Bill 156 threat to animé and manga.

[heero_yuy]

A bill currently passing through Tokyo's legislature seeks to bring the age ratings on films and other video media to the world of animé (animated films) manga (comic books) and doujinshi (art books). Whilst laudable in it's aims critics are afraid its vagueness may stifle the genre.

Youth Ordinance bill

The Mobile Content Forum, an industry group that includes the social networking company DeNA and Nico Nico Douga's Dwango, announced its opposition to the bill on Monday. A group of female creators, including boys-love genre authors, also announced their opposition to the bill on Sunday.

And from the Crunchyroll takeout:

As we are all aware, Tokyo looks set to bring into law Bill 156 (or what many sources refer to as the “Anti-Anime” bill). The governor behind it, Shintaro Ishihara, has risen to prominence because of this significant step towards cleaning up anime's place in Japanese media, quite often seen as sexually promiscuous and degrading towards women (or more relevant to said bill, young girls). In some ways, you can support his intentions – he wishes to stamp out depictions of carnal activities concerning underage persons. However, his actions have left a sour taste in the mouths of publishers and fans alike by the vagueness of how the bill is written which could see anime as we know it be sterilised severly or at worst completely neutered. This has caused Ishihara to be depicted as something of a hate figure solely responsible for what could be seen as anime's demise commercially and creatively. So what caused Bill 156 to become so prominent and potentially make it into Japan's constitution?

I have specifically NOT posted any example images or links (T&C) and being a family forum. A Google search (e.g. "shounen ai" or "heero x duo") with safe off should suffice.

How do people feel about this? Given that other art forms are not subject to age restrictions and could conceivably depict anything that the animé or manga forms do.

When such material is published outside Japan in Europe or the USA age ratings are applied and the content may also be edited or censored according to the intended audience but could this bill strangle the creativity at source?


(Mods: I wasn't sure whether it's lifestyle or current affairs, feel free to move)

[Kymmy]

Just the simple fact that you've got to recommend that people google for a particular phrase with "Safe off" should tell you that they are considered to be age related

---------- Post added at 12:40 ---------- Previous post was at 12:23 ----------

Also it's not art it's media and story telling (the art itself is a by product of the animations), we have the same rules in this country about media in print/film/tv

[heero_yuy]

Originally Posted by Kymmy

Just the simple fact that you've got to recommend that people google for a particular phrase with "Safe off" should tell you that they are considered to be age related

True, point taken but I suspect Google's filtering may be more aggressive than a censor might be given that it responds to complainant's concerns, however to be able to comment on whether content should be censored it is necessary to take a look at the content first.

Curious I can't seem to turn on safe filtering to see what the effect might be on which images are displayed. Cookies are enabled and the preferences show enable but the main search screen says it's off (Yes I have flushed the caches)

Ah, safe search doesn't work on the pure images search, only the web. So I didn't need to mention it. I guess it can only filter against the text and context that the image appears in.

[Damien]

What's the problem with age limits though? The same content is allowed I presume? I fail too see the problem because if an image is deemed 18+ then so it should be, as with all other media.

[heero_yuy]

Originally Posted by Damien

What's the problem with age limits though? The same content is allowed I presume? I fail too see the problem because if an image is deemed 18+ then so it should be, as with all other media.

Animé, manga and doujinshi have not been covered by age limit legislation in Japan at all. Any content has been allowed. It's interesting that the Japanese don't have so many hangups about sexual things as we do in the west so even where there are restrictions they are not so severe.

It's arguable that the content should be controlled, the issue here is will it stifle the creativity of the artists and animators involved?

Another iteresting issue is enforcement:

Manga is just drawn pictures. How do you prove that illegal or immoral acts are being portrayed or glorified? I’m sure it will be clear cut in many situations, but I can think of a lot of potential loopholes.

For example, you can prove incest in real-life through DNA test, but how will you do that in manga? What if the characters involved turn out to be not related by blood? What if they are not depicted as siblings at all, but the girl just likes to call the guy “onii-san”?

The other example used, rape, is similarly mind-boggling. How can fictional characters give consent? What constitutes manga rape? I can see plenty of room for contention if someone chooses to dispute a specific ruling.

Furthermore, are non-explicit yuri and yaoi manga “glorifying” immoral sexual behaviours? And, for that matter, will homosexuality be considered immoral? There are a lot of unanswered questions over which I cannot opine without a copy of the original legislative text.

Darkmirage

[Kymmy]

Yet Anime is covered by UK age limits depending on the material (printed/video).. Just look at some of the world wide ratings for some of the anime films in the last 10 years.. It's not though being controlled, instead the person viewing it is being restricted..

[Chris]

If Anime had never been censored in the UK, we'd never have met this dude:

[Anonymouse]

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

It's interesting that the Japanese don't have so many hangups about sexual things as we do in the west so even where there are restrictions they are not so severe.

Yes, they do - it is illegal in Japan to show sexual penetration, whether hetero or gay. Totally illegal. Absolutely forbidden. If that isn't a hangup, what is?

Besides, why do you think there's all that fuss about tentacle, er, goings-on in anime? It's a substitute.

[techguyone]

Also they always used to (not sure if they still do) had extreme pixellation around anyone 'naughty bits' in anime didn't they?

I'd say the East has as many hang ups as the West, just perhaps different ones.

[Maggy J]

I think it is best that the more violent and sexually explicit stuff is out of the hands of underage viewers where possible..as for the loud complaints well I'd like to actually see whom they are and what their ages are.Much of the stuff featuring very young 'girls' is extremely dubious.

I think the reason why the Japanese have a different attitude towards sex and all that surrounds it is that the Japanese are somewhat naive about what is pornographic and what is art especially as traditionally women are seen as having little or no voice and are expected to be submissive.

It just doesn't occur to them that placing a sex toy section next to a sweet section is rather dubious because they just don't seem to make the connection.

[Lew]

Originally Posted by Chris

If Anime had never been censored in the UK, we'd never have met this dude:

Good old Zark. I have an original set of 7-Zark-7 animation cels.

[heero_yuy]

Originally Posted by Chris

If Anime had never been censored in the UK, we'd never have met this dude:

Err, Is there a link here 'cos I'm not seeing it. Correction, I can see it when I put it in direct to the browser. Hey now the link works.

Originally Posted by anonymouse

Yes, they do - it is illegal in Japan to show sexual penetration, whether hetero or gay. Totally illegal. Absolutely forbidden. If that isn't a hangup, what is?

Oh, didn't know that. I just follow the drawn art forms. Are they that restricted on live action? Internet X-rated sites must have been an eye opener.

But it does explain some of the fan art where the "bits" are pixeleated out. Such as this:

[Pic removed. Sorry ,but even with the pixellation it's a bit much.]

Hope I'm not violating T&C Not intentional.