A question about French Language?

[The Fool]

Am doing a French course. But what is bugging me is when should the VU become the TU. i.e. TU is used for people you are familiar with, but when exactly is that? Or is it just something you pick up along the way?

[MadGamer]

Originally Posted by The Fool

Am doing a French course. But what is bugging me is when should the VU become the TU. i.e. TU is used for people you are familiar with, but when exactly is that? Or is it just something you pick up along the way?

Now where's Damien when you need him?

[Aragorn]

If you get a slap round the face, it's too personal Haven't practiced French for over 20 years, but iirc 'tu' refers to family & close friends.

[Graham]

Originally Posted by The Fool

Am doing a French course. But what is bugging me is when should the VU become the TU. i.e. TU is used for people you are familiar with, but when exactly is that? Or is it just something you pick up along the way?

I presume you mean "Vous" instead of "Tu"

There's no hard and fast rule, and from what I understand these days it's less strictly observed than it used to be, but I suspect the time would be once you're on "first name terms" with someone.

[The Fool]

Originally Posted by Graham

I presume you mean "Vous" instead of "Tu"

There's no hard and fast rule, and from what I understand these days it's less strictly observed than it used to be, but I suspect the time would be once you're on "first name terms" with someone.

ah right. So, for instance, in a customer service environment it would be the Vous but if you bumped into some people (new people) in a pub after you had, say, bought some drinks it would be Tu?

[Graham]

Originally Posted by The Fool

ah right. So, for instance, in a customer service environment it would be the Vous but if you bumped into some people (new people) in a pub after you had, say, bought some drinks it would be Tu?

That would probably be a good compromise, eg a customer or boss is "Sir" when you're at work (unless it's "Call me Gus, I'm a people person..."!) but "Fred" or "Harry" out of work.

[The Fool]

Originally Posted by Graham

That would probably be a good compromise, eg a customer or boss is "Sir" when you're at work (unless it's "Call me Gus, I'm a people person..."!) but "Fred" or "Harry" out of work.

I see


Merci

[Theodoric]

I believe that tu is also used when speaking to young children. In fact, there is a verb, tutoyer, which means speaking down to people by using tu and toi to them, as if they were children.

[Graham]

Originally Posted by The Fool

I see


Merci

But if someone challenges you to a duel, don't blame me...!

[The Fool]

Originally Posted by Theodoric

I believe that tu is also used when speaking to young children. In fact, there is a verb, tutoyer, which means speaking down to people by using tu and toi to them, as if they were children.

cheers (or should I say Salut ). The course I am doing is a 'learn in the car' set of cds - it just gives you the basics to have a bit of a bash of a conversation. The way we got taught it in school was rubbish. They reckon you only need to know about 300 words in a language to sort of appear competent - eg, when, where, who, why, what etc - plus a few other bits and pieces of nouns thrown in here and there - and 'how do you say this in French etc'. You will always sound foreign anyway so they are bound to take that into account.

Also, while I am on the subject of things French - what would be the implications of saying Le instead of La (by mistake) and vice versa - how would it be percieved? is there an anology in English?

[Raistlin]

TBH, I think that most people are happy that you're making an attempt to speak to them in their own tongue.

I know that the last time I went to France I was quite warmly received (ok, the took the micky out of my accent and my pronouniation ) and they said that it was nice to meet someone who was actually trying - note that by "trying" I don't mean "shouting slowly"

[Angua]

Originally Posted by The Fool

cheers (or should I say Salut ). The course I am doing is a 'learn in the car' set of cds - it just gives you the basics to have a bit of a bash of a conversation. The way we got taught it in school was rubbish. They reckon you only need to know about 300 words in a language to sort of appear competent - eg, when, where, who, why, what etc - plus a few other bits and pieces of nouns thrown in here and there - and 'how do you say this in French etc'. You will always sound foreign anyway so they are bound to take that into account.

Also, while I am on the subject of things French - what would be the implications of saying Le instead of La (by mistake) and vice versa - how would it be percieved? is there an anology in English?

Never got the hang of what was male and female in the French language as we only have the and it (except cars, boats and planes all female I understand).

[The Fool]

Originally Posted by Raistlin

TBH, I think that most people are happy that you're making an attempt to speak to them in their own tongue.

I know that the last time I went to France I was quite warmly received (ok, the took the micky out of my accent and my pronouniation ) and they said that it was nice to meet someone who was actually trying - note that by "trying" I don't mean "shouting slowly"

yes - very true. I went to Spain once with a bunch of lads and one of them seemed to think that he could get by by speaking English in a sort of Spanish accent (seriously - he did) . He seemd to think he was a wow with the Spanish women
__________________

Originally Posted by Angua

Never got the hang of what was male and female in the French language as we only have the and it (except cars, boats and planes all female I understand).

yes - english has no sexes (objects) in this manner - so it is hard to grasp the implications of mucking it up.

Originally Posted by The Fool

ah right. So, for instance, in a customer service environment it would be the Vous but if you bumped into some people (new people) in a pub after you had, say, bought some drinks it would be Tu?

A little more subtle than that.

You would use vous with anyone you didn't know very well. Even someone you met down the pub etc. They might then suggest you call them by their first name, at which point using tu would be appropriate.

You would almost always use vous if you were talking to a superior (e.g. boss) or older person, as a sign of respect.

Similarly, if you really don't like someone and you want them to know it, use tu in a formal situation, e.g. a company meeting, where vous might generally be used by everyone.
__________________

Originally Posted by Theodoric

I believe that tu is also used when speaking to young children. In fact, there is a verb, tutoyer, which means speaking down to people by using tu and toi to them, as if they were children.

Yup, and similarly there is vousvoyer which means the use of vous.

Someone, wishing to suggest you might want to be less formal might tell you that it isn't necessary to vousvoyer.

As I mentioned before, to tutoyer is not simply as 'talking to children' - it can also be to 'talk down' to someone.
__________________

Originally Posted by Angua

Never got the hang of what was male and female in the French language as we only have the and it (except cars, boats and planes all female I understand).

After a while you get a 'fee'l for which it is. Even for the ones that don't make sense. lol.

The Fool, I actually wouldn't bother too much about this area of French. Most French people wouldn't actually be offended if you were to use the incorrect pronoun, except possibly older and more traditional people. For any adult you meet, just use 'vous' all the time, it is probable that after a while they'll probably say 'S'il te plait, tutoies-moi' or something, inviting you to use the 'tu' form. This is how my French teacher told me to handle it.