What's YOUR View....???

[Halcyon]

Ok OB, you have a point there.
Things like that should not be tolerated by anyone.
But then again you will always have someone who is twisted in their head and thinks it is right.
Look at pedophiles, they convince themselves it is right to like children.
The world is messed up. There will never be a view that everyone will share.
But if you could get people to share the view about all these tarrible things like murders etc, then I'm sure in these cases we'd have a much nicer world.
If everyone believed that you shouldnt go around killing people, then we'd live in a much safer place.

For other things like religion, we should respect each person's belief.
I can't believe these days that war still revolves around religion and that we can't sort things out without people dying.

[Stuart C]

Am I religious? No.
Do I believe relgion is a bad thing and should therefore be abolished (which is what that sentence appears to be saying)? Yes and No, depending on how religion is used. Most people (in my experience) use religion for good things, and get comfort from their faith. This, to me, is a good thing. However, there are those who use religion as a justification for killing. This, to me, is a bad thing. The trouble is, people will always kill, and they sometimes need an excuse.

Is war a bad thing? Logically, yes. However, many of our greatest technological advances have come about as a result of war. Not just the obvious things (such as weaponry etc), but Computing has made major steps forward as a result of War. There are the obvious advances such as decreasing price, while increasing speed and capacity. There is also the Internet (which, in case you didn't know, was designed to enable the Americans, and any allied countrys to maintain communications in the event of war). The world wide web (what most people know as the Internet) wasn't developed as a result of War, but it certainly wouldn't exist without the Internet.

There are also other fields that have had massive advanaces as a result of War. Medicine for example. IIRC, the first man to attempt Plastic Surgery, develeoped it to reconstruct or repair the appearance of War wounded.

[Skatoony]

Originally Posted by homealone

but at least, here, we can talk, without fear of being judged?

In most cases yes, but not always.

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by orangebird

Sorry, I have to dispute that, with both books. Both books preach that you have to follow a certain life, or your damned. Very understanding. Not. I'm not going to post loads of bits and bobs in here (do a search on posts I've made about the Koran in particular, escpecially those about beating your wife...) and then come back and tell me it's about peace and understanding.

I thought the bible told us to turn the other cheek and not to judge others, it also said redemption for most things is only a word away, providing you mean it of course, as a guide on how to live your life I dont think you can go to far wrong with it, as others have said it is man that twists things for their own ends, unfortunately I have not read the Koran, I think I probably should though.

[etccarmageddon]

Originally Posted by Mick

This subject doesn't get done to death, but more so some people get too wound up by other peoples views and end up arguing over *petty* things really, which usually always ends up in the threads in question getting closed before they get a chance to get done to death.

but putting insensitive comments like "a load of crap written thousands of years ago" isn't needed - what purpose does the "load of crap" bit serve other than to upset those who have these beliefs/opinions/religions. how can you have a serious adult discussion if you start it with words like that?

[sarahlouise45]

Originally Posted by etccarmageddon

but putting insensitive comments like "a load of crap written thousands of years ago" isn't needed - what purpose does the "load of crap" bit serve other than to upset those who have these beliefs/opinions/religions. how can you have a serious adult discussion if you start it with words like that?

That's why I started the thread. I quoted my friend. That's what he said. There are several different ways we can go with his statement, which is why I wanted to know all your views on it. Not just that, but I thought it would also be a good all-round topic for discussion.

[Acathla]

Originally Posted by etccarmageddon

but putting insensitive comments like "a load of crap written thousands of years ago" isn't needed - what purpose does the "load of crap" bit serve other than to upset those who have these beliefs/opinions/religions. how can you have a serious adult discussion if you start it with words like that?

I dont think you got the point of the thread. Sarah mentioned above that this was a quote and not her thinking.

But this begs the question - why do 'those' get upset with a comment from someone lilke that?

Isn't it just someone venting a belief? Aren't we all entitled to our own beliefs and why should the fact that someone doesnt agree with you upset you?

