Career change / distance learning

[Matt D]

Related to these posts here and here, and my last couple of blog entries, I thought I'd start a thread about career change & distance learning.


So.....

My salary is crap, I have been finding my job more & more boring, my boss more & more annoying, & I'm really getting quite fed-up.



I think I'm pretty computer literate, & I've thought for a while about maybe trying to get into IT somehow.

I don't expect it to be something that would happen particularly quickly or easily, but I would like to escape biology.



Earlier in the summer, I decided I'd like to try & start learning programming - hardly going to immediately guarantee getting me a new & wonderful job, but at least it would be an extra skill to develop.

After reading some mags, & looking online, I settled on C#. Also had a chat with a friend, who's got an MSc in Computer Science & has worked in IT since he graduated the year after me. He knows C++, C#, Java, & others, & he suggested C# to me before I even mentioned that was what I decided on.

So, I bought myself some books on C#, & have been working my way through when I have the time.


Now, to distance learning...

As well as trying to learn C# by myself, I've been thinking of maybe doing some sort of IT course, to help give me some more formal IT training & perhaps some sort of recognised certificate.

I've already ruled out Computeach, and other IT training companies I've looked at look fairly similar.


I've thought about maybe doing something with learndirect or the Open Uni, & have filled in the forms on both their sites requesting course info.


Anyone got any experience with either? Any courses you'd recommend?


learndirect do this ECDL thing - I've read that it's a bit basic, but is it still something worth having on your CV as a starter? What's it cost? Recommend anything else they do?

Open also do some sort of IT & Computing Certificate (comprised of 2x 30 point modules), which I guess you can later expand on with further modules to eventually take it to a Diploma or higher.



All advice, recommendations, & opinions welcome.

[Maggy J]

You just want to make sure that any qualification you get WILL be recognised by any future would be employer.That's as much as my knowledge as an educator goes.

Good luck anyway..I admire anyone who does pick themselves up and changes tack and career instead of ploughing the same old rut.

[punky]

In all honesty mate, if you found your industry bad (biomedicine lab techician wern't you?) tough, then IT is worse. Its one of the most oversubscriberd industries out there. I have friends from uni (graduated in 2002) who've still yet to find a decent job. Some of the ones that have aren't on brilliant money.

I don't know much about distance learning.... So I can't really help you there I am afriad. However, once you get a good grounding in IT with some base qualification, you might want to push for one of the advanced ones. Unfortunately they are expensive and involving. However, they'll give you a big edge over jobseekers without them. Qualifications such as MCSE & MCSD (Microsoft programming) or A+ (less programming, more systems) or CCNA (if you want to go into networks, which is one of the few good openings in IT atm)

[basa]

If I were looking for career change right now it certainly wouldn't be in IT. I've spoken to many, many IT techs and they all say work is in short supply and the salaries are crap !!

Whilst I dabble in PC repair part time it certainly doesn't earn a living pay check.

You obviously chose molecualr biology for a reason, there must have been some interest in it ? Why not investigate some offshoot of your present career and pursue further qualifications along a new path that has strong links with what you are doing at present.

Maybe these sites can give you some ideas:

http://www.jobs.ac.uk/categories/molecularbiology

http://www.bmbudhaka.net/car/career.htm (scroll to bottom of page - forensics and environment look the most interesting to me)

[Chrysalis]

Not surprised IT is over subscribed with all these computeach courses etc. Their is good paid IT jobs but they generally require years of experience which means you wont walk into one following a course more realisticly expect 14-17k if outside london.

[Matt D]

Cheers, all

Originally Posted by punky

In all honesty mate, if you found your industry bad (biomedicine lab techician wern't you?) tough, then IT is worse. Its one of the most oversubscriberd industries out there. I have friends from uni (graduated in 2002) who've still yet to find a decent job. Some of the ones that have aren't on brilliant money.

After uni, I spent over three & a half years as a "Research Technician" doing DNA Sequencing. I then shifted sideways (original position was made redundant) to a sister company as a "Production Scientist", making fluorescent labelled DNA probes for various genetic disorders, where I've been since October 2003.

Both jobs are exceedingly dull, although the current one is not quite as mind-numbing as the original one. I graduated over 7 years ago, & still earn under £20k. My girlfriend - who did A levels & an NVQ, and didn't go to uni - earns more than me, & my mates in IT all earn waaayyyy more than me. Biology sucks.


Although from what you say, IT can just be as bad as my current industry

Not always great pay, & hard to find a decent job even if you are qualified.

Originally Posted by punky

I don't know much about distance learning.... So I can't really help you there I am afriad. However, once you get a good grounding in IT with some base qualification, you might want to push for one of the advanced ones. Unfortunately they are expensive and involving. However, they'll give you a big edge over jobseekers without them. Qualifications such as MCSE & MCSD (Microsoft programming) or A+ (less programming, more systems) or CCNA (if you want to go into networks, which is one of the few good openings in IT atm)

Cheers for the info. Something to think about, at least.

