ESA and DLA

[Taf]

Our disabled twins will soon be 20. As they have stayed in further education, we have continued to receive Child Benefit and Child Tax Credit for them.

But on their 20th birthdays all that will cease, so I contacted the Benefit Enquiry Line and was told they should claim ESA even though they are still in college.

The applications were done over the phone and, though very longwinded, the process was quite painless (luckily I had loads of relevant paperwork with me at the time as they ask the daftest of questions in the interview).

Then a rather odd request was made.

"We will need Sick Notes from their GP, a week one will do".

"But they're not sick? They're disabled receiving DLA as I answered during the interview"

"That doesn't matter, they need Sick Notes".

They have never seen the GP for their handicaps, and since age 19 have not even seen a Consultant (moving on to the Adult Service from Paediatrics means no more annual reviews at all).

Then yesterday I got worried.... REALLY worried!

I bumped into a local guy who has single-handedly brought up his disabled son since his wife walked out on them many years ago. We have met at various hospitals and clinics over the years, so are quite friendly. His son has similar handicaps to my son, and is 5 months older.

Anyway, we were chatting and I brought up ESA..... and his face dropped. His son was in the same position, and so ESA was claimed. He too was confused by the request of a Sick Note, but the GP provided one. Then his son attended an assessment interview.

The result was rapid: Not entitled to ESA as "Fit for work".

And worst of all, DLA "under review with intent to cease entitlement". That will mean no Carers' Allowance either.

He says it feels like the whole world has jumped onto is shoulders.

And I now have that nagging feeling that this is a numbers game by HMG that is going to crush our family too.

[nomadking]

I suppose the sick note was required in order to trigger the ESA assessment process. They would have been declared 'Fit for Work' simply on the basis that they are attending further education. That means they can do something.

DLA can still be awarded even where people are in work.

[New to cable]

Well this could be great news for you, If your twins and deemed fit for work they can out and get some independance and meet new friends.

Its no longer about what you can't do, now the focus is what you can do EG, if you're wheel chair bound then that opens up 1000's of jobs that can be done whilst seated.

If you don't work due to caring then now you could also focus on getting your self back into work. See this as a positive in your twins lives and encourage them to excell. Don't hold them back as you're scared of losing benefits.

[Taf]

The twins DO have some independance and DO have some friends, though both are severly limited due to their disabilties, that's why they need caring for, far more than "normal persons".

And, unless a cure is found for their disabilities (we live in hope, but it's unlikely), they will both need caring-for for the rest of their lives, probably at home with us, their parents. And when we get too frail or pop our clogs what happens then? But that's hopefully a long way off yet.... fingers crossed.

As you say, there are still possibilities of employment despite their handicaps, that is why they are both in college to gain skills for that employment!

My point is that the only road to help with living costs post CB and CTC appears to a benefit paid to SICK people who CANNOT work, and that the decison process for one benefit appears to be used to also stop another benefit they are fully eligible for, despite the criteria being far more simplistic and "one size fits all" for the former benefit.

There used to be an add-on for "Dependant Adults" in a household, now no-one seems to have heard of it, or it's replacement, if it exists.

I did ask what help they could possibly get if not disabled but still in Further Education, and never got an answer. Maybe their disablities have short-circuited the new system, as in my fellow Carer's case?

What a time for CAB to go bust and close down in our city.....

[squealy]

I'm sure you know your city best but this article suggests the CAB is still open until the end of October:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-s...wales-15175829

[Taf]

The interim phone service is snowed under, so it looks like they have already gone sadly, and I think the situation is best sorted/explained face to face..

[looselipsuk]

Whilst the new emphasise is focused on what people can do, which is admirable, little seems to taken into account as to whether they are actually employable.
I cannot see many employers rushing to take on a disabled person who can only do half the amount of work as a non disabled person and pay them the same wages.

[Taf]

This can help sway SOME employers, though not many to my knowledge:

Disabled Person's Tax Credit (DPTC) replaced Disability Working Allowance (DWA) from 5th October 1999. It is a tax credit available to people who are working at least sixteen hours a week and who have an illness or disability which puts them at a disadvantage in getting a job.

