sirens, police etc.

[Chrysalis]

For people who live in an area where sirens are heard have you noticed an increase in the past number of years? I have come across quite a collection of stories on google. Here is my experience.

I moved to my current address about 5 years ago, when I moved here there was a siren once maybe every 3 days so about twice a week.

It has increased to the point now I get on average 2 to 3 a day, usually at least once a day and sometimes can be 10-20 a day. Also I hear sirens when the road is dead late at night.

From my observation the vast majority of it is the police and if I ever see an ambulance or fire engine at night they only use their lights whilst the police appear to be arrogant and use no matter what time of the day or if there is a need to. Also the police tend to keep stop starting their sirens, so they will turn on when approaching junction then turn off again after, this may seem better reading it here but is actually worse as I live near a mini roundabout and the sudden turning on can cause quite a shock.

I have heard about it been effectively abused, used for testing routes, non emergencies etc. and wonder if anyone hear has some thoughts or even if someone is in the police themselves and can explain what I am observing.

[haydnwalker]

I moved into my address about 5 years ago also, and I do hear approx 6-10 sirens per day, though we live near (but not on) a main arterial route which connects to a motorway junction.

The majority of these sirens are Ambulances. Round here the police very rarely use sirens unless the traffic is busy or Traffic Signals are on Red.

I hardly ever see a Fire Engine though... they are usually like buses, you never see one then two come along at once!

I know one of the traffic officer instructors for our local force, and he says they are only required to use "own judgement" as to when to use the emergency warning equipment. So for example, on an empty road while travelling to an emergency, there may be a judgement made to use NO emergency lights/sirens etc.

I guess it makes sense to use lights/sirens on approach to junctions/red lights etc though... common courtesy to other road users?

In fact...there was something on the TV a few years ago, where a Motorway Officer had collided with a HGV while responding to an emergency call. Both drivers were (in my opinion) in the wrong, due to the Truck driver was manouvering into Lane 3 (which is illegal) but also the officer in question was only using his flashing headlights, but not any of his blue lights and no sirens, while travelling at over 100mph (I think it was Police Camera Action or something it was on).

[Gary L]

It's probably increased due to a nutty family moving into the area. then you have the hot weather which makes nutters even nuttier.

the thing I've noticed is that some cars are using that french style siren.
they sound really funny.

[haydnwalker]

Originally Posted by Gary L

It's probably increased due to a nutty family moving into the area. then you have the hot weather which makes nutters even nuttier.

the thing I've noticed is that some cars are using that french style siren.
they sound really funny.

The "Nee-Noor" one? Its comical isn't it

We have modern ones around here...with the intermittent white-noise thrown in for good measure.

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by haydnwalker

The "Nee-Noor" one? Its comical isn't it

They are. they sound so laid back. I bet even the ones they're going for are casually finishing up what they're doing when they hear them coming

[Chris]

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

I have heard about it been effectively abused, used for testing routes, non emergencies etc. and wonder if anyone hear has some thoughts or even if someone is in the police themselves and can explain what I am observing.

If I were a betting man, I'd put money on it having to do with cases like this:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...rls-death.html

We had a fairly long thread on that story at the time, with plenty of the usual authority-hating suspects on this forum jumping up and down and accusing the copper of all sorts, then rejoicing at him being thrown in jail.

If traffic cops are getting more cautious and using their sirens more often, it's really not surprising to me at all.

[Derek]

There are a couple of reasons for this.

Firstly all officers trained to advanced driving level (blue lights etc.) now have to be reassessed on a semi frequent level so there are more training runs being done.

Secondly a significant chunk of other road users are completely useless and don't see or hear a police car coming up behind them. Rapid changed from long tone - short tone - off - short tone get the best reaction from drivers.

Also sirens are LOUD. Trying to use personal or car radios while something is screaming just outside the car can be a pain in the rear.

Finally it's a matter of judgement. Going to some calls you want a silent approach so not to scare people off and at nights going through residential areas having sirens on will almost always result in complaints, it's far easier to put them on for junctions only.

[Chrysalis]

are training runs done in random areas or down the same stretches of road?

I would love to know what the reasoning is for sirens at silly late hours when the roads are empty. That cop who got arrested in the link also didnt have lights on thats why he was done.