[Mick]

Originally Posted by etccarmageddon

but putting insensitive comments like "a load of crap written thousands of years ago" isn't needed - what purpose does the "load of crap" bit serve other than to upset those who have these beliefs/opinions/religions. how can you have a serious adult discussion if you start it with words like that?

Please consider who said what, before asking such questions.


I never said 'a load of crap'. So why are you quoting me?

Originally Posted by sarahlouise45

Not just that, but I thought it would also be a good all-round topic for discussion.

In my experience discussing religion very rarely is an all round good topic.

Crap it may be to some, to others it's their life.

And telling people who devoutly believe in a religion that their life is crap will never bring them to the discussion in the right frame of mind.

My own view is that many people need something to believe in. This is mainly brought on by their own insecurity and refusal to accept that this existence is finite.

It is no coincedence that a lot of people turn to religion after the death of a loved one, they need to believe that the person who has passed has not gone, and that they can still communicate with them.

Others turn to religion to feel part of something, to be part of a group, more about friendship and companionship than about worshipping an all powerful deity.

If religion didn't exist, we'd have to invent it because we are not that far evolved from a few hundred/thousand years ago and deep down in our nature is tribalism.

If it isn't a religion you are affliated to you, I bet you are affiliated to some other "tribe"

Whether that is a football team, or a biker , or fashion.

[sarahlouise45]

Originally Posted by Pierre

And telling people who devoutly believe in a religion that their life is crap will never bring them to the discussion in the right frame of mind.

That's the point though.... I didn't say that it was crap.... I was quoting my friend.

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by sarahlouise45

That's the point though.... I didn't say that it was crap.... I was quoting my friend.

I think we have established who said it now however considering religion and family are just about the only things people are prepared to die for perhaps your friend could have chosen his words a little more carefully

[sarahlouise45]

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

I think we have established who said it now however considering religion and family are just about the only things people are prepared to die for perhaps your friend could have chosen his words a little more carefully

I totally agree, but i was still intrigued by what he said....

I think that there will never be world peace. Humans are fundamentally designed to be very defensive, if we weren't, we would have been killed off. It's our nature, natural selection has made us to survive in a competitive world. We will always be divided on one issue, be it race, religion, ideology, whatever... we will never be in harmony. Religion certainly doesn't help matters, though. Religion is divisive and is dangerous. As long as it exists, there will never be world peace. I disagree that faith is harmless. Faith is very dangerous. By definition, it is a process of non-thinking, you just have to accept it, which causes many problems. Logic is thrown out of the window when using faith, such that blowing yourself up in the name of Allah appears acceptable to some because of their blind faith. I find faith very dangerous indeed. We have been given inquisitive, logical minds... why not use them? And common sense.

---------- Post added at 13:12 ---------- Previous post was at 13:04 ----------

By the way, there was a documentary recently on Channel 4 called 'Root of All Evil'. It's real eye opener, if you didn't see it then the episodes are here:

Episode 1
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...ichard+dawkins
Episode 2
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...ichard+dawkins

[etccarmageddon]

Originally Posted by Mick

Please consider who said what, before asking such questions.

I never said 'a load of crap'. So why are you quoting me?

I quoted you because you dont appear to understand why Russ would have a problem with this thread - I explained why.

---------- Post added at 13:50 ---------- Previous post was at 13:46 ----------

Originally Posted by sarahlouise45

That's why I started the thread. I quoted my friend. That's what he said. There are several different ways we can go with his statement, which is why I wanted to know all your views on it. Not just that, but I thought it would also be a good all-round topic for discussion.

that's a cop out - it's was totally unnecessary to include the 'load of crap' in your quote for this discussion other than to wind up Russ and offend (probably) a good number of the religious people of this forum. mocking their beliefs by quoting your friend saying 'a load of crap' is not the way to achieve a discussion that includes those who disagree with your friend.

[zinglebarb]

Originally Posted by orangebird

Anyone who 'tolerates' or accepts wife beating needs stringing up imo.

most of the people you will be stringing up then are the victims of such assault.The majority of people to tolerate this are the women getting beaten