Originally Posted by basa

You obviously chose molecualr biology for a reason, there must have been some interest in it ? Why not investigate some offshoot of your present career and pursue further qualifications along a new path that has strong links with what you are doing at present.

Maybe these sites can give you some ideas:

http://www.jobs.ac.uk/categories/molecularbiology

http://www.bmbudhaka.net/car/career.htm (scroll to bottom of page - forensics and environment look the most interesting to me)

I chose to do a Molecular Biology degree all those years ago 'cos I was doing Biology, Chemistry, & Maths at A Level, & I thought it would be interesting as I liked Biology. I didnt consider the apparent fact that biology jobs can be low paid & boring

I still find some things in the area interesting, but not what I'm doing.

I have also started looking around for other jobs in biology, & have gone back to getting the local paper & New Scientist every week for the job sections, plus have signed up to the New Scientist weekly job email & also submitted my CV to the New Scientist online CV database for employers to search through. A lot of stuff I have seen though is just as poorly paid as what I get now. Plus my current job has really put me off anything biology related.

Cheers for the links. More stuff to search through

Originally Posted by basa

If I were looking for career change right now it certainly wouldn't be in IT. I've spoken to many, many IT techs and they all say work is in short supply and the salaries are crap !!

Whilst I dabble in PC repair part time it certainly doesn't earn a living pay check.

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

Not surprised IT is over subscribed with all these computeach courses etc. Their is good paid IT jobs but they generally require years of experience which means you wont walk into one following a course more realisticly expect 14-17k if outside london.

Damn. From what you two & punky have said, perhaps IT isn't such a good bet.

[Ramrod]

Originally Posted by Matt D

I have also started looking around for other jobs in biology, & have gone back to getting the local paper & New Scientist every week for the job sections, plus have signed up to the New Scientist weekly job email & also submitted my CV to the New Scientist online CV database for employers to search through. A lot of stuff I have seen though is just as poorly paid as what I get now. Plus my current job has really put me off anything biology related.

Perhaps you need to go for a job that whilst dull and poorly paid, can be used as a stepping stone to better positions....take a longer view.....

[Matt D]

Originally Posted by Ramrod

Perhaps you need to go for a job that whilst dull and poorly paid, can be used as a stepping stone to better positions....take a longer view.....

Yeah, maybe.


There really is sod all chance of progression at my current place, so maybe if I found somewhere else with an actual proper pay scale & some sort of ladder it'd be better in the long run even if I started out doing something crap like I am now.

I hope the New Scientist type leads will come through, for you Tez, I recently subscribed & I drool over the kind of jobs being advertised & wish I was more motivated to try for a change, but realistically my age counts against - not so you, good luck

[punky]

Originally Posted by Matt D;34119377C

Damn. From what you two & punky have said, perhaps IT isn't such a good bet.

Yeah, sorry mate. I don't know what your industry is like, but certainly sounds like its out of the frying pan and into the fire. IT is a tough old industry... As someone said, its so heavily publicised... Most people use a computer and think "I can do that".

Your best bet if you want to proceed into IT is to try and punt into one of the least publicised areas. One as I said earlier is networks... Another option is become a junior DBA (database administrator). The work is probably as mind numbing as your doing, and its a lot of data entry from time to time, but its always had a bit of stigma attached so its the least subscribed to. Once you get in (start at around 15k) you should be alright if you keep your nose clean, and upto 25k when you go to full DBA in a couple years.

If you honestly want to earn a decent wage, i'd learn a trade. Plumbers/gas fitters, electricians and plasterers. A lot of my mate with a trade seem to clear 30k alright.

I'm thinking about trying to push my web development freelance, but I am thinking of stepping out of IT.

[Gareth]

Yeah, you'd be surprised at the number of people who have left IT to do "better" jobs.

Punky is spot-on when he suggests finding a niche within IT. It is such a huge field that it covers numerous different aspects. Most people assume IT = programming or tech support, but even these areas have sub-areas that you can look into.

Personally, I'm in the security side of IT. It's not the easiest area to get into, but it's interesting (well, I find it is) and the pay hasn't taken a nosedive in recent years, unlike many of the other areas of IT.

Oh, and don't believe any of those crap adverts for IT training courses where they guarantee you a fantastic job, £40K salary, company car and a good looking girlfriend once you've completed their courses. They're all bollox.

