh View Post
Thank you, BC1 - are the other bots from other IP addresses causing the same issue?
that is not 100% clear as the poster does not make it clear if all bots are causing the problem or just some,

but from the topic title it infers all are to me, but reading the topic in full it is not clear, i have posted a question over there asking for clarification

bc1

---------- Post added at 23:40 ---------- Previous post was at 23:18 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh View Post
Thank you for this - if bots from other ISPs are causing the same issue on that site, I wonder if it is due to the same reason? (we need to be careful of the old "correlation does not imply causation" fallacy, do we not?).

On that note, I notice that the forum that is having issues distributes/uses the same forum software as Phoenix Broadband (which was having the log out issues) - SMF (Simple Machines Forum).
i agree we need more information before making assumptions, so i have asked the question, we now wait and see the response

it could also be more than just talk talk are using the same kit and causing the same issues

there are many possible scenarios and explainations
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Old 16-01-2011, 21:15   #383
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Re: TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?

reply over on SMF forum
Quote:
Quote:
Quote from: bluecar1 on January 14, 2011, 05:48:10 PM

acams,

could you clarify which ip's are the main causes of the logging out issues?

is it all in your HTACCESS list or just some?

thanks

BC1

Most of the ones in the bottom half of my list, I got the top half from Dermot


Here is my list now
so the TT ip's are near the bottom of that list, so that means it is one of the ones causing the issue
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Old 16-01-2011, 22:20   #384
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Re: TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluecar1 View Post
reply over on SMF forum
so the TT ip's are near the bottom of that list, so that means it is one of the ones causing the issue
Or to put it another way, those are 2 out of over 180 addresses on the list that are related to an issue......
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Old 17-01-2011, 08:42   #385
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Re: TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh View Post
Or to put it another way, those are 2 out of over 180 addresses on the list that are related to an issue......
still interesting that the main / current IP addresses used for the TT bot (which as far as i am aware are not used for any other service) are causing the issue of logging people out of forums, the same as was seen on a few shopping sites very early in the trial (july'ish) which i believe led to several sites being whitelisted to avoid the issue (i think tesco's was one, can't find a link at the moment)
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Old 17-01-2011, 09:03   #386
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Re: TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?

erm, I think you need to revisit problem diagnosis 101....

a) there is a problem
b) when this problem occurs, what are the inputs and processes involved
c) are there any other factors that may be involved (level of software, additional mods to software, other linked software such as firewalls/anti-virus, etc, etc)
d) besides b) and c), what else could be involved in this problem (human input, environmental factors (systems power, cooling, etc)

The problem with going in to solve a problem with one's mindset predetermined towards a certain cause, is that if the thing you are certain of is not actually causing the problem, one spends a lot of time going down blind alleys and dead-ends. It is always, imho (but with my opinion informed by over 30 years of IT experience ), important to go into solving the problem with an open mind (bearing in mind that something may be the cause, but "may" being the operative word, especially in this case when there are examples of over 180 other IP addresses involved in this issue on the SM forum - which, again, btw, is the same software that is involved in issue on the Phoenix forum).

Now, I am willing to concede that the TT bots are part of the problem, but if they are, they are only part of a bigger problem (cf the other IP addresses).
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Old 17-01-2011, 10:58   #387
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Re: TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?

i agree they are not the only cause of the logging out issue, there was a discussion elsewhere that suggested some of the other IP's were TOR exit nodes and when the users exit node changed the webmaster saw a logged out error, but the user saw no error as the browser re-authenticated via cookies etc and provided seamless experience

the thing with the two TT ip's is they do nothing else web facing (according to info in the public domain) other than the stalker bot, so with that in mind it would appear that the stalker bot is having an effect on some websites which could be causing users issues,

at the moment the main ones are SM forums, but no doubt that is partly due to webmaters on those forums probably being more pro-actively looking at logs etc
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Old 17-01-2011, 15:31   #388
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Re: TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?

curious,

since the IP's have been highlighted on SMF the IP's seemed to have moved slightly

they are now on

62.24.222.132
62.24.222.131

could be a coincidence or not as a case may be, these have been seen before very early in the trial, may'ish time it seems
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Old 17-01-2011, 20:51   #389
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Re: TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?

and on 16th December 2010
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Old 06-02-2011, 08:01   #390
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Re: TalkTalk tracking you, phorm?

Another forum apparently experiencing problems with the TalkTalk "malware detection" system penetrating login/password barriers. (last post dated yesterday)
http://support.freeforums.org/viewto...&view=previous
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