US Visas

Theodoric · 08-01-2004, 11:29

I see that the Americans have upped the stakes on the need for fingerprints and mugshots of visitors. A few days ago, it was claimed that, because of the 'visa waiving programme', British holiday visitors would be exempt. Now it seems that people with passports issued after 26 October will need, at least for the next few years until 'biometric' passports arrive, to be photographed and fingerprinted. And this means travelling to London or Belfast; sending your fingers by post would be a bit extreme! Not a problem for me as my passport has 5 years to run and I'm only a 20 minute train journey from Central London, but for people living miles away . . .

And despite the publicity, there's almost certain to be scores of people who will be blissfully unaware of the need. Let's hope that the current British lobbying of the US gets some results.

danielf · 08-01-2004, 11:41

Nice one (not)...

I never understood this visa waiver program anyway. Basically, they let you into the country without a visa, but only if you agree to them having the right to throw you out without giving a reason. (This was true even before 9/11)

Theodoric · 08-01-2004, 12:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by danielf

Nice one (not)...

I never understood this visa waiver program anyway. Basically, they let you into the country without a visa, but only if you agree to them having the right to throw you out without giving a reason. (This was true even before 9/11)

Yes, the form you have to fill in on the plane is quite interesting. You have to answer such questions as were you a War Crimainal, do you intend to do anything illegal in the USA etc. It then implies that this may cause you problems entering the USA! I imagine that the real reason for these apparently stupid questions is that it gives them lots of potential reasons for rapidly slinging you out.

My wife and I had a few days in New York last December, and it was really smooth getting into the country; a bit of card stapled to your passport, a couple of quick questions from a bored looking immigration officer, and there you were. Ah well, I suppose we're just going to have to grit our teeth and endure increasing hassle in future.

Xaccers · 08-01-2004, 12:20

I always think of Jasper Carrots scetch on US passport control

danielf · 08-01-2004, 12:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theodoric

Yes, the form you have to fill in on the plane is quite interesting. You have to answer such questions as were you a War Crimainal, do you intend to do anything illegal in the USA etc. It then implies that this may cause you problems entering the USA! I imagine that the real reason for these apparently stupid questions is that it gives them lots of potential reasons for rapidly slinging you out.

I think the phrase was 'acts of moral turpitude'

. But yes, every time I visited the US I passed immigration in a whiff (though the queue can be rather long)

Xaccers · 08-01-2004, 12:24

GMTV had a reporter fly to Washington a couple of days ago, there were some delays going through security checks before they got on the plane, but no one seemed bothered.
He asked a father if he was worried about taking his kids on board, and the father replied something like "what? with these security checks this is probably the safest flight going!"
They had a 2 hr delay while the US went through the passenger list (they can only do this once everyone has checked in as they need to know who has and who hasn't turned up, hence the request for arriving 3 hrs early)

When they got to washington, he taken aside and asked several questions in a polite manner because he was travelling alone.

All in all he said it was very efficient and not much of a problem.

SMHarman · 08-01-2004, 13:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theodoric

I see that the Americans have upped the stakes on the need for fingerprints and mugshots of visitors. A few days ago, it was claimed that, because of the 'visa waiving programme', British holiday visitors would be exempt. Now it seems that people with passports issued after 26 October will need, at least for the next few years until 'biometric' passports arrive, to be photographed and fingerprinted. And this means travelling to London or Belfast; sending your fingers by post would be a bit extreme! Not a problem for me as my passport has 5 years to run and I'm only a 20 minute train journey from Central London, but for people living miles away . . .

And despite the publicity, there's almost certain to be scores of people who will be blissfully unaware of the need. Let's hope that the current British lobbying of the US gets some results.

You missed the bit about paying $100 for it (for each pax), so thats $400 for a family of four! On top of the queues etc at the embassy. The VWP means they are short at the mo, but if 10% of UK passport holders suddenly need visas then the queues will huge.

