How do CF's Christians (and those of other faiths) choose their paths in life?

supremus · 03-10-2008, 17:58

Parental Advisory This thread is Rated "Sensible" for mild religion bashing... and hopefully partial nudity.

Since discussion on the new movie Religulous was straying slightly off topic, my new pal Russ B suggested a new thread for a pertinent question about people's faith, so here goes.

Long story short, I was curious why people of faith, who choose to follow the admirable examples of guys like Jesus, Lord Xenu and others, also feel like they have to sign up for the hocus-pocus aspects like burning bushes, intergalactic warlords, talking snakes, etc, etc. You know, the kind of stuff you would dismiss out of hand, it it weren't called religion, and hadn't been drummed into your head through your parents, school, movies, etc, etc, since childhood.

Russ has hinted that he would reveal the true origin of his own religious self, if a thread like this were to pop up, and I hope other people would share their views and experiences as well. I'd love to hear that someone was bitten by a radioactive Jesus-freak in the ultimate marriage of science and religion.

Anyway, I jest. I'm seriously interested, and let's try to keep it clean and on topic, shall we?

Wicked_and_Crazy · 03-10-2008, 18:02

I visited a Amish family a few months ago and i think they have it about right. They're not allowed to be baptised into the faith until they're 16. Therefore its their own decision at a point in their life where you can appreciate what they're doing as opposed to someone chosing for them. Up until that age they will live the Amish way of life but they do not have to stick to the rules.

Ramrod · 03-10-2008, 18:03

iirc, the main reason for why people follow any given faith is because it's the main faith of the country/place they lie in.....

supremus · 03-10-2008, 18:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramrod

iirc, the main reason for why people follow any given faith is because it's the main faith of the country/place they lie in.....

Yes, that does seem to be the case. I guess that's what called playing the percentages.

Ramrod · 03-10-2008, 18:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by supremus

I guess that's what called playing the percentages.

No, it's just normal for people to tend to do what those around them are doing. An Arab in Saudi will probably be a Muslim rather than a Jew because those around him are mainly Muslims.....etc.....

punky · 03-10-2008, 18:33

OK, i'll bite.

My parents didn't really raise me Christian. The baptised me at my local church and that was about it. My family are CDCO (Christians During Christmas Only). The baptism didn't really have a bearing on anything. Only growing up did start to think about how I feel about life. I went to private schools that have a Christian tilt to them. My secular secondary school had chapel and a full-time chaplain. He was one of the coolest blokes you could meet. You think of anyone in religious authority must be pious and serious, but take the dog collar off and you could see him at a pub. I grew up with a strong science background. My dad was an engineer and got me into computers early. I did two science A-levels (Bio and Chem - although I was badly advised) and did software engineering at University, which draws heavily on maths and physics. I am not anti-science. Nor do I choose not to believe anything that can be proven beyond reasonable doubt (That includes evolution).

Somewhere along the lines I just started to wonder how I came to being. How and why I exist. Where did it start, how and why. Thousands of years ago, people came along and tried to answer which was, and still is unanswerable. To make the problem a bit more feasible to understand they tried to label what they could. For example... They might have said something along the lines of:

"Let's just say a force did it. Lets call him.... God. OK. Us humans are the most advanced lifeforms on the planet, and I can't concieve anything more advanced, so let's say he is human based and made us in his image..."

...and so it went on. Everything we 'know' about religion is man-made. All sources of information inevitably lead back to a human source. This gives opponents of religion great glee in thinking that all Christians actually believe there is a big bloke with a long white beard and hair sitting on a cloud, with winged humans flying around playing harps. I don't know how many Christians (or other religions) believe that, but we don't all. It is just an interpretation of it. However, science can and will only ever go so far. No matter how much more science proves, no matter how much our knowlege increases, we'll always come to a wall. A point where we just don't know any more. Later we'll push that back further but we'll hit the wall again. That is where faith comes in. And faith is largely personal. Many people imagine God in differents ways - it depends on what makes sense to the person. To believe in something we know we will never know requires faith. Of course you can just choose not to be bothered by it all thinking you'll soon be dust. That's your choice.

Science and religion can co-exist. Some of the most famous scientists were religious. The man who came up with the big bang theory is a RC priest. This was only a few decades ago. Not a time when people were forced to appear religious. What science can't answer usually gets labelled as philosphy.

That's just my Ã‚Â£0.02 worth anyway. I don't mind people questioning my beliefs, and I will debate and defend them. What I don't like is the insults that fly about which people call debate.

Raistlin · 03-10-2008, 18:35

I've got a book open on this (my big bucket of popcorn is currently resting on it), my money's on 8 pages.

ikthius · 03-10-2008, 18:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob M

I've got a book open on this (my big bucket of popcorn is currently resting on it), my money's on 8 pages.

my money is for it to be closed.....