Take it from someone who lives in an area with this that having the siren on all the time is less likely to wake people up than turning it on and off. With it on all the time it will start of as a background ambient noise that slowly gets louder so the body will adjust to it easier, versus a sudden loud noise that just occurs aka alarm clock style.

[martyh]

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

are training runs done in random areas or down the same stretches of road?

I would love to know what the reasoning is for sirens at silly late hours when the roads are empty. That cop who got arrested in the link also didnt have lights on thats why he was done.

Take it from someone who lives in an area with this that having the siren on all the time is less likely to wake people up than turning it on and off. With it on all the time it will start of as a background ambient noise that slowly gets louder so the body will adjust to it easier, versus a sudden loud noise that just occurs aka alarm clock style.

The reasoning is quite simple ,in the link that Chris supplied the officer involved didn't use any sirens at a "silly late hour" and ended up killing a young girl ,that was a high profile case which has probably encouraged other officers to use the sirens/lights even when not strictly nescesary just to cover themselves ,and can you blame them .I would say that using sirens is more important at night so i would expect them to be heard more at night

[Chrysalis]

he didnt use the lights.

the point I am making is if he had his lights on (but sirens still off) he wouldnt have been found guilty by law.

I understand them probably been paranoid since then but he had his lights off as well as the sirens.

[Paul M]

I rarely here sirens around here.

[Derek]

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

are training runs done in random areas or down the same stretches of road?

I'd imagine like all driving instructors there are specific patches of road used more frequently than others.

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

I would love to know what the reasoning is for sirens at silly late hours when the roads are empty.

To alert drivers and pedestrians that something is coming towards them quickly. Although trust me all the lights and sirens in th world make no difference to some.

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

the point I am making is if he had his lights on (but sirens still off) he wouldnt have been found guilty by law.

Maybe, maybe not. Using lights and sirens doesn't automatically indemnify you from prosecution.

[martyh]

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

he didnt use the lights.

the point I am making is if he had his lights on (but sirens still off) he wouldnt have been found guilty by law.

I understand them probably been paranoid since then but he had his lights off as well as the sirens.

but would most likely still have killed her ,lights are only any good if you are looking at them .
Having said that the useless sirens that police cars are equipped with these days don't help anybody ,until they are on top of you it's virtually impossible to tell where they are coming from and realy hard to hear if you are in a car/van

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by martyh

but would most likely still have killed her ,lights are only any good if you are looking at them .
Having said that the useless sirens that police cars are equipped with these days don't help anybody ,until they are on top of you it's virtually impossible to tell where they are coming from and realy hard to hear if you are in a car/van

which brings to my next point, if they only turn the sirens on at junctions, how does that help on long stretches of road between junctions anyway? likewise if you at a junction at a red light or something and the siren only comes on when they reach you then the forewarning is lost and as a a result it takes longer to make space for them to past.

at night things are fairly quiet, even in a urban area, so a siren shouldnt be needed for someone to hear an approaching vehicle. unless the person has hearing problems in which case they should be looking more carefully anyway. The death happened which is a sad event but its hardly a widespread problem.

[martyh]

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

which brings to my next point, if they only turn the sirens on at junctions, how does that help on long stretches of road between junctions anyway? likewise if you at a junction at a red light or something and the siren only comes on when they reach you then the forewarning is lost and as a a result it takes longer to make space for them to past.

at night things are fairly quiet, even in a urban area, so a siren shouldnt be needed for someone to hear an approaching vehicle. unless the person has hearing problems in which case they should be looking more carefully anyway. The death happened which is a sad event but its hardly a widespread problem.

I have seen motorist panic at traffic lights because they have heard a police siren but have no idea where it is coming from so cannot clear a path ,this does not happen with fire engines or ambulances ,different sirens i suppose .On the long stretches between junctions they would use the siren to alert pedestrians as much as drivers ,you must realise that if a siren is being used it must be assumed that the driver is on a emergency call and therefore travelling very fast ,it's not unusual for emergency vehicles to travel in excess of 50mph in urban areas and things happen very quickly and the driver has to cover all eventualities of pedestrians being in the road when a car rounds a corner