[Matt D]

Originally Posted by homealone

I hope the New Scientist type leads will come through, for you Tez, I recently subscribed & I drool over the kind of jobs being advertised & wish I was more motivated to try for a change, but realistically my age counts against - not so you, good luck

Cheers Gaz

Originally Posted by punky

Yeah, sorry mate. I don't know what your industry is like, but certainly sounds like its out of the frying pan and into the fire. IT is a tough old industry... As someone said, its so heavily publicised... Most people use a computer and think "I can do that".

Your best bet if you want to proceed into IT is to try and punt into one of the least publicised areas. One as I said earlier is networks... Another option is become a junior DBA (database administrator). The work is probably as mind numbing as your doing, and its a lot of data entry from time to time, but its always had a bit of stigma attached so its the least subscribed to. Once you get in (start at around 15k) you should be alright if you keep your nose clean, and upto 25k when you go to full DBA in a couple years.

If you honestly want to earn a decent wage, i'd learn a trade. Plumbers/gas fitters, electricians and plasterers. A lot of my mate with a trade seem to clear 30k alright.

I'm thinking about trying to push my web development freelance, but I am thinking of stepping out of IT.

Ta for the info, Gav.


A trade... lol, I guess that's another option! We had a sales guy who left to become an electrician, and one of my friends had a workmate who left his job as an electrical engineer to retrain as an electrician. Heh, & I seem to remember a story from a few years ago about a university biology lecturer who left academia to become a plumber.

Originally Posted by Gareth

Yeah, you'd be surprised at the number of people who have left IT to do "better" jobs.

Punky is spot-on when he suggests finding a niche within IT. It is such a huge field that it covers numerous different aspects. Most people assume IT = programming or tech support, but even these areas have sub-areas that you can look into.

Personally, I'm in the security side of IT. It's not the easiest area to get into, but it's interesting (well, I find it is) and the pay hasn't taken a nosedive in recent years, unlike many of the other areas of IT.

Oh, and don't believe any of those crap adverts for IT training courses where they guarantee you a fantastic job, £40K salary, company car and a good looking girlfriend once you've completed their courses. They're all bollox.

Cheers, Gareth.


LOL, yeah, I am wary of all those Computeach-type companies. "Why not write games instead of playing them! 40 grand and a company car! Sign up now!"

[Scarlett]

Again from the ugly side of IT, avoid support based work*. This is the first thing that companies think they can outsource. Inevitably the decision is based purely on cost and not on ability... Me, I'm trying to find the niche to fill quickly before my contract runs out.

To do this I'm looking around the job sites trying to see what people want at the moment and trying to see if I can get close enough with my current skills to be considered. But checking the situations vacant is a good idea.

If you do start to look at getting into IT, you'll probably find that at some point you'll hit a ceiling because you don't have a degree. (Hell I've apparently hit a ceiling because although I do have a degree, its not good enough and not from the 'right' university)Not saying that's going to happen to you but it might and I know people who have had that problem.

Scarlett

*Its a lot of fun because your doing different things all the time but I always get the feeling from companies that they resent having to pay all this money out to provide support and nothing comes back in (because retention of customers isn't an income)

[greencreeper]

ECDL is basic Office skills - tends to be favoured by the over 40s, from what I've seen. It might be useful to have if you're looking at a job that mentions knowledge of Office - but you'd probably be getting a bit of paper that says that you know what you know (already). A+ is hardware. I tried obtaining the qualification via self-study (I bought a book) but I gave up. Seemed to involve remembering a lot of facts that I would never use, nor could I think of a use. I did study an MCDST (Microsoft Certified Desktop Support Technician), which is basically all about XP - two exams to pass. I went to college though, rather than self-study. It wasn't that difficult - could have been done via self-study. I'm currently embarking on my MCSA - and that is difficult I'm also thinking about ITIL - the service provision/support framework that a lot of companies now comply with, either in part of entirely.

I'd suggest finding somewhere like where I work - a boot camp. Not too bothered about technical ability. Can you tie your own shoelaces? You don't dribble? Do you come across as friendly and confident? Bit of exposure to PCs? Maybe a bit of customer service experience? It's basically a place where you learn the craft (one to two years) and move on to £90 a day contract work or a nice, safe internal support job.

[edit] My local college's schedule is here - might give an idea of costs. Exams are typically around £80-£100. http://83.136.122.34/info/LCT%20Netw...2006%20(3).doc

[monkey2468]

I'm about to step out the IT area (well made redundant so its given me the push), and I have found there is very little, good IT jobs, and most are poorly paid. They are poorly paid as there are many people going for the same jobs, so they can offer lower wages as they know someone will take it. I still remember being at school and all the teachers and college lectureres saying "do IT, it's were the future well paid jobs will be!". Unfortunatly, they told the other 15 million kids the same thing!!

So, I am now about to retrain in chemical engineering, as there are currently a lot of companies expanding, with lots of jobs, and they are very well paid. (hopefully!)