LostintheNW · 08-01-2004, 13:16

I agree that extra security is needed when travelling to the USA (or anywhere in the world) after 9/11. I've never had any problems entering the USA on the times that I have been, the longest time at immigration was in New York when I went for New Year 2002-2003 but they questioned everyone on the flight. One thing though is that if everyone has to travel to London to get these passports, whats going to happen to the other passport offices around the UK? I am lucky I live in Manchester which is only a short trip to Liverpool where I could get a passport from if mine had run out, but my latest one isnt due to expire until 2010! Are these new passports expected to cost much more than the standard ones now? and will you be able to upgrade with a discount?

08-01-2004, 13:33

From what I understand passports that are being issued now are still going to be valid, it's only after October that people will *have* to be issued with biometric passports or get themselves a visa.

I was planning on possibly taking a skiing holiday to the US some time next year, so I might just get the passport now, rather than have to faff around and pay for visas next year.

SMHarman · 08-01-2004, 15:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graham

From what I understand passports that are being issued now are still going to be valid, it's only after October that people will *have* to be issued with biometric passports or get themselves a visa.

I was planning on possibly taking a skiing holiday to the US some time next year, so I might just get the passport now, rather than have to faff around and pay for visas next year.

Yes current passport holders will not have a problem. It is for passports issued after October and before the UK passport starts to contain biometric data (sometime in 2005) that the visas will be needed.

So if your passport expires late 04 / early 05 it may be better to renew early (pre Oct 04) to avoid the visa issue, especially if you travel stateside regularly as the visa is per trip and could get expensive.

Dave Stones · 08-01-2004, 15:27

how exactly would they issue these new "biometric" pssports? would it mean you *had* to go to eg the passport office to have your breath tested etc? i cant see there being a home kit to fill in forms like there is at the moment

08-01-2004, 16:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Stones

how exactly would they issue these new "biometric" pssports? would it mean you *had* to go to eg the passport office to have your breath tested etc? i cant see there being a home kit to fill in forms like there is at the moment

perhaps they'll get the post office do it, OMG!!! the thought of it and the queue. U can imagine US immigration, so sir how come you have 2 thumbs prints for your left hand!

The next big blow up will be that everyone who has a passport now has to be fingerprinted, think the police will want to get in on the act as a source of information?

Xaccers · 08-01-2004, 16:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Stones

how exactly would they issue these new "biometric" pssports? would it mean you *had* to go to eg the passport office to have your breath tested etc? i cant see there being a home kit to fill in forms like there is at the moment

Probably set up at larger post offices.
The thing with the media at the moment when they talk about it, they get it wrong.
Your biometric data will not be stored on the card, the same as your credit card balance isn't stored on your credit card.
Instead it will reference a database which contains that information.
Now, you may be thinking, how long will it take to do a check on a UK database from the states?
Well, I would guess that as we already transfer passenger lists before the plane leaves, we'd also transfer those database records.
It will be able to confirm that the person who checked in is the person who arrived.
I can see it being some sort of self service thing, where you swipe your passport, have your fingerprint/iris read and then the barrier lets you through.
That should reduce any hold ups, heck it may even be quicker than the current view and stamp process.
Of course there will be security present incase anything goes wrong or they need to do spot checks or more.

As for the police getting hold of the fingerprint information, not under current laws.
That concern however is one of the reasons why I think iris recognition will be used for identification as you don't tend to leave iris imprints wherever you go

08-01-2004, 16:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xaccers

That should reduce any hold ups, heck it may even be quicker than the current view and stamp process.

well said, i think it could get faster. Its going to be a pain whilst the process changes but who really cares as long as its safer.

ian@huth · 08-01-2004, 16:27

As far as I am aware the first British passports will have a chip containing biometric facial recognition data. This will be held on the chip and not remotely. There will also be room on the chip for a second method of biometric recognition but what that will be is anyones guess.

I wouldn't wait until the last minute to get a new passport as no doubt there will be a hell of a rush for them just before the new USA rules come into effect.