Digital cameras

[idi banashapan]

Originally Posted by zing

My Dad uses them and there are few people more anal about reading reviews and researching s product than him lol

I personally like my bridging cameras but the next ones gonna be SLR

it's worth the jump. I used to own a Canon 400D, now have a 50D. I don;t think I can warrant a single digit EOS as it is only a hobby! but the difference between the bridge and the DSLR is quite something.

[Ramrod]

Originally Posted by TakeCare

I will check these out thanks. Price range up to about £150

Double it and go for this: http://www.jessops.com/online.store/...5837/Show.html

[Chris]

Not to hijack the thread (too much), my dad's looking for a new camera around the £150 price point, and the only precondition is that it has to have an old-fashioned viewfinder (because he's old fashioned like that). I've browsed through DPreview but there doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason as to why one camera has one and the next doesn't. I've seen plenty of expensive enthusiast compact cameras that still don't have a viewfinder and plenty of cheap-as-chips happy snappers that do.

Anyone got any recommendations?

[danielf]

Originally Posted by Chris

Not to hijack the thread (too much), my dad's looking for a new camera around the £150 price point, and the only precondition is that it has to have an old-fashioned viewfinder (because he's old fashioned like that).

Actually, one of the things I dislike about my Lumix is the fact that it doesn't have an old-fashioned viewfinder. The screen is rubbish is bright sunlight, and generally only gives you a vague idea of what you're capturing. I'd much rather have an old-fashioned viewfinder.

[Chris]

Well, he's in good company then ... So which one would you go for?

[danielf]

Originally Posted by Chris

Well, he's in good company then ... So which one would you go for?

I don't know. We have a lumix and an EOS. The EOS is nice, but a bit bulky and out of the price range.

[altis]

I'm sorry but I really have to question the desire for a camera with a lithium battery.

Here's my take:

Availability
The AA format must be the most common battery shape on the planet. Replacements can be found almost everywhere. Many new cameras come with new Li-ion batteries and, for a while, the manufacturer is the only source. Later, as the clone makers bring at compatibles, there are other sources but there are so many models that most retail outlets are unlikely to stock but a few.

Price
Since the AA format is a common standard, the battery manufacturers are forced to compete on price. Proprietary batteries are much more expensive.

Spares Management
Looking after spares for a variety of battery-powered devices is made much easier if they all use the same battery. In established products AAs are probably the most common.

New Developments
Engineers are always developing new battery chemistries with better characteristics. The capacity of proprietary Li-ions hardly, if ever, changes but newer, better AAs are available from time to time.

Flexibility
Many different chemistries are available in an AA package. This allows the user to tailor the battery to the environment eg: rechargeable around town but lithium primaries while away from the mains. If the battery compartment is carefully designed it is also possible to use a CR-V3 (or a rechargeable version) in place of two AAs. With a proprietary battery you are stuck with what the manufacturer provides.

Self-Discharge Rate
This is the Achilles heel of ordinary NiMh cells but now we have Eneloops (and cousins) that hold around 85% after a year. This works out at 1.3% per month. Various rates between 1% and 5% per month are quoted for Li-ions (with the highest rate being most common).

Energy Density
This is difficult to calculate accurately from datasheets. Really, we need the area under the discharge curve under the same conditions but this is difficult to evaluate without actually measuring it. Perhaps the easiest way is to compare cells of the same size but with different chemistries. Using the data from GP Batteries, their '2700' high-capacity NiMh cells typically hold around 3Wh (calculated from 1.15V * 2600mAh). Their 14500 Li-ion cells have a capacity of around 2.5Wh (calculated from 3.6V * 700mAh). For the CR-V3 (double AA) it's around 4.1Wh (2.5V * 3300mAh / 2). For Energizer's e2 lithiums it's 4.5Wh (1.5V * 3000mAh) and for Sanyo's Eneloops it's around 2.5Wh (1.25 * 2000mAh). The non-rechargables have the highest energy density but, of the rechargeable, the high-capacity NiMh is best.

