Debt Collection Agency

[basa]

OK assignment of credit debt is VERY complex.

There are two types of assignment: equitable and absolute (legal).

An equitable assignment really only confers on a debt collector the right to pursue the debt (and keep the proceeds). The original creditor still retains the rights and duties spelled out in the credit agreement and is the only one who can take legal action to pursue it.

Absolute assignment transfers the debt and with it the rights and duties of the original contract.

If an absolute assignee the 'new' creditor must provide to the debtor upon demand (+ a fee of £1) a true copy of the original credit agreement. If the new 'creditor' (the debt collection agency) cannot provide this there is no way the debt can be enforced in court. You will get a default however as the law has yet to decide the legality of this action.

Even with absolute assignment, a DCA can only take legal action with permission of the court as DCAs cannot be creditors.

You should not pay another penny to this debt until the DCA has provided a copy of the original credit agreement and the true deed of absolute assignment.

In the current state as already pointed out they will take your money and sell on the remaining debt (or continue to pursue you for it).

You should write to the DCA requesting pursuant to the Consumer Credit Act 1974 section 78(1) a true copy of your credit agreement for the account and enclose a £1 PO. In the same letter demand a copy of the deed of assignment of the debt from O2.

In the letter explain that you do not acknowledge any debt to the DCA until said documents are received.

They have 12 days (+2 days postage) to comply or else be in default of the Act.

Whilst it is probably true (as has been suggested) that O2 wouldn't have sold this debt if they thought they could legally collect on it, often debts are sold (usually for around 10%) to offset against tax and to avoid the cost of collection and the possible bad PR.

Some say ALL the major banks sell on rather than pursue bad debts nowadays.

[Mr Angry]

Originally Posted by basa

OK assignment of credit debt is VERY complex.

There are two types of assignment: equitable and absolute (legal).

An equitable assignment really only confers on a debt collector the right to pursue the debt (and keep the proceeds). The original creditor still retains the rights and duties spelled out in the credit agreement and is the only one who can take legal action to pursue it.

Absolute assignment transfers the debt and with it the rights and duties of the original contract.

If an absolute assignee the 'new' creditor must provide to the debtor upon demand (+ a fee of £1) a true copy of the original credit agreement. If the new 'creditor' (the debt collection agency) cannot provide this there is no way the debt can be enforced in court. You will get a default however as the law has yet to decide the legality of this action.

Even with absolute assignment, a DCA can only take legal action with permission of the court as DCAs cannot be creditors.

You should not pay another penny to this debt until the DCA has provided a copy of the original credit agreement and the true deed of absolute assignment.

In the current state as already pointed out they will take your money and sell on the remaining debt (or continue to pursue you for it).

You should write to the DCA requesting pursuant to the Consumer Credit Act 1974 section 78(1) a true copy of your credit agreement for the account and enclose a £1 PO. In the same letter demand a copy of the deed of assignment of the debt from O2.

In the letter explain that you do not acknowledge any debt to the DCA until said documents are received.

They have 12 days (+2 days postage) to comply or else be in default of the Act.

Whilst it is probably true (as has been suggested) that O2 wouldn't have sold this debt if they thought they could legally collect on it, often debts are sold (usually for around 10%) to offset against tax and to avoid the cost of collection and the possible bad PR.

Some say ALL the major banks sell on rather than pursue bad debts nowadays.

basa, without my wishing to appear disrespectful of your good intentions I would advise Zee to ignore / disregard your advice as it is neither pertinent, relevant nor factually / legally applicable to his / her situation.

He / she has acknowledged the debt and he / she will have to deal with it from here on in.

Originally Posted by Zee

So i have a dept with Wescot of £1195, i had been really stressed about this, but they actually gave me a good deal. Basicly i have to pay £15 in December and then £260 by 11th Jan 2010 and the debt is cleared.

Has anyone else had a good experience with debt collection agencies or really bad experience?

My stepdaughter got into some debt with an Orange phone bill which got passed to Morcroft in Stockport, they were asking for £1200 as they had bought the bill from Orange, my stepdaughter got in touch with them and arranged a payment plan, she kept up all payments on a direct debit basis, last week she got a letter from Orange saying they had took all the debts back from Morecroft and that she owed £1200 again. She's been on the phone to them with no luck in sorting it out.

Watch these Debt agencies they'll have your last pound if they could.

[swoop101]

If you are having debt problems the people you need to contact are
http://www.cccs.co.uk/

They will give you all the help and advice you need to get things sorted.
This is a charity so there are no costs or charges for the help.

[Mr Angry]

Originally Posted by swoop101

If you are having debt problems the people you need to contact are
http://www.cccs.co.uk/

They will give you all the help and advice you need to get things sorted.
This is a charity so there are no costs or charges for the help.

Good advice!!

[Zee]

just an update. i got off the phone to O2 and explained the situation to them. they did tell me that the debt has been passed onto Wescot and they cant deal with it anymore. The guy was really helpful and after explaining to him that would the debt be cleared after i pay the £260 to Wescott he asked the debt departement and they told me that once i enter a settlement deal of whatever the amount, O2 will clear the debt.

so i guess after i pay the £260 to Wescott, even if they pass on the details to another company to retrieve the rest, that company wont be able to do anything right as they wouldn't have recieved a deed letter from O2?