---------------- Now playing: Led Zeppelin - Bron-Y-Aur Stomp via FoxyTunes

supremus · 03-10-2008, 19:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by punky

That's just my Ã‚Â£0.02 worth anyway. I don't mind people questioning my beliefs, and I will debate and defend them. What I don't like is the insults that fly about which people call debate.

That's certainly a perspective I can respect, particularly the willingness to discuss without being offended or defensive. I'm sure we'd all like to know where we come from, and in the other thread, I made it quite clear that I'm not someone who dismisses the notion of a god or a creator of some kind, just that I find the most common beliefs on the subject to be emotionally immature.

And here's what I really don't get, why the need to call yourself one thing or the other? Take christianity, it's clearly based on the bible, and christians do tend to get all bent out of shape, when you criticise the bible as being nothing more than fairy tales. So why do people feel the need to label themselves christians and align themselves with that sort of nonsense? My new pal Russ B only elaborated as far as to say this was the path that "made the most sense to him", but I just don't get that. "Don't steal", "don't kill", "be kind and rewind", that all makes sense, but the talking snakes and burning bushes do not, and that's what's in the bible. That's what the orthodox christians preach. That is christianity at its core. Why not just be an individual and live according to the aspects that make sense for you? What is it that makes someone sign up to the whole package and want to call themselves a christian?

**Hugh** · 03-10-2008, 20:02

supremus, you would probably get less "flak" if you used modifiers, instead of generalisations - such as
"most common beliefs" -"most common beliefs I have come across"
"christians do tend to get all bent out of shape" - "some christians etc"

Putting all Christians in the same big boat is like putting (imho) all English people in the boat of Man U/Arsenal supporters - whilst a small to reasonable percentage may support these clubs, not all do.

It is probably the tendency of some people to equate all Christians/people of faith with the extreme fundamentalists of a faith, that brings out a defensive reaction (again, imho) - just because some people believe in a literal interpretation of the bible, does not mean that all do.

And remember, please, why Christianity is so named - after Jesus, who is historically recognised as existing, and based upon his tenets and beliefs in the New Testament (so your point about "orthodox" Christians confuses me - the only Orthodox Christians I know are Greek).

LondonRoad · 03-10-2008, 20:04

I think you're missing the whole point of faith Supremus. The bible is far too important to a vast number of people to be simply dismissed as a collection of fairy tales.

danielf · 03-10-2008, 20:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by punky

That's just my Ã‚Â£0.02 worth anyway. I don't mind people questioning my beliefs, and I will debate and defend them. What I don't like is the insults that fly about which people call debate.

That all makes perfect sense to me, but may I ask what made you choose Christianity as your belief? There's a multitude of beliefs out there that would give you answers. What's so appealling about the Christian set of answers, that you choose to believe those, and not others?

**Maggy J** · 03-10-2008, 20:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob M

I've got a book open on this (my big bucket of popcorn is currently resting on it), my money's on 8 pages.

I'm just discovering the REAL downside to being a mod here...I can't ignore these really tediously long threads about a subject I'm quite happy not to bother about....

supremus · 03-10-2008, 20:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by foreverwar

supremus, you would probably get less "flak" if you used modifiers, instead of generalisations - such as
"most common beliefs" -"most common beliefs I have come across"
"christians do tend to get all bent out of shape" - "some christians etc"

I don't mind a bit of "flak".

Quote:

Putting all Christians in the same big boat is like putting (imho) all English people in the boat of Man U/Arsenal supporters - whilst a small to reasonable percentage may support these clubs, not all do.

It's nothing like that. Those English people who are not Man U/Arsenal supporters would not be classed as such by themselves or anyone else. Christians deliberately choose to call themselves that. It's not some slur I've come up with for the sake of generalization.

Quote:

It is probably the tendency of some people to equate all Christians/people of faith with the extreme fundamentalists of a faith, that brings out a defensive reaction (again, imho) - just because some people believe in a literal interpretation of the bible, does not mean that all do.

Then why call yourself a christian and get upset about criticism of the more ridiculous aspects of the bible?

Quote:

And remember, please, why Christianity is so named - after Jesus, who is historically recognised as existing, and based upon his tenets and beliefs in the New Testament (so your point about "orthodox" Christians confuses me - the only Orthodox Christians I know are Greek).

I meant orthodox as pertains to the core beliefs. English is not my first language, but I think it still worked.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maggy J

I'm just discovering the REAL downside to being a mod here...I can't ignore these really tediously long threads about a subject I'm quite happy not to bother about....

Well, if nobody is prepared to offer any answers to the question (much as I expected), as opposed to just criticism of the question itself, this thread will be done soon anyway, and we can dismiss the suggestions by certain people to look for answers as just hot air and diversions. I'd hope that's not going to be the case, though.

LondonRoad · 03-10-2008, 21:22

I don't know if the question can be answered, unless philosophically. Those few individuals who I know that have the deepest faith believe that their path is chosen for them.
To what extent does free will and the an individual's faith play in life's path? There's probably a phd for a theology student in answering that.