It's what our twins are banking on post-college.

I think some employers are obliged to take on specific numbers of disabled staff, though it's up to them to define "disabled" so the "difficult" cases are often not taken on.

[Taf]

Well, I visited the Jobcentre for advice and it took SEVEN members of staff to finally get the picture straight, much to their own bemusement.

Yes - ESA is the only help for disabled students (full time, after age 20)

Yes - ESA requires a Medical Certificate (sick note) to start the process properly

Yes - Almost all claimants HAVE to atend a medical review as the private company doing the assessments are profit driven

Yes - the numbers of disabled people being turned down is far greater as the private company doing the assessments are "apparently" under orders to reject as many as possible. But 45% are going to tribunals after that and are finally awared ESA

Yes - there have been cases where DLA has been triggered for an early review, but numbers are not forthcoming as to the outcomes.

The lead Jobcentre bloke told me he had an hysterical widow with severe handicaps on the point of suicide after being paid ESA at first, then having it stopped, and she was terrified they wanted "overpayments" repaid. But apparently they can't ask for the money back.

So I asked our GP for Health Certificates. He is only paid if he sees the person involved, so an appointment has been made for a FORTNIGHT'S time!

[Hugh]

Taf, the private company don't do the rejections - the reports are assessed by DWP staff.

[peanut]

Originally Posted by Hugh

Taf, the private company don't do the rejections - the reports are assessed by DWP staff.

That's right, they are just selective with the information they pass on.

[Taf]

...minister for disabled people Maria Miller said: "At the moment disability living allowance doesn't have an in-built reassessment as part of it and we have £600m a year going out in overpayments as a result.

"I want to see that change so that the money is really getting to disabled people who need the help the most."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-15398051

Sounds like a fair plan, but I have had contact this week with 4 local families with handicapped young adults, all of whom have been denied ESA then had DLA and Carers Allowance stopped during the past month. All have been told to sign on as unemployed.

None of the disabled persons are able to live independantly according to several charitable bodies and medical experts who give them help and advice, but even their input has been ignored.

And the minister says "disability living allowance doesn't have an in-built reassessment"... does she not know that in most cases huge reclaim forms have to be filled in by disabled persons or their carers on a fairly regular basis?

We are now receiving regular phonecalls from ESA staff reading from longwinded scripts that seem to be demanding that forms be filled-in and returned with "evidence" as soon as possible "or benefits will stop" even though no payments are yet scheduled!

In our case we are still awaiting a doctor's appointment to get the required Medical Certificates, the surgery is snowed under with requests for them for ESA.

---------- Post added at 12:40 ---------- Previous post was at 11:40 ----------

One of the parents just phoned me to say his daughter has been denied Jobseekers Allowance as she goes to college for 16.5 hours a week... so now has no income at all.

[AdamD]

Originally Posted by peanut

That's right, they are just selective with the information they pass on.

That and they often write down the wrong answers, or miss things off entirely.

I had to go through the appeal process myself and their decision was overturned, because the assessor put down two wrong answers.

[haydnwalker]

I don't understand why the ESA assessment has triggered the DLA issue? They are 2 completely separate benefits and entitlement to one doesn't mean they aren't entitled to the other.

Luckily my wife is still on the old Incapacity Benefit (for the moment). I would suggest that you get another set of DLA forms and fill them in again just in case they threaten to remove it from your boys. As I think its just the computer system thats completely not-fit-for-purpose! DLA has nothing to do with fitness for work, but more the amount of time carers are needed (including night times!) and the amount of someones mobility.

DLA DOES have to be reassessed (as you know) at the very least every 3 years so the MP in question obviously lives in a box in whitehall

[Taf]

It would appear that the ESA forms ask just the right questions to also disqualify for DLA if they are not answered JUST RIGHT (other people who have filled in the DLA forms will know what I mean). A wrong or incomplete answer triggers a DLA review, but the opinion of the "medical expert" at ESA can apparently trigger a stop too.