[Mr Angry]

Originally Posted by Zee

just an update. i got off the phone to O2 and explained the situation to them. they did tell me that the debt has been passed onto Wescot and they cant deal with it anymore. The guy was really helpful and after explaining to him that would the debt be cleared after i pay the £260 to Wescott he asked the debt departement and they told me that once i enter a settlement deal of whatever the amount, O2 will clear the debt.

so i guess after i pay the £260 to Wescott, even if they pass on the details to another company to retrieve the rest, that company wont be able to do anything right as they wouldn't have recieved a deed letter from O2?

Think about it.

[Zee]

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

Think about it.

Maybe i didn't put the correct words. O2 said that wescot has been instructed by them to recover the money. they said once i make the settlement payment, wescott will pass the details onto O2 telling them i've made the payment and then i will recieve a letter from O2 saying the debt has been settled.

Nail your doors shut and start wearing a orange wig , only leave your house by the means of a secret trap door and special taps which only you and your family knows about , and get prepared for letters from debt collection agencies plus start drinking heavily to dull the memories. Or try and pay your debts.

[Kymmy]

Originally Posted by Zee

Maybe i didn't put the correct words. O2 said that wescot has been instructed by them to recover the money. they said once i make the settlement payment, wescott will pass the details onto O2 telling them i've made the payment and then i will recieve a letter from O2 saying the debt has been settled.

Was this a verbal conversation with an O2 customer service agent, or was this in writing from O2

[Zee]

Originally Posted by Kymmy

Was this a verbal conversation with an O2 customer service agent, or was this in writing from O2

It was over the phone today...

i call will that company tomorrow about the help.

[Flyboy]

Originally Posted by Zee

So i have a dept with Wescot of £1195, i had been really stressed about this, but they actually gave me a good deal. Basicly i have to pay £15 in December and then £260 by 11th Jan 2010 and the debt is cleared.

Has anyone else had a good experience with debt collection agencies or really bad experience?

If it hasn't been said already, do nothing until you get a deal in writing. Then there will be no argument as to what was agreed. If they are not prepared to put in writing, it ain't worth the paper it's not written on.

[Kymmy]

Originally Posted by Flyboy

If it hasn't been said already, do nothing until you get a deal in writing. Then there will be no argument as to what was agreed. If they are not prepared to put in writing, it ain't worth the paper it's not written on.

From Wescot writing might not be enough due to the fact that they might not fully own the debt..

In this case best to run and hide as O2 have already washed thier hands of it by selling it on and wescot just want to make money..

ZEE one question? before the recent wescot and O2 talks how long had it been since you defaulted?

[basa]

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

basa, without my wishing to appear disrespectful of your good intentions I would advise Zee to ignore / disregard your advice as it is neither pertinent, relevant nor factually / legally applicable to his / her situation.

He / she has acknowledged the debt and he / she will have to deal with it from here on in.

It matters not a jot that Zee has acknowleged the debt. He/she acknowledged in error due to ignorance of consumer law in the mistaken premis the debt is owed.

Zee has a legal right to demand to see the agreement under which the debt is allegedly owed and if the agreement does not comply with certain provisions of the Act there is no way it can be enforced in court.

Similarly if Westons cannot demonstrate a legal right to collect the debt then they cannot collect - simples.

I'm sure if some stranger came knocking on your door saying I'm from ABC Debt Collectors, you owe £XXX to Acme Credit Card Co, I'm here to collect, you would show them the door and ask them to prove they had a right to collect. If not you should even if you agree you do owe Acme CCC !

My comments are pertinent, factual and legally accurate.

---------- Post added at 21:55 ---------- Previous post was at 21:39 ----------

Originally Posted by swoop101

If you are having debt problems the people you need to contact are
http://www.cccs.co.uk/

They will give you all the help and advice you need to get things sorted.
This is a charity so there are no costs or charges for the help.

You should be aware that CCCS whilst supposedly a non profit organisation are known to be sponsored by the credit companies. As such they don't give truly impartial advice. They will always get you to negotiate reduced payments but no other remedies that may be available to you under the law.

The CAB are a much better bet - truly independent.

---------- Post added at 22:00 ---------- Previous post was at 21:55 ----------

Originally Posted by Nidge

My stepdaughter got into some debt with an Orange phone bill which got passed to Morcroft in Stockport, they were asking for £1200 as they had bought the bill from Orange, my stepdaughter got in touch with them and arranged a payment plan, she kept up all payments on a direct debit basis, last week she got a letter from Orange saying they had took all the debts back from Morecroft and that she owed £1200 again. She's been on the phone to them with no luck in sorting it out.

Watch these Debt agencies they'll have your last pound if they could.

Moorcroft do not buy debts, they are one of many scumpanies that chase debt on behalf of the original creditor.

These scumpanies are the lowest of low lives. They are not even legally competent.

[Flyboy]

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

basa, without my wishing to appear disrespectful of your good intentions I would advise Zee to ignore / disregard your advice as it is neither pertinent, relevant nor factually / legally applicable to his / her situation.

He / she has acknowledged the debt and he / she will have to deal with it from here on in.

Mr Angry, it maybe helpful, for us all, to learn where this information is incorrect.