Originally Posted by martyh
They get away with it because the cheats are the only ones who know the system well enough.Given the complexity of the benefits sytsem it's not surprising that there is this level of fraud commited with such ease .Problem is though when we finally get a government willing to address the problem by simplifying it to make it harder to defraud and discourage people from being so dependant on it ,people are up in arms as evidenced by certain posters on this forum
I dont think anybody against simplification and addressing issues dont understand why you think this. I assume I am one you further from the truth with me martyh. I think the bill needs rework in some areas on disabled. I not sure why room issue is been done. It should be flexible is there availabilty downsize, Size of the rooms box rooms are box rooms not bedrooms. 1 spare room should be allowed.
What I want is for the system to be modified so mistakes are minimised/elliminated from assesments. There should be safety net against collateral damage. Seems down to numbers appeals it will be dismatled its plainly wrong. ATOS should done there job more efficiently. That though could mean the assenment itself is weak open to loose interpretation russian roulette for those being assessed.
I agree there people out there who KNOW it inside out more knowledgable than the people who work there. I even will say this we wont get zero fraud its human nature what can be made some one can circumvent. Some are clever as lawyers maybe should take it up lol. It sounds this fraud was down to many factors.
Certainly not against stoping the frauds but questionable how many who lost disibilty are frauds there been some real horrors of errors. Its been going on for years I know someone under labour got removed but put back on it due to ATOS error. To prove they was disabled has since passed every assesment now thankfully on esa support. The place where he signed on only let him sign on once even accepted him doing cross while very ill else he would lost his benefit. Management agreed put him back on the IB as they clearly saw it was huge error. Would love to see this more often then again not suprising as they had to call ambulance he spent over week in hospital. The staff was fantastic to help him give him first aid which his family was grateful.
So yes I understand its hard to judge thats why better system should be in place.
I would go as far this we should have 2 support groups those who by what is medically wrong clearly wont recover wont need to be re-assessed by ATOS ever very servere disabled etc. Although nice visit ocasionally by Works and pension to make sure they alright getting all the help support they need.
The other is what they term might be able one day go into working group as illness might or might not be lifetime depending on advances in medical breakthroughs or simply even they get better. Visa versa if someone deterorates they can be removed from flagged assesment if its deemed lifetime illness. The system needs flexibilty those they deem disabled. The grey one is terminal I seen quite enough times doctors timeframes NOT absolute and guides. Feel its not right for those who will die to be shoved in wrag they clearly should be in support. Even if at times there quite healthy there many times it will be painful and treatment dibilitating. They got enough problems last thing they need is government kicking. I cant see this being a fraud situation just crazy decision. I dont care if its 2 years they should be allowed quality time with there loved ones.
The other is shared information talking to departments other organisations surely this would help eliminate those who try defraud.
Now if its more sensible without the mandate for saving money who could not disagree. Better system will hopefully stop these cases there should be system in place which flags early warnings of possible fraud.