Of course, lithium-based cells are very light so, by weight, they have a better energy density. Energizer's e2s weigh only 14.5g so the gravimetric density is 0.31WH/g. For the CR-V3 (38g / 2) it's 0.22Wh/g and for the 14500 (19g) it's 0.13 Wh/g. For the 2700 (31.5g) it's 0.095 Wh/g and for the Eneloop (27g) it's 0.093 Wh/g. Advantage lithium - but the non-rechargables are by far the best.

Discharge Rate
Lithium-based cells tend to be rated conservatively to stop them overheating. The maximum recommended discharge current of GP's 14500 is 700mA whereas the 2700 NiMh cell is rated for 7.5A. Being able to draw lots of current is useful in applications like flashguns where this helps to reduce the cycle time.

Charge Rate
Likewise, lithium-based cells are not comfortable with fast charging. The fastest chargers seem to take about 2 hours but NiMhs will tolerate being charged in 15 minutes. Sure, this will reduce their cycle life if done repeatedly but not if you only do this from time to time.

Lifetime
Lithium-based primary cells have a tremendous shelf life but can only be used once. Li-ion rechargeables are limited by time since manufacture. We used to get 2 years but newer models last 5-7 years. NiMh cells are limited by number of cycles. Sanyo quote up to 1000 cycles for their Eneloops - equal to once a week for 20 years.

Longevity
Proprietary lithiums come and go but AA batteries will be around for years to come. It's irritating to have a fully working device but for the want of a no-longer-available battery.

Safety
Batteries containing lithium have a tendency, albeit slight, to overheat and catch fire. There are many examples to be found on the web. A 48-pack of Energizer e2 lithium primaries that I recently purchased had a warning on the outside to say it was unauthorized for air transport. All spare lithium batteries now have to be carried in insulating containers on a plane. Alkaline and NiMh cells do not have such problems.

Originally Posted by Chris

Well, he's in good company then ... So which one would you go for?

the fuji bridging camera does I believe

it does and its a old camera shape ( which I prefer)

http://www.fujifilm.ca/x17495.xml

[Taf]

Not much to look at, but it should take pretty detailed photos...

[Hugh]

I assume the petabyte storage disk is in a backpack, for ease of carrying....

[SnoopZ]

I'd like to buy myself a good quality compact digital camera with a powerful optical zoom and would like some advice from people that know what they're talking about please.

I want a camera i can slide into my pocket and my max price point is £250

Do i need to spend £250 to get a really good camera?

I've been looking at this 1 but it's only 10megpix but has a really good zoom and great reviews.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Panasonic-Lu...7891114&sr=8-1

Thanks for any help.

[Delta Whiskey]

I like the TZ7, it had a good review when it came out last year. http://www.trustedreviews.com/digita...mix-DMC-TZ7/p1. You don't have to spend £250 for a good camera, but most of the cheaper ones are 3x-5x optical zoom. 10megapixel is fine for a compact camera, the sensor is tiny and more megapixels means smaller photosites and more digital noise.

[SnoopZ]

Originally Posted by Delta Whiskey

I like the TZ7, it had a good review when it came out last year. http://www.trustedreviews.com/digita...mix-DMC-TZ7/p1. You don't have to spend £250 for a good camera, but most of the cheaper ones are 3x-5x optical zoom. 10megapixel is fine for a compact camera, the sensor is tiny and more megapixels means smaller photosites and more digital noise.

Yes that's the review i saw, the camera is a bit bigger than i'd like really. I'm in no rush so i'll look around but i really fancy a powerful zoom.

[Delta Whiskey]

I have the Ricoh R10, which is 10megapixel and 7x optical zoom, you can get it for £129 from Clifton Cameras http://www.cliftoncameras.co.uk/Ricoh_R10_ (I paid £220 for mine last year). http://www.trustedreviews.com/digita...1/Ricoh-R10/p1

[philwhite100]

The Canon Powershot G10 is very good for the money. I think it is 14.1 Megapixel.
A compact camera with a lot of features from Canon's more expensive DSLR range.